Forge of Destiny(Xianxia Quest)
- Thread starter yrsillar
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- Original Fantasy
Maybe. We need to open a good number of meridians in the near-ish future, but I don't think we know exactly what they are. Though I suppose hitting the SCS cap and our first level of the Arm Art would tell us what meridians we need for the next levels?
I disagree to some extent. Its pretty clear IMHO that our first year is heavily subsidized (because seriously, going up a mountain to pick grass for a single day is not worth 5 yellow stones). I suspect that this extends to everything done this year, including medicine and crafting (because otherwise it simply would be nowhere worth the time expenditure). So she should be able to make far more then a second year outer hall disciple doing the same thing.
Really though, both of those matter less then the talisman bonus (which will just keep getting bigger and more important as we go on).
Plus, there are going to be other things that only give bonuses to one/two elements (eg. element specific pills/an element alligned cultivation art/rare high bonus single element training area) that would further benefit someone going all in in a single element.
That is assuming though that the reward for teir 3 in a element is the same as the reward for teir 1, which may not be the case at all.If there is no top threshold but thresholds scale nonlinearly, that still encourages us to diversify. With your example scaling, I'd rather have 5/2/2/1 for a total of 3/2/2/1 bonuses in four elements than having 10 in one element for a total of 4 bonuses. Note that while we haven't seen too many bonuses, most seem to be generic boosts as opposed to ones locked to an element, so getting an extra bonus in one category is almost certainly going to be less valuable than multiple bonuses in other categories.
Sadly, I don't think we have the information to judge at this point one way or another; our own breakthrough didn't really give us enough information to say.
Either way, you are correct in that we don't have nearly enough info.
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[X] Plan Preparing for Learning
I'm not a big fan of the 'Argent art speculation' action—it's not actionable speculation.
Okay, you posit this set of things: now what? Do you comb the mountain for trials for the rest? Do you ask around? What? It seems like Meizhen will say 'okay good guess, makes sense probably, but what do you want me to do about it?' Cause, really, what is she supposed to do about it? Is it 'worthwhile'? Well, it's exactly as worthwhile as you value those arts (and any sect-related esteem for trials?). Ling Qi, do you want the arts? Yes or no? If yes, then it's probably worthwhile. If no, probably not. Maybe asking for 'how to find neat trials' would be useful information, but that's not what the action is.
How much are the speculated Argent arts actually worth to Ling Qi? Mirror is sort of meridian intensive. FVM and SCS same. Argent Whatever, if there is such a thing, will probably follow the pattern of Mirror. So if you collect 'em all, Ling Qi has a stupendous collection of SIX meridian intensive arts, ignoring anything she picks up from the library. (Notably, Preparing wants another meridian intensive art from the archive's second floor.) If she really works on meridians really really hard, she'll probably be able to use them all. And she might be pretty formidable. But how many actions went into finding and then training those arts? Is the gain enough? It's so vague that you can't actually do anything with this speculation. You should ask 'how can I find more trials' instead, because that leads to any potential Argent art but is not useless if Meizhen can't really continue the line of thought.
I'm still voting for Preparing for Learning, though. Even if I'm also not a huge fan of its pills use, I like its strategy more than Getting Armed's.
I'm not a big fan of the 'Argent art speculation' action—it's not actionable speculation.
Okay, you posit this set of things: now what? Do you comb the mountain for trials for the rest? Do you ask around? What? It seems like Meizhen will say 'okay good guess, makes sense probably, but what do you want me to do about it?' Cause, really, what is she supposed to do about it? Is it 'worthwhile'? Well, it's exactly as worthwhile as you value those arts (and any sect-related esteem for trials?). Ling Qi, do you want the arts? Yes or no? If yes, then it's probably worthwhile. If no, probably not. Maybe asking for 'how to find neat trials' would be useful information, but that's not what the action is.
