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NorseQuest (A Norse Xianxia)

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So just in case I'm mistaken to be clear when we trigger TSS we get (currently) two actions which cannot be contested in any way

so we can burn an aspect and use two Spark bombs dealing about 32 damage total without the enemy having any chance to avoid it and more if we use a folded spark bomb in a fast or use Odr.

And we can do this all at will without the charge time of FTB

Is that an accurate description of Time Stands Still?
 
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alexthealright said:
So just in case I'm mistaken to be clear when we trigger TSS we get (currently) two actions which cannot be contested in any way

so we can burn an aspect and use two Spark bombs dealing about 28 damage total without the enemy having any chance to avoid it and more if we use a folded spark bomb in a fast or use Odr.

And we can do this all at will without the charge time of FTB

Is that an accurate description of Time Stands Still?
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It pauses for a period of time and Folded stuff still takes time, as do things from Fasts, so that stuff is still limited...the first two would go off, but they'd be able to do things about the third and later folds. But you could do a 2Fold attack from a Fast and then a normal one or something like that. Other than that, this seems correct, though. It does cost an Aspect and thus literally around 300 Orthstirr...it better be good.

And a bit of a side note, but at the moment, Sparkbombs are actually 16 damage each, for the record.
 
[X] (Boy) Sigulfr
[X] (Girl) Ulfrun
Though I also like the idea of naming a kid after Asveigs, and with 3 kids remaining there is a chance we don't have another girl. But the thematic pair is probably unique... torn on this, might remove approval vote for Asveig.
[X] (Girl) Asveig

Blademaster said:
Now I really wanna add this to the plan

Especially since Solrun is kinda his... aunt? Stepmom? She is the mother of his murdered half brothers. And the lover of his father
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Issue: society is stupid about men learning/using Seid.
Steinarr is in the "you could mock me for learning Seid, but then I'd have to break all your bones..." tier, but we'd have to have a good reason to ask him/suggest it. 'for the memes!' wouldn't be enough for me to support it.

Maybe we could suggest he learns the basics of defenses to take Asveigs mantle to make sure his youngest is safe (until he can get help from a real Seeress). If his thrall can't do it. Since he isn't gonna find a new wife.

Skippy said:
On the one hand, these are good names, but on the other hand, there is something to be said for simplicity. Also people have already voted for the previous version, which makes it awkward. So I guess I appreciate you taking the time, and these are really cool, but not sure I can switch my vote at this time unless there's a big swing of support for these, if that makes sense?
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If you like them you can approval vote them without issue for the ones who voted for your version.
If not not an issue either.
Mystic Pentagram said:
This could be possible names for the next children, we still have three possible children.
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True, though they are made for these kids, twins with a wolf theme connection them. So they (could) get names sharing a wolf reference.

The new kids will probably have new things
Constenanto said:
This is sort of like, my main reservation with playing Sigurdr? Well, not travelling - thats what I want to do. More so that we don't have to be Sigurdr to actually do any of this, (although Wanderlust would certainly help and also serves as a reason all by itself to actually go travelling) and he doesn't really interest me as a protagonist beyond that. The twins seem cooler on paper, but again, they haven't even formed a personality yet, so I don't want to make any choices yet.

Also, uh, this isn't actually directed at you Skippy, I just wanted to use your post as an example of
why I'm torn between the two. So sorry for quoting you.
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If one wants the travel and an excuse to start: The twins could join Sigurd in his travels ocasionally.
 
DeadmanwalkingXI said:
It pauses for a period of time and Folded stuff still takes time, as do things from Fasts, so that stuff is still limited...the first two would go off, but they'd be able to do things about the third and later folds. But you could do a 2Fold attack from a Fast and then a normal one or something like that. Other than that, this seems correct, though. It does cost an Aspect and thus literally around 300 Orthstirr...it better be good.
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its a fight ending technique. lots of things wouldn't survive 32 damage. and even those that do would be heavily damaged unless they have absurd DR/endurance and then it doesn't matter.

the exciting thing is that you can activate that fight-ending technique relatively quickly, even if not nearly without cost.
we can also gain more actions if we master it. and we really should IMO
Toboe said:
Issue: society is stupid about men learning/using Seid.
Steinarr is in the "you could mock me for learning Seid, but then I'd have to break all your bones..." tier, but we'd have to have a good reason to ask him/suggest it. 'for the memes!' wouldn't be enough for me to support it.

