Threads Of Destiny(Eastern Fantasy, Sequel to Forge of Destiny)

[Raising Kittens]

The most direct way to increase our available strength is by improving improving the arts we already use, not training new ones. Look at this last turn! We spent almost twice as much effort on learning SES + HDW as we did finishing FSS; and can you really say that the former came even close to matching the latter in terms of effect?

Click to shrink...

Of course not. They're lower quality Arts, plain and simple; they shouldn't match FSS. They do cover great gaping holes in our build, improving our Perception and our Resist, as they were hoped to do. The fact that they don't do as much of those as we thought they did is irritating, but tolerable.

Like, the whole reason we put as much AP into them as we did, when we did, was because of that Music pill. Without that Music pill, turn 3 would have looked very different. I don't know what we would have done without access to that pill, because knowledge of said pill was around for quite some time, but I'm reasonably certain we'd be looking at Foundation by turn 6, MNO + IMH over SES, probably a few other differences.

So what you're saying is that most of these arts don't matter because these arts will need to be replaced by the time we get to the tournament - which, in turn, means that we should be looking to acquire arts in order to specialize our skills, not for whatever their techs do. In that case, DLS is our best option because it is specifically a Fade art, whereas ENM is a Stealth art. That also implies we want AFL to get a Flight specialty for Athletics. Like, our goal right now shouldn't be trying to fill holes in our art suite, because we're going to need to do that again as soon as we start getting closer to the tournament. Our goal right now should be to finish out our current arts, find successor arts where we can, and develop specialized skills so that we have a solid foundation for the arts we learn closer to the tournament. I guess that if it costs less AP to advance a skill by cultivating an art, we should do that, but it's the skill we care about not the art.

Click to shrink...

We need to utilize the Arts in challenges to get the resources we need to be better prepared for the Tournament, too - and because we need to be no more than 5 ranks behind CRX, who needs to be in the top 525, by the end of Year Two.

So yes, having Stealth Arts to complete offensive and defensive Stealth Challenges is incredibly useful, as it increases the breadth of challenges we can succeed in and the variety of challengers we can defeat. It also means we're more effective at our Sect Duties, which are as a member of the Scout Force - succeeding there requires good Stealth and good Perception.

We also need more Arts so that we can train up our Domain. One tenth of Art exp to Domain exp isn't all that much when we need 8,360 points of Art exp to reach Domain Rank E, and I'd like to do that before Green Four. Now, it's almost guaranteed with a goal that distant, but... mastery of our current set of Arts to the soft-cap of Green 3 (PLR 8, mastery of SCS, TRF, CDE, SES, HDW), leaves us with ~2,270 Domain exp remaining.

Now, we'll absolutely be getting other fantastic Arts from sources other than the Archive. But... we still need to reach Domain D, too, which is probably (at a conservative estimate) 12,000 Art exp - and the Arts we can use to train our Domain might be narrower in scope and theme, too.

Yes, we don't suffer in a great and terrible way - but we lose time. If we don't work on Physical now, we WILL have to spend more actions working on it later. This isn't going to be solved by a magical pill; if such a pill becomes available we will buy it regardless, so no matter what, not training Physical now means more work on it later.

Click to shrink...

To be quite frank, 1 or 2 AP of physical is the cheapest cost to cover Fade and improve our Stealth Suite that we can get and the option that we can most readily afford the costs of. Cutting SCS/TRF/PLR is practically right out, that last rank of CDE narrows our options for that last Domain slot, dropping Jobs means we miss out on what we need to ensure Spiritual by turn 5 instead of turn 6, etc. Physical is the only place we can cut AP.

That's a strong argument for DLS indeed.

Click to shrink...

The language used for first tech on each of ENM and DLS is the same: 'Enhances'. DLS 'enhances' S. Avoid and S. Armor, while ENM 'enhances' Stealth, S. Avoid, and either S. Hit or S. Pen, the language isn't clear. So at least at level 1, their techniques are tied on S. Avoid. Their passives aren't, true.

Don't get me wrong, I want both DLS and ENM. I just want them for different purposes, and using ENM to train Fade while we're learning it is better than not doing so. Should we end up training it next turn or the turn after, at any rate.

 

[naths]

@yrsillar a question regarding skill training: if we put 1 dice to in this case perceptiveness, but it caps before the roll even happens, what will happen? does the dice get rolled anyways or does it vanish or will it randomly assigned to another skill or maybe something else?

