Remove ads

A Sword Without a Hilt: A Song of Ice and Fire/D&D 3.5 Crossover

Reader mode
Azel said:
@Duesal, the stats of the chain are not on the front page. Where are you pulling the "must be LE" part from?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Huh. I could have sworn the alignment was a conflict trigger.
DragonParadox said:
Coils of Agony

Description: Once the weapon of a champion the baatezu this weapon has gained a semblance of thought not through laborious spell-work and seals of power but by ages uncounted inflicting torturous death upon Hell's enemies. Black as pitch are its links and red as old blood that will never wash away its many dagger-sharp spikes. It speaks in the rattle of metal upon metal, disquietingly like a serpent readying to strike

Caster Level: 16

Base Enchantment: +2 Attack and Damage

Senses: 120 ft. vision and hearing

Communication: Speech

Alignment: Lawfully Evil

STATS:
15 (+2) Charisma
10 (+0) Intelligence
15 (+2) Wisdom

SAVES:
FORTITUDE: 10
REFLEX: 10
WILL: 10 + 2 = 11

Powers:
  1. Grants one extra AoO per turn
  2. User can make a free trip attempt for every full attack
Ego: 2 (Base enchantment) +3 (Powers) +4 (Stat bonuses) = 9

Conflict Triggers:
  1. Celestial Heritage
  2. ???
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
But bottomline, I don't trust this thing for a second, and I'm pretty worried about why it wanted Valaena over everyone else. We have a long and storied history with fiendish items biting us in the ass. The demon sword tried to possess Glyra, the Devil's Eye was actively spying on us and was primed to drag its user to Hell during their weakest moments, the Assassin Devil's amulet apparently had some unknown unpleasant effect until the Old Gods fixed that for us.

So it's not a question of if the spiked chain will fuck all of us over, it's a question of when and how.

I know you're excited about this because it's Lawful Evil, but can't we get something that we're sure won't potentially sacrifice one of our most valuable baby PCs?
 
Azel said:
Can we get rid of the Armor of Holiness too while we are at it?

I still would vastly prefer to get some proper DR on Richard.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

I admit bias towards Good, due to the fact that they don't have suffering/ending everything as their end goals, or at least, they don't appear to, as I understand it, but while the powers are nice, I really just want them to be used in some sort of westeros pricks need saving, Richard has aura like holy vengance.

Apart from that one awesome sounding scene (in my view at least), i'd much prefer the DR of adamantium too :'(.

Edit: my view of fiend loot is that it just needs a bit of effort to go through some processing.
 
Last edited:
Duesal said:
Huh. I could have sworn the alignment was a conflict trigger.

But bottomline, I don't trust this thing for a second, and I'm pretty worried about why it wanted Valaena over everyone else. We have a long and storied history with fiendish items biting us in the ass. The demon sword tried to possess Glyra, the Devil's Eye was actively spying on us and was primed to drag its user to Hell during their weakest moments, the Assassin Devil's amulet apparently had some unknown unpleasant effect until the Old Gods fixed that for us.

So it's not a question of if the spiked chain will fuck all of us over, it's a question of when and how.

I know you're excited about this because it's Lawful Evil, but can't we get something that we're sure won't potentially sacrifice one of our most valuable baby PCs?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Huh, I wasn't aware it had been added to the magic item page. Neat. Reading about it now.
 
Duesal said:
Huh. I could have sworn the alignment was a conflict trigger.

But bottomline, I don't trust this thing for a second, and I'm pretty worried about why it wanted Valaena over everyone else. We have a long and storied history with fiendish items biting us in the ass. The demon sword tried to possess Glyra, the Devil's Eye was actively spying on us and was primed to drag its user to Hell during their weakest moments, the Assassin Devil's amulet apparently had some unknown unpleasant effect until the Old Gods fixed that for us.

So it's not a question of if the spiked chain will fuck all of us over, it's a question of when and how.

I know you're excited about this because it's Lawful Evil, but can't we get something that we're sure won't potentially sacrifice one of our most valuable baby PCs?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Then seriously, just throw it away. I'm not supporting to re-open MS just to get a repeat of the junk from last time on our first trip.
And nobody in the Neutral Good PoA marketplace will want that thing.

In related news, I want to murder some Archons for loot that is actually usable.
 
Duesal said:
Huh. I could have sworn the alignment was a conflict trigger.

