I think we still are?
It's just, the numbers were such that a 200kT hull was getting better-than-average agility off of a single Type 3, which is significantly more edge over OTL than intended.
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It's just, the numbers were such that a 200kT hull was getting better-than-average agility off of a single Type 3, which is significantly more edge over OTL than intended.
darkstarling
Brilliantly Crazed
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I'm not voting for the saucer because it's a canon clone, I'm voting for the saucer because I think it will work best.
In particular, what I'm hoping is a deep dish saucer and a more streamlined engineering section for a better warp field profile, maybe tuck the nacelles in a bit too. Make it more of a racer. We've got warp 8 engines, we've got new impulse engines, lets use those suckers! Get a retro-intrepid and use it as a war ship.
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It was also several years later, had overwhelmingly stronger phasers, stronger shields, and generally more mature tech in most non-sublight-drive regards.
Sorry, thread's moving too fast; I hadn't seen your post till after the edit.
...Did.
I'm honestly not sure how to say this without sounding like I'm flaming, but. Did you read the edit in question?
I very explicitly do not.
Sorry, fast-moving thread; I didn't see the reply till after the edit.
Also, I can absolutely say that, assuming sufficient engines for equivalent maneuverability, a thin Connie saucer will definitely have less space either internally or for forward-facing weapons, possibly both. Given that that's explicitly how the two hulls in question are described by the QM.
Yes, the thin Connie saucer is strictly, objectively inferior to the half-saucer if going for max maneuverability (as is strongly the thread consensus for tactical reasons) via multiple cheap last-gen thrusters (as is strongly the thread consensus for budgetary reasons).
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- America
@Sayle is there any mechanical benefit to this? Like, cheaper shields and/or more economical hull?
Because I saw it mentioned but it wasn't elaborated on mechanically.
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There was, but due to some informational mismatch we (as a thread) ended up not having the full picture when voting. This led to some confusion/annoyance when found out and so Sayle has decided to redo it, corrected.
StriderInCosmos
Wanderer in the Worldsea
- Location
- Somewhere in... Terminal Dogma? I think?
There was an adjustment to the figures of impulse engine power (if I recall correctly) that called for a re-vote after some disgruntlement. I'm just sitting this ship out, for the most part.
[X] 140 Meter Thin Saucer (140,000 Tons) [Canon: Constitution-class]
Honestly, I'm going with this because the more efficient spread of mass and defenses means that we can up attrition by treating the thinner decks as ablative for the more critical systems. The half-saucer might be more agile, but the thin saucer is much better suited towards a slugging match that best suits the Federations present strategic paradigm
Starfleets ships are never going to hold the advantage of initiative against the Klingons in the current era barring larger operations, and both circumstances favor being built for taking hits and dragging fights into a slugging match we can come out on top of rather than the alternative I believe.
Honestly, I'm going with this because the more efficient spread of mass and defenses means that we can up attrition by treating the thinner decks as ablative for the more critical systems. The half-saucer might be more agile, but the thin saucer is much better suited towards a slugging match that best suits the Federations present strategic paradigm
Starfleets ships are never going to hold the advantage of initiative against the Klingons in the current era barring larger operations, and both circumstances favor being built for taking hits and dragging fights into a slugging match we can come out on top of rather than the alternative I believe.
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[x] 140 Meter Thin Saucer (140,000 Tons) [Canon: Constitution-class]
I don't think @Sayle is really super heavily inspired by SFB, but the reason I want a bigger saucer is because one of the reasons the Feds in SFB had such good staying power was because they built big, durable ships compared to the smaller, nimbler ones that the Klingons had.
This meant that oftentimes even though they started unready for a war, they could drastically increase their combat effectiveness with less refit issue, whereas Klingon refits often required significantly more restructuring. The Feds could just stick some auxiliary reactors in space that was normally used for cargo or labs, and when they got better engines, they could refit those on and suddenly their sluggish but powerful ships were no longer sluggish.
