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A Different Breed (Warhammer 29K)

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Ten points to the Aeldmoot and a bunch to the flaw of Tzeentch because that's the one that'll get worse and that might be most impacted by the moot.
 
Look at the actions for the Aeldmoot.

I say we grab Saim-Hann, Ulthwe, the exodites, the harlequins, etc. At the very least the information needs to get to Cegorach so he can safeguard it and spread the good news.
 
Alectai said:
Also, do we have new damage that needs to be resolved for Meros? The Warrior section looks like it might have gotten a bit scuffed. I also don't see Steward options for our new tech?
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Mechanis said:
At present 12 of the Lance Cutters in the fleet are damaged, 8 of which suffer from impaired mobility, similarly 9 of the Lance Sloops are damaged with one mission kill and four with impaired mobility. Ten Ketches have also suffered minor damages, with three suffering from impaired mobility, and two Caravels have similarly suffered from losing a sail. Notably, the new
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It's mentioned in the first Warrior spoiler, about 20 Destroyers, 10 Frigates and a couple of Caravels should probably be replaced. I figure we send some War Ketches to give them a test run, and maybe one of Zahr-Tans fleets? I doubt they'd dislike being asked to help protect another Craftworld.
 
Darik29 said:
I really, Really wanna go all in on the Aeldmoot.

Summon literally everyone. Throwing all ap at it means we can genuinely summon everyone on the list, and that means potentially summoning Biel-tan and Alaitoc as well due toeveryone else being present.
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I agree. We also have a military thanks to allied forces now and will likely need a moment to develop more tech before we're ready to actually start laying out new designs for troops and vehicles.
 
Karnax626 said:
It's mentioned in the first Warrior spoiler, about 20 Destroyers, 10 Frigates and a couple of Caravels should probably be replaced. I figure we send some War Ketches to give them a test run, and maybe one of Zahr-Tans fleets? I doubt they'd dislike being asked to help protect another Craftworld.
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Yeah, War Ketches should do a lot of good there, even if there's a big attack they should absolutely wreak havoc.

I definitely think we'll want to start work on our engines this turn though, because once we're the only Craftworld left immobile, we're going to start drawing a lot of vengeance hits for stopping Meros' doom--Chaos'll want a piece of us too for revenge.
 
Alectai said:
Use our freebies on Iyanden and Ulthwe, then throw 10 SAP on everything else. 4 on Lesser Craftworlds and 4 on Exodites, while roping in Saim-Hann and the Harlequins as part of the game.

Probably use our Allied Forces on home defense while we finish up our commitments externally with our resources.
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This may be my near sleep brain but I think we lose the freebies if we do the Aeldmoot rather than just telling two non-allies

Mechanis said:
If you instead wish to make a more formal meeting with the majority of the surviving Aeldari who are currently active in the galaxy, you will instead be required to spend all listed Action Points, and must select at least four options (again, in addition to your allies, whom will be naturally informed in such an event).
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Karugus said:
So the scale of Zahr-Tann tells us a few things: we absolutely cannot standardize on anything more expensive than VGA, we absolutely cannot standardize on Infantry Conversion Fields and Holo-Fields, that our vehicles should probably focus on 1 or 2 primary weapons and 1-2 hull mounted weapons rather than '11 barrels of hell memes' like our current chassis start with the slots for, that half sized specialist squads back stopping full size line squads work and that they can share dedicated transports, that we're probably going to want specialized affordable armor for melee troops sooner than later, Zahr-Tann seems pretty unconcerned about super heavy vehicles
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We could Make something more expensive then VGA work... IF we dumped a ton of AP, Possibly 2 turns in a row to Build nothing but Foundry lines for it that Make them for free instead of rallying on EP batch buying it, That being said Our effort is much better served right now actually making Foundry lines for VGA and Getting our shit sorted out before trying to spend ANOther turn making a Better suit of armour so we can probably fail to properly mass produce it, leaving our dudes in the starting armour still.

I'm In favour of Aeldmoot, That sounds like a cool event that will buy us some rope to stop Biel-tan jumping on us, without pissing everyone off in a way they can't afford.
 
Karnax626 said:
Honestly I want to just put all of our Steward AP this turn into the Aeldmoot, it definitely seems worth it. Probably 1 each into Lesser Craftworlds and Exodites?
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If we don't leave out anyone we don't want to insult, 1 Lesser Craftworld and 1 Exodite uses up all 10 AP, yeah. Probably worth it.
Karugus said:
we absolutely cannot standardize on anything more expensive than VGA
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Agreed. And given just how widely Zahr-Tann uses Flare Shields, I'm not particularly interested in spending time and effort getting a downgraded cheaper armor - we'd lose the savings from pulling the holo-field buying extra protection anyway. Might as well commit.

