Crystalwatcher's Magical Girl Quest!
- Thread starter Crystalwatcher
- Start date
- Original
- Location
- UTC -6
[X] Plan Magic Chop
-[X] James and Nepgear shoot Candy Heart (Full-Auto and Starshine, respectively), White Knight engages Black Knight, Michael and Samael blast the zombies near the door.
-[X] Candy Heart should be dead. Team GEAR runs out the door, shooting zombies as they go.
-[X] Once outside shout for White Knight to get out of the mausoleum, once she's clear hit Black Knight with Celestial Severance.
[X] EXP Plan Wallop
-[X] Celestial Severance to level 10 (60+70+80+90, 300 Total EXP)
Subtle this ain't. 51,200 Damage if the doubling keeps up.
-[X] James and Nepgear shoot Candy Heart (Full-Auto and Starshine, respectively), White Knight engages Black Knight, Michael and Samael blast the zombies near the door.
-[X] Candy Heart should be dead. Team GEAR runs out the door, shooting zombies as they go.
-[X] Once outside shout for White Knight to get out of the mausoleum, once she's clear hit Black Knight with Celestial Severance.
[X] EXP Plan Wallop
-[X] Celestial Severance to level 10 (60+70+80+90, 300 Total EXP)
Subtle this ain't. 51,200 Damage if the doubling keeps up.
ReaperofInterest
Herald of Disaster
[X] Plan We're a housecat, not a baby Tiger
Ok, in light of the XP from the GM, here's my revised upgrade plan.
[X] XP Plan Upgrade V2
-[X] Purchase Armored Core: Adamantium (250 XP Spent)
-[X] Raise Purifier Beam to level 5 (30+40=70+250=320 XP Spent)
This plan improves our defenses much more than my previous plan, at a cost of less damage gained for the Purifier Beam. The Adamantium purchase will, if it follows the previous Resiliance upgrades its predecessor's did, will upgrade our Resiliance to 165, and will increase by 40 for each level of Armored Core we purchase, in addition to the other damage reduction stuff. The trade of is that instead of raising base damage to something like 151, our base damage will only be raised to something around 101. Ultimately, I believe the increased defense is worth it in this instance.
Ok, in light of the XP from the GM, here's my revised upgrade plan.
[X] XP Plan Upgrade V2
-[X] Purchase Armored Core: Adamantium (250 XP Spent)
-[X] Raise Purifier Beam to level 5 (30+40=70+250=320 XP Spent)
This plan improves our defenses much more than my previous plan, at a cost of less damage gained for the Purifier Beam. The Adamantium purchase will, if it follows the previous Resiliance upgrades its predecessor's did, will upgrade our Resiliance to 165, and will increase by 40 for each level of Armored Core we purchase, in addition to the other damage reduction stuff. The trade of is that instead of raising base damage to something like 151, our base damage will only be raised to something around 101. Ultimately, I believe the increased defense is worth it in this instance.
Adamantium requires core containment at 10.
ReaperofInterest
Herald of Disaster
Actually, we have word of GM that that's for something else.
See?
Crystalwatcher
(Verified GM)
- Location
- Limbo
- Location
- UTC -6
How does defense help us in the slightest right now? With the upgrade: Black Knight still kills us in one shot, Candy Heart goes from hitting us for ~60 damage (~7 exchanges of hits, using Starshine we'd kill her before this) to being unable to scratch us, and the zombies already need to use their combo attack to scratch us. Increasing defense doesn't change which fights we'd win, and is thus pointless at the moment.
What we need is a way to escape or a way to overwhelm Black Knight's health. This is in reach thanks to CS doubling in power with each level.
Well...
At least we now know the Core Purge doesn't effect our allies.
