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A Different Breed (Warhammer 29K)

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If Zahr-Tann has a similarly Vaulish bent, it could be worth investigating (in the coming turn) whatever their equivalent to a combined arms doctrine is. I'd wager at the moment they have a much firmer grasp on integrating things like organization/command and control mechanisms/strategic direction than we do at the moment. Having a fully coherent doctrine might also help aim some of the vehicle rationalizations or designs we do in the future. We might even be able to aim towards things like interoperability standards with them, or at least a coherent chain of command to interface with them before Biel-Tan shows up.
Fairly new to the quest, sorry if I missed a discussion about what Vau-Vulkesh's doctrine is/should be!
 
Strange9 said:
Fairly new to the quest, sorry if I missed a discussion about what Vau-Vulkesh's doctrine is/should be!
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"Wearable tanks and BFGs for everyone"

or

"We don't like fighting and we aren't very good at it, so we're going to put our people in wearable tanks so they are immune to most threats, and huge guns that can annihilate the target even if they can't hit the broad side of a barn."
 
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Strange9 said:
Fairly new to the quest, sorry if I missed a discussion about what Vau-Vulkesh's doctrine is/should be!
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Due to our industry to actual military size.

We have a very strong incentive to throw give the detachments we can raise (AP issue not the cost of the gear) get the best stuff we can give them.

And with the info we got on how the retrofit action works, max sized squads for everything + some restrictions like every squad has 1 type of armor.

Overall, in the end we will be the craftworld with a very heavily mechanized warhost and lots of stuff at the super heavy end I think.
Why go for a normal tank when you can go for a super heavy one that does the same job just better. Even if it cost like 3-4 times as much mid/long term we most likely don't care as both the normal and super heavy tank take 1 slot in the detachment.
 
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I really hope that Zahr-Tann is willing to share their combi-grav and explosives technology with us.
 
Anyway, given that we do now have a lot of defense, I think it might be worthwhile to finally crack open that vault, see if there's something useful in it, rather than do refits immediately?
 
10ebbor10 said:
Anyway, given that we do now have a lot of defense, I think it might be worthwhile to finally crack open that vault, see if there's something useful in it, rather than do refits immediately?
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We're currently cracking one open this turn. The other four will cost steward AP, and we should be able to shake loose at least some of it next turn - we need at least one to deploy tanks, I'd like another to help fix some more armor stupidity in our militia, and we should design a cruiser for refitting purposes, but that still leaves lots.
 
10ebbor10 said:
Anyway, given that we do now have a lot of defense, I think it might be worthwhile to finally crack open that vault, see if there's something useful in it, rather than do refits immediately?
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I am more inclined to say that now that we have enough defense any number of refits will be mostly meaningless, we should be returning to the rationalization and design projects. Ideally we will be able to avoid refitting things ever again and just hide behind our ally until we finish designing and building a semi-reasonable military. I know that's not realistic but it's closer than it was.

We can slide an AP to the vaults now and then, but we still have a huge amount of design work ahead of us- most of the navy, all small craft, and at least half the army.
 
DarkLight140 said:
I am more inclined to say that now that we have enough defense any number of refits will be mostly meaningless, we should be returning to the rationalization and design projects. Ideally we will be able to avoid refitting things ever again and just hide behind our ally until we finish designing and building a semi-reasonable military. I know that's not realistic but it's closer than it was.

We can slide an AP to the vaults now and then, but we still have a huge amount of design work ahead of us- most of the navy, all small craft, and at least half the army.
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The rationalization designs are still in the phase of do them and you can redo them next turn.
We just have too much tech open that will get added over the next few turns.

The only part that isn't hit by that as strongly is the navy.
 
I've been with a few vehicle designs and thought that I'd share the fusion mortar ones and see what everyone thinks.

Cloudkill
-[] skimmer
-[] heavy slot: 1 heavy fusion mortar
-[] 1 ranged slot: sunrifle
-[] 1 ranged slot: Needler Rifle
-[] 2 system slots: Holo-field
-[] 3 system slots: grav-shield

Pyroclast
-[] light grav-vehicle
-[] trade in 6 system slots for 1 vehicle slot
-[] 2 vehicle slots: 2 vehicle fusion mortars
-[] 1 heavy slot: heavy needler
-[] 1 heavy slot: spike cannon
-[] trade in 1 system slots for 1 ranged slot
-[] 1 ranged slot: Needler Rifle
-[] 2 system slots: Holo-field
-[] 3 system slots: grav-shield

Dawn Hammer
-[] heavy grav-vehicle
-[] trade in 30 system slots for 1 superheavy slot
-[] 2 superheavy slots: 2 superheavy fusion mortars
-[] 2 heavy slots: 2 Fatecaster Rifle
-[] 2 ranged slots: 2 Starblaster Rifles
-[] trade in 2 vehicle slots for 8 system slots
-[] 2 system slots: Holo-field
-[] 6 system slots: 2 grav-shields
 
Yeah, I think Zahr-Tann gives us what we need in the short-term to survive as we pivot from emergency builds into building our future, and we can focus primarily on readying ourselves for the days ahead. They're strong and have managed to update their gear to an extent--though I think they're still a tier beneath us in general techwise @Mechanis ? I don't get the impression that Flare Shields match our upcoming Regenerating Conversion Fields for instance, which recover reasonably quickly and don't have to dump protective value to get that high cycle time, and their Pulse Shields look like a straight downgrade from Grav-Shields as they're only active for a moment and fail against non-physical munitions (While Grav-Shields work against anything except--presumably--pure Warp based weapons, and likely have a chance even against those based on the fact that Gravity is consistently one of the few forces that can influence across the Veil)
 
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The engines are priority, but we can't finish them in a single turn anyway,

Plan Engines, Halls, and a Seer Circle.
- The Minor Failures 2 AP
- Replacing Primary Power Distribution 4 AP
- Hall of Stewardship 2 AP
- Seer Circle 4 AP
-- Forge of Vault to shorten time.

