Kornet
Quite possibly a sloth abomination
- Location
- Mother Russia
I dunno, I'd still think twice before going for a priest not of one of the three major ancestor gods. Especially Valaya, as she is the founder of k8p.
Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest
- Thread starter Boney
- Start date
- Fantasy Users' Choice!
Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
- We would not have to whisk people away, but yes it would have to be taught, and yes that would be the work of decades, likely as not to will retaking Karak Eight Peaks. For that matter the restoration of Karaz Ankor if it can be done will take milenia, does that mean it's not a project worth trying. That is how I view sorcery, a major change to the setting with all the effort and risks involved
- Because her god has already saved her from a miscast-like event once. If that could be done again, not just for her but for others well... see above. How many of her fellow magisters might live untainted rather than dying or losing their souls.? We know Mathilde is very affected by the dangers of miscasting from her talk with Panoramia. I think it is worth dedicating her time and effort towards making things better, but then mine is just one vote. What matters is what we decide as a group.
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SuperSonicSound
Shadowmancer of the Shadow Cabal
He was going to be a normal character that just fits the role of bog standard generic priest of Gazul. Then he critted with a natural 100 as his first on screen appearance. Per word of god if something like that happens the character gets bumped up a bit. So Gunnar is now if not a hero tier character then at least approaching it.
- Location
- Cara Fahd
[X] Plan 2 wizards
-[x] Recruit Panoramia
-[x] Recruit Maximilian
[X] Windreader > Windsage: Your magical senses see more than your normal ones. +2 Learning, even more able to see and understand emotion and magical effects in others.
[X] Avatar: You're growing worryingly familiar with being used as a conduit by deities. ???
[X] Take an active hand in the EIC
[X] Donate it to whoever ends up leading the Undumgi.
-[x] Recruit Panoramia
-[x] Recruit Maximilian
[X] Windreader > Windsage: Your magical senses see more than your normal ones. +2 Learning, even more able to see and understand emotion and magical effects in others.
[X] Avatar: You're growing worryingly familiar with being used as a conduit by deities. ???
[X] Take an active hand in the EIC
[X] Donate it to whoever ends up leading the Undumgi.
Personaly I'm doing it because I'm concerned that the Grey College might put on their stompy boots if they think Mathilde is no longer keeping an eye out. If Anton of Wilhelmina get assassinated by Grey Magisters that is likley to take Mathilde to a very dark place emotionally.
- Location
- Planet Earth
This has already been brought up, and the answer is yes.
Not all traits seem to be 100% positive. Check out the list from the last time we got an option to pick a trait, they don't all seem like good choices that we want to select. There are also traits that we either wouldn't want to use or might actually have negative side effects.
From this round we've got some traits that have negative side effects, or aren't actually as useful as they first appear.
From this round we've got some traits that have negative side effects, or aren't actually as useful as they first appear.
-1 learning. Pretty obvious down side here.
Being larger is good for fighting but also means Wolf will eat more and be harder to fit into places. Still good but not better in every single way.
We can already get terror immunity with a spell, so this isn't actually as useful as you might first think. This makes Campaigner and Marksman more attractive in comparison.
I can't believe I actually forgot about Johann's reroll power. How could I do that?
We need Johann! We'll force him to stand around all day giving us free rerolls and continuously call him journeymanling Johann. Max also has Law of Logic which seems to do similar things to Trial and Error in that it gives a bonus to task.
We can also get them to write up our MAP spell.
By comparison Panoramia seems pretty useless to have as a minion since the things we'd order to do would be things she's likely to do anyway which means no real action bonus. It's not like Panoramia is going to hang around and not bless fields, research plants and cure diseases after all.
The Amber Wizards are going to leave if we don't take command of them. The Amber Wizards are debatebly worthwhile but they have a lot of overlap with our rangers. If we're just having them go around scouting and such it might not be worth the actions to keep them around.
Max if we don't boss him around will presumably just hang around the dwarf smiths and learn about metallurgy and stuff for years. That's basically worthless for us since we can just pay an random dwarf smith for high quality merchandise.
Johann if we don't boss him around will presumably be busy messing around with Skaven tech. As the Learning Advisor this is actually probably pretty useful for us.
Yeah I feel more confident than ever in my choice of Fields of Gold. Max needs to be bossed around to be worthwhile and Johann should be bossed around because it's funny and for the rerolls. I haven't seen any good arguments to turn the others into minions.
- Location
- Austria
Given that Greys think it's our call one way or another, I think it's going to be either better or worse.
Better - if our assessment of "it's gonna be fine" is on point, they'll just go along.
Worse - if it is wrong, they'll consider it our fault, with all the implications.
Addendum: I am not precisely sure how actively working on empowering a local monopoly will mesh with Vows. It probably can be alright if we ensure it's working purely for benefit of Empire, but I think us taking a personal care to empower it makes it a harder line to toe.
