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To Boldly Go... (a Starfleet quest)

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To Boldly Go... (a Starfleet quest) Starfleet Ship Design Bureau, Refit ("To Boldly Go...")
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SynchronizedWritersBlock said:
It's scouting drills. The Caitians will be involved in rallying but not really in scouting. Their inclusion over the Apiata makes no sense.
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Caitians have a similar wolf pack doctrine and force composition. They need the experience with other members. We've already used the Apiata a ton in war games. Plus, they're nowhere near the Seyek, which again makes less sense for inclusion than the Caitians.

Think of this as not only seeing capabilities, but adding experience. Caitians need the most and are similar enough anyways.
 
SynchronizedWritersBlock said:
Yes. If we do not fulfill a role within five years (in practice due to turn delays, four years), the Council starts asking questions and we get penalized.
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So If we were to update the Science Frigate stats to be inline with Kepler, there would be no drawback as long as the prototype was finished within 5 years? (and same again with Heavy Explorer reqs)


Also with the Able Archer in Space plan, can you add an Orion ship to the red team? Anything we can do to help their readiness would be worthwhile.
 
I am not paying goddamn 17pp for a wargame. The wargae I proposed last year ended up being a useless drain of points; let's not repeat the mistake. I fear SWB over-reaches and merely voting []SWB is a bad idea that abrogates responsibility.

[X][ROLES] Do Nothing [2.0x Weighting on this vote]
[X][WG] A 2v2 with any Ships, including member world ships, (a gaeni tech-cruiser vs. two caitian swarmers)

17pp! And we are going to have a lot ot purchase at this year's snakepit. All sorts of tactical options.

[X][REPORT] A different possible War Scenario: Limited warfare with Harmony of Horizon attempting to reclaim to Tauni.
 
MS-21H 'Hawke' said:
Wasn't there a discussion about us having to update the Frigate requirements now or in the near future at some point?
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The Generalist Frigate yes. Combat frigate has been judged to be an obsolete concept; since a good combat frigate is basically a generalist, why not make it so and thus not have to pay Militarization?

TyrialFrost said:
* Waystations ?what are these?
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We have a category of stations called just that, "Stations." I've seen stats before but can't remember where. They stat out to smaller outposts, basically. We have 2 in the GBZ.
 
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SynchronizedWritersBlock said:
No, as both ships are past research stage, if we update the requirements, we would have to produce a new ship.
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Okay so the Roles vote is only for creating new Ship classes?

If we pushed up the Reqs on one of the roles, could that work to prompt a refit option? (sorry i have no idea how we trigger a refit option)

The other change I can think of is telling them to remove the combat frigate role.

Shame we cant ask for a Heavy Cruiser role and just set the reqs at Excelsior-A levels.
 
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[X][ROLES] Do Nothing [2.0x Weighting on this vote]
[X][WG] A 2v2 with any Ships, including member world ships, (a gaeni tech-cruiser vs. two caitian swarmers)

This should help us plan for the horizon. And it sounds like the mwco will have options for Andor/Caitian cooperation. As for the Indoria they already know they need to modernize their fleets and have started to do so.
 
For the wargame, I was thinking 2x Miranda-As and an Excelsior vs. 2x Centaur-As and an Excelsior to do a study on the role of scout sensors in fleet operations, given we are having a lot of discussions of that for next frigate design use.

Should be 6pp.
 
Iron Wolf said:
Caitians have a similar wolf pack doctrine and force composition. They need the experience with other members. We've already used the Apiata a ton in war games. Plus, they're nowhere near the Seyek, which again makes less sense for inclusion than the Caitians.

Think of this as not only seeing capabilities, but adding experience. Caitians need the most and are similar enough anyways.
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I just don't really see what role they can play. The scenario is premised on inactivity to start. Caitian ships aren't going to reach the CBZ unless we pre-position them. We could have them pretend to be Apiata ships on that frontier, but that would probably be something of an insult to the Apiata.

Briefvoice said:
I am not paying goddamn 17pp for a wargame. The wargae I proposed last year ended up being a useless drain of points; let's not repeat the mistake. I fear SWB over-reaches and merely voting []SWB is a bad idea that abrogates responsibility.

[X][ROLES] Do Nothing [2.0x Weighting on this vote]
[X][WG] A 2v2 with any Ships, including member world ships, (a gaeni tech-cruiser vs. two caitian swarmers)

17pp! And we are going to have a lot ot purchase at this year's snakepit. All sorts of tactical options.

[X][REPORT] A different possible War Scenario: Limited warfare with Harmony of Horizon attempting to reclaim to Tauni.
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It would be worth 17pp if we could convince the Indorians to upgrade their ships, and that's only one of the likely results.
 
SynchronizedWritersBlock said:
I just don't really see what role they can play. The scenario is premised on inactivity to start. Caitian ships aren't going to reach the CBZ unless we pre-position them. We could have them pretend to be Apiata ships on that frontier, but that would probably be something of an insult to the Apiata.


It would be worth 17pp if we could convince the Indorians to upgrade their ships, and that's only one of the likely results.
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The Indoria s already know they need better ships. They have been in the process of doing so.

