Remove ads

Attempting to Fulfill the Plan: GDI Edition

Reader mode
For the grant option, fair allocation. Need I remind you folks that all businesses over a certain size are already required to be cooperatives?

All this wailing about evils of capitalism and what not seems to be memory holing that little fact.

We've already got extremely strong regulations and enforcement of protections for workers and consumers.

Honestly this vote should be thought of as: Do you want focus on consumer goods? Do you want focus on capital goods? Do you want to offer a olive branch so we can get a bit more PS (while also getting a trickle of Cons and CapGoods)? Or do you want a bit of all of the above?

The options feels to me to be the above.
 
aceraptor said:
Honestly this vote should be thought of as: Do you want focus on consumer goods? Do you want focus on capital goods? Do you want to offer a olive branch so we can get a bit more PS (while also getting a trickle of Cons and CapGoods)? Or do you want a bit of all of the above?

The options feels to me to be the above.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Correction on this from Discord: IIRC, the smaller start-ups was said to be more Income, not more Capital Goods. If they were more Capital Goods I don't think anything could stop SV from slamming that button.
 
Chimeraguard said:
The Transit Rights we can cover pretty easily. Adding another phase for the Planned City project is also doable, though it would absorb most of our Infrastructure Dice for the remainder of the Plan. On the other hand, it's also more Abatement, Processing Capacity, etc. that we can mostly pay for with Infra Dice, and it doesn't cost Energy like the next stage of Chicago does.

I'm personally in favor because making sure the Mecca project succeeds is a big thing from a political standpoint, but I can see arguments for just sticking to Transit Rights to minimize costs.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

If it's not breaking the bank them I'm all for it.
 
I say we do both options for Mecca because I really want this to work and we probably can afford to do so. Apart from Chicago, I want this to be Dr. Granger's crowning achievement (or at least give a good leg up on it for Seo). Perhaps this nat 1 was a blessing in disguise? It put us on the back foot, but now we can also show that (most of) GDI is committed to making this work.

As for grant allocation, I'm split between Fair Allocation and Existing Co-ops.
 
[ ] Focus on Existing Cooperatives

This is the consumer-goods focused option. It'll prioritize more Consumer Goods production as the existing cooperatives ramp up production.

[ ] Focus on New Start Ups

This is the +RpT option. It'll prioritize more of the market competition that will eventually start giving tax revenue visible on our system.

[ ] Focus on Old Business Restoration

This is the political option. It'll throw certain politicians a bone.

[ ] Focus on Fair Allocation

This is the fair option. It'll do a little bit of everything.

Personally I'd pick either of the first two. Either we focus the Grants on doing more to cover our Consumer Goods needs, or we focus on decreasing the RpT the Grants cost us sooner. Either way Grants will remain an inefficient use of resources for a long time, (what with them not needing any dice to operate,) but it'll be less inefficient faster if we pick one of the first two options.
 
Last edited:
It's been two hours, so the Moratorium's up.

[X] Both
[X] Focus on Existing Cooperatives
[X] Focus on New Start Ups

Decided to stick with Both for Mecca. I am a bit worried politically about having to slow-roll BZ Arcologies, but given that we're seeing demonstrations over the issue of Mecca, this is pretty clearly an issue that the general public is interested in, so I think it'll be alright.

For Grants... I honestly can't decide between these two. Existing Cooperatives would be good for letting us focus our attention elsewhere rather than on Consumer Goods, but New Start Ups gives Resources per Turn, which we're always, always short on. But in a situation like this, I think it's better to prioritize one thing rather than split the focus.
 
[X] Offer Transit Rights
[X] Focus on Fair Allocation

I don't see the need to invest even more into the planned city that was pretty much just a political statement, not when many other issues will need those dice soon, AKA every Tiberium dice that will be needed sorely in the very near future for all the abatement efforts, along with the Infrastructure dice that will be needed for the Housing issues that seems to only intensify further as more YZ mining is done and further encouraging more refugees to come to GDI. I'd get why people vote for both for the +10 PS to offset the -10 PS overall, but it still feels like a massive waste of resources and dice for a measly +5 after that much spent over it, not when other options exists to get PS at a much cheaper and more cost-efficient rate.

As for the grants, fair is fair.
 
