It's hard to come up with a feasible solution to this without defaulting to KILL!MAIM!BURN! tactics. For now I'm just going to leave the simple question up. Hopefully we'll get some useful information to help us determine the best course of action.

Yeah it is, I have an idea that might be a bit risky but could also shortcut this whole process.

Create Mindscape Greater, creating it with the Harmful trait and anything else that may benefit us.

Why this(maybe) works:

You don't need line of sight to draw the subject creature into the mindscape, but you must be aware of its presence within range.

The range should encompass the whole property and we know he exists as an entity.

The Greater version allows us to take multiple creatures into the Mindscape.

Basically we can create a battlefield, put him on it as a non-house entity and then fight it out Matrix style.

Any one else concerned about the group facing ol'Tentacle-Beard? Mind Flayers are no joke, and that isn't a very highly leveled party.

Yeah I'm a little concerned, I think if they're smart they'll be relatively safe but it also makes it pretty likely the Mindflayer can escape if it so chooses.
We'll have to see.
 
What do ya'll think of this route? DP has outright said the Herald likes to taunt its enemies and lord over them, and I think the option he presented at the end of the chapter is a decent enough clue as to how we can handle this.

[] Try to bluff N'Gath that you had been taken in by his threat that he may show himself in a form more convenient to capture than the whole house.
-[] "Stop, stop!" Viserys pleads, his voice seemingly that of a man on the edge of panic. "Would you consign this world to the pitiless encroachment of Winter or the infinite armies of Hell? What use would Ymeri have for it then?"
--[] While talking, Viserys uses one charge from his bracers, along with his innate ability to cast Silent spells, to cast a Silent and Stilled Blood Wish to duplicate a Surge of Fortune spell.
--[] Viserys asks Varys to Telepathically warn the rest of the group to play along as best they can manage, either outraged, afraid, angry, etc., so long as they don't give away the ruse.
-[] "What must be done to free you before too many years are spent? Surely it cannot be done while you haunt this cursed place?"
--[] Use Surge of Fortune (+20) and already active social spells (Air of Nobility, Voice of the Dragon) any other consumable buffs which might be in place (Divine Insight, Grand Destiny, etc) along with a Mythic Surge (+1d6 bonus) to convince N'Gath of our sincerity.
Everyone in the party must be going "WTF" at Viserys saying this shite, especially the less acquainted members :V

One hopes that noone would fail their will/insight checks on this and try to stop Viserys.


I'm not sure we have access to socials at any given point in time like that either, we weren't specifically preparing for going into social combat. Would Viserys really keep Air of Nobility and Voice of the Dragon up?

I don't think he would, nor really.
 
Everyone in the party must be going "WTF" at Viserys saying this shite, especially the less acquainted members :V

One hopes that noone would fail their will/insight checks on this and try to stop Viserys.


I'm not sure we have access to socials at any given point in time like that either, we weren't specifically preparing for going into social combat. Would Viserys really keep Air of Nobility and Voice of the Dragon up?

I don't think he would, nor really.

I agree on the party issue but buff wise it's quite reasonable.

Each will last 190 minutes, or just over 3 hours and we've talked enemies down from or into poor decisions more than once.

Furthermore they are defensive buffs, one gives Sense Motive and while the other does not it does give Bluff which can also be used defensively.
 
I agree on the party issue but buff wise it's quite reasonable.

Each will last 190 minutes, or just over 3 hours and we've talked enemies down from or into poor decisions more than once.

Furthermore they are defensive buffs, one gives Sense Motive and while the other does not it does give Bluff which can also be used defensively.
Thing is, I'm pretty sure we never added them to a "pure combat" pre-buffing schemes.
I don't think there ever was a precedent, even if the use itself can be justified.

Would saying that we have any buffs we want before any given encounter be a good practice?
:/
 
Thing is, I'm pretty sure we never added them to a "pure combat" pre-buffing schemes.
I don't think there ever was a precedent, even if the use itself can be justified.

Would saying that we have any buffs we want before any given encounter be a good practice?
:/

No it wouldn't but Viserys is established as a talker, it's his jam.

I wouldn't argue that we had Seamantle up walking into a fight against Fire Elementals even if it's the perfect buff against them.

Talking is always an option and they are low level spells, the sheer lack of opportunity cost and breadth of application should inform that it is reasonable to assume that Viserys' would have them up in any pre-planned situation like this.
 
Finally had time to deep read. So, nitpicking time!

Others would not be possessed of such delicate sensibilities and they would take far less care than the death-priests of Caraxes did.
the death part is wrong, sky/storm/trade is Vhagar. Will edit.
You speak this invocations to Vhagar who was Lord of Death

DP, you've made Vhagar the goddess of Sky/Storm/&Trade. Caraxes is the god of death.