But bottomline, I don't trust this thing for a second, and I'm pretty worried about why it wanted Valaena over everyone else. We have a long and storied history with fiendish items biting us in the ass. The demon sword tried to possess Glyra, the Devil's Eye was actively spying on us and was primed to drag its user to Hell during their weakest moments, the Assassin Devil's amulet apparently had some unknown unpleasant effect until the Old Gods fixed that for us.

So it's not a question of if the spiked chain will fuck all of us over, it's a question of when and how.

I know you're excited about this because it's Lawful Evil, but can't we get something that we're sure won't potentially sacrifice one of our most valuable baby PCs?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
So true. If anything the chain being LE is a warning sign since it means it came from Devils, and Devils are in love with their booby traps.
 
Seriously though, if you guys really want to keep the chain for Valaena there's an easy fix.

Sacrifice to the Old Gods.

Magic Domain, have already demonstrated the ability to block off fiendish magic items from the influence of hell so that we can use them for our own purpose, etc. If we get a sacrifice and the Old Gods do their thing and also remove whatever hidden curse DP has slipped in there just for fun, I'll happy stand aside as you give the chain to Valaena.

EDIT: I mean, just look:
DragonParadox said:
"Sure," Vee shrugs, then with all the ceremony of one gutting a chicken for the pot she drives a small iron knife she has been carrying for as long as you have known her into the back of the dogai's neck and into its brain.

The devil's form melts into dark bitter dust and swirls away, leaving behind the same nine-sided amulet it had been wearing when you captured it, though you knew the thing safe in your treasury. A not altogether pleasant reminder of the power and influence which the living gods of this world can exert seemingly on a whim.

Cautiously you pick up the medallion and find that it is now carved with runes of the First Men. Fortunately Malarys could still work a minor spell to understand foreign script which tells you he had meant to use to read some Westerosi histories.

"It sharpens wits and... grants the power to slay as though by potent death magic," he reads out. "Most of these markings seem to be a warding to allow mortals to use its powers without falling under the dominion of infernal powers."
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
It works perfectly. All we've got to do is get a powerful enough sacrifice and we're golden.
 
Last edited:
Duesal said:
Seriously though, if you guys really want to keep the chain for Valaena there's an easy fix.

Sacrifice to the Old Gods.

Magic Domain, have already demonstrated the ability to block off fiendish magic items from the influence of hell so that we can use them for our own purpose, etc. If we get a sacrifice and the Old Gods do their thing and also remove whatever hidden curse DP has slipped in there just for fun, I'll happy stand aside as you give the chain to Valaena.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

We don't have to worry about it controlling Vaelana. She'll have a PfE item and it only has an Ego score of 9. The issue is that anyone who isn't Lawful Evil will gain a temporary negative level so long as they wield it.

So, sell it, sacrifice it, or save it for a LE character. Maybe Malarys prefers to use a spiked chain?
 
Goldfish said:
We don't have to worry about it controlling Vaelana. She'll have a PfE item and it only has an Ego score of 9. The issue is that anyone who isn't Lawful Evil will gain a temporary negative level so long as they wield it.

So, sell it, sacrifice it, or save it for a LE character. Maybe Malarys prefers to use a spiked chain?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Why should they gain a negative level? The conflict trigger is Celestial Heritage, not different alignment.
 
Azel said:
Why should they gain a negative level? The conflict trigger is Celestial Heritage, not different alignment.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

It has nothing to do with a conflict trigger.

Intelligent Items
Intelligent Item Alignment
Any item with intelligence has an alignment. Note that intelligent weapons already have alignments, either stated or by implication. If you're generating a random intelligent weapon, that weapon's alignment must fit with any alignment-oriented special abilities it has.

Any character whose alignment does not correspond to that of the item (except as noted by the asterisks on the table) gains one negative level if he or she so much as picks up the item. Although this negative level never results in actual level loss, it remains as long as the item is in hand and cannot be overcome in any way (including restoration spells). This negative level is cumulative with any other penalties the item might already place on inappropriate wielders. Items with Ego scores (see below) of 20 to 29 bestow two negative levels. Items with Ego scores of 30 or higher bestow three negative levels.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
 
Goldfish said:
We don't have to worry about it controlling Vaelana. She'll have a PfE item and it only has an Ego score of 9. The issue is that anyone who isn't Lawful Evil will gain a temporary negative level so long as they wield it.

