Forge of Destiny(Xianxia Quest)

If I remember right, Sun Liling lost the battle of stealth vs. perception. She was only able to recover because she got a wound off on Ling Qi and was able to use a "track wounded prey" technique to keep staying in the vicinity (where she'd be able to keep trying to find Ling Qi and turn her into a pincushion).

How much would another stealth-focused art help against something like that (or a tracking brand on Ling Qi, or anything else along similar lines)? I mean, you need either an art that is able to dispel or counter each particular effect, or some way to make "can generally/specifically locate Ling Qi or something on her" useless. For example, more speed - pushing Fleeting Zephyr forward until the soft-cap comes to mind...
I would expect that kind of effect can be handled by the next level of Argent Mirror or the successor to Argent Mirror.

If the green power balance is lots of dice from green stones against lots of successes needed to advance then picking up the first couple levels of yellow utility arts will get a lot easier over time.
 
If I remember right, Sun Liling lost the battle of stealth vs. perception. She was only able to recover because she got a wound off on Ling Qi and was able to use a "track wounded prey" technique to keep staying in the vicinity (where she'd be able to keep trying to find Ling Qi and turn her into a pincushion).

How much would another stealth-focused art help against something like that (or a tracking brand on Ling Qi, or anything else along similar lines)? I mean, you need either an art that is able to dispel or counter each particular effect, or some way to make "can generally/specifically locate Ling Qi or something on her" useless. For example, more speed - pushing Fleeting Zephyr forward until the soft-cap comes to mind...
Mechanically, Liling's blood tracking technique only seemed to add dice to her perception/tracking for finding us.
 
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That's why, to me, the argument that Cai's support is needed to progress is flawed.
I am not sure if this is addressed to me, but I have never argued that it was needed. Only that it would likely be beneficial.

(getting attacked for being a Cai henchwoman, distance from non-Cai-affiliated potential allies and friends, that kind of thing).
Yeah, this is what I view as the major potential downside. My thought is, between Meizhen being her friend, and us serving on her council, I think we're already too closely associated with her to avoid that unless we full out turn against her which isn't happening since she's Meizhen's friend now.

if you don't reward your retainers such that they think serving you is an advantage rather than a disadvantage you've really screwed up.
Yes, this is the true heart of the matter. If serving CRX does not give better rewards than not serving her, people will simply not serve her. She wants us to serve her loyally, therefore she will make it worth our while to do so.
 
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That might seem overly generous, but if you don't reward your retainers such that they think serving you is an advantage rather than a disadvantage you've really screwed up. Right now, we're getting more information though- it'll certainly be interesting to see how Cai Renxiang rewards Ling Qi for the recent political windfall and may give an indication as to how much freedom she has in dishing out rewards.
Remember, CRX praised our loyalty to our friends when it came to doing something that hurt our bottom line. She wants to prove that she can earn such loyalty by being someone we will feel proud of serving, even if it's not always 'good' for us personally.

The CRX route is the high risk incredible reward route. She has to go incredibly big or go home, because her position is both incredibly powerful and incredibly fragile, and as such merely being exceptional isn't enough.

The greatest attraction of working for CRX is that she cannot afford to ever, ever not plot anything to prove how she is one step more exceptional than people thought she was last week.
 
Remember, CRX praised our loyalty to our friends when it came to doing something that hurt our bottom line. She wants to prove that she can earn such loyalty by being someone we will feel proud of serving, even if it's not always 'good' for us personally.

The CRX route is the high risk incredible reward route. She has to go incredibly big or go home, because her position is both incredibly powerful and incredibly fragile, and as such merely being exceptional isn't enough.

The greatest attraction of working for CRX is that she cannot afford to ever, ever not plot anything to prove how she is one step more exceptional than people thought she was last week.
Thats honestly the attraction of the option to me.

Just seeing how far the ride goes.
 
Yeah, this is what I view as the major potential downside. My thought is, between Meizhen being her friend, and us serving on her council, I think we're already too closely associated with her to avoid that unless we full out turn against her which isn't happening since she's Meizhen's friend now.

