Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
On the other hand, running around as a LM, while taking on dangerous enemies is more risky if we don't have access to spells that kill stuff if we need them.
And Mathilde knows how risky battle magic is, if it gets used it's probably because we would be in a bad situation otherwise.
 
If succesful, it would look real good and impress the dragon and their elf.
Not correct at all. That wasn't even a thread decision, that was a Mathilde decision:
You turn your attention back up to the higher Daemon, but to your shock it's not being torn asunder, but instead has wrapped itself around Deathfang's neck and is slowly sinking the claws of one hand into a gap between the hard scales and fending off Asarnil's sword with the other. Then the Daemon shrieks in pain and anger as a Silver Bolt lodges in its back, and that moment of distraction settles it for you: it's time to act.
It was that the Dragon was under imminent threat and the demon was distracted, giving us an opening.
(I personally totally agree) but that's a terrible risk assessment.
Not what we did.
 
You seem to forget Mathilde would be the one who would decide if to use Battle Magic in a fight weighting the risks of risking a BM miscast vs all the other available options she has. Or maybe you aren't and you just don't trust that if Mathilde decided to use BM in a fight it'd be for a frivolous reason and so she shouldn't be trusted with it.
We use the tools we have available to us. If we learn BM, then Mathilde adds BM to her tookit. I would rather her toolkit have more reliable tools, rather than less reliable ones—hence, fog based BM or bust.
 
[X] [NUMBER] Trio
[X] [BEHAVIOUR] Bodyguard

This doesn't seem to be a popular combination, but whatever.

I want more than one and Bodyguard seems the best Behaviour option.
 
We use the tools we have available to us. If we learn BM, then Mathilde adds BM to her tookit. I would rather her toolkit have more reliable tools, rather than less reliable ones—hence, fog based BM or bust.
I'd rather she have unreliable tools instead of no tools.
But when it comes to magic, thread seems to prefer no tools because a slightly crooked hammer might explode or something.
 
This is actually pretty amazing, and while it isn't what Mathilde wanted the spell for would absolutely be worth developing with a single rider.

This is "detect a spell being cast within X kilometers and track the caster" spell. That is incredible. Mathilde, with some of the best windsight among modern mages almost certainly couldn't do that unless it was a very big spell and the entire thing was on open plains.
If we want a magical bloodhound, we probably want to use a different apparition. Red Riders aren't particularly subtle. Whispering Darkness seems like a good fit, being non-corporeal, commonly working on a longer timescale than "I run up and smash now!" and, as a side-benefit, having a taste specifically for Dhar.

I'd be up for grabbing one down the line if we end up taking a post-Waystones job where we're more likely to be regularly doing things where it would help. Any of the "Troubleshooter" variety jobs, for example.
 
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I'd rather she have unreliable tools instead of no tools.
But when it comes to magic, thread seems to prefer no tools because a slightly crooked hammer might explode or something.
We already have many good tools—all of our spells, Branulhune, etc. This is just a question of adding one more tool, and whether we should take care with the quality of that new tool.
 
I think ambush is better than people think. A battle magic spell that hits targets with a cavalry charge out of nowhere sounds like it could get stupidly lethal if used right. It's mainly a matter of what to add to the toolkit and this just seems like the instantaneous damage spell option. Plus, imagine the effect on enemy moral if your leader just suddenly gets skewered by shadowy riders.
If we want a magical bloodhound, we probably want to use a different apparition. Red Riders aren't particularly subtle. Whispering Darkness seems like a good fit, being non-corporeal, commonly working on a longer timescale than "I run up and smash now!" and, as a side-benefit, having a taste specifically for Dhar.
This sounds very handy, but the apparition in question might also be too close to ulgu to control with it, when compared to the rider and the hounds
 
That they live secluded lives in self study the whole time? The way they've been treated as respected people who are sacrificing a lot for the Empire? The entire way everyone treats battle magic? That when it's cast, we have to make a roll above a threshold or miscast?

There's a lot of evidence for this throughout both the quest and the lore.
Here is the thing. This is all evidence for battle magic being dangerous. But no one is argueing against that. The question is: how dangerous? Because the impression i got from your post and anti-BM posts in genersl, is that you consider picking up BM as nothing less then a delayed suicide. And that is what I am questioning.
 
[X] [BEHAVIOUR] Instinctive
[X] [BEHAVIOUR] Charge
[X] [NUMBER] Trio
[X] [NUMBER] Lance
 
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Honest question: can somebody explain the logic behind having cavalry acting as bodyguards to me? The strength of cavalry lies in its mobility and ability to deal charges, not in standing around (or appearing around) to defend a lone individual, so it just seems like a poor use of the available resource to me. I'd be completely down for bodyguard with a humanoid apparition or something, or even a red in a non-cavalry form, but with this form it just doesn't click to me.
 
