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A Different Breed (Warhammer 29K)

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[x] Plan Two Anvils One Militia Warhost
-[x] 2x Star Anvil Superheavy Assault Tank, 1300 EP each, total 2600 EP
-[x] 109x Needler Carbine, 4 EP each, total 436 EP
-[x] 7x Starblaser Carbine, 8 EP each, total 56 EP
-[x] 84x Needler Rifle, 6 EP each, total 504 EP
-[x] 12x Heavy Needler, 10 EP each, total 120 EP
-[x] 6x Spike Cannon, 12 EP each, total 72 EP
-[x] 202x Void Guard Warsuit, 6 EP each, total 1212 EP
Next turn we will
- refit 2nd Heavy Militia Hearthguard Line Detachment with 2 Anvils and 1 Blazestar instead of 3 Blazestars;
- refit all 4th Militia detachments
- Militia Assault Squads, Militia Marines Squad, Bright Talon squads and all Hearthguards in VGW
- all the rest infantry and jetbikers in Brigantine
- all jetbikers get needler carbines
- Militia Fire Squads in Militia Heavy detachment get 4x Heavy Needlers, 2x Spike cannons, 4x Needler Carbines
- Militia Fire Squads in Assault detachment switch 7 lasrifles to 7 Starblaster carbines
- Militia Fire Squads in other detachment switch 7 lasrifles to 7 needler rifles

Refits AP costs will be 1 refit point for tanks, 7x2=14 refit points for a 4th Militia warhost for a total of 3 stewards AP.
There will be 36 VGWs extra to keep for the next turn or sprinkle among fire squads, and one needler carbine to pad it to 5000 EP.

edit: I assumed moratorium has ended, sorry, removing the vote
edit2: edited the vote back
edit3:
Based on discussion with Karugus, I changed the plan to
- specialize heavy militia detachment at holding chokepoints, giving their fire squads more heavy weapons
- specialize assault detachment's fire squad on being runny and killy, giving them starblaster carbine
- changed jebikers' armaments with a needler carbine because it's likely they won't be able to field a rifle. We were not allowed to give jetbiker a rifle when we were designing the crew for it.
 
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LOLROFL said:
I'm baffled as to how you keep insisting that me arguing that Biel Tan could potentially use some war seer to provide their own artillery with more effective corrected counter-battery fire means that somehow I am pitting our artillery solely against their entire warhost.
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I...don't see where he made that argument. Point it out to me?

EDIT:
[x] Plan Two Anvils One Militia Warhost
[X] Long on the Longarms
 
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Also folks please I'm begging you to cut down on number of different kinds of weapons. 3 weapons systems is what we can distribute in one refit, and the leading plan is fielding four. Let's have one in each tactical role. Either all in starblaster carbines or needlers, we don't need AP hell later trying to figure out what to do with extra weapon system that doesn't fit in one pass.

And I really don't see an appeal of building a stockpile when next turn we'll have what, 3x more weapons, some of which are more suitable for general distribution?

Mechanis said:
No major attack has pressed against Meros during this period—instead, a most worrying sign appears, for the Orks have been skirmishing, sending small parties that do not commit to a battle but instead poke and prod at the fleet there. This means only one thing: facing Meros now is the most dangerous manner of Ork: one who has learned patience, and a manner of rudimentary tactical skill—and been able to browbeat his subordinates into employing it.
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That's good though? There's a good chance next turn Meros will just skedaddle to our general area of space so we can join defenses. Current Meros predicament is exactly where unsophisticated ork tactics work better.
 
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[X] Long on the Longarms
[X] Plan Oh shit there were supposed to be 200 voidguard suits in that plan fuuuuc-

vsh said:
That's good though? There's a good chance next turn Meros will just skedaddle to our general area of space so we can join defenses. Current Meros predicament is exactly where unsophisticated ork tactics work better.
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No, it is not good, because that means the Orks will make a big push the next turn.
And given the ETA for Meros I don't think the chance for them to get finished next turn is going to be high.

They might also start applying (some) strategy instead of trying to ram into the nearest ships.
 