Oh, I think it's almost certain that, unless Ling Qi goes for the Imperial Bureaucracy or threads the needle in the sect and embraces that power structure, she's going to have a noble giving her orders (I don't see "loose cultivator" as working out in a centralized power setting). And of the various options that seem to be viable, Cai Renxiang is probably an almost-perfect liege for her to have (she loses a point or two for potential inflexibility and immaturity, and a few more for a frighteningly authoritarian mother who'd be in ultimate control). And unless there's an Imperial Postman-type position for messengers and delivery-cultivators and suchlike, I don't see anything in the Bureaucracy suiting her. Thus I currently see her ideal ending point in five years as being Cai Renxiang's vassal.

My main concern is when this relationship should be formalized - now, when she enters the Inner Sect (or shortly after), when she starts her military career or when her service ends. I feel the net direct mechanical benefit of doing so now would probably be fairly minimal - the benefit is starting the "years of loyal service" early, being there before anyone but Gan Guangli and Xuan Shi and greater relationship with Renxiang and her current personal vassals (ie, Gan Guangli... Xuan Shi might count here as well). She's almost certainly need to be spending some actions pre-tournament in aiding Cai's plans (and doing so would be a matter of 'must' rather than 'well, this could be fun and/or profitable'), and it would affect her relationships with other disciples in probably a mostly negative way (in the sense of "allies become a bit more wary/distant" rather than increased hostility). And it chooses her path before she really has more than basic information about other options.

Choosing after the tournament decreases her 'value' to Renxiang - she's demurred once already, and Renxiang now has an inner sect full of new potential vassals to choose from. However, it would then be at a point where Ling Qi might be able to find out just how far she can go in the Argent Sect with "just" her personal prowess and what such a career path (ie, towards Elder-hood) would look like. It would also mean her Cai-related "obligations" are more requests than commands and she'll have more control over her activities pre-tournament.

Choosing at later points follows these trends - less ability to have a close special relationship, more freedom to choose and more information to base said decisions on. Really, Renxiang was clever to put this offer right now - before Ling Qi has grasped just where she might go as a cultivator and not giving her enough time to really find out.

So far Ling Qi doesn't actually even have an idea of what Cai Renxiang would be asking her to do, what kinds of social decisions she'd be expected to defer to her liege* and so on. To be honest, until she (and we) get that information - through social actions with Cai Renxiang and other nobles - I myself can't in good conscience vote for her accepting the offer.


* For example - In the longer term, if she finds someone she wants to marry, does Renxiang need to approve? In the short term, does she need to okay any side job she does for another disciple? Is she expected to share any gains from her adventures with Renxiang? If she wishes to continue learning at the Argent Sect after her military service, but Renxiang has now moved on to managing a household, must she follow? Can she take the hypthetical "Imperial postwoman" position or another that appeals, or are such things closed off to her?
 
Remember, CRX praised our loyalty to our friends when it came to doing something that hurt our bottom line. She wants to prove that she can earn such loyalty by being someone we will feel proud of serving, even if it's not always 'good' for us personally.
Failing to usually be 'good' to us would make her look bad to other potential vassals though. If she isn't lavishly rewarding a vassal as capable as Ling Qi, what can anyone else expect?
 
We know tutoring is a thing, and it's likely to be weighted in the tutor's favour so they have an actual incentive to do so. We know more difficult missions exist, with increasing rewards for those able to complete them. We know that inner sect disciples have far more access than outer.
Its a plausible genre trope that past a certain point self training becomes very hard, and lacking a higher teacher, teaching others to refine your skills helps get you through chokepoints by revisiting your understanding training juniors.

Alternatively the Guiding Moon might well give cultivation progress for teaching!
If I remember right, Sun Liling lost the battle of stealth vs. perception. She was only able to recover because she got a wound off on Ling Qi and was able to use a "track wounded prey" technique to keep staying in the vicinity (where she'd be able to keep trying to find Ling Qi and turn her into a pincushion).

How much would another stealth-focused art help against something like that (or a tracking brand on Ling Qi, or anything else along similar lines)? I mean, you need either an art that is able to dispel or counter each particular effect, or some way to make "can generally/specifically locate Ling Qi or something on her" useless. For example, more speed - pushing Fleeting Zephyr forward until the soft-cap comes to mind...
That's part of the point. Further investment there hits diminishing returns because we're basically improviing our ability to hide against one person only. S
I would expect that kind of effect can be handled by the next level of Argent Mirror or the successor to Argent Mirror.
....true, what actually cost us that chase was:
-Lacking a dispel art which can remove Sun's tracking tag. Argent Mirror may have something for this
-Lacking a means to ignore wound penalties. Thousand Ring Fortress may have something for this
 
That's part of the point. Further investment there hits diminishing returns because we're basically improviing our ability to hide against one person only. S

....true, what actually cost us that chase was:
-Lacking a dispel art which can remove Sun's tracking tag. Argent Mirror may have something for this
-Lacking a means to ignore wound penalties. Thousand Ring Fortress may have something for this
Seems like your sentence above got cut.

