- Location
- Utrecht
Only seer training locks actions and have to be taken consecutively. It takes a long time, but it doesn't block us from taking other things.
A Different Breed (Warhammer 29K)
I think it's worth looking at what vehicles Zahr-Tann has that we have versions of:
Rapier Jetbike: 1 heavy weapon + 2 system slots
Longsword Attack Skimmer: 2 heavy weapons + 2 system slots
Falchion Attack Skimmer: 1 heavy weapon + 6 system slots
Halberd Battle Tank: 1 vehicle weapon + 1 heavy weapon + 3/4 system slots (assuming Flare shield is 1 or 2 slots)
Baldric Assault Transport (sealed): 3 heavy weapons + 11/12 system slots
Scabbard Light Transport (open topped): 1 heavy and 1 ranged weapon + 11/12 system slots
If I've got it right we couldn't make the:
Rapier
We can make something the same as the :
Longsword
Falchion
Baldric
We can make better versions of the:
Halberd
Scabbard
So, if we think we might be able to use Diplomacy to get access to their better designs we shouldn't militarise jetbikes but should militarise ou other vehicle chassses.
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Professor Vesca
Good News Everyone!
That doesnt sound right to me. We are probably missing a key part to speed things up or streamline it. Maybe once we get our stewardship hall up and running we will learn more.
- Location
- Seattle, Washington
Here is my idea for a line detachment:
- Void Guard Squad (Line Infantry)
- 12x Void Guard (6 EP)
- 12x Sunblaster Caliver (6 EP)
- 11x Light Melee (1 EP)
- 1x Light Rending Blade (5 EP)
- 160 EP per Squad
- 204 EP if entire squad has Light Rending blades
- Void Talon Squad (Anti-infantry and Melee unit)
- 12x Void Guard (6 EP)
- 12x Needler Carbines (4 EP)
- 12x Light Rending Blades (5 EP)
- 180 EP per squad
- Mechanized Line Detachment (total cost: 3974 EP, 8 Starcrystals, 8 Fatebender Psy-scopes)
- Troops:
- 3 Void Guard Squads in Mirage Transports
- 2 Void Talon Squads in Mirage Transports
- Elite:
- 1 Forgefire Squad in Mirage Transport
- 1 Voidspear Squad in Mirage Transport
- Headquarters
- 1 Veteran Hearthguard Squad in Mirage Transport
- Fast Attack
- 1 squad of Razorwind Jetbikes
- 1 unit of Cloudburst attack skimmers
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- Location
- Germany
In general some of the options are just wild in how long they take considering we are talking about 5 years per turn.
Currently, we have 12 Warrior AP and a bunch of large AP options that take many turns to finish available; "Hull Militization (5 AP per turn; 4-8 turns for Escorts, 6-20 turns for Capitals; can take up to 3)" especially suggests we could probably increase our WAP available or decrease the WAP cost of the project at least quickly enough that the 3 max limit is relevant to mention, considering that (even disregarding all the other demands on our WAP) just those three selections alone would cost more WAP than we actually have, never mind a hypothetical locked off fourth or more selection.
To that end, looking at
I'm pretty sure we'll be able to improve our Sign of the Warrior WAP and/or Costs quite a bit by fixing our current critical deficit of basically the entire command structure. Though getting quality results may take a while, especially considering the mention of splitting off shorter training paths.
As such, we'll probably want to be using most of our available WAP on that for the near future.
For more immediate gains, hopefully getting Move Existing Councils and Create Diplomatic Council done will let us get some quicker WAP from some of the more conflict-minded Sons and other leadership figures being freed up, and benefits from simplified logistics and the like.
On Chassis/Hull Militization specifically, considering we're having to basically reinvent a lot of this shit from scratch at the moment, I'm hoping that the stuff we learn as we do the projects will bring the time and costs down for later ones. Hell, we may even be able to do joint projects with our more militaristic allies once we get the Sign of the Herald going.
It may also be partially tied to the Grand Academy, or some other Seeker improvements. It might just be me, but "Expand the Academy of Vaul on your Craftworld into a Grand Academy, larger and more lavishly equipped, allowing more projects to be undertaken at once" seems like the kind of thing that might be relevant to a largescale design project that we have a 3 design (I assume at once) limit on.
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Trading for the Jetbike saves us two Warrior AP in exchange for whatever we need to give them in trade. I'm not sure that's worthwhile compared to the increased risk for developing a more expensive chassis and getting it wrong.
Besides, as the biggest surviving industrial craftworld we might just be able to come up with modifications other than simple slot arrangements, so it's not certain we'd be making a Rapier knock-off anyways.
