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Attempting to Fulfill the Plan: GDI Edition

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HousePet said:
Our STUs are only "overcommitted" because we jumped at an obviously expensive project without considering alternatives. And we now know that that project only applies to stations at half effect as well.
So why would we not spend a few dice to find out what our alternatives are?
Surely we aren't using the arguments of efficiency to justify rushing blindly?
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I'm trying to be realistic about the demand. The alloys are highly desired among the voterbase and the reality is that they will be used and they aren't going to waste. We do need to budget accordingly; STUs are getting actually scarce as opposed to being merely 'limited.'

Honestly, I think we should be able to close down some of those plasma missile factories we built during the war. Better munitions for the Air Force are all well and good, but I don't think they're worth -2 STUs.

trooperist said:
This has probably been mentioned before, but what makes housing high quality as opposed to low quality?
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More space, better amenities, more aesthetic conditions.

Living in a drab little prefab apartment built as part of a massive desperate rush to put millions of refugees into ANY kind of housing as cheaply as possible? Low quality. Living in a literal bunker in a fortress town designed 100% around resisting Nod attack and 0% around being a fun place to live? Low quality. Living in communal housing with people who really, really shouldn't be in communal housing? Low quality.
 
Also, there are levels of low quality.

All else being equal, 'low quality' blue zone housing is in higher demand than similar quality yz housing (not that we have much of that anymore). The further they are from Nod/tiberium, the safer people feel (and, as a nice side effect, are often deeper in our economic heartlands, with all that entails).

So, extending the concept, space housing is probably going to hit well above its absolute quality levels (once we have enough of it that it isn't restricted to people with multiple phds).
 
Simon_Jester said:
I'm trying to be realistic about the demand. The alloys are highly desired among the voterbase and the reality is that they will be used and they aren't going to waste. We do need to budget accordingly; STUs are getting actually scarce as opposed to being merely 'limited.'
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Zrbite Sonic Weapons likely use STUs (they are in the name), and we have Armor Alloys incoming as well. Those incoming projects likely exceed our capacity for producing STUs, and the IHG upgrade will take time and only improves generation by 11%.
I'm not sure that the general voterbase realises that we can't afford much else if we complete the U-series Alloy Foundries now. Many people vote on what looks cool because they don't have the time to check the numbers.
Charging ahead with Alloy Foundries because they are popular is not budgeting accordingly. We should at least see what our other STU options are first.
Or are you certain that the voterbase does not want Armor Alloys?
 
Ummm. That is slightly concerning.

In any event I'd propose the Alloy Foundries as somthing we would need to finish as they will not only cut the dice requirements by a significant amount, but the last phase will boost our Tiberium Production, something needed to produce more STUs.

The dice cost reductions just with one phase are very significant additional reductions are more then worth it in my opinion. Especially to help ease the completion of the Meja Projects and Space Industry, where one Phase has already saved us at least a die in Chicago, Reykjavik, North Boston, Columbia, and Shala each. Not to mention the dice save elsewhere. So from an ease of making 'Number Go Up' they are very much worthwhile.
 
doruma1920 said:
The dice cost reductions just with one phase are very significant additional reductions are more then worth it in my opinion. Especially to help ease the completion of the Meja Projects and Space Industry, where one Phase has already saved us at least a die in Chicago, Reykjavik, North Boston, Columbia, and Shala each. Not to mention the dice save elsewhere. So from an ease of making 'Number Go Up' they are very much worthwhile.
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The dice cost reductions are good. But going further with them might mean we can't build mega MARVs from tib-resistant alloys that float over tib fields and using Zrbite sonics for harvesting.
And those would also be really good.
 
HousePet said:
I'm not sure that the general voterbase realises that we can't afford much else if we complete the U-series Alloy Foundries now. Many people vote on what looks cool because they don't have the time to check the numbers.
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I have found that it seldom pays to assume the voterbase doesn't realize something straightforward. The thread isn't stupid.

Charging ahead with Alloy Foundries because they are popular is not budgeting accordingly. We should at least see what our other STU options are first.
Or are you certain that the voterbase does not want Armor Alloys?
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The fundamental problem with this approach is that there will always be more STU-consuming items showing up. We can't just sit on our existing STU surplus indefinitely in the hopes that tomorrow's application for the stuff will be even better than today's.

HousePet said:
The dice cost reductions are good. But going further with them might mean we can't build mega MARVs from tib-resistant alloys that float over tib fields and using Zrbite sonics for harvesting.
And those would also be really good.
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Going farther might lock us out. Or we might have already gone too far. Or who knows what?

It would be very easy to justify too much caution. Going ahead with a benefit we at least understand has real advantages.
 
Oledoms said:
I hope that the STU/APK Planned City will come on this plan.
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I think there is a two Planned City maximum. So we have to finish Chicago or Karachi to get a new one.

For a Tiberium focused one, maybe Salt Lake City so we can try and drive a corridor through the North American Red Zone.
And I think there was also a city in Southern Australia on the coast by the Australian Red Zone that was floated as a possibility.
 
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trooperist said:
I think there was a two Planned City maximum. So we have to finish Chicago or Karachi to get a new one.
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Well, there's a fair amount of interest in doing the former and broad support for doing the latter in a reasonably timely manner.