Anyway, Sun didn't have a tracking tag as much as 'her tracking art detects blood, and she has the blood/sunflower element'. Ling Qi also didn't get wound penalties, it's just that Sun Liling get dice for tracking for each wound someone gets.

The really nasty part, there, is that none of those things are 'dispellable'... but are things we can expect stealth arts to take care of. For example:
She could see the surprise and frustration in her opponent's eyes and that was what gave her the strength to keep going. When the moment came and the attacks slowed, she kicked a spray of dirt and snow into the girl's face and fled into a crack in the wall of the ravine Liling had cornered her in. It was a gamble, she had no idea where the hole lead and it was barely half a meter wide, but it was her only chance. Her heartbeat thundered in her ears even as she bled freely from dozens of small wounds and one large one, droplets of blood dissolving into black smoke as she rushed through the narrow tunnel.
Trackless escape, now turned passive, can already make sure you can't track us via blood leaving marks, it's just not quite capable yet of negating tracking of blood within our body. It should definitely get there, though. Incidentally, Liling probably had a -3 to tracking there.
 
We're a vassal, not a slave. What we do on our own time and recognizance is our own business. All being a Vassal means is that she's our nominal liege, and has the right to give reasonable commands to us. And being one of her first retainers means that we hold something of a privileged position compared to any who come along later. Couple that with Meizhen agreeing that we were likely to get tremendous support due to CRX's desire to have loyal and strong retainers, and the real downsides are basically just "Buying Cai Renxiang's enemies, and giving her a hand with our skills."

Like, for all that we worry about her mother, and for all that we worry about her being too much of a hardass--as we've so far seen, she's honestly pretty hands off about the details. She mentions if she needs something done, but makes sure the things she asks you to do fall into your skillset, and lets you handle it however you please. She's not a micromanager, and that's a very good trait to have in a boss!
 
We're a vassal, not a slave. What we do on our own time and recognizance is our own business. All being a Vassal means is that she's our nominal liege, and has the right to give reasonable commands to us. And being one of her first retainers means that we hold something of a privileged position compared to any who come along later. Couple that with Meizhen agreeing that we were likely to get tremendous support due to CRX's desire to have loyal and strong retainers, and the real downsides are basically just "Buying Cai Renxiang's enemies, and giving her a hand with our skills."

Like, for all that we worry about her mother, and for all that we worry about her being too much of a hardass--as we've so far seen, she's honestly pretty hands off about the details. She mentions if she needs something done, but makes sure the things she asks you to do fall into your skillset, and lets you handle it however you please. She's not a micromanager, and that's a very good trait to have in a boss!

Eh, I'm honestly not that enthused about the Vassal idea in general. It seems the most inherently limiting of the futures we could choose.

I would rather stay with the sect, honestly. It seems like an environment that would balance responsibilities with duties in a more interesting way; the sects exist as a counter-balance to the old nobilities power, but their duties are mainly to their own communities, and the arrangement seems much more fluid on the whole.

Alternative, if we are going to go for the more traditional advancement options, I would pick going to work for the Imperial Government itself over vassalage. Same kinds of rules and restrictions, better advancement and more power, and an easy time retiring from service if you come to hate it.

Hell, I would pick adventuring past the empire first. That ultimately just kicks the can down the road, as we'll eventually need more resources, but it kicks it down the road to when we're more experienced.

Agreeing to be anyone's vassal at this point of time is... sort of the end of the road. You've given up self-control over your destiny.
 