Alectai said:
I definitely think we'll want to start work on our engines this turn though, because once we're the only Craftworld left immobile, we're going to start drawing a lot of vengeance hits for stopping Meros' doom--Chaos'll want a piece of us too for revenge.
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That's an excellent point.
 
Ah, got it.

Well, it is what it is. We can hold off on further Rationalization for now I think, nailing this is critical to our long term goals.

So yeah ,in light of that, a heavy emphasis on getting our engines online by the end of next turn in SAP feels like the way to go. 7-8points ish, won't leave much more for gear implementation, but we can get one in at least I think. We want our wings back before anyone can mobilize assets to fuck us over.
 
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Alectai said:
Use our freebies on Iyanden and Ulthwe, then throw 10 SAP on everything else. 4 on Lesser Craftworlds and 4 on Exodites, while roping in Saim-Hann and the Harlequins as part of the game.
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Mechanis said:
You may contact up to Two Factions (other than your allies, whom will be informed as a matter of course) about the Curses without spending an Action Points. If you instead wish to make a more formal meeting with the majority of the surviving Aeldari who are currently active in the galaxy, you will instead be required to spend all listed Action Points, and must select at least four options (again, in addition to your allies, whom will be naturally informed in such an event).
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By the description we can only pick two for free if we go for the more informal meetup. Picking the full Aeldmoot means we need to pay the full cost for everything.
Alectai said:
Yeah, War Ketches should do a lot of good there, even if there's a big attack they should absolutely wreak havoc.

I definitely think we'll want to start work on our engines this turn though, because once we're the only Craftworld left immobile, we're going to start drawing a lot of vengeance hits for stopping Meros' doom--Chaos'll want a piece of us too for revenge.
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I'm on board for that, though I still want to know how Forge actions would work with Repairing the Plasma system, and whether it costs 12AP or 36AP in total.
 
If we go all in on the Aeldmoot this turn, stockpile wargear this turn, we can spend as many SAP next turn as we can afford and refit as many detachments as we likely would otherwise and still have them ready for a Biel-Tan attack next turn. There's very little reason not to do the Aeldmoot unless we were expecting to refit far more than 10 SAP of detachments between these two turns. I don't see us refitting more than 25 detachments a turn anyways.

Alectai said:
Yeah, War Ketches should do a lot of good there, even if there's a big attack they should absolutely wreak havoc.

I definitely think we'll want to start work on our engines this turn though, because once we're the only Craftworld left immobile, we're going to start drawing a lot of vengeance hits for stopping Meros' doom--Chaos'll want a piece of us too for revenge.
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So long as we build a lot of wargear this turn to avoid wasting refit SAP next turn and cover our asses against Biel-Tan turn 5 that should be fine. But there's no point trying to fix our engines if Biel-Tan deals major damage or the Orks escalate before we can fully extract. And our commitments to the Exodites to the Galactic East limit how far we can go without giving an Ork Waaagh a free hand to spiral out of control and risk an even worse fight in the Exodites' defenses.
 
Karugus said:
If we go all in on the Aeldmoot this turn, stockpile wargear this turn, we can spend as many SAP next turn as we can afford and refit as many detachments as we likely would otherwise and still have them ready for a Biel-Tan attack next turn. There's very little reason not to do the Aeldmoot unless we were expecting to refit far more than 10 SAP of detachments between these two turns. I don't see us refitting more than 25 detachments a turn anyways.


So long as we build a lot of wargear this turn to avoid wasting refit SAP next turn and cover our asses against Biel-Tan turn 5 that should be fine. But there's no point trying to fix our engines if Biel-Tan deals major damage or the Orks escalate before we can fully extract. And our commitments to the Exodites to the Galactic East limit how far we can go without giving an Ork Waaagh a free hand to spiral out of control and risk an even worse fight in the Exodites' defenses.
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Biel-Tan won't have a chance, they missed their chance to hit us this turn (Biel-Tan rolls their chance to find us at the start of a turn, and if they fail, we go into a normal turn, if they succeed, we get an instant Crisis turn), and we're executing the Aeldmoot this turn, which will absolutely make them attacking us Political Fucking Suicide, given how we'd have achieved the single greatest contribution to the post-fall Diaspora except for Iyanden's Soulstone studies (And arguably greater even than that). Them jumping us will be absolute suicide at that point since Everyone will assume they're Agents of the Enemy at that point.