Mind, I can see the point, but...well, I was not voting for Steward in previous vote either, I am plain not quite interested in that whole thing at all.
Idk, job takes 2-4 IIRC, running with the minimal possible workload estimation, while we are in warzone no less, is somewhat optimistic.
edit: wait, I am not sure where did I get 2-4 from. Maybe I am wrong there?
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- Location
- The Star Kingdom of Manticore
1. Well the lady of the lake wisks people away to teach her arts. And it sounds like the Liche Priests had to spend generations before they managed the same. How would we speed up the timetable so we could teach people in our life. You also have not answered how we would create the apparently close relationship needed between divine and sorcery user for people who may not like Ranald.
2. Divine acts are Divine acts. The most common question when a miracle occurs is not "How can we do that again?" I am unconvinced that Mathilde would even know that purposefully sending energy to Ranald is possible and instead believe that Ranald stole the energy through her. She did not really do anything besides inviting Ranald to try. There was no agency on her part once Ranald stepped in. If she doesn't know Ulgu sorcery is possible why would she pursue it?
You are right though that the whole thread gets to vote on this. That is why I am bringing up these questions. Ulgu sorcery has a lot of unanswered questions. The thread has to decide if the time spent solving those questions is worth it?
People are saying sorcery would help the world but I still remain unconvinced with that. Wizards are people too. Learning sorcery would not make wizards better people. We can look to the Liche Priests for that. It would make them less likely to kill themselves but that will happen naturally as the training and the power of the colleges grow.
Mathilde can of course try to make the world a better place but to my eye sorcery has a pretty poor track record in that regard. First were the Liche Priests and all the pretty terrible things they did. We also have Bretonnia which has sorcerers running around the place but still brutally subjugates it's lower classes. Honestly sorcery seems to be a force to keep the status quo whatever that status quo is.
If we really want to change the world for the better perhaps our research should direct itself to different methods. Sorcery looks like it has a pretty poor track record.
Right now I am not convinced that pursuing sorcery would be worth the cost.
- Location
- United States of America
I'm voting for it because I do believe that we will have the actions for it, and because of the sheer potential in the institution that I see. A huge trade empire that spans the Old World and is under the influence and control of the Grey Order will be able to do a lot of good things, both for Karak-Eight-Peaks and the Empire. It will help facilitate communication with Karak-Eight-Peaks, allow for trade goods to flow more easily into the Empire, create stronger ties between Karak Anzor as a whole and the Empire, and provide easier means for the soldiers of both nations to come to each other's aid.
I see the potential, but I also see the danger. We don't need a stifling monopoly like what the Stirland League became, and the more we can move the EIC away from that the better. By pushing out of Stirland and into the wider Old World, the EIC has less incentive to squeeze Stirland dry because there will be so many more ways of making money out in the Old World.
- Location
- Planet Earth
pretty sure 2-4 came from a WOG on our post as intrigue advisor for Abelhiem, although that 1 action running herd on the other wizards will likely count towards our job,, and if need be/in time of crisis we can throw however many actions we need to get shit down.
We're not a standard advisor either, expected to have regular tasks. We're the learning advisor/court wizard, when someone else finds something wierd they will call Mathilde to poke it and thats about it.
And Boney managed to Mathilde me.
SuperSonicSound
Shadowmancer of the Shadow Cabal
if we have multiple wizards 2-4 would wrangling them count as doing our job as a court wizard? I'm assuming we'd be wrangling them to help Belegar.
- Location
- Austria
Aha.
So.
2-4, avg 3, on Councillor action. Optimistic for a warzone with everything on fire, but we are scarier than we were in Stirland so it evens out - and Stirland was on fire too (Sylvania). So 3 it is.
1 on EIC.
~1 on catmanlings.
Ergo, ~5 actions are spoken for every turn, and we have ~1 for our own projects.
Now, some of our personal projects are going to be Councillor actions/EIC stuff too, I suppose. Still, it's something of a concern, I would say.
If people really want to manage EIC, may I suggest requesting an underling from either Colleges or hiring one locally and delegating EIC management to them, same way we delegated parts of our job to Julia back in Stirland?
edit: we have 17 college favours; spending them on a Grey Order journeymanling with Econ specialty can be a wise investment if we are keen on keeping an eye on the economic developments of both EIC and K8P. On other hand, it's yet another journeymanling to manage, which will take up an action too, unless we take Collegiate.
Come to think of it, with rise in ranks of any organization, Collegiate-esque traits - ones with action economy effect based on effective management of other people (so, delegation) are going to become more important too, unless we lean hard into Solo Hero.