My main concern is when this relationship should be formalized - now, when she enters the Inner Sect (or shortly after), when she starts her military career or when her service ends. I feel the net direct mechanical benefit of doing so now would probably be fairly minimal - the benefit is starting the "years of loyal service" early, being there before anyone but Gan Guangli and Xuan Shi and greater relationship with Renxiang and her current personal vassals (ie, Gan Guangli... Xuan Shi might count here as well). She's almost certainly need to be spending some actions pre-tournament in aiding Cai's plans (and doing so would be a matter of 'must' rather than 'well, this could be fun and/or profitable'), and it would affect her relationships with other disciples in probably a mostly negative way (in the sense of "allies become a bit more wary/distant" rather than increased hostility). And it chooses her path before she really has more than basic information about other options.
I think the fear of the "must" activities is a little overblown. Unless CRX is an idiot she is going to ask Ling Qi to do things that she is good at, which means she's giving us those sweet sweet stealth and larceny successes. In addition, from what we've seen of the culture of the setting it is perfectly acceptable to tell somebody "hey I'm going to be unavailable this week because I scored some gnarly cultivation drugs and I need to max them out." CRX is unlikely to give completely mandatory "do this immediately" type tasks except in dire emergencies where we would probably be voting to take the task anyways.

I see a few different axes along which to judge CRX's offer:

Shinies
  • Short term: probably an initial gear-up infusion. Not clear if she will continue paying us for services rendered or put us on a salary. When she did pay us for tasks completed the pay was competitive with sect jobs (10 yellow stones for an easy-ish investigation).
  • Medium term: unclear. If we're effectively adopted into the noble family system we can expect to get rewards for achieving cultivation milestones. This is a big question mark.
  • Long term: positive, based on what Bai Meizhen told us.
Hassle
  • Short term: reduced hassle thanks to protection from overt Sun Liling assaults. If we could expect to receive the current level of protection after turning down her offer (unlikely) then I'd call it a net neutral. Joining up with CRX won't call any additional enemies down on our heads that wouldn't be gunning for us anyways other than possibly Chu Song who, while formidable, doesn't seem like the kind of person who will really ruin our lives the way Yan Renshu would if he could.
  • Medium term: kind of a question mark. This is what I would most like to get out of our interaction with CRX: what's she planning for year two? If she's on a collision course with one or more Cyan cultivators then that's a big problem. We also don't know the rules of the Inner Sect. If the elders actually enforce order then the value of the CRX protective umbrella goes down.
  • Long term: crisis and opportunity. Being attached to CRX will have people gunning for us that we've never even heard of. OTOH we'll also have a chance to rise up the ranks in a way that we couldn't otherwise.
Access
  • Short term: significant positive. CRX has access to drugs well beyond what's available in the store. Even if she's not handing them out for free she will likely let us place orders through her. It's possible we could do this through FX but even if that happens over the next couple weeks CRX might order him to cut us off if we turn her down.
  • Medium term: unknown. We just don't know what inner disciples typically have access to. CRX will probably still have access to better stuff, but it's not clear at all how much better.
  • Long term: positive. Being connected to the direct heir of a White cultivator opens a lot of doors. It's possible we could do as well if we manage to secure an apprenticeship with Jiao (hardly a sure thing), but we probably can't do better and we could sure do a lot worse.
Basically, I'm pretty sure we're better off tying ourselves as closely as possible to CRX for the next four months. Starting in week 53 there's a chance we'd be better off keeping some distance. In the very long term it's a high risk high reward play that we can't really judge the odds of at this point.
 
I've seen some people here talk about Cyan cultivators in the Inner Sect.

But I'd like to remind people that Gu Yanmei is a bit of an aberration. Her progress is ridiculous in comparison to others, and even then she's applying for Core Sect, which seems to imply any Cyan level cultivator in the Inner Sect is essentially gunning for the Core.

I'd like to think that with that in mind, the number of Cyan cultivators in the Inner Sect is very minimal. And the ones that ARE there are trying to prepare for the test to enter the Core sect.
 
Short term: reduced hassle thanks to protection from overt Sun Liling assaults. If we could expect to receive the current level of protection after turning down her offer (unlikely) then I'd call it a net neutral. Joining up with CRX won't call any additional enemies down on our heads that wouldn't be gunning for us anyways other than possibly Chu Song who, while formidable, doesn't seem like the kind of person who will really ruin our lives the way Yan Renshu would if he could.
Could you elaborate on why you feel vassalhood has significant bearing on protection from Sun Liling? I'm drawing a blank on why CRX would hold back on protecting any of her council from Sun Liling's aggression or the methods she'd employ to give more security against the same.