Maybe we could suggest he learns the basics of defenses to take Asveigs mantle to make sure his youngest is safe (until he can get help from a real Seeress). If his thrall can't do it. Since he isn't gonna find a new wife.
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I was mostly joking you know. though the second reason might be good. Steinnar does want to protect his family a lot and those incidents spiritual hazards got past him weight heavily on him. we can also just frame this as a simple meeting in the beginning, he probably already know Solrun thinking about it
 
Blademaster said:
its a fight ending technique. lots of things wouldn't survive 32 damage. and even those that do would be heavily damaged unless they have absurd DR/endurance and then it doesn't matter.
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Absolutely. Even decently high DR is gonna feel it if we unleash that on them. I'm not saying it's not great, just clarifying details as I understand them.

Blademaster said:
the exciting thing is that you can activate that fight-ending technique relatively quickly, even if not nearly without cost.
we can also gain more actions if we master it. and we really should IMO
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Oh, it's definitely on the list of things to raise going forward. I dunno if it's worth delaying Perfecting Slowing Slog or hitting Hugr 10 for (I'm thinking not), but we're putting 1d into it every turn at the very least.
 
The real thing to pair with Time Stands Still would be something with extreme attack strength but would be difficult to use otherwise. Threadcutter's a good example, and Stoking Engage as well might work if the speed acceleration involved lets us get a full chain done before following into Threadcutter.
 
DeadmanwalkingXI said:
It pauses for a period of time and Folded stuff still takes time, as do things from Fasts, so that stuff is still limited...the first two would go off, but they'd be able to do things about the third and later folds. But you could do a 2Fold attack from a Fast and then a normal one or something like that. Other than that, this seems correct, though. It does cost an Aspect and thus literally around 300 Orthstirr...it better be good.

And a bit of a side note, but at the moment, Sparkbombs are actually 16 damage each, for the record.
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Dropping Folded techniques in a Time Stands Still is really cool since it makes the number of attacks we can deliver progress like triangle numbers. Currently we can hit someone with three Folded attacks within the stopped time, at Mastered we'd be able to drop six, and at Perfect, ten Folded attacks.
 
Skippy said:
Dropping Folded techniques in a Time Stands Still is really cool since it makes the number of attacks we can deliver progress like triangle numbers. Currently we can hit someone with three Folded attacks within the stopped time, at Mastered we'd be able to drop six, and at Perfect, ten Folded attacks.
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This only works in combination with Fasts. But yes, it's super cool.
 
DeadmanwalkingXI said:
This only works in combination with Fasts. But yes, it's super cool.
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Would you mind reminding me how many Fasts we have currently, and how many we'd need to deliver the full possible number of Attacks at Mastered/Perfected?

Alectai said:
The real thing to pair with Time Stands Still would be something with extreme attack strength but would be difficult to use otherwise. Threadcutter's a good example, and Stoking Engage as well might work if the speed acceleration involved lets us get a full chain done before following into Threadcutter.
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There's been considerable discussion on the Discord about how exactly long the constituent attacks of Threadcutter take relative to one "action"; we're waiting to hear back from IF. FWIW, I think they are probably compressed in time going by the description when we were first experimenting with the move, but maybe do take longer than a single action slot, by some vague amount determined by narrative rules.
 
[X] Stigmar, who is off by himself after a rather sour discussion with a woman
[X] Asva, who clearly wants to talk to you
[X] Lidrun, who hasn't stopped staring at you since she arrived
[X] (Girl) Asveig
[X] (Boy) Sigulfr
 
Skippy said:
Would you mind reminding me how many Fasts we have currently, and how many we'd need to deliver the full possible number of Attacks at Mastered/Perfected?
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We currently have three, which would be enough for even Perfected if we specced them all for that (one 4Fold+, one 3Fold+, one 2Fold+), which we probably don't want to (we do have other uses for those). On the other hand, two of them, one 3Fold+, one 2Fold+, which would be what was needed for Mastered is much more easily doable.