For a Tiberium focused one, maybe Salt Lake City so we can try and drive a corridor through the North American Red Zone.
And I think there was also a city in Southern Australia on the coast by the Australian Red Zone that was floated as a possibility.
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The southern Australian site (Adelaide) was floated as a giant shipyard city. I'm not sure what Salt Lake Planned City would be like, but "place to put our ugly tiberium refineries" sounds like as good a plan as any. It's that or YZ-11 (effectively a big depopulated blob of land kept from turning into a Red Zone entirely by the efforts of the MARV hub we once knew as the YZ-5b hub, the one that some of Stahl's underlings decided it'd be a great idea to YOLO back in the '50s).
 
The cities we know have been discussed in quest are a navel focused one in Australia and a stu focused one in South America.

I don't see going for alloys as being reckless with STUs. They will knock 25% of most mega projects we need to do plus the same percentage from many other projects. They are highly in demand, tiberium resistant, super metals. They might take up nearly all of our current stockpile of STUs but that's worth it for the benefits. Especially if they also reduce the cost of refits and improve mining as well.

And if they also reduce the cost of the STU city... well let's get to work.
 
Materials science is fundamental to technological progress in a huge variety of fields, I will gladly burn up our entire STU supply on supplying as many xenotech alloys as possible. Between saving piles of dice in all the other sectors and the finisher providing a boost to Tiberium harvesting, I think we'll more than get our investment back over the rest of the game and hopefully push our science and engineering to otherwise impossible heights. Honestly we could probably use 50 STU's worth of alloys, 12 is just what the bureaucrats have decided we can afford to allocate as a max right now.
 
If we're going ga-ga for STUs, then we very much need access to Mars and Venus, that materials science bay, or even it's own full on station, and the STU planned city. Also that next generation repulser tech, and just dumping dice into any improvements in STU refining. Hundreds of STUs are possibly the tallest order we'll see this entire quest.

It also means humanity will never be free of Tiberium dependency, but that's a fight humanity has probably collectively given up on already.
 
Crazycryodude said:
Materials science is fundamental to technological progress in a huge variety of fields, I will gladly burn up our entire STU supply on supplying as many xenotech alloys as possible. Between saving piles of dice in all the other sectors and the finisher providing a boost to Tiberium harvesting, I think we'll more than get our investment back over the rest of the game and hopefully push our science and engineering to otherwise impossible heights. Honestly we could probably use 50 STU's worth of alloys, 12 is just what the bureaucrats have decided we can afford to allocate as a max right now.
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Also, I suspect Ithilid is limiting it to 6 phases as to avoid breaking the quest. 25% discounts to most projects and a definite big boost to the Tiberium mining is a lot.
 
bigking321 said:
The cities we know have been discussed in quest are a navel focused one in Australia and a stu focused one in South America.
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Since South America is a place where we have sizeable tracts of totally depopulated land (reclaimed from tiberium, at Yellow Zone standards of habitability) reasonably secure from Nod (fenced off by a thousand kilometers of RZ-6 and oceans in all directions), it's a good pick for the STU city.

Crazycryodude said:
Materials science is fundamental to technological progress in a huge variety of fields, I will gladly burn up our entire STU supply on supplying as many xenotech alloys as possible. Between saving piles of dice in all the other sectors and the finisher providing a boost to Tiberium harvesting, I think we'll more than get our investment back over the rest of the game and hopefully push our science and engineering to otherwise impossible heights. Honestly we could probably use 50 STU's worth of alloys, 12 is just what the bureaucrats have decided we can afford to allocate as a max right now.
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I suspect fifty STU's worth would be well past the point of diminishing returns. Better materials don't trivialize ALL the aspects of constructing a giant megastructure or something like that, after all.
 
As a reminder/reference, when I roll the Blood SacrificeAssassination Rolls, the first dice is GDI, the second is Nod.

So this time around, GDI prevented one attempt by a good margin, though probably didn't capture anyone....and then they went and put on a clown show for the 2nd attempt.
 
So question, how feasible is it to just build updated Nuclear Fission reactors for our power needs? It seemed something that could be used for our alternative energy needs.
 
MrRageQuit said:
Great. I hope they hit one of the politicians, rather than someone who might actually matter.
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Just because you cannot see the exact numbers of the effects it has, does not mean that there aren't effects. I'll point to the death of Al-Jilani a bit over a year ago in-quest.

And that's leaving aside the whole bit about saying that a person's life doesn't matter, which I will leave to this nice fellow from InOps. :whistle:

staplesdex2 said:
So question, how feasible is it to just build updated Nuclear Fission reactors for our power needs? It seemed something that could be used for our alternative energy needs.
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They might get folded into DAE, but I believe they're too big for that currently, and not really worth it compared to Fusion otherwise.
 
staplesdex2 said:
So question, how feasible is it to just build updated Nuclear Fission reactors for our power needs? It seemed something that could be used for our alternative energy needs.
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Large scale nuclear power plant construction would probably look a lot like the old mid-2050s Power Production Campaigns, which cost 550 Progress at 10 R/die for +16 Energy. Nowadays we'd never consider a project like that, and DAE is objectively more Energy-efficient in terms of dice and resource costs.
 
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