DecaffeinatedOwl said:
Is this targeted towards, say, retrofitting the Iron Fist? That's our heavy armour warhost, insofar as we have one.
I'd run the math, but I can't get @vsh's warhost refitting generator to cooperate with me and I don't have the spoons to make a spreadsheet. Maybe tomorrow.
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The basic idea is that while large-scale rollout of infantry gear all over is great, we do need a concentration of toughness and major punch somewhere that we can rely on to just win in whatever location we drop it. So we should have one more modern-mechanized warhost to accomplish that. The Iron Fist is a great choice, so I'll run its numbers, but vehicles are really expensive- we simply can't manage to even meaningfully begin the warhost refit for just 5000 EP.

If we drop the four Hearthguard Skirmish Detachments and focus on the other three detachments we can manage it, though. We can replace the attack barges and needlestorms with 5 Mirages (similar carrying capacity), plus the 6 blazestars with 6 Starhammers, for 910+2280 EP. There are 133 personnel not crewing the replaced vehicles in those three detachments, so that many void guard suits comes to 798 EP. Six psykers in the warcasting circle, which we're putting in ithilmar as standard, comes to 138 EP. The three detachments are absolutely well-off enough in their weapons except for the single Militia Fire Squad, so just plan to replace all their lasrifles with Starblaster Carbines at 8 EP each for now, 56 EP total. That brings us to 4182 EP.

Unfortunately, armoring the 176 people in the detachments that we ignored on vehicles we're not planning to replace will take more EP than we've got left, but we can build 136 suits- most of what they'll need. This plan will leave us with the Iron Fist mostly refit but needing another 10 Mirages and 40 Void Guard suits to be built to finish them off before the refit can be completed, and that's before addressing the replacement of all the jetbikes and skimmers. But overall, the warhost would be in a far better place as our heavy fist.

The plan would look like:

[ ] Iron Fist Near-Refit
-[ ] Mirage Hover-Transport x5 (910 EP)
-[ ] Starhammer Battle Tank x6 (2280 EP)
-[ ] Void Guard Warsuit x269 (1614 EP)
-[ ] Ithilmar Assault Suit x6 (138 EP)
-[ ] Starblaster Carbine x7 (56 EP)
 
Mechanis said:
Exotic gravity weapons that fire distinctive black beams of gravetic force that can punch through nearly anything without resistance, Graviton Thrusters are the terror of any armored unit with known weakpoints—their beams may be thin and their range limited, but very, very few materials can resist these weapons at all.

Type: Ranged
Equipment Points cost: 7
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Oh my god look at that price, it's cheaper than our starblasters and has even more armour penetration than an equivalent weapon, and they might even be able to punch up above their weight class if they aim well. (Plus space marine weakpoints usually tend to be their heads, and the autotargeters could really help us with our accuracy to that end)

Dear god the rending blades, they're only 8ep! And plasma pistols are only 2! We could make some NASTY assault infantry (rending blades, plasma pistols, Void Guard armour) for only 16EP each (that's literally cheaper than a single Ithilmar suit!)

Mechanis said:
Unlike smaller graviton-thruster weaponry, Graviton Thruster Lances have significantly less limited range, being comparable to the average range of other energy weapons of similar scale—this makes these rare and exotic devices extremely dangerous even in relatively small numbers.
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I think we might have found our naval lance equivalent weaponry for our ships (and I am positively drooling at the shinies right now)

Mechanis said:
Point Singularity Projectors
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Oh I have no idea what these could be used for (flak batteries or macrocannons maybe?) But they are gorgeous, these / amplifier bombards could be a macrocannon equivalent if we wanted to field an exotics free ship.

Mechanis said:
No major attack has pressed against Meros during this period—instead, a most worrying sign appears, for the Orks have been skirmishing, sending small parties that do not commit to a battle but instead poke and prod at the fleet there. This means only one thing: facing Meros now is the most dangerous manner of Ork: one who has learned patience, and a manner of rudimentary tactical skill—and been able to browbeat his subordinates into employing it.
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Aaaand that's what I'm worried about, an Ork that can think is probably one of the worst things Meros can face right now and we need to pray that they can fix their engines soon (as in, next turn), otherwise we might be screwed.