 

[archangis]

The language used for first tech on each of ENM and DLS is the same: 'Enhances'. DLS 'enhances' S. Avoid and S. Armor, while ENM 'enhances' Stealth, S. Avoid, and either S. Hit or S. Pen, the language isn't clear. So at least at level 1, their techniques are tied on S. Avoid. Their passives aren't, true.

Click to shrink...

I was talking about thus scattered which is a defensive response (and as such not part of the action paradigm).

Thus Scattered: C
Duration: Immediate
In the moment before a spiritual attack would strike home, though user's spirit and dantian scatters into a thousand wisps of shadow, reforming after the attack has passed through. Enhances spiritual avoid, and reduces damage from a successful attack significantly.

Click to shrink...

 

[PrimalShadow]

To be quite frank, 1 or 2 AP of physical is the cheapest cost to cover Fade and improve our Stealth Suite that we can get and the option that we can most readily afford the costs of. Cutting SCS/TRF/PLR is practically right out, that last rank of CDE narrows our options for that last Domain slot, dropping Jobs means we miss out on what we need to ensure Spiritual by turn 5 instead of turn 6, etc. Physical is the only place we can cut AP.

Click to shrink...

We cannot cut Physical; we can only push it back. If you want to pick up an art to cover Fade (despite Six covering it in the short- and mid-term) or the like, you have to actually CUT something. Given that fully mastering in art plus opening the meridians for it probably takes 5+ AP, what do you imaging actually cutting to make room?

 

[Black Noise]

We cannot cut Physical; we can only push it back. If you want to pick up an art to cover Fade (despite Six covering it in the short- and mid-term) or the like, you have to actually CUT something. Given that fully mastering in art plus opening the meridians for it probably takes 5+ AP, what do you imaging actually cutting to make room?

Click to shrink...

We can, in fact, cut physical (or spiritual) if we take jobs and dedicate the SP from those jobs to cover the missing AP progress. The advantage is flexibility, the disadvantage is unreliability of progress (since it relies on pill RNG). Though on average it should result in faster progress than "just" base training, provided the sacrifice is limited in scope.

 

[Raising Kittens]

I was talking about thus scattered which is a defensive response (and as such not part of the action paradigm).

Click to shrink...

SCS's mastery technique accomplishes much the same, against any attack, not merely spiritual ones. So while that's a good technique, we currently 'have it covered'.

We cannot cut Physical; we can only push it back. If you want to pick up an art to cover Fade (despite Six covering it in the short- and mid-term) or the like, you have to actually CUT something. Given that fully mastering in art plus opening the meridians for it probably takes 5+ AP, what do you imaging actually cutting to make room?

Click to shrink...

And I meant 'cut' one/two AP of physical from turn 4/5 plans.

As far as 'cutting' anything in the lead up to Green Four to 'make room'?

Nothing. I see it as a requirement for a basic stealth suite, and not having ENM - or an equivalent tool to 'reset' our stealth - means not having a completed stealth suite. And not having a completed Stealth suite, when we're a member of the Sect's scout force, is counterproductive.

Because doing Duties through the Scout Force is probably the best way we'll have to gain more Contribution Points, barring defensive Challenges.

 

[yrsillar]

Ok so point by point:

• We don't have the time or room to look for an art that solely provides instant combat buffs. Same with a pure Fade art.
• PLR is strong but to use JT we need to setup a B-rank extremely showy tech. This is expensive and time-consuming as all hell.
• Archive 2 arts aren't gonna be magic, their advantage over Archive 1 is a higher max scaling, not quality. At Appraisal they should have similar in power to Archive 1.
• FSS Aria does indeed provide sp.def and sp.atk (via debuff), but it's it's about as anti-stealth as PLR. FSS is also not a Fade art so it's bonus there is more incidental, it won't actually matter when up against a tech-based bypass effect.

Last 2 points are more questions to ask yrs for clarification. The impression I have is:
> "unaware" is a status we can lose after we get discovered once, attack or are hit, and regaining it is very much a non-trivial assumption, but is an effect ENM provides much like SCS erased our mundane physical tracks.
> in a vacuum AFL may provide a stronger stealth buff than ENM, and said buff may apply to "hiding" stealth and not just "larceny", but it should provide little-to-no additional benefit in terms of physical stealth when used in conjunction with SCS's OWS, where we literally become an immaterial shadow capable of teleporting around.

EDIT: worth noting that we very much want "unaware" to apply since SCS gives us another +10 hit against such targets (for an effective +20 over "unsure").


So to @yrsillar, can you clarify these 2 points?

1. Do we get to keep the "Unaware" state after attacking or if stealth gets broken otherwise, and how would ENM work with it? (e.g would it allow us to get "unaware" even against opponents within 1 rank of our stealth).
2. Is AFL's stealth buff one to hiding, larceny, or both, and if it buffs hiding would it directly stack with SCS/OWS?

