Threads Of Destiny(Eastern Fantasy, Sequel to Forge of Destiny)

[naths]

about clan structures: the template for a conventional imperial clan was explained like this: (Forge of Destiny(Xianxia Quest) Original - Fantasy)

Peak of the clan: Matriarch/Patriarch. Position is determined by cultivation level and age. Their peers are called Ancestors.

the clan is usually run by the Clan Head. Their cultivation determines the rank of the clan. Usually at most 1 cultivation stage down from the Patriarch/Matriarch. Their peers are called Elders.

the age group below that has the Clan Heir. their peers are the ones who are working for the clan or get posts in the army or in ministries and such.

and the last age category is the one for young masters and misses. they are the kids sent to sects and stuff. their 'job' is basically to get a decent cultivation. upper age limit is usually around 30-40, though CRX mentioned that high ranking clans might not give someone serious responsibility until they are at least 100

 

[Bakkasama]

Li Suyin and Su Ling are both fellow baronesses and the Sect is going to be very interested in keeping them. The Ma sisters are a more realistic target, but the new interlude suggested they've got a good chance of reaching Green and getting their own titles before they hit 17. So it's probably just a dream, unless I misunderstood and you were talking about recruiting for our team in the inter-sect tournament rather than for our fief.

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They can still be subordinates without being vassals, in which case them being barons too wouldn't matter that much. Like, we can be Cai Renxiang's left hand in which case we would be higher in the hirarchy to other people who work for her even if they are higher in the nobility scale.

 

[memoryofglory]

They can still be subordinates without being vassals, in which case them being barons too wouldn't matter that much. Like, we can be Cai Renxiang's left hand in which case we would be higher in the hirarchy to other people who work for her even if they are higher in the nobility scale.

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I don't think that's quite how it works? Even if we are the left hand of the Duchal clan heir that doesn't make any other titled nobility our subordinate even if we have more influence than them. Even if we become 'Chief-Minister of the Emerald Seas' or whatever we said to Han Jian that doesn't mean we can give a noble clan head marching orders, though we would have a great deal more influence and power than anyone who isn't at least a Count.

As far as I know the only way to get a noble vassal is to be a higher ranked noble, so if we reach Viscount we could definitely recruit any of them if they like our offer.

I suppose if we remained in the Sect and became a Core Disciple before any of them we might be in a position to call them subordinates without them being our vassals, same thing if we all joined a ministry and we got promoted ahead of them.

 

[JohnnieBoy123]

It is also hard to be friends with a subordinate. CRX needs to maintain a certain degree of distance from us to keep everything healthy, no matter how lonely she is.

So really it is good that our friends won't be our subordinates.

 

[Bakkasama]

I don't think that's quite how it works? Even if we are the left hand of the Duchal clan heir that doesn't make any other titled nobility our subordinate even if we have more influence than them. Even if we become 'Chief-Minister of the Emerald Seas' or whatever we said to Han Jian that doesn't mean we can give a noble clan head marching orders, though we would have a great deal more influence and power than anyone who isn't at least a Count.

As far as I know the only way to get a noble vassal is to be a higher ranked noble, so if we reach Viscount we could definitely recruit any of them if they like our offer.

I suppose if we remained in the Sect and became a Core Disciple before any of them we might be in a position to call them subordinates without them being our vassals, same thing if we all joined a ministry and we got promoted ahead of them.

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I think there is some miscommunication here? I said in the first sentence that you can be someone's subordinate without being a vassal. As in, even if they have the same nobility rank as us, if we hire them to work for us they would be our subordinates. It is not that by becoming 'Chief minister of Emerald seas' we would have barons as subordinates but that if we became 'Chief Minister of Emerald Seas' and we hired some Barons to work in our ministery then they would be our subordinates. Another example would be if we had a higher rank in a military we both belonged to and they were part of our unit; in that case they would also be subordinates without being vassals.

So it is still technically possible to have Su Ling, Li Suyin or the Ma sisters as our subordinates even if they are socially our peers.

 

[CrimsonOddball]

I don't quite remember the exact wording, but I don't think CRX promised to give us land immediately after the sect. She said we are going to do our eight years of servitude in her fief, which could mean we get our own piece of clay only after that.

In any case, this has very little to do with my original question, which was about what defines "vassal" in the context of this story. In other words, are we a vassal before we get landed? Or does being held in retainer make as one?