Wargear can wait for now, we have our safety net, Meros Tower Defense ends mid-turn as long as they don't take any further damage, and we have a fuckton of burly, trained dudes bolstering our garrison, we should be okay as long as we make sure Meros Tower Defense doesn't get a last minute reversal, which I hope to achieve by deploying our War Ketches there.
 
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Karnax626 said:
I'm on board for that, though I still want to know how Forge actions would work with Repairing the Plasma system, and whether it costs 12AP or 36AP in total.
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Even that best case scenario is a 1/3 chance of saving 9 BAP when a VAP is worth 10+ BAP of EP. Considering we've just learned we are frog in a well and our ostensible juniors are roided up Battle Toads by comparison, we should probably commit to addressing that.
Alectai said:
Biel-Tan won't have a chance, they missed their chance to hit us this turn (Biel-Tan rolls their chance to find us at the start of a turn, and if they fail, we go into a normal turn, if they succeed, we get an instant Crisis turn), and we're executing the Aeldmoot this turn, which will absolutely make them attacking us Political Fucking Suicide, given how we'd have achieved the single greatest contribution to the post-fall Diaspora except for Iyanden's Soulstone studies (And arguably greater even than that). Them jumping us will be absolute suicide at that point since Everyone will assume they're Agents of the Enemy at that point.
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I don't think it's so easy to say that Biel-Tan of all groups will back down over political consequences. These are the people who fritter their strength away in self-defeating campaigns as a matter of course. It's not impossible Biel-Tan backs down, and its even fair to say it's more likely than not. But it's a real dangerous game to tell them they don't have the balls to fuck with us and stop preparing for the immediate possibility.
 
Karugus said:
Even that best case scenario is a 1/3 chance of saving 9 BAP when a VAP is worth 10+ BAP of EP. Considering we've just learned we are frog in a well and our ostensible juniors are roided up Battle Toads by comparison, we should probably commit to addressing that.

I don't think it's so easy to say that Biel-Tan of all groups will back down over political consequences. These are the people who fritter their strength away in self-defeating campaigns as a matter of course. It's not impossible Biel-Tan backs down, and its even fair to say it's more likely than not. But it's a real dangerous game to tell them they don't have the balls to fuck with us and stop preparing for the immediate possibility.
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It means they'd have to Utterly wipe us out and somehow keep it quiet forever or everyone will gang up on them to break their back.

There's playing Fuckfuck Games, and there's immediately turning around to wipe out a Craftworld responsible for the single greatest light of hope the diaspora has experienced since the Fall. That's the kind of shit that nobody forgives you for. The mere act of trying would be likely to piss Ulhwe off to the point of getting them to pick up on it and call everyone else to pull a full Gondor Calls For Aid moment on them, especially after one of those bullets that went hidden was aimed right at them.

Biel-Tan is jingoistic, not actively suicidal. Them attacking us would become Politically radioactive for centuries after this.
 
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Karugus said:
Even that best case scenario is a 1/3 chance of saving 9 BAP when a VAP is worth 10+ BAP of EP. Considering we've just learned we are frog in a well and our ostensible juniors are roided up Battle Toads by comparison, we should probably commit to addressing that.
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Sure, but spending VAP on the engines saves us BAP which we could spend on stuff like Production facilities, which would save us EP in the long run.
 
I think if we make a big enough splash with the Aeldmoot we might be able to avert beil-tan's attack. We would make attacking us politically problematic in the extreme, and even if it does not avert the attack it would create complications for our attacker as now beil-tan will have taken a swing at the guys who gave everyone absolutely vital intel.
 
I think we should expect Biel-Tan to give us a bloody nose at the very minimum. But I think thats all they will be able to do considering how spread out they are likely to be considering who and what they are. They are no longer the existential threat they used to be, that moment has passed. Especially with them having to fight through militant Zhar-Tann to get to us.

Especially in light of the big fat knowledge bomb we are about to drop onto the entire Aeldari race.
 
Another turn, another map infomark update. I have previously noted map update details here and here, for reference. As ever I encourage people to look at the new map and compare it to the old maps themselves.

Movement of craftworlds:
  • Arach-Qin has moved sharply east and north, moving directly toward us quite a bit. They're all the way on our side of Isstvan now.