Edgelord much, Daemon? Just because big brother Viserys I tamed Balerion he named his dragon, Death.
 
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@Crake, @Duesal, having thought on the topic more and asking DP, the Librarian's stock might just be about worth the price.

His ile of books not as deep as yours, with books that open entire new avenues of obscure research, but but would be comparetevily as wide or wider in scope, more topics from across the planes.
We sorely lack lore on Psionics, on forging elementals (alike to that found by Lya in R'hlor's book), and varied stuff like moving images (serpentstone RA takes absurdly lot because we have little knowledge related to it), we lack basics to start from for many projects we thought up.

He might just get us an in into some of worst RAs progress-wize.


Also, I think we can offer him a job as a Librarian in our Halls of Knowledge.

Aside from additional flavor to our Better!Hogwarts, he'll also be a fair bit of security said halls currently kinda lack for all lore they hold.
 
@Crake, @Duesal, having thought on the topic more and asking DP, the Librarian's stock might just be about worth the price.


We sorely lack lore on Psionics, on forging elementals (alike to that found by Lya in R'hlor's book), and varied stuff like moving images (serpentstone RA takes absurdly lot because we have little knowledge related to it), we lack basics to start from for many projects we thought up.

He might just get us an in into some of worst RAs progress-wize.


Also, I think we can offer him a job as a Librarian in our Halls of Knowledge.

Aside from additional flavor to our Better!Hogwarts, he'll also be a fair bit of security said halls currently kinda lack for all lore they hold.
I would rather purchase lore on specific topics that we are currently lacking rather than just buy the entire library, which is sure to include a lot of redundant material.
 
I would rather purchase lore on specific topics that we are currently lacking rather than just buy the entire library, which is sure to include a lot of redundant material.
Honestly, buying it all in a batch would just make most research we come up in the future a bit easier.

It is only simpler to do (OOC), than trying to go through the entire RA-list, picking out the avenues with the least background knowledge...

And then having DP roll separately for everything.


I'm not going to push for this unless I get some support from the thread, but I'm even less interested in trying to pick our specific lores from all the libraries around*.

God knows, we have enough unnecessary rolling happening already.

*2(!) extraplanar library complexes we can enter freely, Efreeti and Helllven's markets, whatever's on PoW... and The Librarian.
 
Finally had time to deep read. So, nitpicking time!





DP, you've made Vhagar the goddess of Sky/Storm/&Trade. Caraxes is the god of death.

Edgelord much, Daemon? Just because big brother Viserys I tamed Balerion he named his dragon, Death.
NOTHIN' PERSONNEL, NEPHEW.

I say, as I plunge two thousand feet to the ground with my sword stuck through your eye after leaping from dragonback in a feat of acrobatics that was just as much luck as skill.

Really Daemon? Really? And Ceraxes just wanted that day to be over.
 
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Part MMMCVIII: An Arcane Tangle
An Arcane Tangle

Second Day of the Eleventh Month 293 AC

At Dany's answer you fall silent within as without, and for a long moment you weigh your one path against another. Thankfully it seems the herald is expecting shock and inner struggle, seeming to grow more confident and more hopeful with every passing moment that the hour of its deliverance is at last at hand.

"Varys," you send first to your familiar. "Warn Zherys, Benerro, and Teana that I am about to try to lure this thing into a trap." Ser Richard knows you enough to guess that you have a plan, and you remember well that Rina had followed your command at once when you had dealt with the traitor Fey. Ordinarily you would say the same of Teana, but given how much pain this horror had caused her you would rather err on the side of caution.

They all react each in their own manner, breath catchings slightly, eyes widening by the barest fraction, but all of them are skilled for their own reasons in keep their inner selves from reflecting upon the face and body. N'gath might guess that you had conversed with them, but not what you had said. Hopefully your own attempt will go as well. It would be no easy feat to destroy the manse without harm to the rest of the city and the less said of the possibility of the fire spirit abroad and loose the better.

"How can we free you if you have become one with this structure?" you ask aloud through gritted teeth as though the words pain you.

"How easily you dip your banners in defeat..." Mad giggles spark off the walls, though something tells you there might be as much mummery to this mirth as to your own question. It wants to be underestimated. "Will you not take my oath, then, that I will shine upon some other land far off from your ambitions?"