How much are the speculated Argent arts actually worth to Ling Qi? Mirror is sort of meridian intensive. FVM and SCS same. Argent Whatever, if there is such a thing, will probably follow the pattern of Mirror. So if you collect 'em all, Ling Qi has a stupendous collection of SIX meridian intensive arts, ignoring anything she picks up from the library. (Notably, Preparing wants another meridian intensive art from the archive's second floor.) If she really works on meridians really really hard, she'll probably be able to use them all. And she might be pretty formidable. But how many actions went into finding and then training those arts? Is the gain enough? It's so vague that you can't actually do anything with this speculation. You should ask 'how can I find more trials' instead, because that leads to any potential Argent art but is not useless if Meizhen can't really continue the line of thought.
I'm still voting for Preparing for Learning, though. Even if I'm also not a huge fan of its pills use, I like its strategy more than Getting Armed's.
Don't be so sure. Remember, a normal trip up there would probably have us encountering multiple Grade 2 beasts; we just dodged those encounters thanks to spirit-mom scaring everyone. Is a trip that has those sorts of encounters worth 50 red stones? I think so.
Remember, 5 red stones is what we get from killing a single grade 1 beast; so we could have reasonably spent our time hunting and come back with a similarly sized haul.
TheLastOne
Person of impeccable tastes (for destruction)
Eh, it matters two ways.
First, there is no 'right' or 'wrong' here, this is us submitting a quest idea to yrsillar. If he likes the idea we'll get a positive response and hints on how we might pursue it. Maybe we study the Feng Shui of the mountain and find places in balance, maybe we go to town and ask older students about tests that had a silver choice, whatever.
If he doesn't like it, he closes it down and we don't waste thought on it. But we'll never get it if we don't open the door by trying.
Second, why would we want to learn this 'set' if it exists? Three possible reasons. Argent Mirror is awesome and it's Argent so we keep getting free successes from the vent, any other Argent skill will also be awesome and get free successes from the vent. Second, if they exist they'll might act like an equipment set with synergistic bonuses if you have them all. And third, finding all the parts of it might help get us noticed by the Sect.
Basically, it's a quest that makes sense thematically, but since it's us looking at it rather then yrsillar we have to put out feelers to find out if we can pursue it.
@FixerUpper @DarkLight140 what do you say to putting the omake points into either Strength or Stamina? They're both two points from leveling up...
[X] Plan Preparing for Learning
[X] Plan Preparing for Learning
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This is the main reason I am still kind of hoping Suyin in the thief. Suyin stepping up and being active would be at least as good as her bending the knee and admitting she is our minion.
I don't actually have a problem with this, but keep in mind how Bai at least sees these two. She thinks we found a couple of useful lesser cultivators and are helping them grow so they can be our subordinates. I highly doubt that Han Jian and his group will see them as anything other than that. I don't actually have a problem with rolling up to the hunt with a couple of 'subordinates', but I am not sure if that is the message you wanted to go for.
TheLastOne
Person of impeccable tastes (for destruction)
Han Jian has several subordinates, and they're generally stronger then Suyin or Su Ling. I suspect it would go fine. We're going to be entering the nobility, it's expected we have followers.
I feel that its important to note that this entire mountain is a controlled environment.
I'm pretty sure this entire area is covered in formations. If they wanted to they could have had a mortal walk up there and pick the grass safely.
All those spirit beasts up here? All the trials? The sect puts them here to test us and give us ways to earn money.
Yes, the mission itself was fairly dangerous. But it was a controlled dangerous. We picked the more dangerous path, and even then there were no hostile 3rd grade beasts. I don't imagine that this was a coincidence.
Now, we certainly could have spent the time hunting and killing ~10 first grade beasts in a day doesn't seem unreasonable. But the mere fact that we can find and kill that many spirit beasts in a day (without risk of running into any hostile 3rd grade beasts or real dangers) speaks of an extremely rich environment, one that we won't presumably won't have next year.
Codex
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We also have to consider how Suyin and Su Ling might feel about that. Suyin might agree to be our vassal, but I doubt Su Ling would. Especially when she literally told us she couldn't trust us after realising we went shopping instead of coming to help them. She doesn't hate us, but there's no way she trusts us.
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Yeahhhh...
She respects us and there's nothing stating she dislikes us because we went shopping.
In the chapter we say we wanted any advantage we could get and she agrees.
She's still not on friend level but you don't necessarily have to be friends with all of your vassals.