Do you mean you expect CRX to cut us loose to suffer at Sun Liling's mercy if we turn down the vassalage offer?
 
Hmm to weigh in myself on the whole vassal or not vassal thing.


I don't really know enough to compare the Sect, the Imperial Government, wandering and CRX in terms of resources. Like, for example wandering should be the one with the least amount of resources in general because we only have Ling Qi to rely on and any temporary friends she can make, but with some luck and effort you can find amazing things in the more dangerous places of the world. It kinda skews things.

Personal preference on what I would prefer because it sounds engaging would be adventures beyond the empire. It seems fun in the sense of having lots of adventure. The other options would be fun to by doing different things, but I like more adventure type fun for this quest. Exploring a fantasy death world sounds really engaging.

I'm certainly not sure about it but I imagine that if we had enough fun and impressed the Empress by basically conquering a new chunk of land by accident I'd be thoroughly entertained. Incredibly unlikely though.


Given that I can't really compare the options we have, I'd like to talk about what I think of CRX personally. I like her. My initial impression was a bit eh. However, I like her now after watching what she is doing and since she seems to be trying to follow parts of the maxim "Well reasoned action is indistinguishable from good will". She's immature and not really in her own yet, but that's really just a matter of experience. I especially like that she gave respect to Ling Qi when she was only a commoner, albeit a talented one(I ain't gonna expect anyone in this setting except Ling Qi to give respect like CRX did to a normal commoner). Another good point is that she earned the total loyalty of Gan Guangli, and he's basically the epitome of honesty. He's kinda like a paladin in my assessment. It speaks well of her that she has his what seems to be undying loyalty. It also speaks well of her that she has the loyalty of Xuan Shi and Golden Fields who are also pretty chill folks. Her alliance with Huang Da is a bit ehh, but the dude is leaving us and ours alone and Cai seems in part to be something of a reason for that so I'll just chalk that one up to needs must. So looking at the people in her orbit, it paints a decent picture.

She doesn't seem like a bad boss given the above personality and exploits and the tasks she's given us seem tuned for what we want to do anyway and that to expect that to change much. So overall I probably won't push for accepting vassalage, I'd be okay with it too. It should still be a kind of fun I like.
 
Actually, I know most of us are thinking of vassalage as this huge, lifetime commitment, but could we be mistaken about that? Perhaps it is easier to quit Cai's service than it would be to quit the military/MoI/whatever, which is why she's so interested in loyal vassals.

I'm definitely glad we're taking the Cai minor this week, and I hope we'll continue to take the Cai minor in the following weeks. It's necessary both for building friendship and finding out more details about this retainer arrangement.
 
Actually, I know most of us are thinking of vassalage as this huge, lifetime commitment, but could we be mistaken about that? Perhaps it is easier to quit Cai's service than it would be to quit the military/MoI/whatever, which is why she's so interested in loyal vassals.

I'm definitely glad we're taking the Cai minor this week, and I hope we'll continue to take the Cai minor in the following weeks. It's necessary both for building friendship and finding out more details about this retainer arrangement.
This is actually something I was thinking about, after I posted my thoughts. Given the rumblings we have been given, trouble is on the way and it may be that Cai dies for some reason. I assume our vassalship is passed on to another retainer of the Cai in that regard.

Additionally I imagine there must be some way to trade vassals. Like for example lets speculate that Xuan Shi becomes heir of his house(if he is not already) and ends up marrying CRX in a subordinate position. I imagine that any personal retainers or vassals he has would instead become Cai vassals. Dependent on the exact specifics of the marriage contract.

Trade deals may also involve exchanges of vassals. Liaisons to other noble houses are also given a lot of free reign because of practicality and need to do their jobs.

And at the very top and super unlikely I imagine you can have the Empress come down and say "No, you are now This House's vassal now" and it works. Though why she would and why she would spend the exorbitant amount of political capital I don't know.
 
Three actions spent on this decision, and we still know nothing in terms of mechanical benefits.

Well, I should really say two, since we haven't actually completed the Cai option.

It's basically a blind decision. All we know is that Meizhen, our best friend, thinks it's a good choice. Gan supports Cai immensely, although as we don't know him all that well, the value of his support is suspect.

Personally, I haven't seen a good reason to not accept Cai's offer, unless you are simply conflict adverse.