Click to shrink...

unaware is normally lost after attacking, at least until you act again which might enable you to regain stealth. since attacking effectively gives a large penalty to stealth. Once an enemy has gone from unaware to unsure you can't reverse that without an effect like ENM's or another stealth art

AFL is more larceny than hiding

@yrsillar a question regarding skill training: if we put 1 dice to in this case perceptiveness, but it caps before the roll even happens, what will happen? does the dice get rolled anyways or does it vanish or will it randomly assigned to another skill or maybe something else?

Click to shrink...

I'd probably refund the dice and add it to an addendum vote

 

[Echki]

@yrsillar What happens if a cultivator has to do something that goes against the insights in his domain?
Will he be unable to think or act like that?

 

[PrimalShadow]

We can, in fact, cut physical (or spiritual) if we take jobs and dedicate the SP from those jobs to cover the missing AP progress. The advantage is flexibility, the disadvantage is unreliability of progress (since it relies on pill RNG). Though on average it should result in faster progress than "just" base training, provided the sacrifice is limited in scope.

Click to shrink...

If taking Sect Jobs to buy pills spend on Physical is a better way to advance our Physique than Physical Cultivation actions, we should do that regardless - and regardless, this does not constitute cutting Physical. Fundamentally, we are going to have to commit a certain amount of investment to advancing our base cultivation one way or another; you can't get around that, any more than you can get rid of the water in a sealed water balloon by squeezing different parts of it.

If you want to dedicate resources to an extra Archive 1 art, that extra investment MUST be matched with cutting something else.

And I meant 'cut' one/two AP of physical from turn 4/5 plans.

As far as 'cutting' anything in the lead up to Green Four to 'make room'?

Nothing. I see it as a requirement for a basic stealth suite, and not having ENM - or an equivalent tool to 'reset' our stealth - means not having a completed stealth suite. And not having a completed Stealth suite, when we're a member of the Sect's scout force, is counterproductive.

Because doing Duties through the Scout Force is probably the best way we'll have to gain more Contribution Points, barring defensive Challenges.

Click to shrink...

So the assertion is that, in the long term, we need to allocate time for a stealth art, and it is that time that is being used for ENM now?

Fine. In that case, I contend that the thing you are cutting is a better stealth art. After all, if we DIDN'T grab an extra Archive 1 art now but wanted stealth late anyways, then in the future we would probably grab a better art from either a higher level archive or from the Cai Library. But since you are using up those actions now, that becomes off the table.

(Unless, of course, you plan to grab ENM now and also grab a better stealth art in the future. At which point, we are back where we started;what are you cutting to make room?)

 

[Raising Kittens]

Fine. In that case, I contend that the thing you are cutting is a better stealth art. After all, if we DIDN'T grab an extra Archive 1 art now but wanted stealth late anyways, then in the future we would probably grab a better art from either a higher level archive or from the Cai Library. But since you are using up those actions now, that becomes off the table.

(Unless, of course, you plan to grab ENM now and also grab a better stealth art in the future. At which point, we are back where we started;what are you cutting to make room?)

Click to shrink...

/facepalm.

Is getting an art now, that we can get good utility out of now, something you can't understand? Because it seems you can't understand it. We have a slot that I feel needs filling, that's the only option available at this time to fill it. If we don't fill it and wait for 'whatever' to come to pass - what, three-five turns down the line, when we've got free access to Archive 2 and free AP to actually utilize any Arts we've obtained from it (Or maybe you're holding out on Archive 3 being that much 'better'? That's ten+ turns down the line to get 'free access') - then we're out of getting that effect for that time.

Will this matter, WRT EMN? Maybe; there's no way of knowing in advance. Does it have the potential to tilt certain events in our favor? It certainly looks like it. Does it alter our skill training plans? Yes - Fade C in 3 training AP instead of 4, capped Fade C by turn ~5/6, [Advanced] Fade B by turn ~7. Dropping ENM, and not replacing it with, say, DLS, means our Fade is pushed back by at least two turns, more probably three.

Yes, we'll get better stealth Arts. We'll also get better Perception, and Defenses, and Social, and Damage, and debuffs, and, and, and... later. We'll get them all! Eventually.

Does getting an Art as good at what PLR does, except it starts in Green 3 and ends in Green 5, invalidate PLR? No, it doesn't.

Would getting a 'Forgotten Vale Melody' equivalent that was dark/wind ('Howling Vale Melody'?) that started in Yellow 2 and ended in Green 3 have invalidated FVM? No, it wouldn't.