I'm not sure rushing Perfected on this is our best tactic, either, and getting a fourth Fast slot to play around with is very doable long term as our shapeshift slots expand. We definitely want to hit Mastered, but I think we might be overinvesting in dueling tactics by aiming for Perfected in the near future. This is definitely a duel-winner more than an army killer.
 
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DeadmanwalkingXI said:
We currently have three, which would be enough for even Perfected if we specced them all for that (one 4Fold+, one 3Fold+, one 2Fold+), which we probably don't want to (we do have other uses for those). On the other hand, two of them, one 3Fold+, one 2Fold+, which would be what was needed for Mastered is much more easily doable.

I'm not sure rushing Perfected on this is our best tactic, either, and getting a fourth Fast slot to play around with is very doable long term as our shapeshift slots expand. We definitely want to hit Mastered, but I think we might be overinvesting in dueling tactics by aiming for Perfected in the near future. This is definitely a duel-winner more than an army killer.
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I mean... if we had some decent AOE attacks for hitting multiple human opponents, which right now I'm not sure we do, then ten of them isn't anything to sniff at, either. Enough to kill a group of people. Also I think even in mass engagements, quite often we'll be tasked with duelling the enemy heavy hitters, rather than fighting multiple foes at once. The fact that we now have Against the Odds helps as well.

But fundamentally I think the nature of a Xianxia setting means our most proximate threats are other strong fighters. We shouldn't neglect crowd control, but I think it's subordinate to winning deathmatches with other really strong opponents.

All this being said, I don't think we necessarily want to rush getting Perfected... but I'm not sure we want it to take forever either.
 
Skippy said:
I mean... if we had some decent AOE attacks for hitting multiple human opponents, which right now I'm not sure we do, then ten of them isn't anything to sniff at, either. Enough to kill a group of people. Also I think even in mass engagements, quite often we'll be tasked with duelling the enemy heavy hitters, rather than fighting multiple foes at once. The fact that we now have Against the Odds helps as well.

But fundamentally I think the nature of a Xianxia setting means our most proximate threats are other strong fighters. We shouldn't neglect crowd control, but I think it's subordinate to winning deathmatches with other really strong opponents.

All this being said, I don't think we necessarily want to rush getting Perfected... but I'm not sure we want it to take forever either.
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The thing is, against big groups, we need 'small e' endurance, and the combo of sending all those attacks and burning an Aspect is the opposite of that. Versus small groups...it seems like either they're gonna have a way to survive 10 attacks, or they won't have a way to survive 6. There's a narrow band of efficacy there, IMO, where '6 wasn't enough, but 7-10 was' actually applies.

That's somewhat true of individuals as well, but individuals are a lot more likely to be 'survive 6 attacks unopposed' kinda tough. People who can do that without being immune to the attack entirely in some way aren't common, they're boss material...hence it being a dueling thing.

The only use I see for it in really big mass combat is doing Flamecalling then Unstoppable Inferno both unopposed, which we can already do at the current level, and if an unopposed one of those doesn't work, I'm skeptical more will help.

Blademaster said:
we are quite close to perfecting slowing slog though. once we do, I think we are ought to move some of the dice to it
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We're a bit further from getting Hugr 10. Which I don't think is we want to put off for several turns.
 
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DeadmanwalkingXI said:
The thing is, against big groups, we need 'small e' endurance, and the combo of sending all those attacks and burning an Aspect is the opposite of that. Versus small groups...it seems like either they're gonna have a way to survive 10 attacks, or they won't have a way to survive 6. There's a narrow band of efficacy there, IMO, where '6 wasn't enough, but 7-10 was' actually applies.

That's somewhat true of individuals as well, but individuals are a lot more likely to be 'survive 6 attacks unopposed' kinda tough. People who can do that without being immune to the attack entirely in some way aren't common, they're boss material...hence it being a dueling thing.

The only use I see for it in really big mass combat is doing Flamecalling then Unstoppable Inferno both unopposed, which we can already do at the current level, and if an unopposed one of those doesn't work, I'm skeptical more will help.
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I think it's pretty intuitive that more attacks allows us to do more total damage, and if we have an attack that lets us hit two or three people at once and can spam it a bunch of times without any opposition, that would let us hit a medium size group of foes by ourself. This is true for six attacks as well as ten, there's no magical line that get crossed, ten is just... two thirds extra from what six is. There's scenarios you can construct where that's extremely useful, and some where it isn't, as with anything.