Edit mid term priority last MWCO was refit and listed as underway
 
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SynchronizedWritersBlock said:
Yes. If we do not fulfill a role within five years (in practice due to turn delays, four years), the Council starts asking questions and we get penalized.
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@SynchronizedWritersBlock and while we're at it @Nix ...

Important question. We've got several proposed ship design ideas in the foreseeable future that have gotten a lot of discussion- particularly the combat frigate, generalist frigate, and heavy cruiser.

In what years do you foresee it being practical to design a good, solid ship in each of those categories? Knowing ahead of time would be nice, because I'm starting to get a bit antsy about how much we're talking about the need to design better ships, knowing our rivals are doing the same, and having us vote "do nothing" on the tactical role. I understand that it may not be wise for us to start a new role right this minute, but I'd at least like to see some numbers about when it probably WILL be wise to do so.

TyrialFrost said:
Okay so the Roles vote is only for creating new Ship classes?

If we pushed up the Reqs on one of the roles, could that work to prompt a refit option? (sorry i have no idea how we trigger a refit option)
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Literally every ship class we have, except the Oberth, is either brand new or has received a refit recently. I doubt we're going to get any more refits any time soon.

Shame we cant ask for a Heavy Cruiser role and just set the reqs at Excelsior-A levels.
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If we did that, we wouldn't be able to fill the requirements for several years, and the Council would get pissed at us for trying to design a ship that couldn't meet the requirements we set for it. Come to think of it, that's pretty much exactly what happened to Admiral Rogers...
 
Agree that a large, focused fleet exercise, especially one with PP specifically attached to it, should have political fallout that we can use to our advantage. That's basically what spending PP on it means, right? That it's big enough to draw political attention?
 
Void Stalker said:
It is in the last mwco under medium term. Also it is part of why they have two Renissance under constriction. They do have the Large Escort class which is a Miranda-A with +1 combat.
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A large exercise at this point would contribute significantly to their refit projects. I don't see that as a downside, and I don't see the current Indorian feet paradigm as viable anyway so we better get some proper experience in.
 
Simon_Jester said:
@SynchronizedWritersBlock and while we're at it @Nix ...

Important question. We've got several proposed ship design ideas in the foreseeable future that have gotten a lot of discussion- particularly the combat frigate, generalist frigate, and heavy cruiser.

In what years do you foresee it being practical to design a good, solid ship in each of those categories? Knowing ahead of time would be nice, because I'm starting to get a bit antsy about how much we're talking about the need to design better ships, knowing our rivals are doing the same, and having us vote "do nothing" on the tactical role. I understand that it may not be wise for us to start a new role right this minute, but I'd at least like to see some numbers about when it probably WILL be wise to do so.
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The best timing would be 1.5y in advance. So if we can sketch a design not for next Snakepit but for the one after, then we should order it that Tactical Operations so that we have the opportunity to modify it once if we don't like the exact requirements that come out. In addition, a 1.5y window is more than enough to predict exactly what research would be available. I can't currently say exactly what research will be available for the later years in our window for the next few designs, so I can't make a year prediction, but I can say that it's beyond the predictable window and therefore we should sit tight this year.

In addition, the sweeping tactical review is an outlier that basically changes everything, and we should order it the turn before we order our next ship design project.
 
charysa said:
Let's hope this Able Archer doesn't cause problems with the Cardassians like the RL one did with the USSR.
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"My Fellow Federation Citizens.

Today I have passed legislation that outlaws Cardassia Forever.

We begin bombing in five minutes"

"Uhh...... President N'Gir. Ma'am. This stream is live"
 
Simon_Jester said:
@SynchronizedWritersBlock and while we're at it @Nix ...

Important question. We've got several proposed ship design ideas in the foreseeable future that have gotten a lot of discussion- particularly the combat frigate, generalist frigate, and heavy cruiser.
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Going to Echo Simon here, trying to create a roadmap for when we want to upgrade the role requirements and/or add new roles. and, again, given that this sort of vote is more an expression of intent, we cou

I am going to agree with Briefvoice about the wargame. To be honest, we should also start putting things in place in case the Harmony of Horizon tries anything.
Let's be brutally honest, if they are as we seem to think they are, IF we go to war with Cardassia... that might be the moment they try something overt.

Now, on the report, I think we need to start shoring up some of our weak spots, the Orions need better readiness, and we will probably need to expend some efforts to ensure they are somewhat prepared.
Seyek induction into the Federation and increasing their readiness should be a priority for us, short term.
We should also work with the Qloath here.

But Seyek and Orions seem to be our biggest weak points atm
 
[Jk][WG] 1v1: K'Tinga vs a Renaissance.
[Jk][REPORT] A different possible War Scenario: invading the Klingons, with Rihan as our ally

My ears are perfectly normal, I assure you.
 
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We know nothing about the Horizon ships, Horizon planets, Horizon fleet bases, defenses, nothing. A tactical report that includes them will be useless and say nothing. We were barely able to get a useful Diplomatic Posture report! The level of detail here in the readiness report is multiple orders of magnitude beyond that. We simply don't have the information available.
 
If you want data on the Horizon, might try asking the ISC? Their diplomats apparently recognize Horizon ships on sight, and if they have fought a war in the past they're likely digging out and refreshing old tactical reports as we speak.
 
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