Does getting something better later invalidate learning an Art now? No, it doesn't. I think this would be obvious. A 'condensed' build? Would still have 10+ Arts, even if every Art just did one thing really well, and not 2-3 okay-ish.

I do, in fact, understand AP constraints - if I didn't I'd be advocating training Formations and our 'Ossuary Scouts' in particular to utilize any insights we gain via utilizing CDE's projections, but we don't have the time. Our deadlines are too damn strict for anything other than personal prowess, in both the social and combat arenas.

And, of course, all of our plans will come to naught given upcoming events. As they usually do.

 

[DeAnno]

@PrimalShadow , we would probably do ordering on a Physical/Jobs plan like this, with EPC all into Spiritual:

Spiritual x4
Physical x4
Jobs x4
Meridians x1 (Head, Lung)
TRF x1
PLR x3
SCS x1
CDE x2

Spiritual x4
Physical x4
Meridians x1 (Head, Spine)
TRF x4
PLR x2
SCS x1
CDE x1-2 (Depends on T4 rolls)
Jobs x2-3

CDE is frontloaded a bit because it's borderline for 3 AP and this would let us decide what it needed. Turn 4 meridians go to CDE (1 blank lung has to go to PLR) and turn 5 meridians go to CDE 5 and SCS. (If CDE 5 looks like garbage we could also abort doing it)

For a skill plan it wouldn't include the Fade that is being bantered about for the ENM plans.

EDIT: We could also frontload 2 more jobs and backload 2 more PLR for more pill flexibility and less month 4 PLR

 

[sophistsDismay]

@yrsillar Is it deliberate that MNO doesn't have Resilience or Fade as a keyword or is it an oversight?

 

[Thor's Twin]

Now, I know some interesting build discussions are ongoing... but here's an omake instead!

Burning Trees; Growing Fires

Gui Baoshi exhaled, her breath creating a steady stream of mist in the morning chill. Even with the sweat beaded on her brow, her arms and legs did not move from the stance she had assumed. Old Man Kuai paced around her with his length of willow, prepared to lash out should even a single muscle be out of place. Feeling the burn of exertion, Gui Baoshi began to carefully cycle some of her qi. Under her tight direction, the flows of her qi swept away the exhaustion her muscles were feeling, like a cool summer stream. After what felt like an eternity of this process, Old Man Kuai stopped his circling, nodded, and lowered his willow whip to the side.

"Hmm… it seems like I have nothing left to teach you Gui Baoshi. Do you believe that to be true?"

Gu Baoshi forced her face to remain placid to the question. It was most likely a trick question, either implying that she had learned all that he could teach or that she was so hopeless that this was the limit of her ability. Better to sidestep the question entirely then.

"Only so far as I must advance in my other abilities before returning to your training, sir."

"Hah! If only my student was as fleet of foot as she is quick of wit, then maybe some actual progress can be had. There has been enough training today though. While I am unsure how much of a difference it could possibly make, it would reflect poorly on me should I let my student exhaust herself before the competition. As such, you are dismissed, prepare yourself for tomorrow."

And with that curt dismissal, Old Man Kuai spun around and walked inside the training hall. Most likely to contemplate how to make every other students' lives miserable, that sadistic monster. At least he got the job done, she knew the basic stances better than any of her cousins, with the possible exception of Gui Bo.

Gui Baoshi felt some mild euphoria as she relaxed her muscles for the first time in hours. Every bone and muscle ached, but it would recede after a couple of stretches and some downtime. The sun was still some hours away from its zenith, which meant that she had some time before her more mentally taxing lessons. She walked over to the shade provided by the courtyard wall, took a swig of water from the jug she had left there, and then poured the rest over her head to cool down.

Tomorrow was the big day. The day of the blasted tournament where Gui Bo would win and secure the determination of the elder's to send him to the Argent Sect. Everyone knew that's what would happen, but everyone was too polite to make a big fuss of it. All the hard work, all the bruises and welts, all the sleepless nights slowly moving through mindnumbing katas to engrain them into her body, all meaningless in the face of true talent and a place as the son of the heir of the clan. Gui Bo got the best teachers, Gui Bo got the best pills, Gui Bo got the best fucking training sites!

The sharp retort of shattering pottery was painfully loud to her ears. Looking glumly at the remains of the water jug, she resolved to get over herself. So what if she couldn't get to the Argent Sect because of some stuck up cousin! There were still lesser sects scattered around the Emerald Seas, maybe if she acquited herself well in the tournament the clan elders would hear her request to be sent to one of those. Anything was better than these familiar walls and valleys.