"I asked you a question and made no offer yet," you reply sharply, finding it disturbingly easy to play along. Unlike all the times you have played the arrogant stripling, the foolish conjurer or some other exaggerated mask, these are the answers you would have given if the Fey were not lying. Time is more precious than gold or gems, more precious than knowledge. To have it is squandered so would be a greater harm done to your plans than anything save a dagger in the heart. No, worse than that even, for you can turn death's hand but not the pitiless wheels of the clock.

"Have your ice witch compel the answers from Tagar," the spirit replies. "Only from his tangled mind could one grasp the tangled web of his folly." N'Gath answers with disdain. "Remember, the wheel turns blindly and none are at the helm..."

"Do not force me speak of that day," the tattered shade of the dead magister now divested of its shroud of memory proclaims hollowly. "He has sought to break me for years. Has it been years or centuries? The passage of time means so little now..."

"What do you mean break you?" Teana asks, obviously struggling to keep her tone level when faced with what remained of the man responsible for the Day of Fire, for the death of so many close to her.

"The betrayer has sought to bewilder my mind with old memories and false hope, to make me see the day of his treachery as something other than what it was." Ash swirls around the figure as he moves closer. "Yet no matter how many times he forces me to witness that which was I can never forget my death, never forget what I am. I will not be made a fool of a second time!" The voice rises to a screech, like metal carving through stone on the last words.

"It was trying to make you believe in a world where it did not betray you so that you would then speak of your precautions thinking it an ally?" Zherys interjects, unshaken by the spirit's rage rage.

"Yes... yes, and he will lie to you... of how sweetly he will lie, how much will he promise... ashes... ashes and blood... do not trust it, never trust it," the increasingly frantic specter proclaims.

Of course you have no intention of trusting N'Gath any further than you can throw the Red Keep and all within it, but that is not something you can say here where the dark spirit himself might hear you. So the question is now how to persuade the shade of magister Tagar that you would not make his mistakes or even if it is worth attempting to converse with it at all. You could simply ask Rina to attempt to compel the Wraith, but she had never commanded the unliving, much less for such a purpose. Worse still if the dead magister's will should prove stronger than it could destroy itself upon your weapons or flee through the manse.

What do you do?

[] Try to convince the wraith to explain what happened on the day of the summoning
-[] Write in

[] Ask Rina to try to compel the Wraith

[] Write in


OOC: The rolls were pretty close, but ultimately in your favor.
 
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This is great fun! Seriously DP, I'm having a blast. It's tense and rather intimidating, but it's a fun change from Sacramental Seal tag ;)

I mean, I like rocket tag and all, but some variety like this is great too.
 
This is great fun! Seriously DP, I'm having a blast. It's tense and rather intimidating, but it's a fun change from Sacramental Seal tag ;)

I mean, I like rocket tag and all, but some variety like this is great too.

I like to think of this like...delayed rocket tag? There isn't really an apt statement for when you wait to inevitable tag someone with a rocket.
 
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[X] Try to convince the wraith to explain what happened on the day of the summoning
-[X] Blood Wish a Zone of Silence spell so that we can converse with the Wraith without being overheard. Ask Varys to Telepathically inform the Herald we are doing this to gain the Wraith's trust.
-[X] Play upon the Wraith's guilt and regrets to convince it to tell us of the day it died and what it did to not only Summon the Herald, but to bind it to the mansion. If it balks, fearing we will work with the Herald, outright admit we have no intentions of freeing N'Gath which don't include it's capture or destruction. The Herald erred in letting us know the Wraith held the key to it's prison.
 
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[X] Try to convince the wraith to explain what happened on the day of the summoning
-[X] Play upon the Wraith's guilt and regrets to convince it to tell us of the day it died and what it did to not only Summon the Herald, but to bind it to the mansion. If it balks, fearing we will work with the Herald, outright admit we have no intentions of freeing N'Gath which don't include it's capture or destruction. The Herald erred in letting us know the Wraith held the key to it's prison.

The problem with the latter is that N'Gath himself is likely listening, you have to figure out a way to persuade the wraith without giving the game away
 
That does no work on the undead since it is a mind affecting spell.
We have gone around it before, haven't we?
I remember this for instance:
Threnodic Spell (Metamagic)

You can convert mind-affecting magic to necromantic power capable of controlling undead.

Prerequisites: Knowledge (religion) 6 ranks, Spell Focus (necromancy).

Benefit: This feat only works on mind-affecting spells. A threnodic spell affects undead creatures (even mindless undead) as if they weren't immune to mind-affecting effects, but has no effect on living creatures.

Level Increase: +2 (a threnodic spell uses up a spell slot two level higher than the spell's actual level.)

Normal: Undead are immune to mind-affecting effects.
And there was a spell to imbue Undead with life to take away some Undead traits...
 
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