Still we are trying to get close to her, earning her trust however will take longer.
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I never said she disliked us. I said she doesn't trust us. She says "you can't rely on others in the end", that implies to me she doesn't trust us enough to become our vassal. Considering her personality, I doubt she would even want to be one.
Considering the thread's current outlook on Social, it'll take much more than we're willing to give if we want her to trust us by the time the Inner Sect tournament comes around.
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TheLastOne
Person of impeccable tastes (for destruction)
And we're probably not going to ask for vassalage any time soon from anyone. But if we keep giving her opportunities and asking small favors, at some point she will effectively work for us. That's how it works in ad hoc systems.
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It's called a partnership. Not everybody you work with works for you.
TheLastOne
Person of impeccable tastes (for destruction)
If we're pushing techniques her way, helping her train with better teachers, and otherwise not treating her as a partner, people won't see it that way. Like, up till now we were Meizhen's Project. We weren't her partner, nor her equal. We still aren't her peer.
But our relationship with her is much more even then it is with Suyin or Su Ling in character. We've offered her opportunities, she's offered us opportunities, she's done favors for us, we bowed out for her so she took take a good prize. All very mutual, and coming from both directions. We don't have that kind of relationship with Su Ling.
Meizhen we introduce to our friend and have a social girls night out. Su Ling we introduce to our training partners and help her improve herself (because her being stronger helps us).
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Except, why would Su Ling care what people think? Just because people think she's our vassal, if SHE doesn't think she works for us, then she doesn't. If Su Ling feels compelled to give stuff to us as payback for what we've given us, then that'd be cool. If not, then she chose to interpret our gifts as just that: Gifts that don't have to be paid back. I don't understand in what way Su Ling works for us or would work for us any time soon. Maybe if we keep pushing and get closer, but at this point it just seems like a seriously far off idea.
Su Ling doesn't feel the same way Ling Qi and Li Suyin feel. Despite giving her a pretty good talisman she never felt like she had to pay us back. That's because Su Ling doesn't dwell on things like that. When we gave her Argent Mirror and asked her how to make a Kiln and how to harvest beast cores, she was satisfied as if she had paid us back. But no matter how you look at it that's a really disproportionate trade.
I'm saying, Su Ling would be a hard to acquire subordinate, and at this point I highly doubt she thinks she's our subordinate. Like, we're not Meizhen's subordinate, despite the fact that people see it that way, we're in an uneven relationship, and our relationship is pretty similar to us/Su Ling.
If we apply your argument to our relationship with Meizhen, then it would be pretty easy for Meizhen to make us her vassal.
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TheLastOne
Person of impeccable tastes (for destruction)
Yes she could? Like, she could have done it casually, and we could do nothing but go along with it.
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Actually, it would be left to a vote. If people voted not to become her subordinate, we wouldn't become her vassal.
However, considering the thread's viewpoint on Meizhen. I doubt many would argue against it.
TheLastOne
Person of impeccable tastes (for destruction)
Sure, and bucking that would have left us with no options, with a poisoned well, and no home.
The only reason we left her shadow is because we broke through both physical and spiritual, and because Meizhen gave us a nod of respect at the meeting of Yellows to show we stood there on our own. Without both of those things, nothing we could have done would have had people treating us as an individual rather then Meizhen's Maid.
Our votes wouldn't have changed other peoples expectations, which are a lot more important when talking about social standing then our own expectations.
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It won't ruin our relationship with Meizhen? If Meizhen asked us right now if we wanted to become her vassal, and we said no, she would have said "Yeah ok" and forget about it. Meizhen wouldn't sacrifice her only good friendship (aside from Cui) just because we told her no.
TheLastOne
Person of impeccable tastes (for destruction)
Sure. That's a completely different point. But she wouldn't have had to ask us if she didn't want, she simply didn't need to push the idea that we were independent and we would stay in her orbit because everyone would see us as part of her faction and treat us as such. We wouldn't get invited to speak to Lady Cai, because without her pointing it out people would have thought she spoke for us.
Hell, we already have enemies for that reason, people who are after us because we're 'Meizhen' faction.