We already have many good tools—all of our spells, Branulhune, etc. This is just a question of adding one more tool, and whether we should take care with the quality of that new tool.

So basically you don't think there's a situation (or that Mathilde will never be in such a situation to begin with) where Mathilde's safest path of action would be to cast BM and so there's no point to even learning BM because there will always be a better tool in our toolkit for what we want to do?

Cause honestly that is what I am getting from your messages.

If not I don't get your reason against Mathilde having a slightly but very powerful unreliable tool in her toolkit? (Unless you don't trust her judgement in battle of course).
 
"We have taken risks before, and therefore should take every risk available to us" is not an argument that's ever going to convince me of anything.

It's all a measure of risk vs reward. Some risks are worth it, some are not. Non-mist battlemagic is firmly in the 'not' category for me, as clearly Mathilde can consistently function extremely well without it.

If we decide we do need more battlemagic, just inventing our own that we can cast as FC instead will always be worth it.
 
We already have many good tools—all of our spells, Branulhune, etc. This is just a question of adding one more tool, and whether we should take care with the quality of that new tool.
The problem with this analogy is that the Toolbox doesn't have a size limit. Is not like we have to chose some spells over other, that we have to sacrifice realiable option for acess to the more powerfull ones, we can have both.

So think like that, is better to have all the tools and then chosse the best one for the situation, or not have and try to make do ?
 
Honest question: can somebody explain the logic behind having cavalry acting as bodyguards to me? The strength of cavalry lies in its mobility and ability to deal charges, not in standing around (or appearing around) to defend a lone individual, so it just seems like a poor use of the available resource to me. I'd be completely down for bodyguard with a humanoid apparition or something, or even a red in a non-cavalry form, but with this form it just doesn't click to me.

The logic is it is a big beefy killy thing with a sword that cannot be hurt by npn-magical weapons. We are not playing this quest from the perspective of the rider trying to maximise its talents
 
As a sidenote, even if we do manage to standardize this, we might have trouble with other Grey Wizards actually being able to get it. We got our Red Rider extremely easily because we had a Gold Wizard who knew what we were doing and is extremely physically powerful knock it silly. Other Greys won't have those advantages, because we want to keep the whole "this spell needs an Apparition" thing on the down-low. So any Grey Wizard who wants one of these things is going to have to kick its ass(es) by themselves.
 
The vow mostly just impacts the lower ranks and something that involves binding apparitions isn't going to be shared with people who aren't at least trusted magisters.

Mathilde, a trusted Lady Magister with a dedicated income stream from a highly successful trading company and very few expenses because she can wrangle rent-free acommodations she is not responsible for the upkeep of, largely fold her food, laundry, etc. budget into the operating expenses of her current project, and pay for her personal research expenses by having the library she runs get her books for her, has 831 crowns.

To get performance approximating that of the Rider, you're going to need to hire several very good mercenaries, because benefits like "ignores armor" and "can't be hurt by most nonmagical weapons" require either getting someone quite high on the power scale or making up for them with numbers. Now, a whole mercenary regiment is probably overkill, but we have a cost for hiring one for a month, at 10,000 crowns, so we have a starting point for how much this might cost.

Let's start by slashing that by 90%, on the grounds that it is overkill. That's still more money than Mathilde has, and for the quality of mercenary you need to hire to match up to an Apparition's basic statline, that doesn't seem too unreasonable, but let's cut it in half just for the sake of argument. That's... Within her means, strictly speaking, but only for a single month, and it takes more than half her reserves of cash when she is, again, in a very good position relative to most people, even most non-Grey Wizards.

Mercenaries, particularly high-quality trustworthy mercenaries, are not cheap.

Honest question: can somebody explain the logic behind having cavalry acting as bodyguards to me? The strength of cavalry lies in its mobility and ability to deal charges, not in standing around (or appearing around) to defend a lone individual, so it just seems like a poor use of the available resource to me. I'd be completely down for bodyguard with a humanoid apparition or something, or even a red in a non-cavalry form, but with this form it just doesn't click to me.

Unlike mundane cavalry it doesn't die if you stab it with nonmagical weapons and physically can't be unhorsed. That changes the situations you can use it in significantly.
 
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Honest question: can somebody explain the logic behind having cavalry acting as bodyguards to me? The strength of cavalry lies in its mobility and ability to deal charges, not in standing around (or appearing around) to defend a lone individual, so it just seems like a poor use of the available resource to me. I'd be completely down for bodyguard with a humanoid apparition or something, or even a red in a non-cavalry form, but with this form it just doesn't click to me.
I'd also think it has big advantages concerning Mathilde's tendency to get stuck alone behind enemy lines. Next time she winds up failing a stealth roll and finds herself surrounded by orks, with this option, there is the possibility to just pull some hardy, supernatural fighters out of her metaphorical pocket (other options can do so too, but are focused offensively and would not be as useful in a chaotic situation, especially when she is in danger herself)
 
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