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Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

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notanautomaton said:
@BoneyM would Gotri's offer to Gotrek apply to his wife and kid now that he died before accepting? If not, could we lie and claim that Gotrek accepted before he died in to help his wife and kid?
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Karak Eight Peaks isn't exactly overpopulated. If she wants in, she's welcome.

94000130FFF70000 said:
Since we don't actually know which of the unidentifiable remains was a named character, it feels like we ought to be able to make a desperate gamble, is what I was getting at.
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That brings us right back to the 'how many charges do we spend' conversation that's a really ugly debate that will probably be pointless but might be what decides if the quest ends or continues. That conversation is exactly what I'm trying to avoid. So no.
 
Garlak said:
The Urmskaladrak carried more food than the others, but it also used to carry the Slayers... who had died at Vlag. And Asarnil and Deathfang made it off the wagon.

Who would be better to lose though? The Volans with all the mages, or the Magnus with Ljiljana?
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From a purely objective standpoint, most of those characters were less important than Gotrek since he was the one needed for any intricate repairs on the Steam Wagons. We're kinda fucked if they suffer a major breakdown.
 
Deathbybunnies said:
If Karag Dum is still standing, it doesn't need immediate aid. If it's falling, we can't help any survivors without room to carry them or supplies for them.
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TotallyNotEvil said:
Turning back now means Dum is going to have to wait another few decades at best, probably.

If they are in a bind, this is our moment to bail them out or to at least confirm they need help, give some hope and come back with reinforcements.
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Mathilde on shadowsteed is fast enough to get back to civilization even if we straight up run out of food.

If we can't actually evacuate anyone at this point, couldn't she just... personally go check up on the status of Karag Dum?
 
Redshirt Army said:
It's not clear to me that Gotrek's wife would even want the offer. If she does then we can extend it, of course, but it's not a given.
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This looks illogical. From what I can tell, it expects us to mind read her to find out if she'd want the offer, then only make the offer if our telepathy lets us know she does. As opposed to extending the offer and seeing if she wants it based on whether she accepts it or refuses it.
 
Redshirt Army said:
It's not clear to me that Gotrek's wife would even want the offer. If she does then we can extend it, of course, but it's not a given.
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Yeah, she might want to stay in Ostermark (I think that was where it was said Gotrek was living?) and might not need looking after, being able to take care of herself for all we know. After all, this was the woman that Gotrek fancied enough that he was willing to leave his Clan over it. She probably isn't helpless or hapless. If she wants to, then I guess we make the offer. If she doesn't want to, then she doesn't want to, I guess.
Andres110 said:
This looks illogical. From what I can tell, it expects us to mind read her to find out if she'd want the offer, then only make the offer if our telepathy lets us know she does. As opposed to extending the offer and seeing if she wants it based on whether she accepts it or refuses it.
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Nah, it's not mind-reading, just simple conversation. We talk to her, and probe her for whether she's going to remain in Ostermark, whether she'd go elsewhere, or how stable and self-sufficient she is. Then if she expresses need or interest, then we float the offer her way.

You don't have to flat-out first offer. You can probe the person in conversation to see if they are in the state of being where they're looking for opportunities, or if they're perfectly comfortable where they are right now and not wanting to move.
 
[x] Press on

How long would it take for Mathilde to shadowsteed ahead to Karag Dum and back? Mathilde can go take a quick look to see if the Karag has already been sacked while the expedition continues on, if there is nothing left the expedition can just turn back with minimal waste of supplies. Sure there would be more danger to Mathilde but she should probably be able to flee whatever she comes across as a Grey Lady Magister. Would this be at all viable?
 
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Fayhem said:
IMO confirming Karag Dum still stands would have a MAJOR effect, however. Right now that's considered disputed at best and unlikely by most it seems like. Mobilizing more help for them would get much, much easier if we can confirm they're still there.
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Garlak said:
The other main objective of "Scout out what is Karag Dum's status" still remains though. Evacuating people may be harder, but it is still critical to find out if Dum is fallen or needs help or is hanging on well(ish) enough.
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...You know, if we're only a week out for the dwarf convoy, could Mathilde-
reignonyrparade said:
If we can't actually evacuate anyone at this point, couldn't she just... personally go check up on the status of Karag Dum?
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Okay Eshin chill (joking)

More seriously, I agree that's maybe an option. We aren't that far by shadowsteed reckoning, are we?

...Could we have Deathwing carry us and Borek to Dum, just to ascertain its status, as the Expedition proper starts to head back?

Andres110 said:
I don't think any amount of dwarf reputation will get us radical pistols. If Zhufbar were the sort to give experimental weapons to people solely for being held in high regard, I think we'd simply be able to get the pistols with Dwarf Favour.

As for pistol looks, I'm not expecting anything per se, but I am guessing that it'd look like the Outcast Engineer's pistol from Vermintide
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I actually meant how it was different rather than visually, but "experimental" is good enough. I don't think getting all of the convoy back would make too much of a difference to Mathilde's standing, to be honest.
 
Trickster314 said:
How long would it take for Mathilde to shadowsteed ahead to Karag Dum and back? Mathilde can go take a quick look to see if the Karag has already been sacked while the expedition continues on, if there is nothing left the expedition can just turn back with minimal waste of supplies. Would this be at all viable?
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Depends how many enormous gribblies she encounters capable of chasing her down on horseback. If there's any more than zero, it could take infinite time on account of being dead. There's a reason the Expedition is extremely heavily armed.
 