I have to admit, I really don't like the standard Close Combat Weapon. If we wanted to do a non-assault squad that has some melee capability, I'd say steal ideas from Zahr-Tann's Starbringer Squad and give half of them light rending blades and the other half some sort of close-in pistol, maybe a Needler or Flamer or Plasma Flamer.
Probably some kind of dedicated naval design office infrastructure would be the solution. Although I have no idea how we would get to that point.
- Location
- Germany
I personally will hold onto the forgefire squad in the troop slot.
I just don't get the complaining that they have to be an elite unit.
Our Assault squads have to be pretty beefy defense wise otherwise we will lose a lot of them because going against fortified positions is fucking dangerous.
And if there is one thing that will hurt us the most mid/long term it is losing people.
As is I wouldn't update the line detachment because we can't replace the jetbike with something better as the Razorwind feels like a low key failed design.
I just don't get the complaining that they have to be an elite unit.
Our Assault squads have to be pretty beefy defense wise otherwise we will lose a lot of them because going against fortified positions is fucking dangerous.
And if there is one thing that will hurt us the most mid/long term it is losing people.
As is I wouldn't update the line detachment because we can't replace the jetbike with something better as the Razorwind feels like a low key failed design.
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I mean, we're still just barely post-apocalypse, arguably even still currently-apocalypse, and as several of our options have called out we basically don't have even what little the pre-Fall Eldar possessed in the way of a functioning government, never mind all the lost personnel, ruined infrastructure and the fact huge chunks of our techbase rely on fundamental forces that no longer exist at best or are conduits to hostile warp entities at worst. It's not really a surprise things are a wee bit fucked.
Hell, I'm just glad we're not stuck in a gravity well trying to reinvent basically the entirety of achieving orbit from scratch!
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It's only 20 turns if everything goes wrong with the project. If everything goes right in could be as little as six turns.
What enemies are we facing that we'd want both Needlers squads and Sunblaster Squads? They're both anti-infantry weapons, but they're intended to kill different kinds of infantry.
Sunblasters are, based on the Tau experience, what you want ywhen you fight orks. Each shot does massive damage, enough to kill one or physically destroy enough of one of the Boyz that it puts them down. When you fight orks you want that stopping power, because they shrug off wounds that aren't immediately lethal or crippling, as they don't go into shock and aren'tvery psychologically vulnerable to being suppressed by a volume of unaimed fire.
Needlers are what you want to fight unaugmented humans who aren't in power armour or carapace. They do go into shock from smaller wounds and are more psychologically vulnerable to suppressive fire.
As we probably don't generally want both on the same battlefield, I'd go with a layout like this.
- Void Guard Squad (decision of whether to deploy with Sunblasters or Needlers is made by commander at the point of deployment)
- 12 Voidguard Warsuit (6)
- 12 Sunblaster Calivers (6)
- 12 Needler Carbines (4)
- 12 Rending Blades (5)
- 12 Energy-Dispersion Barrier Generators (6)
- 324 EP total, for what that matters, although it doesn't really, what matters is Forge/Foundry production rates
They're also decently capable of surviving melee with their Rending Blades, so if they get stuck in it they can give a good account of themselves.
And between holofields and their conversion fields they're significantly more survivable.
If we made 1 Sunblaster Caliver Forge, 1 Needler Forge, 1 Rending Blade Forge, 2 Voidguard Warsuit Forges and 2 Energy-Dispersion Barrier Generator Foundries we can probably recruit 11 squads of them a turn.
2 Warrior AP for 1-12 turns, so an average of 13 AP. As well as on average getting it 4.5 turns earlier so being able to design and deploy vehicles using that chassis that much earlier.
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Professor Vesca
Good News Everyone!
It could be that we are not meant to militarize battleships until after we start timeskipping such as if we finish our faction quest or after the primarchs disperse.
- Location
- Utrecht
maybe we could get a time reduction from hero actions (we have a dude nicknamed the mariner) or by studying high human technology.
I'm pretty sure the bigger, more complicated chassis are going to take longer than the smaller, simpler ones. Since that action has to cover everything from jetbikes to superheavy tanks and titan walkers.
Hmm. Possible. I was just assuming it was random, like the length of Bonesinger or Seeker projects with variable length seem to be, depending on how well the project happens to go.
I mean, it does fit the idea that it takes multiple decades to build a battleship that it also takes multiple decades to design one. And I think that 20 turns is for the superheavy, 700+ point units in BFG, not the smaller 400 points range BBs you might have as a more 'line battleship'. Eldar cruisers run around about 250 points in that game so, about three times that much for a flagship/first-rate BB with all-exotic weapons seems about right?
Professor Vesca
Good News Everyone!