Collecting the pieces of shattered pottery was slightly relaxing. It felt like she was cleaning up her life and resolving herself to request the elder's permission to apply at one of the lesser sects. There was a niggling feeling though, that what she was actually picking up were the pieces of her shattered dream.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The noonday sun beat down on Gui Baoshi as she stood in line with her cousins. All of them were dressed in the traditional training gi for the occasion. Light greens tastefully combined with darker reds with some embroidered stylized leaves and flames made the gi stand out against the sullen brown dirt of the large training ground. Something strange was going on though, Gui Bo had not joined the assembled cousins. Taking a quick glance around, she noticed that while many of the prominent members of the clan were present for the tournament, the most influential and powerful were conspicuously absent. Including the Head of the clan as well as the heir. And their absence at the traditional competition was causing a stir amongst the assembled clan members.

The sudden arrival of the Elders, though, stifled the murmurers. Standing atop their designated section of the stands, the Elders were a sight to behold. The ten Elders of the Gui clan were intensely powerful cultivators, with the head elder having recently ascended into the violet realm. Then, with a voice like the rumbling of ancient mountains, the Head Elder began to speak.

"Today is the day that we test the young and bright of the Gui clan against each other, to determine who among them is the brightest of our youth. As today is an honored occasion, it brings us joy to see many of the Gui clan here to support their children and cousins. Some among you might have noticed the absence of rather prominent figures from among the Gui clan, which tradition would normally dictate should be present. Do not be concerned, for if they could have made the time to supervise the tournament they would have. However, the Ling Clan requested the Gui Clan's aid in a matter of some importance and the main branch of the Gui Clan has answered the Ling Clan's call."

The silence from the crowd was absolute, but even Gu Baoshi could feel the thread of fear worm its way into her heart. If the matter had the Ling Clan requesting Gui Clan warriors, then it was assured that there would be fighting in the near future. And if the main branch had responded to the call, then the fighting would require the best of the Gui Clan, a frightening proposition.

"But we are not here to worry," the elder continued, "but here to celebrate and rejoice. The prosperity of the Gui Clan has swollen our coffers beyond the point of bursting, and it has been the determination of the Council of Elders that an investment for the future of the Clan should be made. As such, we have elected to send the two brightest youths of the Gui clan to the Argent Sect for further education and assistance in the ways of cultivation."

At this, Gui Baoshi felt a thrill of hope. There is a chance! A chance to make it to the Argent Sect! And with the rise of Gui Baoshi's hopes, came the rise of murmurers and whispers from the assembled members of the clan. The elder was not yet done, however, and with a cascading wave of power he silenced the excited whispers of the on-lookers.

"There are other changes to this year's tournament as well. Gui Bo has broken through into the yellow and silver realm and as such shall not be participating in this tournament. He has already received the elder's blessing to go to the Argent Sect for his astonishing progress and talent. Moreover, it is not a guarantee that another youth will be sent to the Argent Sect. The winner of the tournament must acquit themselves well in a spar against Gu Bo to be considered eligible for the chance to proceed to the Argent Sect. Additionally, I and the Second Elder will adjudicate the tournament and provide protection for the contestants in lieu of the Head and Heir. That is all of the announcements. As such, let the tournament commence!"

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Gui Baoshi looked out across the sullen dirt of the training ground towards her opponent. Already ugly back scars crisscrossed the field and light grey ash had settled over the dirt. Gui Chun was her opponent, known for her continued mastery of the Ashen Meadow art and her work on its offshoots. It was… unfortunate for her then, that Gui Baoshi had already prepared a strategy for just this encounter.

Given the high qi costs for the Ashen Meadow arts and Gui Chun's failure to advance further into the Turtle's Forest arts, this fight should end very quickly. Well, as long as Gui Baoshi was able to land a couple of hits from her Raging Inferno art. And then, with the sound of sturdy timber cracking, the fight began.

With a sudden start, Gui Baoshi charged towards her opponent, taking as many deep breaths as she was able. At the same time, super-heated ash flowed out of Gui Chun's mouth, surrounding her and then expanding, creating a cloud of toxic heated ash. Gui Baoshi gave it no thought as she closed her mouth and charged into the cloud. Flecks of ash stung her eyes and nose and tried to burn her skin, but cool wood qi flowed out of her skin and grew into a barrier to protect against the oncoming ash. Suddenly Gui Baoshi spotted a shadow darting around her, trying to get behind her. Slamming her foot into the dirt, she pivoted and jammed a fist wreathed in flames into the shadow's midsection. The shadow crumpled into a heap, gasping for air, but the fight had not been called and the ash still swirled around Gui Baoshi. Already, she felt her lungs straining for air after the moments of intense exertion, but with calm efficiency she ignored it. Breathing now would let ash scorch and poison her lungs, which would make this fight harder to finish and later fights harder to win.

