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We also have to make a pretence of fighting the 'beastmen' if we stick around, otherwise the kurgans will be suspicious, since Mathilde claims she is here to test herself.

So idea, if we made contact with Borek, we can tell him to have Morghur and Mathilde have a mock battle , before leaving just to make the Kurgan tribes less suspicous when we leave.
 
I mean, it's not MORE implausible than the other crazy theories we've got. But it doesn't have that ring of "huh, this actually makes a lot of sense" that your other theory did. Because I could, and did, come up with an explanation for why Cor-Dum would have reacted like that to Borek and why Borek would have reacted like that to Cor-Dum. But with the "binding" explanation? Kadon's Scrolls of Binding can bind damn well near anything, yes, though tbh I'd still call binding a demigod iffy. But what the scrolls can't do is make the thing they're binding like it. So I see no way to reconcile the binding theory with the Borek Factor in the situation.
I think before he mutated he was originally a dwarf from Karag Dum.
He's been called upon to fullfil his ancient oaths to protect his home, and is potentially corrupting them via proximity in the process.

Remember that dwarf souls are supposed to reincarnate in a new body if they're not sent to the underearth. What Beastman does that remind you of?
 
Ultimately this is still a win for Order, whatever Dum is doing, whether they've dabbled in Chaos or not, as long as they keep sending energy to KaK that means this Expedition has gained two Karaks of power to help stave off Dwarven extinction. That's well worth it. This should not be used for decision-making though because IC Mathilde has no idea what that power is really being used for.
 
Could Karak Dum have uncorrupted Morghul?

Cleansed him of Chaos and restored or changed him into a Nature Spirit?

Can we talk to a Priest of Gazul to ask if there is any life here?

Is this all a part of the afterlife which is overlapping with the world of the living?
 
I think before he mutated he was originally a dwarf from Karag Dum.
Like, this spawning originally or the first time ever circa -600 IC originally?

Ultimately this is still a win for Order, whatever Dum is doing, whether they've dabbled in Chaos or not, as long as they keep sending energy to KaK that means this Expedition has gained two Karaks of power to help stave off Dwarven extinction. That's well worth it. This should not be used for decision-making though because IC Mathilde has no idea what that power is really being used for.
Eh, if this is the actual Morghur, just him being occupied up here instead of making southern Bretonnia into his own little slice of the Chaos Wastes is a win.
 
...Wonder what they thought every time we spontaneously caught fire while using Rite of Way.

Not even just then!

If you had this in Sylvania you would have just had to deal with occasional minor flashfires on your skin instead of those ominous 'go on, raise the dead, you know you want to' options popping up all over the place.

We're just constantly having little fires start on our skin.

It probably looks really cool, but also what the fuck :V
 
If I say that, I'll wake up to find someone's built a massive venn diagram that somehow pinpoints the correct combination.
Fair enough. That's why I said if. Still probably going to have it once people realize they all need to be at least somewhat compatible, and that the ones supporting a semi-good outcome are more detailed than most who just want to leave.
 
There is no way to learn more about this place and what they have done which doesn't greatly hurt the Karaz Ankor in the short term. I am not against investigation. I think Order could come out with an extremely strong overall win here even if there is a Karaz Ankor civil war because of it.

I.

Them staying Order despite all that has happened? Order but radical (and atraditional) in the extreme? It's maybe the worst outcome for the Karaz Ankor (as we know it) possible.

How many longbeards and elders would go slayer if the established traditions are found, without a shadow of a doubt, to be significantly weaker and less effective than radical adaptation? How much shame would weigh the hearts of the Dawi knowing that their rigid traditions have made them weak to the point of breaking. To the point where one Zhufi of a species only recently civilized with only a small magical history can do more for the Karaz Ankor by the time they're a plaitling than all of dwarfkind can do for themselves in centuries of toil?
Longbeards might despair and be horrified and ashamed, but not for the reasons you list, I think.

They won't be going "What fools we are, to think of how much more effective you might be if you foreswore sanity and propriety!"

They'll be horrified and ashamed because: "Oh god, look at what they have been reduced to. If we had only given Karag Dum the support it needed when the Great War Against Chaos hit, they might not have had to resort to this."

Though they might just double-down on "You can't be blamed for not trusting the message, if the messenger is not trustworthy." That, if Karag Dum were willing to do this sort of thing, weeelll...
But then, part of the premise of your post is "Imagine if they were accepted as Order" which means this particular version doesn't fly. Which means it goes back down to "Oh my god, look at what our brothers and cousins have been forced to resort to, in order to survive! If we had only listened to them and helped them, things might not have come to this..."
So a lot of these theories are inconsistent with what we actually know about quest-reality.

why do we think there was any chaos-taint burning?
The crater could equally be the result of some other form of magic, or from Morghur teleporting here.
Because the temperature is hotter than normal, which is something that might be the result of tons of Dhar being burnt in fire; and because there is far less Dhar here than there should be; there's less than in the rest of the Chaos Wastes that Mathilde has seen. (When, really, if Morghur is here the place should have way the hell more Dhar than even the Chaos Wastes we've seen.)