To be fair though, Cai is taking a gamble here too. According to Meizhen, you generally don't get vassalage offers unless you have a history of military service behind you.

She's basically operating on the same thing we are. A handful of observations and the advice of a friend.
 
She's basically operating on the same thing we are. A handful of observations and the advice of a friend.

She actually knows how the system works and what can and cannot be expected out of a vassal.

Also, @BungieONI I would be extremely concerned if you could just trade around vassals like that. Feels too much like agreeing to be property, and the point of my post was to say retainer-hood under Cai may not actually be that constricting. Like, the obligations of a retainer may actually be much looser than typical employment, which is why being loyal is such an important quality that Cai is looking for. It's possible that instead of the lifelong commitment we think of it as, it's actually fairly easy to quit being a retainer. Hence the need for loyal retainers.
 
@Kai Merah

If it were like european vassalage, we'd owe her a small tithe, and she could call us to arms for three or four months (depending on region.) out of a year.

Vassalage in this system seems a bit different, but I doubt she's going to make us into her maid, or demand all of our time.

The big thing is, her enemies would be our enemies. Probably the biggest cost of this venture, but also an opportunity if done correctly. Our biggest hauls have come from doing things that also help Cai.
 
Three actions spent on this decision, and we still know nothing in terms of mechanical benefits.

Well, I should really say two, since we haven't actually completed the Cai option.

It's basically a blind decision. All we know is that Meizhen, our best friend, thinks it's a good choice. Gan supports Cai immensely, although as we don't know him all that well, the value of his support is suspect.

Personally, I haven't seen a good reason to not accept Cai's offer, unless you are simply conflict adverse.

To be fair though, Cai is taking a gamble here too. According to Meizhen, you generally don't get vassalage offers unless you have a history of military service behind you.

She's basically operating on the same thing we are. A handful of observations and the advice of a friend.

Yeah, and I haven't been hot on any of them, but the Gan one was the most obviously pointless. I'm no nearly to supporting this move then I was at the start.

She actually knows how the system works and what can and cannot be expected out of a vassal.

Also, @BungieONI I would be extremely concerned if you could just trade around vassals like that. Feels too much like agreeing to be property, and the point of my post was to say retainer-hood under Cai may not actually be that constricting. Like, the obligations of a retainer may actually be much looser than typical employment, which is why being loyal is such an important quality that Cai is looking for. It's possible that instead of the lifelong commitment we think of it as, it's actually fairly easy to quit being a retainer. Hence the need for loyal retainers.

But that's as much supposition as @BungieONI's that we would be property. Actually, with what we've seen of the relationship of the Golden Fields Group, and the expectations we've seen, I suspect @BungieONI's thoughts are closer then yours. At the very least, the obligations and restrictions are more serious then you're trying to argue here.
 
But that's as much supposition as @BungieONI's that we would be property. Actually, with what we've seen of the relationship of the Golden Fields Group, and the expectations we've seen, I suspect @BungieONI's thoughts are closer then yours. At the very least, the obligations and restrictions are more serious then you're trying to argue here.

Ah, sure, I was just bringing that up as a possibility. I'm pretty sure myself that being a retainer will be a huge commitment, I just thought it might be interesting to explore what if it wasn't like what we were assuming.

Basically, I was just wondering why Cai felt loyalty was so important. Maybe it means retainers have a high degree of independence and ability to shirk their duties if they want? Maybe 'retainer' has greater ability to say no to their liege than 'vassal'? Basically, if lieges were able to exert a high degree of control and authority over their retainers, to the point of being able to treat them as property or trade them around, or veto their marriage prospects or whatever else people have been suggesting, then why is 'loyalty' such an important quality for a retainer? Doesn't it suggest that without loyalty, a retainer could theoretically abuse their connection with their lord?

I dunno, I'm honestly just tossing out ideas at the moment because I'm tired of the same old arguments and was wondering if I could stir up anything remotely new.
 
being there before anyone but Gan Guangli and Xuan Shi and greater relationship with Renxiang and her current personal vassals (ie, Gan Guangli... Xuan Shi might count here as well)
Xuan Shi's a member of an ancient noble family, I'm not sure why you'd think he's CRX's vassal? He apparently has a crush on her and I could see marriage being beneficial but I can't see him lowering himself (or even being allowed) to being her vassal.
 
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