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The Liche Priests as a whole seemed to be a generally sane bunch, it was just Nagash who was... Nagash. As for the repetition of miracles, yes it was a miracle, but it was also an act of magic, Mathilde reached out to Ranald first and she saw that conection. That siad I totally understand not being interested in this path. I was not intersted in steward for instance so I voted and argued against it but if it had won I would have kept reading and enjoyingthis excelent story regardles and mmoved on to presenting my oppinions of the next vote. That is how questing goes at the end of the day
Quest
The Great One
- Location
- Everywhere
We can open a branch in K8P and hire an assistant to manage it for us. Also, wrangling Journeymanlings is part of the job.
- Location
- Goose Land
[X] Take an active hand in the EIC
[X] Avatar: You're growing worryingly familiar with being used as a conduit by deities. ???
[X] Windreader > Windsage: Your magical senses see more than your normal ones. +2 Learning, even more able to see and understand emotion and magical effects in others.
[X] Avatar: You're growing worryingly familiar with being used as a conduit by deities. ???
[X] Windreader > Windsage: Your magical senses see more than your normal ones. +2 Learning, even more able to see and understand emotion and magical effects in others.
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Depends on the tasks and the wizard, clearly. If Belegar gives us a task that can be done by the wizards we have, yay. If only we can, oops. An argument in favor of a minimal number of wizards, perhaps, for greater flexibility.
- Location
- Austria
Then either take Collegiate so that adding another journeymanling does not take up extra action (with two already managed it'd be exactly 3 wizards, so 1 action) or take up 3 wizards right now, so that that adding 4th will take up 2 actions in total.
edit: Delegation is an action-saver, but management costs action too! Hence why Collegiate is a trait choice at all.
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Stranger1950
Worth It
- Location
- Reverse Side of the World
If we do want to hire someone from the college to help manage EIC, I rather have them being a perpetual apprentice than a journeyman. Easier to get and less chance of blowing up/getting possessed/summoning a slaneeshi demon for research.
- Location
- his hidden lair
I've got a real crazy solution for you buddy. I get it's unorthodox but, the daemon could always cut off our hand containing the seed. Never mind the fact the Seed doesn't let us regrow loss of limbs or massive bodily trauma that outright destroys body mass.
As for your 'inability to judge the risk of possession' I'm going to remind you this hypothesized resistance is an incidental benefit- not necessarily anyone's specific priority. As for the risk of possession on miscast... just use common sense, a slight risk in general because who knows with Tzeentch and a significantly higher chance when we're putting our magic and will directly against Daemons.
Is that likely in the near future? Not really, but we're not going to see Avatar again any time soon, and it's by no means wasteful to consider defenses against Daemons in Warhammer.
So why Ranald Sorcery? I could give any number of reasons, but in the end- because it's awesome. It gives Mathilde her own unique brand image that stands with the likes of other big name casters of the setting. It gives us a way to have lasting impact in our field long after we're gone. It provides awesome narrative potential in exploring where divine magic begins and color magic ends and convincing others to allow it. It's a potential magnum opus borne out of the development and refinement of unique character traits we've had since the start of the quest. It doesn't have to be the theoretical most optimal choice to be gripping and cool. to change how we the voters, Mathilde herself, and the society she comes from view magic can't be anything but compelling.
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If they're doing something useful to the Hold, sure. If you're just getting them to write your papers and make you swords, no.
- Location
- Austria
Depends on what we want them to be capable of.
If we want someone who is capable, if necessary, of going onto an infiltration mission to steal ledgers (c), we want a journeyman.
If we just want a clerk who is incapable of independent field action on our behalf, apprentice is fine too.
I think former is preferable - the map between EIC and K8P is not safe, any journeyman is likely to have to go out and stab a gribbly or deal with corrupted trade guard or check the ledgers(tm) at least at some point. Costs more, but we are paying for the valuable resource, not nothing. But I can see the arguments towards a mere apprentice.
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Lots of things can give her unique brand image.
Assassin + Infiltrator + killy sword, for example, gives a very straightforward brand of "she can sneak up almost anywhere and kill almost anything there ever is", especially if we then double down and develop those traits.
Scout + Hands On gives another brand - a woman you go to if you need to get into some extremely well-guarded/dangerous reliquary, get some information on what's inside and get the priceless data nobody else could possibly have acquired to the people who need to know it.
Collegiate + Warrior of Paperwork is yet another brand - pretty simple, think of that scary Head Bursar woman. Not my fave, but Grey Order certainly has respect for the kind of person who can make nobility shit their pants and pay their taxes purely via managerial/paperwork magic.
And so on. If you put some thought into it, lots of traits and their combinations can give her compelling brand images. Sorcery does not have monopoly on that.
(You could argue it's more impactful than any of those; I would counter, quite reasonably IMO, that with time investment enough to develop Sorcery, if it is possible at all, those splats/brands could be grown into comparably fearsome things)
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