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Ask for clarity and yeh shall recieve

Ling Qi frowned deeply, feeling like she may have missed something in her friend's words, but she could also tell that Meizhen didn't want to say anymore. "So… what would it be like then, being her retainer?" Ling Qi asked, changing the subject.

"You would likely be given a fief near the capital of emerald seas, or wherever the duchess elects to send her heir if she chooses not to keep her at court," Meizhen replied, relaxing fractionally. "You would be expected to perform tasks for your lord and attend her in official capacities, as you would in any other situation," the other girl continued. "However, you would receive rather more significant resources toward the building of your own house. Cai Renxiang has every reason to desire vassals who are more than the fodder new houses often become."

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It wasn't fair, but neither was what came after. Ling Qi let out a long breath, she was being childish, the world wasn't fair and never had been, she knew that well enough. "What is it you actually want from me?" Ling Qi asked quietly after a minute of silence had ticked by. "You know my background. So you know how ignorant I am in some ways. What will taking your offer really mean?"

Interest sparked in the heiress' eyes, and the eye-wings splayed across her chest narrowed hungrily. "It would mean being my hand in many things," The light behind her sparkled, increasing in intensity. "The Lady Duchess has, in her generosity indicated that I will be granted a fief from her holdings in the borderlands should I prove myself worthy within the Sect. Rather than serving your term within the Sects forces, you would instead serve among the forces of that holding."

"So I'd still a get a little patch of mountains to call my own?" Ling Qi asked, only half joking.

Cai Renxiang took her question seriously though. "You would of course retain all privileges of a normal vassal, though in the interest of development, I would likely waive any taxes until you have become established," she paused here. "Primarily though… you would be among those who attend to me when I must visit the capital, or other similar functions," left unsaid was what sorts of things she'd probably be asked to do there. Ling Qi knew what talents she was valued for.

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Ling Qi flushed a little at the examination and praise. She supposed that it also told her that Advisor Hou wasn't aware of her personal circumstances. "Thank you for your kind words," she replied. She paused then, considering her next words. "I know it may be a little rude to ask… but may I ask what incentives the Sect offers for people like myself to stay rather than going to seek their fortunes in vassalage?"

"It is a fair question, " The old man replied, not seeming bothered as he leaned back in his chair. "You must understand that we in the Argent Sect do not wish to to conflict with our noble patrons," he continued carefully. "However much we might wish for young talent such as yourself to stay with us even at the end of your debt period. However, we offer the best opportunities for education and cultivation, in this advisors humble opinion. The archive of the outer sect is but the least of the Sects collection of knowledge, passed down since the second dynasty, and our Talisman department, headed by the Venerable Elder Sima Jiao is the jewel of the south and produces wonders and advancements by the decade," he sounded pretty sincere in his pitch. "In addition," Advisor Hou said lowering his voice. "The Sect is a place largely free of the more delicate politics one finds in the greater province."

Ling Qi nodded, lowering her eyes in thought. "That is how most new houses fall isn't it? They run afoul of more established clans?"

"Not as often as you might imagine, but it is a heavy concern," he admitted. "More often, I find, new clans are simply folded into others by marriage or adoption, or their new heads put themselves into fatal positions in efforts to expand their new and usually barely tamed holdings."

"I guess ruling a little village is harder than it sounds," Ling Qi said wryly.

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In summary: We are indeed CRX's vassal and in addition to vassalhood we are also her direct retainer, and she does indeed plan to give us our own slice of land to call our own

Being a vassal means means much of what it means in real life feudalistic society
You are given land and titles by your lord and in return they are owed your fealty; you pay them the required tithes and taxes, are subject to their laws and rulings, provide them required military aid, etc

Our situation is made more unique by also being a direct retainer to the Cai, specifically to CRX
What this means in practical terms is things like:
CRX has paid for our tuition to the Sect, and as such she inherits our debt, the 8 years we would have had to serve in the army are instead served under her
CRX has a direct hand in controlling the various aspects of our Barony to be, for instance by Imperial Law we are exempt from taxes until we actually establish our holdings, but CRX gets to decide when exactly we are considered established
We serve directly under CRX, rather than under a Count
CRX gives us specific tasks and we attend to her directly
We are considered her representative, and what we say and do is considered reflective of her
And whatever other details I can't bothered to fully list out

Or to answer the question, we are a vassal of the Emerald Seas, and therefore the Cai, the moment we decide to establish an actual barony within it rather than seeking a career in the sect
All land owning nobles of the Emerald Seas are vassals of the Cai by default, the land ulltimately belongs to them
We aren't a vassal because we're a direct retainer of CRX, but being her retainer means we are also her vassal

 

[storryeater]

My understanding is that what land we end up getting will be ours in our own right and that our liege does not have the right to strip us of it.

