Resonant
Procrastinator Supreme
Possible typo inconsistency: this is either Milita or Milit(sa).
Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest
- Thread starter Boney
- Start date
- Fantasy Users' Choice!
Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
The Phoenixian
The Glacier Witch
- Location
- My own little world
The more I think of it, the more I like Runelord to Runelord. Not just in and of itself, but also as a model for such discussions in the future.
It seems fitting if agents of the Project from each contributor can ask their organizations and polities for relevant information.
Meanwhile, Karak to Karak feels like kind of lacks that prototypical level, even if Belegar is reasonably likely to be able to get an answer.
(Okri to Okri and Empire to Empire meanwhile, both still have that level, it's just that in the first case it means Mathilde, herself, who builds up a relationship and leverages it to attain information, while in the second it weighs on the treaty.)
It seems fitting if agents of the Project from each contributor can ask their organizations and polities for relevant information.
Meanwhile, Karak to Karak feels like kind of lacks that prototypical level, even if Belegar is reasonably likely to be able to get an answer.
(Okri to Okri and Empire to Empire meanwhile, both still have that level, it's just that in the first case it means Mathilde, herself, who builds up a relationship and leverages it to attain information, while in the second it weighs on the treaty.)
ReaperofInterest
Herald of Disaster
Regarding Waystones for Kislev, while we will obviously need to survey the place to get an idea of how the energy pathways and local network are set up, I think we could handle Kislev quite well with two types of Waystones, including our first design. Our New Waystones can go on the rivers to serve as emergency Dhar ejection routes, while we could build a simpler version to serve as support structures/effective plug-ins for the network. After all, there are only...what, 3 major rivers in Kislev? Some simpler Waystones that don't have the riverine transmission component will be just as effective, while taking less effort to put together.
Yes, that is the possibility. However I don't think Thorgrim has turned the Eyes on on his own. Someone in the guild has to know something as well. Maybe not the whole truth, but close enough.
I mean sure it would be ideal if Kragg both has the information and is willing to give it to Thorek, but I see no indication of either of those things being true. Kragg did not really like Thorek to begin with and his actions over the span of the quest would only make that dislike deepen:
- Playing politics with elves/organizing trade routes
- Playing politics with imperials for those keys
- Playing politics with other dwarfs over the fate of Dum
The throne is literally a control panel. I see no reason why he could not turn it on himself.
My proposal is that whoever taught Zlata is insane.
Ljiljana mentioned that Zlata could have participated in the battle. Her comment about Nadezhda might imply that Zlata knows battle magic? It would be weird for Ljiljana to point Zlata as someone who could go to battle if she can't do battlefield-scale magic.
Actually come to think of it is really weird of Ljiljana to keep Zlata in a magic research project with Baba Niedzwenka. Ljiljana would absolutely throw someone who doesn't know battle magic into battle. Zlata could just know less magic than Nadezhda, who at least can do a little bit of battlefield-scale magic.
I came up this idea completely seriously, before I started picking more holes in it and it became more of a joke. Right now I am just confused. Who was the person worse than Zlata? Was it Nadezhda? If it was, maybe Zlata does know battle magic? It would make sense if it was Nadezhda. She had greater odds of being the Ice Witch present than all the others. She seems to... admire Boris enough that it seems likely for her to have been in the city at the time. But how good at battle magic could Zlata be for Nadezhda be 'worse' than her? Nadezhda is a full Ice Witch. (though yeah, the dice rolls aren't exact lists what is better) (also it could have been someone else entirely)
I always thought that was weird. It makes you wonder how it happened. The Kings of the Karaz Ankor would have needed to know for them to be willing to make nexuses out of their Karaks and waystones out of their mountains. But the King of Karak Azul doesn't know. They were some of the best at preserving rune-lore if I remember correctly. How did they forget? Like Kazador probably would have told Thorek or Mathilde at some point.
I'd guess that the Time of Woes made them lose the knowledge, but this seems a bit extreme even for that.
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It's not really weird at all, the vast majority of casters that participate in battles don't know battle magic.
Aranfan
Team Plasma Grunt
As far as "stuff only a king is cleared to know" goes, all it takes is a single king dying in battle before he can finish passing all his secrets to his heir to break the chain. That happened a lot during the time of woes.
That one's a freebie, so it doesn't make sense to pick it on its own. Mathilde can argue that alongside whichever method is chosen.
- Location
- Washington
We have not directly gone "hey let's start setting up tributaries, Laurelorn" but Laurelorn has basically already gotten what they originally wanted out of the project, which was tributaries that do not involve a bunch of gold and silver under a tree, and at any time Laurelorn Project Member Cadaeth can start installing the dreaming woods tributaries she herself developed. That's a deliverable.
- Location
- Earth
- Pronouns
- She/Her/They/Them
[X] Karak to Karak
[X] Guild to Guild
[X] Guild to Guild
- Pronouns
- He
The Forestborn are probably an extremely large talent pool for performing the Dreaming Wood tributary, if they learn Lingua.
Regarding the organization of Ice Witches;
(I'm a bit drunk)
From what I've gathered, at the moment it's like Discworld. Just like the witches books follow Granny Weatherwax and co. (But imply there are a bunch more Witches scattered across the Ramtops), every Oblast probably has a decentralized cadre of Ice Witches.
