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Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

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picklepikkl said:
That is a terrifying answer. Uh, people in the know, if the Asrai are Fëanor, what the fuck are the Silmarils?
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The god-avatars they have ruling them? The giant tree they live by? IDK, really.

Although, I will say that it would probably be better to say that the Eonir are Legolas, the Asrai are the Laiquendi, but they're even more obscure than Fëanor.
 
[X] Laurelorn
[X] Research Institute

Dwarfs are fine and all, but Waystones are not their area of expertise. Gonna have to try the Elven route this time.
 
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[X] Karak Eight Peaks
[X] Laurelorn

The obvious option, I'm also tempted to vote
[ ] Tobaro, just for the optics of Absolute Chad Mathilde walking into their house after stealing their girlfriend number-one-dwarf-ally spot

BTW, does anyone (@picklepikkl ) know who won the "Holiday cheer; one of these follows Mathilde's lead to become for Dwarfish" competition?

edit: appary he beat me to it.
[X] Carcassone
not interested in actually working for them, but let's check on them and maybe they'll change my mind.
 
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DragonParadox said:
Well they did help make the network, the issue is they lost more than Ulthuan, whether that means they lost more than the Eonir we have no way of knowing right now.
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Still, better try and give it a shot. If it fails or the Elves got prissy, we can try the Dwarf route or the standard Imperial Research Center.
 
[X] Karak Eight Peaks

While the Dwarfs are a nice bonus, I just really want to see the priests of Sigmar blue screen when their own strictures compell them to help the dwarven effort to understand, maintain and potentially recreate a magical anything.
 
[X] Laurelorn
[X] Middenland
[] Karak Eight Peaks

It was the Eonir that first approached us with this, through Middenland and the Ulricans. Also, the Cult of Sigmar in general has a large concentration of assholes in it and I don't like the idea of having to put up with Sigmar-supremacists among our "natural allies", much less having one as our superior (meaning Dragomas, unless I'm misremembering something). Kinda torn on whether or not I like the idea of starting the project under K8P, though. On one hand, I'm eager for a step away from Dwarfs because they keep figuring so heavily in nearly all the good WHF quests, and I've grown a bit weary of seeing them everywhere. On the other, it would put us in a position to possibly defuse the building schism in the Karaz Ankor over a misunderstanding... but it also puts us in a position where we might be forced to make IC reports with incomplete information that reinforce the big misunderstanding that we only know about OOC.

After some mulling as I put that paragraph together, I'm not voting for K8P for now. We can always send missives to King Belegar if we discover relevant information (and proof) that resolves the misunderstanding, without being forced to make reports to him with incomplete information that might kick off a Dwarf civil war.
 
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BoneyM said:
it might be nice for the Fire Spire to rule Praag's skyline once more.
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Humm…

But the Citadel of Praag never fell, and when the forces of Chaos were pushed back, the survivors that took refuge there refused to abandon their city and instead learned which parts of the rubble were less cursed than the others and rebuilt atop them. It's said that in the aftermath of the Great War, one in two children born in Praag was horribly mutated in some way or another, and that the streets would rearrange themselves each night and had to be rebuilt regularly to prevent them from shaping themselves into sigils of terrible power. The taint of those times has faded somewhat over the decades, but every night the taint of Chaos waxes once more, and black blood bubbles up from below, and the faint screams of those that were sacrificed to Chaos here echo through the darkness. Even in the noon sunlight the streets throb with Chaos taint to your Magesight, as if Morrsleib shone at full strength above.
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Nice it might be, but I don't think basing a research initiative out of the most corrupted place in the civilized world is a good idea.

Also:
Ice Witches spurn Praag due to the presence of the ruined Fire Spire
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Doesn't sound like the 'natural allies' would be all that keen on seeing the FS rise again. Wiki says they hated it even before it fell to Chaos.
 
[X] Laurelorn
[X] Middenland
[X] Praag
[X] Carcassone

DragonParadox said:
Funny as he may be Setra is a tyrannical asshole whom no one taught now to share as a toddler, so unless you can get Lord Kroak to be his babysitter that is a no go. :V
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To add onto this, the only reason Settra isn't a bad guy is because he's busy the wrangling of the other Tomb Kings and keeping Arkhan/Nagash out of Khemri and the Black Pyramid. He'd probably be making a run at conquering the world again if he had the time.
 
Rafin said:
Well of course. Though if what Mathilde said in her own narration about this being "common knowledge among the Grey Order" were literally true I'd trust the story even less. Every "turn" Kurtis had was probably just times that he slipped up in front of someone or had to do something that another Grey Magister couldn't stomach and the whole tear-eyed confession thing is Algard's scheme to make sure that Kurtis's enemies within the Order itself stop hassling him about it or otherwise making trouble. Or maybe the whole story is just the version all the other LMs are trying to sell Reiner Starke, with undetermined levels of success.
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I think I prefer the idea he just bumbled into it by sheer accident. In fact, I prefer the idea that they all accomplished their great deeds completely unintentionally.