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Sort of, but not exactly.

Feudal law is kind of hard to understand as far as property goes, because people there didn't see it the same way people today do. In our times, when someone gets land, they are either a private owner (so the land is considered fully his) or an administrator for a government (in which case the government is considered to be the owner, and has the right to remove him at will). Neither is true for feudal governments.

In a feudal government, a given piece of land is "owned" by the immediate noble controller and by each of their superior. In this universe, that would mean that most pieces of land is owned by a Baron, a Viscount, a Count or Marquis, a Duke or King and the Emperor, all at the same time. What this means is pretty hard to describe in modern terms, but the short version of this is that, as long as we do not do anything truly outrageous and we pay our taxes in time, we can do whatever most of the time but we can be ordered to do some things some of the time. (the particulars of what these orders can be and how they can be given is not uniform in all feudal systems, so I cannot generalise here.)

Youngest daughter of the current head of the clan. Lanlan is really too young and low in cultivation to have any real rank beside that.

We only really hear about the patriarch/matriarch (usually older and high in cultivation), the head (running the clan) and the heir when it comes to offical ranks. Clans probably have their own systems, but we have not really heard anything beside Lanlan claiming that she is "She was second only to her sister among her whole generation."

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It should be noted though that her talent gives her really high importance relative to her peers, so she does have an unofficial rank in practice.

 

[JohnnieBoy123]

In a feudal government, a given piece of land is "owned" by the immediate noble controller and by each of their superior. In this universe, that would mean that most pieces of land is owned by a Baron, a Viscount, a Count or Marquis, a Duke or King and the Emperor, all at the same time. What this means is pretty hard to describe in modern terms, but the short version of this is that, as long as we do not do anything truly outrageous and we pay our taxes in time, we can do whatever most of the time but we can be ordered to do some things some of the time. (the particulars of what these orders can be and how they can be given is not uniform in all feudal systems, so I cannot generalise here.)

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My understanding was that feudal government generally consists of a variety of lords who have economic and military power. These lords then have a rat's nest of legal obligations to each other with an even more complicated set of rules for when one obligation overrides another.

The degree to which a liege has power over their vassals can range from "first among equals" to "the undisputed lord whose territory we are but caretakers of" and a liege's liege has no particular relationship with a vassal. In theory there's no reason why the vassal could not be the liege of the liege's liege, forming a circle. Additionally these relationships can easily be bound to a specific subject and then deciding which holds sway would be its own mess.

Obviously the empire in this setting uses cultivation to at least establish a hierarchy which gets rid of the weirdest stuff. However I have no doubt that there are a lot of extremely busy lawyers figuring out exactly who owes how much taxes to whom.

 

[me.me.here]

CRX has a direct hand in controlling the various aspects of our Barony to be, for instance by Imperial Law we are exempt from taxes until we actually establish our holdings, but CRX gets to decide when exactly we are considered established

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I'm pretty sure Imperial Law doesn't factor in. Taxes being waived until our fief gets itself established is totally up to CRX's whim - it's just that between us being a strong supporter, CRX's general administration style, and CRX trying to be a just ruler means Renxiang is highly likely to let taxes slide for as long as we need provided we continue to make good faith efforts at putting that money towards development.

 

[JohnnieBoy123]

I'm pretty sure Imperial Law doesn't factor in. Taxes being waived until our fief gets itself established is totally up to CRX's whim - it's just that between us being a strong supporter, CRX's general administration style, and CRX trying to be a just ruler means Renxiang is highly likely to let taxes slide for as long as we need provided we continue to make good faith efforts at putting that money towards development.

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Imperial Law almost certainly details only how much taxes the Cai pay to the Imperial family. How they decide to come up with that money is their own business.

 

[CrimsonOddball]

I'm pretty sure Imperial Law doesn't factor in. Taxes being waived until our fief gets itself established is totally up to CRX's whim - it's just that between us being a strong supporter, CRX's general administration style, and CRX trying to be a just ruler means Renxiang is highly likely to let taxes slide for as long as we need provided we continue to make good faith efforts at putting that money towards development.

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You dare to challenge the wisdom I have so graciously bestowed upon you peasant?