Last edited:
[X] Both
[X] Focus on Existing Cooperatives
[X] Focus on New Start Ups

Full in on Mecca as this is still a chance for us to flip some of NODs forces. In addition we get more mitigation and processing capacity with infra dice and not tib or mil dice which is going to be useful.

marids said:
AKA every Tiberium dice
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Of note it need 1 tib dice each time we take it, the rest can be infra dice. And it increases our processing capacity which we need (the other way to do so is tiberium dice only)
 
Last edited:
Shard of Victory said:
I was right! Look, capitalist scum is back! They formed a cartel, even!
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I'm presuming this was intended to be a joke, but because of past behavior, and the quote below, it's hard to be sure.
Also, to take this way too seriously, why do you assume they ever left? That's a significant part of the Free Market Party. :D
Shard of Victory said:
To quote Deng Xiaoping, "Some people will get rich first!". The words of the man who has driven the corruption of Chinese government, who spearheaded the loss of communist spirit, who build prosperity for "some people" on the broken backs of workers, are the words not worth listening to! The only harmony they have is harmony of exploiting same people.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
This sort of thing is not helpful.
Vilegrave said:
Honestly i'm kind of worried about what Litvinov is doing in Mecca, her heart might be in the right place but some of the stuff she's doing looks like it could bite us in the ass.

Especially as the stuff she's focusing on is likely to cause a massive amount of disruptions if she gets elected, needed though it might be reforming the government when we're in the middle of a crisis with the Tib mutation seems like a bad idea.

Whatever she's doing in Mecca (whether she actually throws her support behind the Mecca Warlords or joins up with Kai in an attempt to call them to account) i just can't see anyway it works out well for us in the long run.

If she teams up with the Caravanseri and campaigns for their demands it would likely get a lot of good people killed as we really cannot afford to stop using Ion cannon strikes, they are a vital part of our current military setup that we have no alternative too (NOD would almost certainly plan their heavier operations around the pause on Ion cannon strikes too), not to mention it could push the craziest of the hawks into outright insurrection from 'allying with the enemy' if she even gets close to winning the election (and yes yes, crazy right wingers, good riddance and all but thats no reason to actively start a civil war if we don't have to).

If she doesn't ally with them (and going by how she's talking with Jun thats a distinct possibility) and plans to try and get them kicked out of Mecca then it's just as bad as suddenly we're dealing with a religious uprising on top of everything else as it wouldn't go down well with any of the Muslim population, Nod or GDI, due to how they've been keeping the city and pilgrimages going even before we got there.

It just seems like she's about to set off a massive bomb that could rapidly shift us from building up anti Tib measures to scrambling to perform damage control no matter what she goes with.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
It seems to me that Litvinov is setting a series of what seem to be controlled burns, attacking the Initiative First-style Blue Zone priorities of a fair amount of the GDI establishment. Which is kinda dangerous, but probably needs to be done, because there are a lot of people out there who only support NOD because the alternative is dying of thirst, starvation, or exposure.
Theunderbolt said:
I'd like this but I want to hear from the cabal on how the numbers look tbh.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
2-3 dice per turn on Mecca should be doable, and would satisfy the demands for this.

marids said:
I don't see the need to invest even more into the planned city that was pretty much just a political statement, not when many other issues will need those dice soon, AKA every Tiberium dice that will be needed sorely in the very near future for all the abatement efforts, along with the Infrastructure dice that will be needed for the Housing issues that seems to only intensify further as more YZ mining is done and further encouraging more refugees to come to GDI. I'd get why people vote for both for the +10 PS to offset the -10 PS overall, but it still feels like a massive waste of resources and dice for a measly +5 after that much spent over it, not when other options exists to get PS at a much cheaper and more cost-efficient rate.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
It's not even close to "just a political statement". It gets us more mitigation using Infrastructure dice, it gives us an opportunity to peel off support from the NOD hardliners, it increases Tib Processing Capacity, as well as giving us Political Support and smacking Initiative First in the nose. Yes, it requires 1 die per turn to be a Tiberium die, but that's not a critical issue.


Edit: Votes
[X] Both
[X] Focus on New Start Ups
 
Last edited:
[X] Both
[X] Focus on Existing Cooperatives

To repeat my previous post, another tier of Mecca offers benefits rather than a net loss. It also builds up the standing of the Treasury and basically wipes out the problem for the rest of the departments. It's costly, both in dice commitments and in resources, but it isn't a complete waste of resources and time.

