- Location
- England
I feel like if we wanted this to not be a rare machine, we shouldn't have made it an Ace Custom.
We Stand Against the Stars (Gundam/Macross)
- Thread starter manofjay
- Start date
- Crossover
- Location
- Back in Cali
Except we are not going to make them like zeon's ace machines that were only experimental units that only got built in low numbers. I want to keep producing these machines the entire time and when the replacement comes up that one as well. They will not be a mass produced as the regular MS but the will not be rare. And the expenses for using Lunar Titanium in such large amounts will make it so our forces will not have enough MS with better performance like what Zeon ended up with near the end of the OYW.
- Location
- USA
Right now there only two kinds, and the other is more expensive and less effective.
- Location
- England
Again, then we shouldn't have made it an Ace Custom. We get equivalent purchasing power to a Special unit, but that comes at a cost.
We'll definitely be producing more of these than we would Gundams, which were all one-offs and probably also Special Ace Customs, and probably more than the Federation produced Ground Gundams and GMs, but I doubt we'll even see (Rick) Dom numbers with this thing.
- Location
- Back in Cali
What is medium-heavy armor anyways?
- Location
- USA
I'm sorry I thought you were talking about Gundaium, the tier below is "conventional" heavy armor, like the Dom.
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- England
Funnily enough, it probably won't be called Gundarium in this timeline. Because the Gundam sorta didn't do anything.
- Location
- Back in Cali
Then you are not thinking logically. We need to be able to produce as many of all our machines as possible. We need to be used to producing large numbers of powerful MS. Just because sometgsom is a Ace unit doesn't mean we can't make a lot of them. In fact as our manufacturing and expertise grows the number we can build will only go up.
Is it treated to resist beam weapons?
- Location
- England
We'll probably make a few hundred to a thousand of it over its service lifetime if we commit to making a new ace suit once beam rifles enter the picture. Remember, the Zaku II F Type, the most common model of Mobile Suit during the One Year War, only got 3,246 unit built, and that was definitely a Mass type Mobile Suit.
- Location
- Back in Cali
We will be exceeding the numbers made one because we are not fighting each other and destroying valuable resources and infrastructure. And also because we have the size of the aliens and at least now a idea of their power.
- Location
- England
Zeon never lost any infrastructure until the very last days of the war. In fact, Zeon will produce fewer Mobile Suits than canon because they don't have the resources of Odessa.
Although, if we want to make many of this unit, maybe we just ignore the GM? This suit is better in every way after all, so if we want to make it en mass there's not much point. And if we desperately need cheap filler there's the Zaku I.
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- USA
No, anti-beam coating hasn't been invented yet.
With the numbers of the Armada you are going to need the GM, If nothing else to have something to build off of.
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- England
With the numbers of the Armada we're going to need a lot of things. The GM... is insufficient.
And besides, I think Advent is planning to build off of this instead?
- Location
- Who even cares?
How about this one?
[X] New MS designation: MSH-10 Zudah Bomber (model number tentantive, need a better suggestion)
-[X] Production type:
--[X] Limited (1000 points)
-[X] Use:
--[X] Specialized (One Free part for Specialization)
---[X] Anti-Ship
-[X] Parts:
--[X] Performance: (can pick more than one)
---[X] Saturn Engine 2.0 (cost 100)
---[X] Propellant Tank (cost 100)
--[X] Armor:
---[X] Medium (cost 100)
-[X] Weapon: (Can pick more than one)
--[X] Standard
---[X] NF·GMG-Type.37/100mm Machine Gun (cost 100)
--[X] Anti-Ship
---[X] BLASH HB-L-03/N-STD Hyper Bazooka (cost 200)
--[X] Sniper
---[X] 135mm Anti-Ship Rifle (cost 150)
Way I see it, the Zudah is really fast. So why not put that speed to use by making a boom-and-zoom anti-ship interceptor? That is, once enemy MS forces engage friendly MS forces, the Zudahs use their superior speed to zoom past them and wreck their mothership before they can double back. They don't engage enemy mobile suits, they go straight after the ships and rely on their superior speed to evade AA fire. Get in, wreck shit, get out. Same deal as the likes of the Kampfer and the Dendrobium. Even if they can't take the ships out quickly enough before the enemy doubles back, they still force the enemy to go on the defensive because mobile suits tend not to have endurance for long-range treks back to friendly territory so if their carrier goes down and no other friendlies can take them on board, they are frakked.