"In the immediate sense, very little," Advisor Hou replied. "As a beneficiary of our scholarship program, your responsibilities and title are held in trust until the end of your service," he continued to patiently explain. "Though as a landless baroness, you will be entitled to an officer position immediately, unlike those of lesser ability. The exact details of those matters will be left to the commander where you are stationed. You are of course, also exempt from your tithes and taxes for until you have established a holding, so do not worry over those matters."

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Tithes and taxes being exempted until holdings are actually established is the standard, probably for practical reasons
We simply don't have the infrastructure or income to actually start paying the taxes that are expected of a Baron
But as a retainer directly under CRX she gets to waive off taxes further until she's satisfied that we're set up and prepared since we're a long term investment

 

[angelofwhim]

Oh yeah, thanks to whoever commissioned the ma jun piece, they are my favorite background characters.

 

[memoryofglory]

I think there is some miscommunication here? I said in the first sentence that you can be someone's subordinate without being a vassal. As in, even if they have the same nobility rank as us, if we hire them to work for us they would be our subordinates. It is not that by becoming 'Chief minister of Emerald seas' we would have barons as subordinates but that if we became 'Chief Minister of Emerald Seas' and we hired some Barons to work in our ministery then they would be our subordinates. Another example would be if we had a higher rank in a military we both belonged to and they were part of our unit; in that case they would also be subordinates without being vassals.

So it is still technically possible to have Su Ling, Li Suyin or the Ma sisters as our subordinates even if they are socially our peers.

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Ok this seems mostly right, but the context of discussions about these people becoming our subordinates is usually people trying to justify having them come live with on our fief permanently, which is dumb. We could hire a fellow baron to do a job for us, but that would be like if you hired a plumber or exterminator or electrician to do a job for you, it would be kind of weird to call them a 'subordinate.' The only way I'm aware that you can have a peer be working for you semi-permanently is in the context of a larger organization like a sect, ministry, or army. Hiring a social peer to work for you personally for any long period of time probably isn't a thing.

 

[Catwings]

I made a little animation of the mist sword.

 

[AbeoLogos]

I have a different read. Xuan Shi seems like a shy guy or at least somewhat introverted. Ling Qi being both female and having had pleasant interactions with him is enough for a crush to develop in those cases.

People want to fall in love an be happy. Sometimes, you just have to hint at it for it to happen and the less you think it might happen to you the more likely it is. You don't need a big reason to develop a crush if you are lonely.

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Oh, that's not directly why I think Xuan Shi has a crush. It's why I think Xuan Shi admires Ling Qi. And he has a crush because he admires Ling Qi. He admired Renxiang and had a crush on her, so there's something of a precedent.

 

[OneArmedYeti]

Ok this seems mostly right, but the context of discussions about these people becoming our subordinates is usually people trying to justify having them come live with on our fief permanently, which is dumb. We could hire a fellow baron to do a job for us, but that would be like if you hired a plumber or exterminator or electrician to do a job for you, it would be kind of weird to call them a 'subordinate.'

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I mostly agree with you, but title rank isn't the sum total of someone's social rank.

Hyppthetical scenario, Fast forward a few decades.

Were at peak Cyan, working on our breakthrough. We have a clan with multiple Greens in it. We're a direct subordinate to the Ducal heir.

Our neighbor is a Green 7 Baron who's only meaningful clan member is his "heir" who's peak yellow at 16.

We are both Barons

We are NOT peers.

 

[memoryofglory]

I mostly agree with you, but title rank isn't the sum total of someone's social rank.

Hyppthetical scenario, Fast forward a few decades.

Were at peak Cyan, working on our breakthrough. We have a clan with multiple Greens in it. We're a direct subordinate to the Ducal heir.

Our neighbor is a Green 7 Baron who's only meaningful clan member is his "heir" who's peak yellow at 16.

We are both Barons

We are NOT peers.

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You can be a peer in title, but not in cultivation or vice-versa. Peer is a very general term. And not sure if you were implying this but I'll say it anyway: even in that circumstance we probably wouldn't be able to just have that Green 7 Baron work for us permanently. To do something like that we would either need to finish our breakthrough and claim a Viscount title or absorb them by arranging a marriage to a member of our clan. In that situation so close to our breakthrough we might have hashed out a presumptive vassalage agreement ahead of time in expectation of that breakthrough.

 

[me.me.here]

You dare to challenge the wisdom I have so graciously bestowed upon you peasant?