Instead of doing what her body begged her to do, Gui Baoshi unleashed her own version of hell. Small branches sprouted from the ground to bracket and cover Gui Chun's kneeling form, and then a tight whirlpool of fire formed to consume and destroy the tiny bush, with Gui Chun still inside it. Just as suddenly as it had begun, it stopped. Second Elder appeared between her and Gui Chun extinguishing both the whirlpool of fire and the cloud of ash. Gently, he gripped Gui Chun and disappeared, probably to the clan's healers. Gui Baoshi was left on the tournament ground alone, to deal with the applause her victory deserved. Bowing and smiling, she walked back to the rapidly dwindling assembly of cousins. Just a couple more to go, before she was the winner of the tournament. One more step closer to achieving her dream.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The rest of the fights went by in a blur. There was little room for variation on the clan arts given that they were all only in the red realm, and so it was merely a combination of enduring flaming fists, not breathing in toxic ash, and cracking open her opponent's defenses. With each opponent defeated, Gui Baoshi's anticipation grew, until she was thrumming with nervous energy and facing down Gui Bo across the field. She had already won the tournament, but the real fight was before her now.

There was only so much she could do to prepare for the fight. Second Elder had given her a pill to replenish all of her qi and the clan healers had done some basic healing so that both she and Gui Bo would be in peak condition for the final fight. However, no one was expecting her to win. A single late red against a member of the main branch who was already in the yellow realm? There was almost no chance to actually secure a win. Yet, with a small grin, Second Elder had granted her request, to carry a small jug of chilled water on to the battlefield.

Gui Bo stood there before her and sneered. With condescension dripping from his voice he began his typical pre-combat taunting, "If you think a jug of water is enough to stop my flames, then perhaps the rumors of your addled brain are true. Or is it wine? Do you need some alcohol to make a fire, or are you planning to drink the sorrows of the defeat away?"

"Gui Bo!" Gui Baoshi exclaimed, "Surely you know I'm too young to truly partake in wine! Unless old age has come early to you and stole your memories as well as your looks? No, I just thought that after I gave you a good thrashing a drink of water will be pleasant."

And then with the sound of cracking timber, the fight was on. Gui Bo exhaled, and ash poured out of his mouth, quickly surrounding him and surging towards her. Just as quickly, however, she tore off the sleeve of her gi and drenched it in cool water, and then rapidly tied it around her mouth. Then, with a surge of her legs, she dashed into the swelling cloud of ash.

The heat was oppressive, and ash stung her eyes, nose, and skin. But the cool comfort of vital wood qi quickly expanded and shrouded her, creating a protective covering. A twisting branch erupted from the ground, seeking to grapple her legs and restrain her, but with a quick sidestep, it was left grasping air. Suddenly, a shadow was upon her, fists sheathed in flame slamming into her shoulder. Her viridian armor buckled and cracked as she backpedaled away from the threat. Ash was already worming its way in and corroding the armor while leaving stinging burns on her shoulder.

She needed to do something now! If he kept at this, she wouldn't have even been able to land a blow and that would definitely not work in her favor. Planting her backfoot, she pivoted and slammed a kick into Gui Bo, who merely caught it and prepared to throw her over his shoulder. But using his hands as a platform, she twisted her body and slammed a flaming foot into the side of his face. Surprised, he let go of her trapped foot, and she tumbled to the ground.

Scrambling backward to gain a little distance from Gui Bo proved to be a mistake. Thick roots shot out of the ground all around her and pinned her to the ground. Soon a raging inferno roared around her, cracking, breaking, and crumbling her armor. Gui Baoshi poured even more qi into the construct, begging for it to outlast Gui Bo's inferno. All for naught, as the raging flames were not to be denied. As the last layer of wood qi broke, all Gui Baoshi felt was heat and pain. And then nothing.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Gui Baoshi woke up in a comfortable bed next to a window overlooking a section of the Emerald Sea. A quick check of her skin assured her that there were no burn scars or blemished skin, and there was no sensation of pain to tell her that anything was wrong. Which meant that the healers must have already received her. With a sigh of relief, she began to look more closely at the rest of her surroundings.

Most notably was a stark white slip of paper on the nightstand next to the bed. Picking it up, Gui Baoshi noticed that it was a small letter with the… elder's stamp? Tearing it open, she read the contents, and a bright grin stretched from ear to ear. Her performance had been more than satisfactory, and as such, she had been selected to go the Argent Sect!