Continuing changes from last update:
  • The webway south of Meros appears to have stabilized, but the webway AROUND Meros has distinctly thinned in all routes. A comparison between the previous map and this one is very clear- that webway route is shrinking rapidly. I have serious concerns that the whole area's network might be too narrow for Meros to use by the time their engines are fixed, which would be devastating for obvious reasons- they'd be stuck slowboating out of there instead of escaping the orks!
  • The splitting webway to our west has separated, leaving the original northern path to the orks intact but sending the two parts of the southern route questing into the previously-inaccessible dead zone to its south, between Tork-Toofa and Isstvan. There's nothing that we know of in that area, but surely if someone is guiding webway routes into existence in that direction there's something there which we'll notice soon enough.
  • The Zahr-Tann webway branch has continued to grow longer in parallel with the southern network rather than connecting to it. It hasn't led anywhere interesting yet but that's some aggressive growth so surely it will.
  • The southern network has experienced a distinct thinning of its paths similar to what we're seeing around Meros. Those paths may also cease to be traversable, which would cut us off from the Othion-Agathon-Turhal area as that is the only route to that direction.
  • The Quilan webway has continued to fork and split in crazy ways. We've scouted out a series of uninhabited systems to its west.

New changes:
  • A new webway route has opened up south of Kronite. Hasn't been scouted as leading to anywhere yet.
  • Some shifts in webway angling around Bitter Hold, might be the first signs of more drastic changes
  • Some shifts in the webway between the uninhabited systems immediatedly east of us, might be the first signs of more drastic changes
 
And asking them to protect us is one of the most politically reasonable things we could do, especially if we're overextended because we're bailing other Space Elfs out of their own crises.
 
Right now does seem to be the best moment to start building up our industry. We should be able to start up one Enhance Industry for an extra Bonesinger AP and one factory, which should probably be for Void Guard Warsuits. Still a bunch left to get to work on the drives, which since we're about to pants Chaos is probably advisable.
 
Alectai said:
It means they'd have to Utterly wipe us out and somehow keep it quiet forever or everyone will gang up on them to break their back.

There's playing Fuckfuck Games, and there's immediately turning around to wipe out a Craftworld responsible for the single greatest light of hope the diaspora has experienced since the Fall. That's the kind of shit that nobody forgives you for. The mere act of trying would be likely to piss Ulhwe off to the point of getting them to pick up on it and call everyone else to pull a full Gondor Calls For Aid moment on them, especially after one of those bullets that went hidden was aimed right at them.

Biel-Tan is jingoistic, not actively suicidal. Them attacking us would become Politically radioactive for centuries after this.
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For what it's worth if they found a path this turn they could theoretically hit us during the process of organizing, but yeah it won't let them justify more than a raid and it'll end up looking super bad for them at the moot
 
Mechanis said:
One Flaw to select One Minor Advantage for your designs, to as many Flaws and Advantages as desired, including none. Note that these are still lesser than the main focus equivalents in most cases.
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We should probably talk about this and decide which if any disadvantages and advantages we'll take. Because which ones we take will probably shape how and where we use Conversion fields going forwards. High power draw for example is a disadvantage we can mostly work around if we settle for designing new armor that incorporates the shielding.
Mechanis said:
[ ] Advantage: Pressure Resistance
Your design is particularly resistant to wide-area pressure—blast waves, being buried in sand, grappling a Bloodletter so it can't stab you, and so on.
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This would be VERY nice given our Grav shield's current weaknesses. And would be the one to go for, perhaps alongside Compact, if we want to focus on Conversion shields that combo with our existing defenses. Perhaps pair it with Low threshold or the physical projectile weakness in order to make a shield Ideal for comboing with Grav shielding.

Fast cycle and Rugged together would create a shield that would be able to be up very consistently, no matter how many times it gets knocked down.
 
Candesce said:
Right now does seem to be the best moment to start building up our industry. We should be able to start up one Enhance Industry for an extra Bonesinger AP and one factory, which should probably be for Void Guard Warsuits. Still a bunch left to get to work on the drives, which since we're about to pants Chaos is probably advisable.
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No, getting our Engines online ASAP is Priority One right now, because All of the shit is going to pour on us after we reveal Chaos' Big Game in front of the entire Diaspora. They'll pay big to be able to attack us directly, and if they can't, they'll make damn sure every Ork in the sector is aimed right at us. We need to be mobile so they can't collapse on us in a single blob
 
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Alectai said:
There's playing Fuckfuck Games, and there's immediately turning around to wipe out a Craftworld responsible for the single greatest light of hope the diaspora has experienced since the Fall. That's the kind of shit that nobody forgives you for.
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Especially if we build a strong enough relationship with the Harlequins in general, that we are under their political protection/alliance. Because the Harlequins are probably the one force able to remove Bel-tan's current leadership for something saner and more realistic with minimal loss of Eldari lives, with the sanction of possibly the only god of the Phoenix court to escape the coup of Slaneesh intact.
 
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