As soon as we've fought off BT, Meros is fixed and we unfucked our warhosts, we NEED to kill off this warboss by any means necessary (full orbital bombardment, scrying, etc)

dgr11897 said:
Thruster Lances apparently mostly lose the low range drawback, and scale all the way up to heavy naval. Tbh I could see them being a new standard heavy naval weapon. Because spaceships generally don't like big holes getting put in them. Especially if we follow up with explosive weapons or fatecaster fire into the hole.
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Maybe something like:

[ ] Grav-Ketch
-[ ] 1 Heavy Thruster Lance
-[ ] 2-3x Fatetwister Cannons

To act as a sidegrade to our war-ketches, but maybe we can use a version like this one:

[ ] 1x Heavy Thruster Lance
[ ] 2-3x Amplifier Bombard/Point Singularity Projectors

To go fully exotics free / save them for our high end capital ships (brigs need ~1k crystals per mega-lance, those can add up quickly).
 
vsh said:
I like the plan, but Iron Fist is deployed and can't be refit next turn. Maybe delay it a turn?
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Hm, I'd thought that we were expecting them back by the end of this turn for some reason. Well, no matter, there are other plans on the table... and being aggressively voted for even though we're not supposed for vote for another 40 minutes, it seems.
 
DarkLight140 said:
Hm, I'd thought that we were expecting them back by the end of this turn for some reason. Well, no matter, there are other plans on the table... and being aggressively voted for even though we're not supposed for vote for another 40 minutes, it seems.
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Or right, I'm sorry about that. People started voting and I assumed the moratorium has ended.
Iron Fist is hunting Val-Terrine's attacker which might end next turn or take another five years for all we know.
 
BigFungus26 said:
Oh I have no idea what these could be used for (flak batteries or macrocannons maybe?) But they are gorgeous, these / amplifier bombards could be a macrocannon equivalent if we wanted to field an exotics free ship.
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I'd also take a look at Vibration weapons if you're looking into Naval Stuff. Melting entire sections of enemy ships at short range is their MO and it's fairly terrifying.
 
vsh said:
We can make Caravels really good with this.
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[ ] Grav-Caravel
-[ ] 1x Heavy Thruster Lance
-[ ] 2x Point Singularity Projectors, 2x Amplifier Bombards

Maybe something like this could be a good heavy-hitting light cruiser for our fleet, coupled with a screening force of War Ketches to help peel enemy shields and (hopefully) using their fatecaster batteries to point out the best spots for the Caravel to shoot on an enemy warship

Obvious downside to this design is that its gonna need an escort of ketches or some other shield-popping force to clear the way for them, but for a light cruiser it could punch high above its weight class (cruisers) once we've sufficiently peeled the target.
 
vsh said:
We can make Caravels really good with this.
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Yeah, the Caravels are in for a massive upgrade when we get to redesigning them.
Something to keep in mind the Thruster Lances not only do very bad things to armor, they also outright ignore most types of shields going by the info we have of the gravity shields.
 
[x] Plan Two Anvils One Militia Warhost
Alright, Here we go.
Side note I have an idea. So apparently Imploders and Amplifiers work really well together, and both have heavy naval variants, and a special naval slot can fit 2 heavy naval batteries. So that's a fun option.
 
BigFungus26 said:
Oh my god look at that price, it's cheaper than our starblasters and has even more armour penetration than an equivalent weapon, and they might even be able to punch up above their weight class if they aim well.
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The Real Question is how long does this thing fire its beam? Give it a Second maybe? A Pencil thin beam for a Second.... now sweep from left to right...
 
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I wonder if we could develop a Naval Special scale Singularity Projector. Straight up fire a small, ish, black hole into an enemy fleet. Should disrupt their formation and I really would not want to be in front of that thing.
 
dgr11897 said:
I wonder if we could develop a Naval Special scale Singularity Projector. Straight up fire a small, ish, black hole into an enemy fleet. Should disrupt their formation and I really would not want to be in front of that thing.
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I'm thinking about Amploder gun, combo amplifier + imploder. Amplify gravity 3x then make it collapse on itself for 10x more. Or combo amplifier + singularity, which should be a nova equivalent.
 
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