In comparison, the Colleges are more like the Unseen University, where they draw their talent pool from across the continent and train them there.
Regarding the organization of Ice Witches;
(I'm a bit drunk)
From what I've gathered, at the moment it's like Discworld. Just like the witches books follow Granny Weatherwax and co. (But imply there are a bunch more Witches scattered across the Ramtops), every Oblast probably has a decentralized cadre of Ice Witches.
In comparison, the Colleges are more like the Unseen University, where they draw their talent pool from across the continent and train them there.
- Location
- Outside the Box
- Pronouns
- She/Her
I don't think that's going to happen on its own. I think we have to spend the AP to make it happen.
- Location
- Alaska
For Laurelorn, I'm guessing the Queen already thinks the project is a huge success. What with her political enemies getting sidelined, Dwarven trade becoming a thing for the first time in thousands of years, Tor Lithanel being able to expand to keep the cityborn happy, and the Imperial passports possibly acting as a kind of pressure release valve for tensions with the forestborn.
From her point of view, getting new waystones might just be a nice bonus.
I wouldn't hate it if Laurelorn got the first waystone, but I don't think they have anything to complain about.
From her point of view, getting new waystones might just be a nice bonus.
I wouldn't hate it if Laurelorn got the first waystone, but I don't think they have anything to complain about.
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- Location
- New Brunswick, NJ
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
Unfortunately, we do not actually know this is true. We haven't studied the Kislev network; we don't know that the modding the Ice Witches of the past did to the leylines and nexuses of Kislev to create their ice vortex hasn't broken the ability to plug in via Anoqeyan control codes. I think investigating Kislev is a high priority for next turn for this reason.
- Location
- Deep in a bog
[X] Karak to Karak
- Location
- Washington
I don't think it's going to happen on it's own very QUICKLY but like, if Mathilde dropped dead right now, Cadaeth would hardly forget about the replacement tributary she personally made, when that was literally what she went into the project wanting to get out of it.
[X] Okri to Okri
[X] Karak to Karak
[X] Karak to Karak
ReaperofInterest
Herald of Disaster
Ah...ok, fair enough point. And yeah, I'm fine with investing our AP into looking into Kislev next turn. We can still design a simpler version of the Waystone next turn though, since we're doin something similar this turn. And if it turns out that any Kislev-specific Waystones need some extra modifications...then that's admittedly a bit annoying, but we currently have a fully functional design, and can use that as a starting point to figure the issue out.
What's the reason you say that? I would say that the majority of casters just don't participate in large-scale battles. Personally I think it is more likely that casters participating in battles where the Tzar is bringing a rota would likely disproportionately know battle magic in comparison to the general caster population.
I'm not saying it is out of character for Ljiljana to send Zlata to situations she shouldn't be at. Zlata is journeyman basically. That's not someone sensible would point to as someone who can go off be their faction's contribution to anything even remotely important. And yet Zlata is here at the project.
Yeah but it couldn't have been cleared only for the King to know. This project was too massive for that to happen. The wonders of the Ancestors would have been public knowledge-ish back then. Noticing that they were running out of power because the ambient magic had massively fallen due to the Great Vortex would also have been "public" knowledge. So basically everyone should be able to figure out that the waystones are powering the Ancestor relics.
We should not assume the Waystone Project will get credit for actions it does not do. The Waystone Project will get credit for developing the Dreaming Wood tributaries the moment that it arranges their construction. I should also note that waystones are incredibly more important and significant than tributaries.
Trying to say "but I made you a tributary ritual and I am expecting you do make it yourself" (when the tributary ritual was developed by a Forestborn) when the host of the international research project you are leading is wondering where exactly their waystones are, is not exactly going to get you much credit from that host.
Especially because at soonest Laurelorn would be third to receive products from the Waystone Project. Though to be fair, you could argue it would be the second though. Right now Kislev's magic traditions are focusing on organization, so to my understanding, we didn't actually train anyone to make tributaries. But third/second assumes that we spend an action to get tributaries to them before anyone else.
You are a much more optimistic person than I.
But politically you see why the host of the Project would expect to be pretty high on the priority list for deployment? I would much rather give them their proper due than gamble they won't feel snubbed.
Sarvoi mentioned that it was mostly seen as a foreign relations project, something that would improve ties with the Empire. He mentioned that it would lower the chances that Nordland would go to war with Laurelorn. But the other thing he mentioned was that it would make sure that Laurelorn is respected. The host not getting dibs on the goods is something that could strike people as disrespect.
Basically I'm saying don't underestimate people's ability to be ungrateful.
I definitely agree. We need to figure out how we can integrate waystones into Kislev's network. I am betting that the Ancient Widow can serve a similar role as Caledor. Similarly, any expansions of their network would involve trying to figure out how the ancient Ice Witches communicated with her. Failing that, telling the Ancient Widow a new way for Ice Witches to communicate with her about waystone management.
Ulthuan had to figure out how to communicate to Caledor and explain to him the keyphrases. That was probably something done by the the greatest (surviving) archmages of that age.
But uh. Zlata. >_>
A leyline variant of this waystone is definitely important. Having both leyline and leyline/riverine waystones when we set out to deploy waystones seems like the best way to ensure that no effort is wasted. So I would prefer to wait to deploy until we have developed the leyline variant.
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