A/N: Another omake for the omake throne @yrsillar! This one continues in the vein of what a future Emerald Seas could look like. The Gui clan are a vassal clan of the Ling clan that focus on learning concepts from Zhengui and distilling them into arts for their clan members. I always have loved the concept of growth and destruction, and if humans can be inspired by the natural spirits (given AFL), then I believe that people can be inspired by Zhengui. I hope you enjoy the read, and as always I appreciate critiques and comments.

 

[Black Noise]

Fundamentally, we are going to have to commit a certain amount of investment to advancing our base cultivation one way or another; you can't get around that, any more than you can get rid of the water in a sealed water balloon by squeezing different parts of it.

Click to shrink...

That's the thing though, it's a false analogy because Job AP are fundamentally positive sum. In fact, job AP return scales pretty linearly until we're running into more than 3-4 jobs/turn average, something we can't do unless we cut heavily into something, arts or Base.

Granted cutting base (or more specifically, phys) means we would likely delay it by a turn or 2 depending on how much we cut provided we can't use the freed up SP to divert to phys-boosting pills to compensate for the loss, but the gain here is in a faster overall progression (more jobs/turn = "effective" AP in total) and earlier access to direct power in the form of Arts (since they'd get cut for jobs less and are in any case likely required to maximize pill potential).

(Unless, of course, you plan to grab ENM now and also grab a better stealth art in the future. At which point, we are back where we started;what are you cutting to make room?)

Click to shrink...

Oh I don't know, how about at least 3 turns of having a functional stealth art that also doubles as a Fade art, one that would also give us some of those darkness meridians for domain weapon use and allow buffing from Sixiang.

 

[PrimalShadow]

Yes, we'll get better stealth Arts. We'll also get better Perception, and Defenses, and Social, and Damage, and debuffs, and, and, and... later. We'll get them all! Eventually.

Does getting an Art as good at what PLR does, except it starts in Green 3 and ends in Green 5, invalidate PLR? No, it doesn't.

Would getting a 'Forgotten Vale Melody' equivalent that was dark/wind ('Howling Vale Melody'?) that started in Yellow 2 and ended in Green 3 have invalidated FVM? No, it wouldn't.

Does getting something better later invalidate learning an Art now? No, it doesn't. I think this would be obvious. A 'condensed' build? Would still have 10+ Arts, even if every Art just did one thing really well, and not 2-3 okay-ish.

I do, in fact, understand AP constraints

Click to shrink...

You say you understand AP constraints, but you repeatedly dodge away from actually addressing them.

Yes, we'll eventually get better stealth Arts, better Perception, better Defenses, better Damage, and debuffs, and so on. But the amount of those things we can get is directly related to how much time we spend on them. Time spend on an Archive 1 art now necessarily means less time spent on something more advanced later.

If you want to pick up an art now because it presents significant immediate utility, that is fine - but you have to accept that this comes at the cost of losing time in the long term. I merely demand that you announce something that you are willing to give up for this. And yeah, nobody knows the future and our plans are liable to change, but I'm not demanding a specific plan or the like; I just want to to instantiate the opportunity cost in a tangible way.

 

[PrimalShadow]

(Unless, of course, you plan to grab ENM now and also grab a better stealth art in the future. At which point, we are back where we started;what are you cutting to make room?)

Click to shrink...

Oh I don't know, how about at least 3 turns of having a functional stealth art that also doubles as a Fade art, one that would also give us some of those darkness meridians for domain weapon use and allow buffing from Sixiang.

Click to shrink...

This doesn't match what you quoted; did you mean to quote something else?

That's the thing though, it's a false analogy because Job AP are fundamentally positive sum. In fact, job AP return scales pretty linearly until we're running into more than 3-4 jobs/turn average, something we can't do unless we cut heavily into something, arts or Base.

Click to shrink...

If we start from the assumption that Sect Jobs are net AP positive, then we should be maxing out Sect Jobs in ANY plan, barring something which has an emergency demand on our time. If anything, that actually strengthens the case in favor of not picking up anything extra - it gives us a chance to do more Sect Jobs and build up a bit of a cushion in case we get multiple good pills at the same time or want to surge our actions and not spend time on Sect Jobs.

 

[EternalObserver]

So suppose that you train the archive 1 art and eventually get a skill upgrade to it like Sable Grace, in that very same turn you get an art that works way better. What do we do with the skill now? Do we just keep training it or do we try to get another skill from that art?