So the question is what do we do now? Well let's look at our options. Thanks to the edit we now have 334 XP to spend. Let's start with upgrading Purifier Beam:
Level 3 + 30xp + 40xp + 50xp + 60xp + 70xp + 80xp = Level 9
What does Level 9 Purifier Beam look like? Well near as I can tell Purifer Beam follows the pattern:
This give us:
Level 1: 20
Level 2: 20 * 1.5 = 30
Level 3: 30 * 1.5 = 45
Level 4: 45 * 1.5 = 67
Level 5: 67 * 1.5 = 100
Level 6: 100 * 1.5 = 150
Level 7: 150 * 1.5 = 225
Level 8: 225 * 1.5 = 337
Level 9: 337 * 1.5 = 505
If we want Purifier Beam to be at all useful in our fight against Candy Heart we need to buy it up to at level Level 7 since she has DR 150. Of course there is the magic modifier which would push it higher. For Magic Modifier we seem to just gain +5 for each level of Purifier Beam giving us:
Level 1: 10
Level 2: 15
Level 3: 20
Level 4: 25
Level 5: 30
Level 6: 35
Level 7: 40
Level 8: 45
Level 9: 50
But frankly Magic Modifier is too random to really rely on and Candy Heart has MM 45 boosting her DR so we'd see little effect anyway at Level 6.
For Starshine we don't really have the numbers yet to be sure but initial impressions suggest a 1.25x growth rate. The highest we can currently upgrade it to is Level 8:
Level 2 + 20xp + 30xp + 40xp + 50xp + 60xp + 70xp = Level 8
Level 1: 100
Level 2: 100 * 1.25 = 125
Level 3: 125 * 1.25 = 156
Level 4: 156 * 1.25 = 195
Level 5: 195 * 1.25 = 244
Level 6: 244 * 1.25 = 305
Level 7: 305 * 1.25 = 381
Level 8: 381 * 1.25 = 476
From a base damage perspective upgrading Purifier seems the more attractive option. However this doesn't take into account that Starshine fires 4 projectiles at once which combo quite nastily:
Now as far as I can tell the details of this mechanic are not really laid out however going by:
The attacks add together to create a Total Damage value which may have a Synchronize Bonus. So in actuality as long as all 4 Starshine beams are at the same target the Total Damage is:
Level 1:100 * 4 = 400
Level 2: 125 * 4 = 500
Level 3: 156 * 4 = 624
Level 4: 195 * 4 = 780
Level 5: 244 * 4 = 976
Level 6: 305 * 4 = 1,220
Level 7: 381 * 4 = 1,524
Level 8: 476 * 4 = 1,904
Ultimately the question is whether we should upgrade Purifier Beam, Starshine, or some combination of the two? Personally I think Purifier Beam is the better option right now because it has a basically zero chance of collateral damage, while Starshine does have a chance, and because it likes the Divinity affinity that Starshine has.
Starshine having a Divinity affinity, like Core Purge, means that it might also deal that nasty -5,000 Hostile Divinity Exposure debuff and that could easily catch Dark Knight's attention even if it's not targeted at her.
With that out of the way it's now a question of how much should we spend on Purifier Beam? Well as I said before a bare minimum of 180 XP is required since that will give us 225 base damage + 1d40 which is enough to chip away at Candy Heart's health although barely since she has 50 regen per turn.
Candy Heart has 300 base damage + 1d50 and her Candy Crush attack deals (200 base damage + 1d50) * 2. So we're looking at a maximum of around 500 damage per turn. To counter that we have 125 DR which drops it to 375 and then Armored Core which slashes it down to 187 since it's >200 damage followed finally by No Longer Human slashing the damage further down to 93.
That said while boosts in Core Containment or Armored Core would help at that rate we'd take more damage then we can dish out. So it looks like we're better off just dumping all our XP in Purifier Beam.
[X] Plan We're a Baby Tiger
-[X] White Knight handles the Knight, while we handle Candy Heart and the zombies outside.
-[X] Team GEAR fires on the zombies from within the mausoleum, while radioing to request backup and detailing the situation, with specific mention to Goddess Red's Black Knight.
-[X] Engage Candy Heart with Purifier Beam. Put her back to rest as fast as possible.
--[X] Once Candy Heart is down join Team GEAR in holding off the zombies with Purifier Beam while awaiting Reinforcements.
---[X] Switch to aiding White Knight if she needs it.