So, sell it, sacrifice it, or save it for a LE character. Maybe Malarys prefers to use a spiked chain?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
The main problem is that I have zero trust for fiendish magic items in general. And ever since DP revealed hidden effects that don't even have a ??? to reveal them I've lost pretty much all hope of safely using fiendish magic items without completely subverting them.

Even Malarys I wouldn't want to use the Chain until we figured out exactly what it does and whatever curses it has. We waited forever to get our Lawful Evil cleric and like hell we'll ever lose him to devils. :mad:

So, why not just hang on to it, then break it out when we get our next big sacrifice to the Old Gods? That fixes almost all the problems we have with it. We don't have to worry about diabolical curses, Azel and Artemis get their flavorful weapon, Valaena wields a very useful weapon that's practical from dragonback, etc. It's not a big sacrifice at all, especially since Valaena is only level 2.

She doesn't need a powerful weapon right this second. She can wait for us to fix this chain.
 
Azel said:
Then seriously, just throw it away. I'm not supporting to re-open MS just to get a repeat of the junk from last time on our first trip.
And nobody in the Neutral Good PoA marketplace will want that thing.

In related news, I want to murder some Archons for loot that is actually usable.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

I'm ok with going in and shouting to that the efreet that it's his own fault that he didn't expect some sort of horrible sting in the tail from a devil item, and if he has a problem with the cost of his own foolishness, he shouldn't drag people (his fellow effreet) into spending their valuable time and wasting ours (viserys') too for that matter.

So he had probably come up with a good reason for us to not scrafice him to the gods.

And then we bp him, and scrafice him to the gods after we compel him to fully explain how every magic item he has, works.

Or just kill him if we don't want to take him to Planetos.

Edit: the credulous one is in a jar if we want to use it.

If it wasn't 35? days away, i'd love to throw it in to the merlings king temple consecration, see if we can't get her to be a cloisterd cleric with awesome chain.

Tortorus death to merciful death and such.

Would probably distract her from husband-hunting
 
Last edited:
Azel said:
Ah. Nevermind. I thought it needed to be a trigger to cause that.

Let's just use it as a sacrifice for something then. It's not worth the effort.
And I'm definitely not going to invest 10k IM to turn it Lawful Good in a repeat of the Glyra thing.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
It's not a total lost cause. All it takes is one powerful sacrifice to the Old Gods and we've got a very good weapon on our hands with most of the drawbacks put in check.
 
Duesal said:
The main problem is that I have zero trust for fiendish magic items in general. And ever since DP revealed hidden effects that don't even have a ??? to reveal them I've lost pretty much all hope of safely using fiendish magic items without completely subverting them.

Even Malarys I wouldn't want to use the Chain until we figured out exactly what it does and whatever curses it has. We waited forever to get our Lawful Evil cleric and like hell we'll ever lose him to devils. :mad:

So, why not just hang on to it, then break it out when we get our next big sacrifice to the Old Gods? That fixes almost all the problems we have with it. We don't have to worry about diabolical curses, Azel and Artemis get their flavorful weapon, Valaena wields a very useful weapon that's practical from dragonback, etc. It's not a big sacrifice at all, especially since Valaena is only level 2.

She doesn't need a powerful weapon right this second. She can wait for us to fix this chain.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
The thing is, that chain is sentient. It won't be that easy and I'm entirely against wasting effort on it.

And yeah, I agree with @Goldfish. The whole "every infernal item is 50% Obviously-Evil-ium, 30% Cursetanium and 20% Mind-Controll-ium is kinda getting a bit stale.
 
Azel said:
The thing is, that chain is sentient. It won't be that easy and I'm entirely against wasting effort on it.

And yeah, I agree with @Goldfish. The whole "every infernal item is 50% Obviously-Evil-ium, 30% Cursetanium and 20% Mind-Controll-ium is kinda getting a bit stale.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
:(

What about sacrificing the chain to the Merling King and asking for something better for Valaena? That should be both flavorful and hopefully devoid of curses, and it should be something that qualifies for weapon finesse.
 
Azel said:
The thing is, that chain is sentient. It won't be that easy and I'm entirely against wasting effort on it.

And yeah, I agree with @Goldfish. The whole "every infernal item is 50% Obviously-Evil-ium, 30% Cursetanium and 20% Mind-Controll-ium is kinda getting a bit stale.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
To be fair, it's totally IC for Devils to do that. It's just boring for the Quest because Devils love showing up to fight us. We need enemies that aren't Evil Outsiders.
 