Coops in order to get more consumer goods since the next plan is likely to include consumer goods targets and the faster the coops grow, the more consumer goods they will produce and the less consumer goods we will need to build ourselves in the future.
 
[X] Both
Transit is cheap, and Medina gives us an opportunity for more RpT and abatement.
[] Focus on New Start Ups
[X] Focus on Fair Allocation
Would prefer equal allocation, for the sake of fairness and ensuring covering all the bases, but if I had to pick one it would be more RpT.
EDIT: Since both are far in the lead, I switched over to voting on the one I want most.
 
Last edited:
aceraptor said:
For the grant option, fair allocation. Need I remind you folks that all businesses over a certain size are already required to be cooperatives?

All this wailing about evils of capitalism and what not seems to be memory holing that little fact.

We've already got extremely strong regulations and enforcement of protections for workers and consumers.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

A reminder that a sizable portion of the playerbase wants to implement socialism and don't want to see any reactionary backsliding. To that end, there's no memory holing at all happening.
 
[X] Both
[X] Focus on New Start Ups

Definitely need to do both on Mecca, we can afford it pretty easily it just eats all our Infra dice for the rest of the year. But spending Infra dice to get political support, income, processing, abatement, and a diplomatic coup all in one is a damn good deal. Arcologies get the short end of the stick but c'est la guerre, the people obviously care enough about Mecca to get out in the streets for months on end about it, they'll be fine if Infra dice go to Mecca instead of Arcologies.

Less sure about the grants, honestly I'm fine with either new startups or existing co-ops, mechanically I could go either way. Narratively I think that funding new startups to plug some of the holes in GDI's centralized production is slightly more attractive than just cranking out more printed t-shirts or whatever, but I'm not at all married to that and wouldn't mind existing co-ops or fair allocation winning.


Vilegrave said:
Especially as the stuff she's focusing on is likely to cause a massive amount of disruptions if she gets elected, needed though it might be reforming the government when we're in the middle of a crisis with the Tib mutation seems like a bad idea.

Whatever she's doing in Mecca (whether she actually throws her support behind the Mecca Warlords or joins up with Kai in an attempt to call them to account) i just can't see anyway it works out well for us in the long run.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
There's never going to be a better time to reform the GDI is the problem though. This is the start of the crisis that will determine the entire rest of the game, when we beat mutation and solve Tiberium (or abandon 80% of humanity to die and fuck off to live on the Moon, either way) that's the end of the game. And the crisis only gets more intense from here on out. It's now or never, and never isn't an option. She's honestly my new favorite, yeah it'll be disruptive but it HAS to happen unless we want to spend another 30 years repeating the mistakes of the past.

Vilegrave said:
If she teams up with the Caravanseri and campaigns for their demands it would likely get a lot of good people killed as we really cannot afford to stop using Ion cannon strikes, they are a vital part of our current military setup that we have no alternative too (NOD would almost certainly plan their heavier operations around the pause on Ion cannon strikes too), not to mention it could push the craziest of the hawks into outright insurrection from 'allying with the enemy' if she even gets close to winning the election (and yes yes, crazy right wingers, good riddance and all but thats no reason to actively start a civil war if we don't have to).
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
You know what else gets a lot of good people killed? Giant death lasers from space vaporizing them while on pilgrimage. It's not a total ban on all ion cannon strikes everywhere, that would be obviously absurd. It's not using ion cannon strikes, in the Middle East/East Africa, during pilgrimage season, due to a negotiated ceasefire with the local warlords. If NOD starts using the lack of ion cannon strikes to make moves that's the NOD warlords breaking their end of the deal and we get to terminate with extreme prejudice. It's in their interest to not pull any funny business if they want to keep having access to Mecca, and that's what they care about above all, I think it's worthwhile.

As to a possible GDI civil war, I think that's a very overblown concern at this specific moment in time, but it's hardly impossible. It was a key plot point in The Game That Shall Not Be Named after all, but tbh those fault lines need to be forced on our terms or they'll be forced for us by Kane on his terms. They won't go away just because we ignored them or tried to placate them away. Like I said, it's not a good time to be tearing apart the GDI political establishment, but every single turn later in the game we go is an even worse time so might as well just bite the bullet and do it ourselves before it boils over 20 years from now.
 
Last edited:
Reader mode
You must login or register to reply here.
Remove ads
Back
Top