[X] XP Plan Purifier
-[X] Raise Purifier Beam's level to 9 (330XP)
By my math Level 9 Purifier Beam will take down Candy Heart in 3 turns:
Turn 1:
505 damage - 125 DR = 380 damage
Health = 1,000 - 380 = 620
Turn 2:
Health = 620 + 50 = 670
505 damage - 125 DR = 380 damage
Health = 290
Turn 3:
Health = 290 + 50 = 340
505 damage - 125 DR = 380 damage
Health = 290 - 380 = -90 (Candy Heart Dead)
Hopefully that is fast enough to help hold back the Zombie Hoard.
At least we now know the Core Purge doesn't effect our allies.
So the question is what do we do now? Well let's look at our options. Thanks to the edit we now have 334 XP to spend. Let's start with upgrading Purifier Beam:
Level 3 + 30xp + 40xp + 50xp + 60xp + 70xp + 80xp = Level 9
What does Level 9 Purifier Beam look like? Well near as I can tell Purifer Beam follows the pattern:
plus the x2 bonus from Extension.
This give us:
Level 1: 20
Level 2: 20 * 1.5 = 30
Level 3: 30 * 1.5 = 45
Level 4: 45 * 1.5 = 67
Level 5: 67 * 1.5 = 100
Level 6: 100 * 1.5 = 150
Level 7: 150 * 1.5 = 225
Level 8: 225 * 1.5 = 337
Level 9: 337 * 1.5 = 505
If we want Purifier Beam to be at all useful in our fight against Candy Heart we need to buy it up to at level Level 7 since she has DR 150. Of course there is the magic modifier which would push it higher. For Magic Modifier we seem to just gain +5 for each level of Purifier Beam giving us:
Level 1: 10
Level 2: 15
Level 3: 20
Level 4: 25
Level 5: 30
Level 6: 35
Level 7: 40
Level 8: 45
Level 9: 50
But frankly Magic Modifier is too random to really rely on and Candy Heart has MM 45 boosting her DR so we'd see little effect anyway at Level 6.
For Starshine we don't really have the numbers yet to be sure but initial impressions suggest a 1.25x growth rate. The highest we can currently upgrade it to is Level 8:
Level 2 + 20xp + 30xp + 40xp + 50xp + 60xp + 70xp = Level 8
Level 1: 100
Level 2: 100 * 1.25 = 125
Level 3: 125 * 1.25 = 156
Level 4: 156 * 1.25 = 195
Level 5: 195 * 1.25 = 244
Level 6: 244 * 1.25 = 305
Level 7: 305 * 1.25 = 381
Level 8: 381 * 1.25 = 476
From a base damage perspective upgrading Purifier seems the more attractive option. However this doesn't take into account that Starshine fires 4 projectiles at once which combo quite nastily:
Now as far as I can tell the details of this mechanic are not really laid out however going by:
The attacks add together to create a Total Damage value which may have a Synchronize Bonus. So in actuality as long as all 4 Starshine beams are at the same target the Total Damage is:
Level 1:100 * 4 = 400
Level 2: 125 * 4 = 500
Level 3: 156 * 4 = 624
Level 4: 195 * 4 = 780
Level 5: 244 * 4 = 976
Level 6: 305 * 4 = 1,220
Level 7: 381 * 4 = 1,524
Level 8: 476 * 4 = 1,904
Ultimately the question is whether we should upgrade Purifier Beam, Starshine, or some combination of the two? Personally I think Purifier Beam is the better option right now because it has a basically zero chance of collateral damage, while Starshine does have a chance, and because it likes the Divinity affinity that Starshine has.
Starshine having a Divinity affinity, like Core Purge, means that it might also deal that nasty -5,000 Hostile Divinity Exposure debuff and that could easily catch Dark Knight's attention even if it's not targeted at her.
With that out of the way it's now a question of how much should we spend on Purifier Beam? Well as I said before a bare minimum of 180 XP is required since that will give us 225 base damage + 1d40 which is enough to chip away at Candy Heart's health although barely since she has 50 regen per turn.
Candy Heart has 300 base damage + 1d50 and her Candy Crush attack deals (200 base damage + 1d50) * 2. So we're looking at a maximum of around 500 damage per turn. To counter that we have 125 DR which drops it to 375 and then Armored Core which slashes it down to 187 since it's >200 damage followed finally by No Longer Human slashing the damage further down to 93.