Algard just wanted to have a nice tower where he doesn't get bothered. Completly unrelated, some beastmen get killed nearby. And then assholes kept showing up, thinking something well hidden and protected must be valuable. And nowadays he can't even go there because he's so busy with all this Patriarch business.
Melkoth is still kicking himself that he froze on the spot and the best he could come up with was "I didn't want any more birthday parties" when someone noticed his miscast.
Kurtis gets talkative after a bit of drink. He's very careful that it only happens around those that can be trusted, and quite good add judging such, but those trusted don't always agree on his judgement of trustworthyness.
Lady Grey has a really bad sense of direction and geography, and was actually headed to Kislev. The real reason that she doesn't go out anymore is that it's a real pain to find her way back. She was one of the very few to figure out the pocket dimension bit, because she never left the college by accident. (Extreme spacial uncertainty actually sounds like a possible Ulgu mark)
 
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[x] Karak Eight Peaks
[x] Laurelorn
[x] Carcassone
[x] Praag

I wish there was a snowball in hell chance of Praag winning as I'd like a reason for Mathilde to figure out a waystone powered Ice Wall ™ to keep the Chaos wastes out.
 
[X] Karak Eight Peaks
[x] Marienburg
[X] Laurelorn
[X] Carcassone
 
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BoneyM said:
If the comments that go along with a vote indicate there's a misunderstanding going on, that's fine, but if someone makes no comments along with their vote then the default assumption should be that they know what they're doing.
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The Count/Markgraf one that I mentioned as an example was a commentless vote. Once the voter was engaged there was some friendly back and forth over a handful of comments and they approval voted both of those options (plus some other options) because they noticed that Count wasn't just a strictly superior option as they first thought.

I really don't think that tagging someone in a friendly tone once is that big of a thread disrupting danger. I mean, I obviously won't do it again as long as you are strictly against it, but right now I am still hoping that you change your mind away from zero tolerance to such behavior.
BoneyM said:
Carcassone in particular has a knack for creativity, as they're the ones that invented the fine art of 'of course we don't hire mercenaries, that would be dishonourable, they were merely a very large, heavily-armed and well-paid group of shepherds looking after a single sheep that just happens to be in the path of an Orc warband'.
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I now imagine just how hilarious the various mascot sheep of Carcassone-specialized mercenary groups must look.
kingreaper said:
It's also worth asking how many issues are considered at any given Elector Meet. If each Elector is only allowed to bring up a single issue, and the meets are only every few years, that's not actually all that much even getting discussed let alone decided.

If things have to be "raised and seconded" and each Elector can only put one issue to vote (either raising or seconding) then it becomes even more of a slow-down.
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I can't imagine that the Electors themselves would have implemented arbitrarily restrictive rules on how much and about what they are allowed to talk and deliberate seriously. If at some point in history people abused the Meet through filibuster then some Emperor or Meet might have introduced a way to shut someone up after they talked a certain amount of time, but limiting it to a single issue per Elector per X years or even less sounds absurd.
BurnNote said:
I think I prefer the idea he just bumbled into it by sheer accident. In fact, I prefer the idea that they all accomplished their great deeds completely unintentionally.

Algard just wanted to have a nice tower where he doesn't get bothered. Completly unrelated, some beastmen get killed nearby. And then assholes kept showing up, thinking something well hidden and protected must be valuable. And nowadays he can't even go there because he's so busy with all this Patriarch business.
Melkoth is still kicking himself that he froze on the spot and the best he could come up with was "I didn't want any more birthday parties" when someone noticed his miscast.
Kurtis gets talkative after a bit of drink. He's very careful that it only happens around those that can be trusted, and quite good add judging such, but those trusted don't always agree on his judgement of trustworthyness.
Lady Grey has a really bad sense of direction and geography, and was actually headed to Kislev. The real reason that she doesn't go out anymore is that it's a real pain to find her way back. She was one of the very few to figure out the pocket dimension bit, because she never left the college by accident. (Extreme spacial uncertainty actually sounds like a possible Ulgu mark)
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I mean it's funny and all as an idle thread madness joke, but if it were even remotely true then that would make Mathilde into quite a bit of a Mary Sue. Because while she did bumble into some of her successes, the things she is most famous for among the upper reaches of the Grey Order (Destroying Drakenhof, aiding the reconquest and securing of K8P, destroying the Black College, translating Queekish, returning Vlag) are all things where she lucked into the opportunity to do so, but deliberately took said opportunity with the backing of her considerable skills and knowledge in order to make it a reality.
 
I'm not sure if BoneyM intends to make any of the material from Warhammer the Old World canon here, but if so the below map of Bretonnia in the run up to the Great War on Chaos may be relevant:


Note in particular the two high elf enclaves on the Bretonnian mainland, and two on islands off the coast. This suggests that the Bretonnians might be a route to cooperation with Ulthuan, and that Marienberg aren't our only option.

Finubar did start his adventures in the Old World at L'Anuguille, so it would make sense for him to have established diplomatic relations there rather than putting all his eggs in one basket in the Exarchate in Marienberg. This is what the article accompanying the map has to say:

The High Elves of Ulthuan were once the undisputed rulers of the seas, maintaining a trade network of colonies and glittering port-cities on every continent, from the Tower of the Rising Sun in the east to the Citadel of Dusk in the west.​

The coast of Bretonnia was no exception, and the map features no fewer than four such enclaves. Tor Soleil sits on the north-west coastline, while Tor Bidouze can be found to the south-west, just north of the city of Brionne. Meanwhile, Tor Martel and The Silent Isle can be found on islands just off Bretonnia's western coast.​

This is all in the past tense because this is talking about 'The World That Was'.
 
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So pro's for Carcassone.

- damsel buy-in. (potentially)
- no real enemies of the project
- very, very loose interpretations of the word of the law.
 
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