[X] New MS designation: MSH-10 Zudah Bomber (model number tentantive, need a better suggestion)
-[X] Production type:
--[X] Limited (1000 points)
-[X] Use:
--[X] Specialized (One Free part for Specialization)
---[X] Anti-Ship
-[X] Parts:
--[X] Performance: (can pick more than one)
---[X] Saturn Engine 2.0 (cost 100)
---[X] Propellant Tank (cost 100)
--[X] Armor:
---[X] Medium (cost 100)
-[X] Weapon: (Can pick more than one)
--[X] Standard
---[X] NF·GMG-Type.37/100mm Machine Gun (cost 100)
--[X] Anti-Ship
---[X] BLASH HB-L-03/N-STD Hyper Bazooka (cost 200)
--[X] Sniper
---[X] 135mm Anti-Ship Rifle (cost 150)
Way I see it, the Zudah is really fast. So why not put that speed to use by making a boom-and-zoom anti-ship interceptor? That is, once enemy MS forces engage friendly MS forces, the Zudahs use their superior speed to zoom past them and wreck their mothership before they can double back. They don't engage enemy mobile suits, they go straight after the ships and rely on their superior speed to evade AA fire. Get in, wreck shit, get out. Same deal as the likes of the Kampfer and the Dendrobium. Even if they can't take the ships out quickly enough before the enemy doubles back, they still force the enemy to go on the defensive because mobile suits tend not to have endurance for long-range treks back to friendly territory so if their carrier goes down and no other friendlies can take them on board, they are frakked.
- Location
- USA
One thing to note about the GM is that you can modify it to do anything. It's a bit like the Sherman tank in that's it not the best, but good enough. Later variants, like the C-type (GM Kai), were well loved and used up until the Unicorn era.
- Location
- England
If you dropped the Sniper, you could make it a Mass Production suit.
Ah yes, well therein lies the rub, doesn't it? The Type C (and Command I suppose) are actually kind of relevant compared to our super-Zudah, but do we have to produce the base GM to get to those?
- Location
- USA
Yes, but if you get lucky you could skip straight to the Type C. (In stats anyway)
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- Location
- Who even cares?
I'm not sure about that. It has no melee weapons whatsoever, even a Zaku would chop it up in close combat.
ThatGuyWithIdeas
Treize died for our sins
- Location
- Romania
I'd say we keep the Zudah, no matter what new variant we vote for to replace the original Zudah, as an Ace mobile suit, as even with the corrections to the Saturn Engine, it is stil an incredibly fast mobile suit that I wouldn't trust in the hands of just any pilot. I feel like an Ace can more safely make use of the new Zudah's speed than an average pilot can.
- Location
- England
Ah. Well then maybe we do still produce the thing...
You could drop the Sniper, add a Heat Hawk and Vulcans, and still be in budget for a Mass Production unit.
- Location
- Back in Cali
No the GM is going to be the main lineage for our MS. That line goes very far. This is simply a powerful MS line that I want to be able to equip our best pilots with. There was always more pilots than there were MS to match their skills to. But since beam-coating isn't invented yet I will be staying with the heavy armor.
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- Who even cares?
If I could, I'd add shoulder cannons but I figure the Federation engineers are still futilely trying to figure out how to mount Guncannon barrels on a GM without the recoil tearing into the GM's weaker frame, hence why it isn't available. The reasons why I didn't add a shield are that 1) keeping it pointed at the ship to fend off AA fire is distracting during an attack run and 2) a bazooka can be fired one-handed, but an anti-ship rifle can't.
Yes, but we can't give the good stuff exclusively to aces only. Remember that the Zentradi have a massive numerical advantage over us, so we can't afford to cut corners and go with "good enough" basic designs like the stock GM because they'll be eaten alive. It worked against Zeon because the EFSF had the numbers and resources to replace casualties but against the Zentradi, we can't take it easy. Ideally, every single one of our final MP suits should be a one man army versus the Zentradi or they'll grind us down by sheer attrition.
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- England
Frankly, I think you're both getting ahead of yourselves. Until we've fully reverse engineered the alien technology and begun production of Variable Fighters, any unit we design is going to serve as either:
1. An emergency stopgap.
2. A testbed for either production optimisation or pushing the envelope of performance.
3. A design in case we ever have to fight Zeon.
Ideally, nothing we make now should ever be going up against the Zents, we should be fielding mostly Valkyries with MS-Destroid hybrid support forces.
- Location
- USA
I've said it before, Variable Fighters are not likely to be a thing in this quest as Mobile Suits fill that roll more than adequately, and that I wanted this quest to be UC Gundam vs Zentradi.
- Location
- England
Even if Variable Fighters aren't actually variable or fighters (we could totally standardise around, say, the ReZEL if tech advances fast enough but let's ignore that for now) the point stands that we're lacking in technology. There's a solid argument to be made that the Valkyrie is equivalent in performance to, say, the Heavygun and other such late suits. This OYW era stuff isn't going to cut it against the Zents either way.
My point stands. Until we have all our tech unlocked (maybe not all, but a good majority of the alien tech as well as beam rifles) anything is gonna be a stopgap, testbed, or anti-Zeon design.