I feel like if we continue to argue about this we're going to get drawn into one of those rabbitholes where we construct big differences out of what are in actuality pretty minor ones. Especially because we actually both want TSS Perfected eventually, we're essentially arguing about one versus three to four dice for some number of turns.
 
Skippy said:
I feel like if we continue to argue about this we're going to get drawn into one of those rabbitholes where we construct big differences out of what are in actuality pretty minor ones. Especially because we actually both want TSS Perfected eventually, we're essentially arguing about one versus three to four dice for some number of turns.
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Yeah, fair. I think we want at least Mastered on all Finales, preferably Perfected though how viable that is strikes me as more variable. We can start arguing once we've hit Mastered or something like that.
 
[X] (Boy) Sigulfr
[X] (Girl) Ulfrun

[X] Lidrun, who hasn't stopped staring at you since she arrived
[X] Asva, who clearly wants to talk to you
[X] Dorri Rattlespear, who arrived with an offer for you
-[X] Deploy Abjorn to go and have a bro moment with Stigmar
 
[X] (Boy) Steinulfr
[X] (Girl) Asveig

[X] Lidrun, who hasn't stopped staring at you since she arrived
[X] Asva, who clearly wants to talk to you
[X] Dorri Rattlespear, who arrived with an offer for you
-[X] Deploy Abjorn to go and have a bro moment with Stigmar
 
A couple of questions for our characters @Imperial Fister

Halla:
1) Does Clearwater, Campfire, Ignition, Forgefire, Firestorm, Gale, Sword, Atgeir, all have a 'shroud' or some equivalent like Standstill, or is Standstill unique (among the Hugareidas you have) in this?
2) Did Puncture seem like it could be alloyed to other things while it was alloyed to Ignition?
3) Can you, if you wanted to for some reason, cast Ignition or other Hugareida as a 'lower' level of 'comprehension', i.e like at Ignition level 1 instead of your level 6, letting someone with Ignition 3 cancel it out?

Abjorn:
1) Does Leverage have some sort of 'shroud' or similar that you 'use'?

Blackhand:
1) Do you know if a Knight's Rebuke qualifies as a Perfect Defence for purposes of Puncture?
2) Have you ever tried infusing Odr into your Muna or your understanding of a Hugareida?
 
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Skippy said:
You never know, if he's a cultivation whizz, he might work it out on his own? We'd need to come up with some sort of rules or guidelines for how much meta-knowledge is okay to use, honestly.

Like correct me if I'm wrong, but the thread actually worked out on its own (without realising) how to unlock Odr cultivation for Halla, right? I guess we could rationalise that as having been part of Blackhand's implicit procedural memories surfacing, but still. It's clearly possible to work it out independently, I think the issue is more if we could do it in a way that feels earned and like we aren't just exploiting our meta-knowledge.
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DeadmanwalkingXI said:
The thread did, yeah. However, we figured out the version with, like, a 10% survival rate and only survived it via Blackhand's intervention. So Sigurdr finding that method pre-Charred Soul would actually be a bad thing, since he'd likely die. Also, we were hoping to have him do Disclosure which really doesn't work if he's an Odr cultivator before getting Charred Soul.
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Toboe said:
Without Blackhand there we would have died by overcultivation.
We didn't know how to close the gate AND were unconscious.
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So I was thinking about this recently, and actually it occurred to me that if Sigurd or one of the other kids discovered Odr Cultivation independently without Charred Soul, they do have a mentor figure who could leap in to the rescue and close their Gate whilst they're unconscious. Namely, Halla herself!

This strengthens the argument that we should work out how to enter souls, in my view, for exactly this reason. It's not beyond the realms of possibility that a loved one figures out Odr cultivation on their own, and being able to do this in a hurry could be the difference between life and death. Of course, for this to be reliable for the kids, we'd also need some sort of way of remotely telling if they've dropped into a spiritual trance and are in danger, but that should be fairly easy? We could make each of the kids pendants which are protective against hostile Seidr and spirits, but also sound an alarm if they're in trouble.

Some might call this helicopter parenting, but IMO Halla loves her kids and would be perfectly willing to do this, and I'm perfectly willing to do it as well.
 
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