 

[djd]

If we keep on waiting for the perfect stealth art, we're never going to pick one. "Perfect being the enemy of the good" and all that.

 

[Arkeus]

@yrsillar could you add the cultivation stages in green somewhere in the tutorial? Or cultivation realms too, iirc it's not there either.

Iirc:
Early, Appraisal, Foundation, Threshold, Framing, Formation, Fortification, Completion

 

[sophistsDismay]

Yes but on the other hand mediocrity is the enemy of excellence and boy are the archive arts mediocre

 

[Raising Kittens]

You say you understand AP constraints, but you repeatedly dodge away from actually addressing them.

Yes, we'll eventually get better stealth Arts, better Perception, better Defenses, better Damage, and debuffs, and so on. But the amount of those things we can get is directly related to how much time we spend on them. Time spend on an Archive 1 art now necessarily means less time spent on something more advanced later.

If you want to pick up an art now because it presents significant immediate utility, that is fine - but you have to accept that this comes at the cost of losing time in the long term. I merely demand that you announce something that you are willing to give up for this. And yeah, nobody knows the future and our plans are liable to change, but I'm not demanding a specific plan or the like; I just want to to instantiate the opportunity cost in a tangible way.

Click to shrink...

We can't know the actual opportunity cost. Not in the long run, and not in a tangible, guaranteed, 'by doing 'X' now we're giving up 'Y' later' sense.

We. Can't. Know it. The knowledge does not exist, because the events aren't at our doorstep.

This is planning for the future - what is the opportunity cost of an action taken or not taken next week? Next month? Next year?

You can't genuinely know that. You can guess, you can approximate, you can come pretty damn close, but you can't actually know in advance. It will only become truly clear in hindsight.

You can know the immediate opportunity cost - like, dropping an AP of Phys, or w/e. You can know the knock-on effects of that - needing to do a bit more phys later.

But you can't know what the long-term opportunity cost of an action is going to be with any great certainty, because opportunity costs are two-edged swords. An opportunity not taken could mean... anything. An advantage not gained, a weakness ignored, could be the difference between life and death, or be meaningless.

What are you willing to give up that ENM could potentially give us in the short term? And I'm talking known possibilities, rather than unknown ones. A wider variety of challenge targets - to get those rank-ups we need to get more GSS + Better Vent + Higher archive access - I think we've got another few Sect Training events coming up, Fade B ~four turns sooner, etc.

...

Anyway, to actually answer your question - 'what don't I want to train' is what I think you're asking:

I'm fine with not picking up any dedicated Social Arts (other than ensuring we have at least something for Social Perception [HDW fills this... mostly]) Bureaucracy Arts, 'Art' Arts, 'Craft' Arts, Beast Handling Arts, Spirit Ken Arts, or any 'Weapon Skill' Arts.

Though I don't think I'd get an argument on most of those.

Yes but on the other hand mediocrity is the enemy of excellence and boy are the archive arts mediocre

Click to shrink...

And oh boy is 'Mediocre' better than 'Nothing'.

 

[EternalObserver]

Could we also get a skill advancement from SCS as well or does it have to be this one skill the art advances?

 

[archangis]

We can't know the actual opportunity cost. Not in the long run, and not in a tangible, guaranteed, 'by doing 'X' now we're giving up 'Y' later' sense.

We. Can't. Know it. The knowledge does not exist, because the events aren't at our doorstep.

Click to shrink...

Except they are. We know when the tournament is gonna happen and we should make plans to have our power levels spike then. All our plans should be made with that goal in mind.

 

[Thor's Twin]

I have formulated the best plan ever on how to achieve our goals! What we need to do is do 2 explore actions, and then illegally boost them up with omake points so that all four rolls hit 100.

Once all four rolls hit 100, then Ling Qi should discover a portal to a pocket dimension that contains priceless pills and elixirs to boost physical and spiritual as well as having a time dilation device so that we gain double AP! Surely we can discover it because that's what happens to practically every Xianxia protagonist ever at one point or another.

 

[FakePriest]

I have formulated the best plan ever on how to achieve our goals! What we need to do is do 2 explore actions, and then illegally boost them up with omake points so that all four rolls hit 100.

Once all four rolls hit 100, then Ling Qi should discover a portal to a pocket dimension that contains priceless pills and elixirs to boost physical and spiritual as well as having a time dilation device so that we gain double AP! Surely we can discover it because that's what happens to practically every Xianxia protagonist ever at one point or another.

Click to shrink...

You are joking, but it's actually interesting idea. Maybe not portal in another dimension but even without 'illegal actions' we easily can find very potent sites capable of greatly boosting our Art Cultivation.