Size is expansion room, and having spare space for further mid-life upgrades and refits is a good idea for a workhorse design which we expect will probably stay in operation for a good long time.
This meant that oftentimes even though they started unready for a war, they could drastically increase their combat effectiveness with less refit issue, whereas Klingon refits often required significantly more restructuring. The Feds could just stick some auxiliary reactors in space that was normally used for cargo or labs, and when they got better engines, they could refit those on and suddenly their sluggish but powerful ships were no longer sluggish.
Size is expansion room, and having spare space for further mid-life upgrades and refits is a good idea for a workhorse design which we expect will probably stay in operation for a good long time.
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No, because I don't vote on aesthetic/emotional/nostalgic grounds, and never claimed to.
Although I have voted for nonstandard configuration often- probably usually, though I'm not about to scour the thread to double-check- this was usually incidental to other concerns.
[X] 140 Meter Thin Saucer (140,000 Tons) [Canon: Constitution-class]
[X] 140 Meter Saucer (200,000 Tons)
[X] 140 Meter Saucer (200,000 Tons)
Art: Selachii-class Frigate
My worry about the big saucer was that we wouldn't have the mass for a ventral deflector and would be forced to mount an in-line one.
Since some research and discussion suggests we might still be able to do a 50kT ventral hull even with the big saucer, and there's lots of stuff to do with all that lovely space (and the 4x Type 2 engine fit has some excess power), I think the big saucer is probably pretty good.
Since some research and discussion suggests we might still be able to do a 50kT ventral hull even with the big saucer, and there's lots of stuff to do with all that lovely space (and the 4x Type 2 engine fit has some excess power), I think the big saucer is probably pretty good.
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Our problem isn't that the warp 7 fleet can't fight, it's that they're too slow to withdraw from a losing fight or retreat from the area. I think a modern cruiser that can shore up the weaknesses of our warp 7 squadrons is going to be way more useful in a long war than trying to mass produce torpedo boats to hunt cloaked ships.
The war is expected to last years and cover a huge amount of space. I think it's a smart idea to leave room for things like Triage or Advanced Medical Facilities, maybe even Advanced Sensors. The kinds of modules that were passed on for the last generation of ships so they could focus on logistics/survey.
The war is expected to last years and cover a huge amount of space. I think it's a smart idea to leave room for things like Triage or Advanced Medical Facilities, maybe even Advanced Sensors. The kinds of modules that were passed on for the last generation of ships so they could focus on logistics/survey.
[X] 140 Meter Thin Saucer (140,000 Tons) [Canon: Constitution-class]
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I agree, and repeat that the half-saucer has more space than the thin full saucer.
This would be cool, but sadly the deeper saucer (the 200kt one) is a very distant third in this race, and unlikely to overtake the others. Also, we have explicit Word of QM that secondary hulls are still cylindrical in this era.
It's fine, I wouldn't be mad or anything if it won; I think the smaller, lighter ship will end up being at least meaningfully quicker and cheaper to build, but I agree, it wouldn't be overwhelmingly so, and the extra mass wouldn't necessarily be wasted by any means. Thick full saucer is a good choice, just not my choice. Thin saucer is a bad choice.
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[X] 140 Meter Half-Saucer (140,000 Tons)
[X] 140 Meter Saucer (200,000 Tons)
[X] 140 Meter Saucer (200,000 Tons)
[X] 140 Meter Thin Saucer (140,000 Tons) [Canon: Constitution-class]
Goldenlima
Statistical Anomaly
[X] 140 Meter Thin Saucer (140,000 Tons) [Canon: Constitution-class]
Chargone
Invisable operator
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Don't think anyone is suggesting building torpedo-boats to hunt cloaked ships. The main focus is on dealing with the enemy's capital ships, which have a lot more firepower than our existing ships' defences can handle and enough defences to render our phasors insufficient. Hence the torpedos, and the engines to both more reliably use them and more consistently dodge incoming fire.
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