This lets us lower difficulty on seer actions(critical to flaw resolution) centralize stewardship, and begin repairing the engine with a decent commitment.
Mechanis said:
Whilst your fleet is beginning to be stretched thin, evacuating the Ishari from Fea-Eresh is, it is felt, something best started now. Civilian transport ships are already organizing for the necessary convoys, but at least a small naval escort will be needed, if for no other reason than to buy time for the convoy to escape in the event of attack, however unlikely.

[ ] Assign Escort Ships
Determine how many ships you can assign to this duty, and thus how many convoys can be run at the same time.
Each convoy needs one (1) capital ship and four (4) Escorts. A maximum of five (5) convoys can be run at the same time before it becomes inefficient to add more.
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We can also increase our Fea-eresh commitment to the max. We should include one trimere transport for manpower and the extra cargo space, as well as the greater defense array to ward off attackers.

With over 500 escort frigates under our command, we can increase our webway scouting ten fold easily.

For stewardship, I'm still in favor of a new light cruiser model for 6 AP and finishing the remaining vault exploration with 4 AP.

Thoughts?
 
Skjadir said:
The rationalization designs are still in the phase of do them and you can redo them next turn.
We just have too much tech open that will get added over the next few turns.

The only part that isn't hit by that as strongly is the navy.
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And one of the things we can expect from the Vaults is tech projects.

I'd like to at least know what stuff we're leaving on the table.
 
Alectai said:
I think they're still a tier beneath us in general
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Seems like, yeah. Nothing in there requires exotics.

Personally, if we're doing rationalization, I think we might want another two or more Troops options. The previous set were made with, uh, assumptions that I don't think have held up. Also, we didn't previously have rending blades, which are a big upgrade for our cheap melee option.
 
Yeah, update our Guardian squad designs with our new tech, and maybe do a pass on our Forge series 'Professional Troops' to give them better melee options, and get ready to be able to start actually making modernized Detachments.
 
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10ebbor10 said:
And one of the things we can expect from the Vaults is tech projects.

I'd like to at least know what stuff we're leaving on the table.
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I mean i am not arguing against the vault actions here.
I am saying we should let our ground forces be for a few turns until we don't have tech coming in each turn that we very much want in the squads and detachments.

And then design our entire army in 1-2 turns with the focus of most of our steward ap.
 
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Skjadir said:
I mean i am not arguing against the vault actions here.
I am saying we should let our ground forces be for a few turns until we don't have tech coming in each turn that we very much want in the squads and detachments.
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I think we should do at least 1 gear factory. Pick something that we know we're probably not going to be replacing all that soon or need a lot of (maybe Mirage Transports, maybe?).

That way, we can see and understand how effective our production infrastructure is.
 
10ebbor10 said:
I think we should do at least 1 gear factory. Pick something that we know we're probably not going to be replacing all that soon or need a lot of (maybe Mirage Transports, maybe?).

That way, we can see and understand how effect our production infrastructure is.
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I would pick our heavy power armor.

Mirage will likely get replaced sadly as we do our troops.

The info we got about the system pretty much means that any squad design we have below max size us wasting power for no reason.
 
10ebbor10 said:
I think we should do at least 1 gear factory. Pick something that we know we're probably not going to be replacing all that soon or need a lot of (maybe Mirage Transports, maybe?).

That way, we can see and understand how effective our production infrastructure is.
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Three factories.

One for needlers
One for spikes
One for an armor type we know will be widely used.
 
Skjadir said:
The rationalization designs are still in the phase of do them and you can redo them next turn.
We just have too much tech open that will get added over the next few turns.

The only part that isn't hit by that as strongly is the navy.
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There are a ton of things which we could reasonably build this turn that we won't need to redo, though. I can think of three speeder designs off the top of my head- transport for a six-man squad, fusion mortar gun carrier, singularity gun carrier- which could be designed next turn and not need revision until we start building militarized chassis types, probably a century or more from now. A simple heavy jetbike refit that just adds a holofield to our existing design is another. A small craft interceptor design that throws defenses onto our extremely vulnerable fighters would be a good move, too.

There are definitely things we aren't ready for, but there are also things that we are ready for and could spend the design points on right now to good effect.
 
DarkLight140 said:
There are a ton of things which we could reasonably build this turn that we won't need to redo, though. I can think of three speeder designs off the top of my head- transport for a six-man squad, fusion mortar gun carrier, singularity gun carrier- which could be designed next turn and not need revision until we start building militarized chassis types, probably a century or more from now. A simple heavy jetbike refit that just adds a holofield to our existing design is another. A small craft interceptor design that throws defenses onto our extremely vulnerable fighters would be a good move, too.

There are definitely things we aren't ready for, but there are also things that we are ready for and could spend the design points on right now to good effect.
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Thing is next thing we likely do if given any chance is to a new armor for our vehicle operators.
That we can then just copy paste on all of them when designing new vehicles, just as an example.
 
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