[] Have Arsanil and Deathwing fly ahead to Dum to ascertain its status - possibly with Mathilde and/or Borek - while the Expedition heads back.

@BoneyM is this a possibility? With the understanding that if Arsanil says they're actually holding out just fine, we can discuss turning back around.
 
Deathbybunnies said:
[] Have Arsanil and Deathwing fly ahead to Dum to ascertain its status - possibly with Mathilde and/or Borek - while the Expedition heads back.

@BoneyM is this a possibility?
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There's a reason the entire Expedition didn't begin and end with 'pay Asarnil to visit Karag Dum'. There aren't a lot of things in the world that can solo a dragon of Deathfang's calibre, but most of them hang out in the Chaos Wastes.
 
Deathbybunnies said:
[] Have Arsanil and Deathwing fly ahead to Dum to ascertain its status - possibly with Mathilde and/or Borek - while the Expedition heads back.

@BoneyM is this a possibility? With the understanding that if Arsanil says they're actually holding out just fine, we can discuss turning back around.
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Mathilde might be a better bet here, she's slower sure but she will actually run when she meets the more dangerous critters whereas Deathfang probably wont due to sheer pride.
 
Garlak said:
Nah, it's not mind-reading, just simple conversation. We talk to her, and probe her for whether she's going to remain in Ostermark, whether she'd go elsewhere, or how stable and self-sufficient she is. Then if she expresses need or interest, then we float the offer her way.

You don't have to flat-out first offer. You can probe the person in conversation to see if they are in the state of being where they're looking for opportunities, or if they're perfectly comfortable where they are right now and not wanting to move.
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Feels scummy to not give the offer just because we feel she'd refuse. Even if we think she'd refuse I think it's good to extend the offer.
 
@BoneyM Apologies if this falls under "manling nonsense" which you have already said the dwarves are unwilling to try unless all else fails, but can Johann use Trial and Error to assist the steam-wagons in their movement around the hazardous turn? He's Dawongr, so I figure they might accept assistance from him for the driving, even if they won't let him at the guts of the machine.

If so: would this need to be specifically written-in as a command, or is it something we can trust characters to do without our micromanagement?
 
Question. If we turn back now, without having fulfilled Ljiljana's mission of getting the Chaos Goblet...

How are the Kislevites going to feel about the next Dwarf expedition to the north?

If the Kislevites made a deal and didn't get what they asked for at all? (Sure, the Dwarfs might reply "We paid you all we asked" but the sticking point is Mathilde's side of the bargain. And that won't stop the Kislevites from being sorta annoyed.)

Either way, I figure it might be harder to get a thawed and unfrozen passage through the High Pass on the next expedition, if we turn back now.

So, that's another reason to continue on to Karag Dum. Because the next expedition probably won't have very pleased Ice Witches. =/

I mean. They're probably not going to be totally unreasonable about these things. But, certainly unsatisfied. So, testier and less easy to deal with, probably. 'Course, I guess that doesn't matter (well I mean I guess they could freeze High Pass out of anger on our return trip, but... why would they?) for this expedition, just the next hypothetical expedition.

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Andres110 said:
Feels scummy to not give the offer just because we feel she'd refuse. Even if we think she'd refuse I think it's good to extend the offer.
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What, how so? How is it scummy at all? If we talk to her and find that she's not interested at all, then... why bother giving the offer at all?

I highly doubt she's some helpless dependent who can't take care of herself after all.

I mean, if Gotrek was leaving behind only some young kids, yeah I'd make the offer anyway and feel bad about not making the offer. (Though, more than just Gotrek died on the expedition, truth be told... Then again, Gotrek was probably, probably, the only Clanless one amongst them.)
 
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[x] Press on

Salvage what food and critical items from the downed ship and move on.

The body not found for Gotrek leave abit of a hope that he got out at the last second but MIA somehow but if not, he will be missed.

Lets get the expedition moving again.
 
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picklepikkl said:
@BoneyM Apologies if this falls under "manling nonsense" which you have already said the dwarves are unwilling to try unless all else fails, but can Johann use Trial and Error to assist the steam-wagons in their movement around the hazardous turn? He's Dawongr, so I figure they might accept assistance from him for the driving, even if they won't let him at the guts of the machine.

If so: would this need to be specifically written-in as a command, or is it something we can trust characters to do without our micromanagement?
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Johann would have serious objections to being asked to ride every single steam-wagon as it crosses Doom Gulch when his magic actually has a very low chance of being able to change whether or not the ground will hold up underneath it.
 
picklepikkl said:
@BoneyM Apologies if this falls under "manling nonsense" which you have already said the dwarves are unwilling to try unless all else fails, but can Johann use Trial and Error to assist the steam-wagons in their movement around the hazardous turn? He's Dawongr, so I figure they might accept assistance from him for the driving, even if they won't let him at the guts of the machine.

If so: would this need to be specifically written-in as a command, or is it something we can trust characters to do without our micromanagement?
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Alternatively, maybe he can use some of his spells on that rock, to determine if the rock is more likely to crumble and fail or not? Brain is failing me right now but... it was the same spell he used on the mining spot of Karak Eight Peaks.

Same goes for any other useful spells any wizards might have. For scanning and determining if the rock might give way.
 
QTesseract said:
I completely understand the desire to press on, but it feels like sunk costs to me. If you had told me while we were setting out that this would be the condition we'd be crossing the steppes in, I wouldn't have wanted to set out, and I don't think that has changed. Emotionally there's a strong desire to continue on, but.

[x] Turn back
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But, what did you expect of the conditions? We're going into hell. it's been emphasized multiple times.
 
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