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I'm bold like that.

With respect to the exemption bit, I think Hou Cheng is using established to mean something different than you and CRX are.

A scroll of snow white paper, wrapped by a string of violet silk materialized in his hand, and Ling Qi accepted it tentatively. "What… changes now?" Ling Qi asked as she gingerly tugged the silk ribbon loosening it so that she could unroll the scroll a bit. Her gaze met incredibly intricate borderwork and fine calligraphy, declaring the establishment of of the Clan of Ling in dense legal terms.

"In the immediate sense, very little," Advisor Hou replied. "As a beneficiary of our scholarship program, your responsibilities and title are held in trust until the end of your service," he continued to patiently explain. "Though as a landless baroness, you will be entitled to an officer position immediately, unlike those of lesser ability. The exact details of those matters will be left to the commander where you are stationed. You are of course, also exempt from your tithes and taxes for until you have established a holding, so do not worry over those matters."

Ling Qi blinked, she hadn't even considered that she would suddenly owe taxes because she was a noble now. "The Empress is wise and generous," she said, for lack of anything better. "May I ask then, what becomes of my mortal family?"

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This scene is essentially the Sect going, "So you're a Baron now - here's how that works." Based on that wider context and the way Ling Qi was all, "Oh yes, taxes. I definitely know how taxes work." I'm pretty sure that the exemption from taxes/tithes is referring to the period of military service.

In other words, Ling Qi is being assured that her tax bracket won't be increased (and she doesn't have to govern anything) until her land grant actually comes in - "established", in this context, is not referring to the development of the holding but said holding's existence as a separate legal entity. i.e. the holding is established when the deed granting Ling Qi a certain amount of land comes into effect.

Meanwhile, when CRX says it.

"So I'd still a get a little patch of mountains to call my own?" Ling Qi asked, only half joking.

Cai Renxiang took her question seriously though. "You would of course retain all privileges of a normal vassal, though in the interest of development, I would likely waive any taxes until you have become established," she paused here. "Primarily though… you would be among those who attend to me when I must visit the capital, or other similar functions," left unsaid was what sorts of things she'd probably be asked to do there. Ling Qi knew what talents she was valued for.

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Notice how she first mentions the privileges of normal vassals, and then separately mentions waiving taxes until Ling Qi has "become established". That pretty strongly implies that sort of taxation waiving for increased development is not the normal state of affairs, and also that "established" is being used in the context of development rather than whether Ling Qi has her own little patch of mountains or not.

Anywho, that's my opinion - YMMV.

 

[CrimsonOddball]

I'm bold like that.

With respect to the exemption bit, I think Hou Cheng is using established to mean something different than you and CRX are.


This scene is essentially the Sect going, "So you're a Baron now - here's how that works." Based on that wider context and the way Ling Qi was all, "Oh yes, taxes. I definitely know how taxes work." I'm pretty sure that the exemption from taxes/tithes is referring to the period of military service.

In other words, Ling Qi is being assured that her tax bracket won't be increased (and she doesn't have to govern anything) until her land grant actually comes in - "established", in this context, is not referring to the development of the holding but said holding's existence as a separate legal entity. i.e. the holding is established when the deed granting Ling Qi a certain amount of land comes into effect.

Meanwhile, when CRX says it.

Notice how she first mentions the privileges of normal vassals, and then separately mentions waiving taxes until Ling Qi has "become established". That pretty strongly implies that sort of taxation waiving for increased development is not the normal state of affairs, and also that "established" is being used in the context of development rather than whether Ling Qi has her own little patch of mountains or not.

Anywho, that's my opinion - YMMV.

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I mean I more or less agree with you there, though perhaps I wasn't clear enough in my first few posts

When the Sect official was mentioning how Ling Qi would be exempt from tithes and taxes he meant until she actually owned some land, since she's currently a landless Baroness
While CRX was saying that she would waive Ling Qi's tax obligations while she built up her holdings first, until she was more firmly established to make it easier on her

 

[Sirrocco]

Speaking of noble allies, what is Xiulan's rank within the Gu?

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Actual rank right now is nebulous, and not *that* impressive... but they've pretty much acknowledged that they have two people of her generation remaining who have the chance of cultivating to the level that they want/need for the next Clan Head, and she's one of them. That's why she got pulled home.

They can still be subordinates without being vassals, in which case them being barons too wouldn't matter that much. Like, we can be Cai Renxiang's left hand in which case we would be higher in the hirarchy to other people who work for her even if they are higher in the nobility scale.