Might also be worthwhile to just delay until the time skip.
I mean, if we think we really need a militarized BB right away, thats fine and ill hear out the argument for it. But I kinda think we will be fine making do with refits?
- Location
- Utrecht
It could also be that the actions synergize with each other.
Militarizing a destroyer might make frigate militarization easier, as the lessons learned from one carry over to the other.
They are pretty much having to reinvent the wheel, after all.
And we might also get the option for knowledge transfer with allies.
Militarizing a destroyer might make frigate militarization easier, as the lessons learned from one carry over to the other.
They are pretty much having to reinvent the wheel, after all.
And we might also get the option for knowledge transfer with allies.
We also don't know whether the Rapier is a properly militarized chassis itself. It might just be a different civilian design Zahr-Tann had lying around because their more military population liked the jetbike equivalent of camo print and combat boots, or a now only half-functional pre-Fall one, so we might still need to use a Chassis Militization on it after acquisition anyway.
That said, it might be a better starting point for a Jetbike Chassis Militization than our current frame, which could save time or get better results. Or having more examples to work from might help.
Or it might not ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ We kind of have to guess on a lot of stuff here, by explicit QM design.
It may be both. A degree of randomisation, applied to a base time dependant on the project. It may also depend on what kind of/how good an end product we aim for with that "precise control over vehicle characteristics" the option gives us.
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- Location
- Utrecht
Sooo... What are the odds of salvaging a nova cannon from Kronite?
I'm also very hopeful for some functioning communication technology too.
What's on your wish list?
I'm also very hopeful for some functioning communication technology too.
What's on your wish list?
Fire. Toilet Paper. Fax Machines. Crypto Mining Rigs.
Mechanis
Confirmed Extremely Screwed
- Location
- Absconding with Alacrity
Combat Brigs have 14 Starlances of standard size. Four standard size pairs and two heavy batteries with three each. (I will, I think, clarify that in the master post doc for the next time I update the post,)
TLDR, Light Melee is "anything that needs only one hand to wield" while Heavy Melee is "you are going to need both hands for this."
So things like swords and warhammers and axes and whatnot? those generally come in both sizes.
Things that are explicitly like, a fancy knife? Light Melee.
Most polearms? Heavy Melee.
and so on.
For reference, Terminator suits are various configurations of Heavy Powered armor; most marks of standard Astartes armor would be light Powered, and the fancy power armor that Inquisitiors slash regular humans can wear is generally some flavor of semipowered armor.
So as I have said before: The armor you have is very good, especially for first attempts!
Keep scale in mind here.
The average escort is over a kilometer in length from stem to stern; regular Battleships are generally something like thirty to forty kilometers long! 40K voidships are colossal constructions more on par with heavily armed space stations by the standards of most other settings. Think about how long it takes to develop an aircraft carrier that is but a tiny fraction of that size, and doesn't have to deal with all the very many problems of being a spacecraft or the many, many complex systems of the kind of technology even the Imperium can throw around, and one realizes that the potential upper range is actually rather fast, given the scale of the project.
But yes, those are ranges, and you are unlikely to hit the higher ends simply because you don't have the level of complex fancy toys to get there, yet.
- Location
- Utrecht
Why would you need that? Eldar digestion is perfect and produces no waste
Humans call eldar stuck up, acting as if their shit doesn't stink.
Eldar: You shit? Ewwww! Like animals
You know, Given their Infinite ammo hax, Needler and spike weapons have a bit of a funny niche.
That thing where the imperium sticks a gun on melee weaponry, Like the Primaris Aggresors Dual powers fists with Underslung bolters, or the custodian spears? Given Needler Infinite ammo hacks, we can do it better. We could totally crib the custodians style, and give our Heavy power armoured dudes Halberds with Inbuilt spikers or needlers to pull the same kind of Murder blender.
EDIT: but yah, The ilthimar is a VERY good terminator equivalent, Especially if you remember that this was made by a bunch of crafters, as a first production model basically slapped together to get something workable in a panic, BY what amounts to a bunch of Crafstmen who know very little about actual war.
That thing where the imperium sticks a gun on melee weaponry, Like the Primaris Aggresors Dual powers fists with Underslung bolters, or the custodian spears? Given Needler Infinite ammo hacks, we can do it better. We could totally crib the custodians style, and give our Heavy power armoured dudes Halberds with Inbuilt spikers or needlers to pull the same kind of Murder blender.
EDIT: but yah, The ilthimar is a VERY good terminator equivalent, Especially if you remember that this was made by a bunch of crafters, as a first production model basically slapped together to get something workable in a panic, BY what amounts to a bunch of Crafstmen who know very little about actual war.
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