Ergo, it might be the case that the Runes of Valaya are hustling hard to burn a lot of Dhar. And this causes the temperature to heat up a bit. And burns away excess Dhar.

I mean, this was actually the exact thing and reason that made me think it might be the case, and I list it at the top of the particular post where I lay out the theory. (Though, I've made several posts in here, so. And I myself had like 50-60 pages unread still, having had to skip to page 70-80.)

"It is also hotter here than anywhere else in the Steppes."
+ "There is less ambient Dhar here than other parts of the Chaos Wastes Mathilde has seen, though still more than outside of it."
+ Mathilde's belt's rune: "Rune of Valaya's Vengeance: The third, the largest and most intricate of the three incorporates elements of both the Rune of the Furnace and the Rune that Valaya gave to the dwarves that allowed them to weather the coming of Chaos. It will grant you such resistance to flame that you could wade through lava, and burn off any taint of chaos before it could even touch you."
= "Maybe the Dwarfs did something with the Runes of Valaya to burn away all this Dhar? Possibly affecting Cor-Dum and the Beastmen in a positive fashion, possibly just making Morghur 'safer' to use or be around, not sure."
 
Ah, balls, I just realized something.

Much of the theories going around are assuming that Dum is desperate (and going to great lengths/radical kickflipping) to hold on in no small part because they're aware of the Waystone network and how important it is.

If it turns out that Dum's Runemasters are aware of what the Waystone energy is being used for, they might very well have the knowledge base to estimate how much energy goes in for each Waystone and how much energy would need to go out for each Hold/dwarf and have done that math.

Given that losing Vlag and Dum both put the whole thing into the net negatives and that Dum would logically be the larger input between them (more magic to absorb up north), it really highlights just why/how Dum would be so much more willing to radicalize themselves - they could reasonably conclude that losing Karag Dum would effectively pull the plug on the Karaz Ankor.

Of course, we've since reclaimed Vala-Azril-Ungol, which provides more than enough energy to offset the losses of Dum and Vlag - which means that all of the lengths Dum has gone to remain would have been for nought (assuming they were justified based on being necessary to keep the KA from making how much of a fossil they are more literal).

That's a really big deal, like, get a haircut level deal. :cry:
 
Just for the sake of argument, perhaps the reason figures like Cor-Dum turn up throughout history is because they are actually all the same person, just with weird chaos time-fuckery.

The conspicuous absence of a mountain range suggests some large-scale reality warping went on here. If Chaos did it they could just as easily have warped the hold wide open and taken it, so it was probably the dwarves, with a combination of the instability of reality in the wastes and radical runic techniques.

It looks like they basically swapped in some other set of terrain. That doesn't provide a huge tactical advantage, so it is probably part and parcel of whatever is getting the beastmen to defend them. Unfortunately, just tricking your enemies into fighting each other around you would not be shameful enough for Borek to just give up, so something worse is going on.

I do think the suggestion that they were creating beastmen is likely.( And possibly they are the original creators of Cor-Dum, courtesy of time-fuckery, [/tinfoilhat] though perhaps this is just a creature built on the same model.)
 
Given that losing Vlag and Dum both put the whole thing into the net negatives and that Dum would logically be the larger input between them (more magic to absorb up north), it really highlights just why/how Dum would be so much more willing to radicalize themselves - they could reasonably conclude that losing Karag Dum would effectively pull the plug on the Karaz Ankor.

Of course, we've since reclaimed Vala-Azril-Ungol, which provides more than enough energy to offset the losses of Dum and Vlag - which means that all of the lengths Dum has gone to remain would have been for nought (assuming they were justified based on being necessary to keep the KA from making how much of a fossil they are more literal).
It's even worse when you realize that it still doesn't matter. All their energy was useless to the Karaz Ankor as long as it was being used by Vlag to stay in the Warp.
 
You'll just drive yourself insane. I hope Boney closes the vote relatively soon before we start going into "flat earth" terrirory. Probably have a couple days before the insanity sets in.

(Also I find this situation maddening! In a good way, since it takes good writing to make me invested enough I wan tto know.)
 
Just for the sake of argument, perhaps the reason figures like Cor-Dum turn up throughout history is because they are actually all the same person, just with weird chaos time-fuckery.
That's... canon? Though, not involving time-fuckery, he's just unkillable. Destroy him and he'll only spawn again later.
 
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