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We checked up on this earlier (I think all the way back in Forge) when we were thinking similar things. You can't have a Baron as vassal to another Baron, regardless of other power differential aspects. In this culture, it doesn't work.

Ah! And then there's this:

"Not as often as you might imagine, but it is a heavy concern," he admitted. "More often, I find, new clans are simply folded into others by marriage or adoption, or their new heads put themselves into fatal positions in efforts to expand their new and usually barely tamed holdings."

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So, yes, new clans are apparently somewhat often married into more established clans and absorbed. I imagine that would be the norm for a new baron marrying a ducal scion.

It actually suggests the idea that if we married Bao Qian, that might mean marrying into the Bao.

 

[JohnnieBoy123]

Ah! And then there's this:

So, yes, new clans are apparently somewhat often married into more established clans and absorbed. I imagine that would be the norm for a new baron marrying a ducal scion.

It actually suggests the idea that if we married Bao Qian, that might mean marrying into the Bao.

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In our case we are being deliberately cultivated into being a vassal clan of the Cai. CRX would like us to have marriage alliances with a relevant clan but our actual job is to build a strong clan that the Cai can rely upon for generations. In an ideal world we would become a Count but that would be the work of a lifetime if it is even possible. A Viscount clan would still be quite valuable to them as they are and is more reasonable for us to achieve, though obviously still a very difficult accomplishment.

 

[Karugus]

While Renxiang wants us to be a strong clan, and is well served by having some of her closest (and presumably most loyal) retainers be some of her strongest vassals- we were offered the position of retainer by virtue of what services Ling Qi can provide her in dealing with court and politics.

Presumably, if we want to maintain that position of privilege, we should make sure our clan is capable of continuing to provide those sort of services beyond just Ling Qi.

 

[Sirrocco]

I honestly think we don't know enough here to know how this will work. I suspect Ling Qi doesn't either, given that I've asked at least one pertinent question that hasn't been answered. Really, we have two hard datapoints that I'm aware of.

- The Admiral became somewhat wistful about opportunities that Xuan Shi had missed, and offered us an invitation to visit their lands and introduce Zhengui to the other turtlesnakes. CRX's responded by warning said admiral not to attempt poaching. Said admiral clarified that that was not his intent.

- We mentioned Bao Qian's suit to CRX. Her response, in essence, was "I'm totally not trying to tell you what to do on this one, but a match with the Bao would be useful."

...thus my conclusion that it's possible (though by no means guaranteed) that there might be problems in that area with the Xuan, but whatever it would turn out to be with the Bao would not be problematic.

Actually, if the Xuan thing would be problematic in some fashion, probably what we'd see would be that the Xuan would tell Xuan Shi that he wasn't allowed to pursue it.

Huh... and there's a funny thign abotu Xuan Shi. He seems attracted to the women who aren't at all into romance. CRX is aro ace, and Ling Qi is pretty deeply damaged, and neither one of them has any real interest in a romantic relationship at this time. It's like... he doesn't know how to deal with romance, so the women he interacts with best are the ones with whom there are no romantic overtones, and then once he has a decent positive relationship with a woman he starts crushing on them? That seems... somewhat self-defeating.

 

[JohnnieBoy123]

Huh... and there's a funny thign abotu Xuan Shi. He seems attracted to the women who aren't at all into romance. CRX is aro ace, and Ling Qi is pretty deeply damaged, and neither one of them has any real interest in a romantic relationship at this time. It's like... he doesn't know how to deal with romance, so the women he interacts with best are the ones with whom there are no romantic overtones, and then once he has a decent positive relationship with a woman he starts crushing on them? That seems... somewhat self-defeating.

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It's entirely possible that he's demisexual or a hetero romantic ace himself. That would also explain his interest in romance novels: allosexuals don't make any sense to him so he's trying to figure them out. Romance novels are a bad way of doing that but teenagers make bad decisions.

Note that he also seemed to have missed the romantic nature of the dungeon he took us to which is weird because it was a romance novel that led him to it.

 

[Jensaarai]

allosexuals don't make any sense to him so he's trying to figure them out.

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Is that a new Allomancy ability?

Note that he also seemed to have missed the romantic nature of the dungeon he took us to which is weird because it was a romance novel that led him to it.

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It was a heavily censored romance novel, with a lot of the ribald stuff missing and thus focused more on the adventure and swashbuckling aspects.