That said while boosts in Core Containment or Armored Core would help at that rate we'd take more damage then we can dish out. So it looks like we're better off just dumping all our XP in Purifier Beam.
[X] Plan We're a Baby Tiger
-[X] White Knight handles the Knight, while we handle Candy Heart and the zombies outside.
-[X] Team GEAR fires on the zombies from within the mausoleum, while radioing to request backup and detailing the situation, with specific mention to Goddess Red's Black Knight.
-[X] Engage Candy Heart with Purifier Beam. Put her back to rest as fast as possible.
--[X] Once Candy Heart is down join Team GEAR in holding off the zombies with Purifier Beam while awaiting Reinforcements.
---[X] Switch to aiding White Knight if she needs it.
[X] XP Plan Purifier
-[X] Raise Purifier Beam's level to 9 (330XP)
By my math Level 9 Purifier Beam will take down Candy Heart in 3 turns:
Turn 1:
505 damage - 125 DR = 380 damage
Health = 1,000 - 380 = 620
Turn 2:
Health = 620 + 50 = 670
505 damage - 125 DR = 380 damage
Health = 290
Turn 3:
Health = 290 + 50 = 340
505 damage - 125 DR = 380 damage
Health = 290 - 380 = -90 (Candy Heart Dead)
Hopefully that is fast enough to help hold back the Zombie Hoard.
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This only happens if she goes seriousface. She wouldn't unless we're too threatening(e.g nearly threeshotting her no save).
Aw yeah, that's much better! A load of xp to spend should definitely help right now. Keep in mind that we have an interception ability, which lowers damage based on our purifier damage. We saw this in action with the Black Knight. And remember that we can also use Starshine on Candy Heart, not only just base damage, so that should hopefully make things go a lot faster, especially if we upgrade it. And by upgrading our weapon, we should hopefully see new options in the shop to take!
Also, judging on the xp calculations above, I think we could have a greater effect if we buy the purifier up to level 7, which is apparently the minimum we need, and then we can upgrade starshine up to level 6, which should be a massive jump in power for us and handily take out Candy Heart in one shot if we can get the purity damage boost and combo by using it on her. This leaves us with not only a better defence via interception with base damage, but also a MUCH stronger offence via Starshine. And we'll even have some small amount of xp left over for the next upgrades to come.
Good times, y'all.
Also, judging on the xp calculations above, I think we could have a greater effect if we buy the purifier up to level 7, which is apparently the minimum we need, and then we can upgrade starshine up to level 6, which should be a massive jump in power for us and handily take out Candy Heart in one shot if we can get the purity damage boost and combo by using it on her. This leaves us with not only a better defence via interception with base damage, but also a MUCH stronger offence via Starshine. And we'll even have some small amount of xp left over for the next upgrades to come.
Good times, y'all.
lbmaian
a thirsty squirrel
- Location
- USA
I have to admit, I'm getting lost in the mechanics of this quest. 
QM, can you make a manual or something (separate from the data mine) that explains the game mechanics revealed so far? You could move the "How to: upgrading" section in there too. I say separate from the data mine, because I'm pretty sure Nepgear is not aware of meta like dice rolls and stuff. Would be much appreciated.
QM, can you make a manual or something (separate from the data mine) that explains the game mechanics revealed so far? You could move the "How to: upgrading" section in there too. I say separate from the data mine, because I'm pretty sure Nepgear is not aware of meta like dice rolls and stuff. Would be much appreciated.
Crystalwatcher
(Verified GM)
- Location
- Limbo
I'll work on one.
- Location
- UTC -6
Black Knight is toying with us because there is nothing we can do to stop it from killing everyone. The instant that changes it will charge us, break MGWK's weapon, and kill us. It would need to be much more conveniently stupid than it has been shown to be to let us waltz out after smoking Candy Heart and the zombies.
By the numbers Candy Heart can't survive a barrage from Team GEAR or a slugging match with Nepgear. Our problem is surviving and dealing with BK, which right now looks tougher than the Spawn of Mayham we had dropped upon us at quest start. Even if Nep hides behind 'merely human' what can be done to stop Black Knight?
OverReactionGuy
Verified Sanity
You know, because of this if we manage to hit the black knight with enough starshine we can kill her.
