"Alliance land"? Excuse me?
So I'll refer back to previous remarks in this thread about the problems of interpreting 30 years of lore which has been through many iterations and a few radical retcons. For example in Rise of the Horde, the Frostwolves are a very small clan of like 40, whereas in game they're all over the place, with hundreds in Alterac for example. As the GM I have to interpret this to form a sensible narrative, so just as it's come up before it'll happen again. I'll try and refer to a central timeline of broadly accepted events though, and I tend to favour sources like Chronicle as that for example is a specific (failed lol) attempt at making a consistent timeline for the story.
For example on sources,
The Stormpikes operate only on the "sovereign imperialistic imperative" by King Magni.
this is pretty biased right? Like clearly Blizzard as noted before aren't great at representing politics well, and therefore went for an unreliable narrator approach? We also have 'The Frostwolves reacted with the most brutal and uncivilized act of aggression the Alliance has experienced.' so I think it's ok to question clearly partisan stuff which has been designed to provide the barely fig leaf of reasoning. At least it's a step up from the usual quest of 'I want X item, go get it for me.'
There's lore stuff that still gets through and we can learn stuff from that, but it's hardly something like, for example, the Witcher, where high politics is the central mover of events.
I don't remember anything about Frostwolves taking part in the First War,
To establish a timeline that combines some elements of old and new lore:
- Orcs invade, destroy stormwind. The Frostwolves take part in the First War, but at some point before the Second War leave. The Frostwolves are seen as reliable enough that Durotan has fairly high office and respect, and we can compare this to some clans which were left behind on Draenor (Laughing Skull for example). Therefore we know they served under Blackhand, and besides that bear some of the collective guilt for the whole Draenei thing.
- The Frostwolves somehow make their way across a whole continent, presumably killing quite a few people on the way. They establish themselves in Alterac Valley, which at that point is presumably unoccupied.
- The Alliance is formed out of human kingdoms, with some representation from other races. At it's base this is a supernational collective security pact, but it does have the ability to levy taxes etc (as seen in the schism over paying for internment camps). I note this because clearly there's some element of super-national juristiction going on here.
- The Second War happens, toward the end of this, Perenolde allies with the Orcs to prevent his kingdom's destruction, and betrays the Alliance in various ways. A Stromgarde intervention force retakes the passes, leading to Doomhammer's defeat. The Horde retreat and are defeated at Blackrock Mountain and the Dark Portal destroyed, leading to the conclusion of the war.
- There may or may not have been some additional Alterac skullduggery.
- In the aftermath, the Alliance establishes the camps system, as well as discussing what to do with various other leftover orc clans who have escaped capture. Again, due to discussions on aid to rebuild Stormwind, I again would assert that the Alliance appears to be more than just a defensive pact, and has more juristiction.
- Orcs start appearing again, not really important but the Alliance invades Draenor. Important point is that random bands of Orcs are still a threat and the Alliance regard them as such, whether more organised (Dark Horde) or less.
- The Alliance debates what to do with Alterac, whether to balkanize it, or to establish a new king, or what.
- Aiden Perenolde maybe dies etc (I've chosen to have the Alliance execute him in this quest), and his son takes over, trying to build his power through the Syndicate, a bandit confederation led by former Alteraci nobles.
- The Frostwolves, who have lived somewherein Alterac since the First War, are still living there. They shelter Orc fugitives such as Thrall and Doomhammer when they come to visit, and are otherwise pretty friendly with other Orcs. I have decided that they also raid humans, like all Orcs tend to on occasion, though I'll acknoledge that this is interpretation rather than backed up by a particular source. The Frostwolves then play a significant part in the destruction of the Camps system, and the stealing of the Alliance's fleet at Southshore, as well as the liberation of fugitive Orcs like Hellscream.
- The Third War and the Scourging of Lordaeron happen. I would argue it's implied (and have therefore represented in this quest) that W3RoC's bandits are part of the Syndicate, and hostile to the Alliance. The Syndicate survive the wars, hold up in Alterac.
- Following the war, at least some Frostwolves return to Alterac, indeed, quite a large number. The Horde maintain several outposts to monitor certain situations, including Hammerfall and the Frostwolves.
- At some point a Dwarven expedition presumably takes advantage of the lack of authority in northern Lordaeron, and sets up shop in Alterac too (though partly this is no doubt because of the needs for two groups being opposed for a BG in WoW.
My point in writing all of this out is to demonstrate that the Alliance has pretty good reason in this quest to be skeptical of the Frostwolves claims to residency. They were part of an invading army, fought their way north through several kingdoms, actively sponsored the alliance's foes, and then took part in war against the alliance. They can have no claim of 'oh we've just been living peacefully all this time chilling with the elements'. The Stormpike don't seem to be there for the land, original it seems to be a somewhat expansionist dwarven effort, potentially also surveying for Titan stuff or minerals, but that's not really relevant. Similarly, whether the Alteraci actually want the alliance there, or acknoledge the Alliance's juristiction over them is also somewhat irrelevnat. The Alteraci are regarded as a criminal state, unworthy of recognition and in active conflict with Alliance forces across various theaters.
Now we might say that maybe some of this unreasonable and the desires of the Alteraci who've been disenfranchised by nobles making decisions for them all the time might be sad abotu this, or object. Similarly, we might argue that the Frostwolves also don't really want to be in perpetual conflict with an invading Dwarves force, and that they perceive Alterac Valley as their land.
However, from the Alliance's perspective, notably from Dathrohan's perspective, the person who's saying all of this to you, that doesn't matter. Dathrohan is interested in expanding the Alliance's juristiction and power as much as he can to fund his war effort. Does the original charter of the Alliance have legitimate authority to arrange the affairs in soverign kingdoms? Dathrohan would argue it does.
I also note that if you were actualyl talking to any of these parties, obviously they would present different views, but you haven't yet, so I feel the need to note these various points.