Last edited:
Duesal said:
:(

What about sacrificing the chain to the Merling King and asking for something better for Valaena? That should be both flavorful and hopefully devoid of curses, and it should be something that qualifies for weapon finesse.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
That would probably end up with an oversized spear (read: lance) and I'm not at all fond of getting her a weapon she won't be able to use when not mounted. Especially since her mighty dragon is only an egg right now.
 
065tdsa said:
To be fair, it's totally IC for Devils to do that. It's just boring for the Quest because Devils love showing up to fight us.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Actually, not really. Why would Devils waste effort on making every weapon they ever made into a trap for mortals when the only way that ever comes into play is when the owner dies?

Do you poison your lunch and take an anti-dote when you eat, just in case someone steals it from your desk?
It's simply ridiculous to waste that much resources on pure spite for a hypothetical being that may or may not kill you somewhen in the next 2000 years. I could get Demons doing that for the abyss of it and the occasional Devil who has enough spare time and souls to do it and not enough other opportunities to be a dick, but everyone? All the time?
 
Azel said:
That would probably end up with an oversized spear (read: lance) and I'm not at all fond of getting her a weapon she won't be able to use when not mounted. Especially since her mighty dragon is only an egg right now.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

It might just change the chain to being non-dick sapient, which is generally an iffy idea, to do to a person, but this is a fiend weapon/person, so eh.

Or we can do it if Valaena awakens her magic outside of the merling kings as a reward for ver via scrafacing the vrook to the OG
 
Azel said:
Actually, not really. Why would Devils waste effort on making every weapon they ever made into a trap for mortals when the only way that ever comes into play is when the owner dies?

Do you poison your lunch and take an anti-dote when you eat, just in case someone steals it from your desk?
It's simply ridiculous to waste that much resources on pure spite for a hypothetical being that may or may not kill you somewhen in the next 2000 years. I could get Demons doing that for the abyss of it and the occasional Devil who has enough spare time and souls to do it and not enough other opportunities to be a dick, but everyone? All the time?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Occasionally this kind of trap just appears naturally.

Like this Chain was never designed to be sapient and evil, it just happened from being used by a devil for millenia.

But hey, they Chain's conscieousness was formed by a Devil, right? Why not make a pact with it, it should be bound by that.
Something like, we'll kill one demon per year with it, slowly, starting with the Vrock, as long as it behaves like a nice and tame little weapon.
@DragonParadox
Could it take such a deal?
 
Azel said:
Actually, not really. Why would Devils waste effort on making every weapon they ever made into a trap for mortals when the only way that ever comes into play is when the owner dies?

Do you poison your lunch and take an anti-dote when you eat, just in case someone steals it from your desk?
It's simply ridiculous to waste that much resources on pure spite for a hypothetical being that may or may not kill you somewhen in the next 2000 years. I could get Demons doing that for the abyss of it and the occasional Devil who has enough spare time and souls to do it and not enough other opportunities to be a dick, but everyone? All the time?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I would guess they figured out a way to it very cheaply, probably taking advantage that the Evil energy they and their home-plane (and therefore the items made there) are literally made of is bad for mortals.

And considering the amount of incursions into the Material we've dealt with alone and the fact they haven't conquered any of it yet, the fact is 90%+ of Devils who come to the Material die and get looted. Therefore, all Devils who come to the Prime Material get cursed items for mortals.

Presumably Devils fighting Demons get items that shit all over Chaotic Outsiders in particular, but maybe that's harder to do.
 
Last edited:
Artemis1992 said:
Occasionally this kind of trap just appears naturally.

Like this Chain was never designed to be sapient and evil, it just happened from being used by a devil for millenia.

But hey, they Chain's conscieousness was formed by a Devil, right? Why not make a pact with it, it should be bound by that.
Something like, we'll kill one demon per year with it, slowly, starting with the Vrock, as long as it behaves like a nice and tame little weapon.
@DragonParadox
Could it take such a deal?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Especially because it wasn't designed to do so, I find it hard to believe that it would actively try to screw its owner.
 
By the way, since we're getting the Day of Change ritual from Bloodraven, we can finally sacrifice all those demonic artifacts that Abraxas left behind in our Shadow Tower that we've had locked away and not being used.

We could grow all the Heart Trees we want, potentially going so far as to grow one on every island in the Stepstones.

But I want to keep that chalice that summons Abraxas. That just seems too useful in the epic levels when we want to taunt the demon lord.
 
Reader mode
You must login or register to reply here.
Remove ads
Back
Top