If we get starshines damage output to be above or around core purges which is like, in the 1000s? Anyway it would just take 5 hits.
Spamming a combo of those would make quick work of alot of things, we just need to work on Neps ability to move and dodge like a proper Danmaku.
Plus the black night doesn't move that fast, but still faster than us unless we fly out of her way or take to the air which we have greater mobility in. Just needs a few levels for speed.
Then there is always the plan to collapse the roof on people.
That would kill the mooks pretty fast, environmental damage is killer as seen in the battle for the hellgates.
Hmm... I'll think about this later. But I think we should use the environment and our mobility in the air to our advantage.
OverReactionGuy
Verified Sanity
No, she was content to swing a sword at us and not using a spell. If we can dodge that we can get in the five hits. >.>
Alectai
Speaks Words of Wisdom... On occasion
Except that we can't even survive her swinging her sword at us.
That whole "Even her most basic attack would kill us three times over" thing.
OverReactionGuy
Verified Sanity
Then don't get hit by it!
...Sorry, but your starting to irritate me. What point of dodge wasn't understood?
She's a ground magical girl, we can take to the air and our mobility is greater than hers in the air even if she jumps. So what if we die three times over if we get hit with the sword? We don't get hit, simple as that.
We can crash the roof on the zombies, fight candy heart on our terms, and then start shooting. But we need to upgrate our flying for greater speed and mobility and starlight for greater damage. For said plan to work.
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chocolote12
A Penguin Flailing Against The Keyboard Of Life.
She can jump faster than we can dodge, and, by their very nature, jumps tend to accelerate faster than flying abilities do.
OverReactionGuy
Verified Sanity
Which is a reason why i said we need to upgrate our flying you know. >.>
I will note the debuff is called "hostile divinity exposure". I don't think it'll occur normally.
Also, you seem to be forgetting the "Danmaku" ability, which is described as "Full Auto, but on steroids". That's +250 minimum per version. I'm guessing it's 500, myself. And from previous data, we know the bonus is x2, so I'm guessing the actual damage is more along the lines of this:
Level 1: 600 * 4 * 2 = 4,800
Level 2: 625 * 4 * 2 = 5,000
Level 3: 656 * 4 * 2 = 5,248
Level 4: 695 * 4 * 2 = 5,560
Level 5: 744 * 4 * 2 = 5,952
Level 6: 805 * 4 * 2 = 6,440
Level 7: 881 * 4 * 2 = 7,048
Level 8: 976 * 4 * 2 = 7,808
Still not enough, but it's worth thinking about with regards to weaker enemies.
Incidentally, something that seems to have been missed:
Looks like Core Purge boosts our attack-power.
Your assuming we upgrade Flight to the point that such a plan is viable with what we have. Other people aren't.
OverReactionGuy
Verified Sanity
Honestly, I may be assuming but I'm also bringing up a valid point. We kinda neglected something important when it comes to surviving battle.
Mobility.
Hell, Nep has a habit of standing still when she could be moving out of the way. Mostly, I just wanted to point out that its theoretically possible to kill the black knight.
We still need to learn how to use the environment around us at well. We are likely going to die again in all honestly.
But if we manage to win this anyway, thats bad as well. Because then the higher ups would see our success and send us against more foes that are above our weight class which is something we haven't been dissuading them of that notion.
We kinda missed that chance at the meeting by jumping into the mission head first.
I was bored and in the mood for math so here is what I've been able to work out.
- Spending XP
- Stats
- Spells
- Abilities
I think that's everything we know for everything non-obvious. If there is something I missed I'll happily edit it in.
They're not deliberaly doing it, its just that damn near everything is above our weight class.
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- Location
- ☯
As kelllogo pointed out earlier, if we really want to kill the Black Knight, why not just upgrade Celestial Severance to around lvl 9 or 10 and simply one shot her, instead of relying on Starshine — The battle plan could be changed to a fighting retreat out of the mausoleum before collapsing it on Candy Heart and Black Knight using CS.
I would rather let Rei deal with the Black Knight though, killing her brings too much attention and misunderstandings about our strength.
I would rather let Rei deal with the Black Knight though, killing her brings too much attention and misunderstandings about our strength.
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