Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
There is always something in the Forest of Shadows the same way there is water in the ocean that does not mean it deserves any particular attention and Paranoth does not know what it is. My guess is he is simply going over the stuff he has to do, choosing the least inportant thing on his itinerary which could be fobbed off to a Grey Wizard and replacing that with a spot of politicking.
If you could get a grey wizard to do your work for you, one with a public and known track record for spectacular successes at long odds, why would you give them the least important task possible instead of something valuable?
 
If you could get a grey wizard to do your work for you, one with a public and known track record for spectacular successes at long odds, why would you give them the least important task possible?

Because you trust yourself more than you do someone you only know by reputation from another college. I mean look at it this way, if our positions were reversed, what would we choose to delegate towards and up and coming Jade Magister?
 
Do you agree to investigate Gryphon's Wood in exchange for the Jade Order joining the Project?

[ ] Yes
[ ] No

I want to vote yes to this—I'm curious about what's happening up there, and it lets us naturally interact with the Ice Witches and maybe earn some favour with them that we can then use to recruit them.

I'm torn between Grunfeld and Culloch, however. One has the practical ritual knowledge we need, but the other has the theoretical lore we need. I'm leaning towards Culloch myself.

For socials, I want to do Egrimm, Elrisse, Panoramia, Gretel, and Cython. Elrisse is a complete unknown, I like Pan and Gretel, and Cython is always fun, especially with the new divine lore we now have.

Edit:
"The part of the Forest of Shadows in northern Ostermark. There's trouble brewing there, but whatever it is keeps hopping across the Upper Talabec into Kislev. And the Jades don't have much reach in Ostermark, never have, even before Teclis. But you of the Grey might be able to find friends there. Plus you got along with the Ice Witches. Uncover what's to blame for the goings-on there, and I'll send one of ours to the table."

Aren't their Hedgewise in the Forest of Shadows? If we play this right, we could end up using this to get on the goodside of both the Ice Witches and the Hedgewise. I think Pannoth is suggesting that with his whole "Grey's can find friends there that we can't" thing.

I think we should do it. The chance to recruit—or at least build favour with—three groups at once shouldn't be sniffed at.
 
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Because you trust yourself more than you do someone you only know by reputation from another college. I mean look at it this way, if our positions were reversed, what would we choose to delegate towards and up and coming Jade Magister?
If we are stuck in AP hell like just about everyone in this world with a any sense of responsibility is. Then yes totally.
 
Because you trust yourself more than you do someone you only know by reputation from another college. I mean look at it this way, if our positions were reversed, what would we choose to delegate towards and up and coming Jade Magister?
Something important that we lack the time and/or necessary skillset to do ourselves. Also, bear in mind that Mathilde's not just a magister, she's a Lady Magister; that's not a title that gets handed out to incompetents and layabouts. I'd trust a random LM with a lot more than I would a random Magister.

I'm not saying that I think Paranoth is giving us his highest priority, most critical task, to be clear. Just that I find the idea that it'll be a junk assignment unrealistic. The Empire has a sharply limited number of magic users and an even more sharply limited number of LMs; the opportunity for one of the latter to do a job for you isn't something you squander.
 
Honestly, if the Magister Patriarch of the Jade is nearly certain his Order knows nothing interesting about the subject, I'm inclined to believe him.
I believe the Jade Order's traditions will prove more important than he thinks, thanks to the Waystone knowledge we've accumulated from so many other traditions.
Look at it this way. With traditions from varied sources, we can compare, contrast between them all and thus get a much better idea of what is a fact and what is only a belief.
We can contextualize the Jade Order's beliefs - Paranoth cannot.

In other news, man, I love Paranoth. It's like meeting Gandalf all over again. Thank you Boney, your characters are an endless delight.
 
Something important that we lack the time and/or necessary skillset to do ourselves. Also, bear in mind that Mathilde's not just a magister, she's a Lady Magister; that's not a title that gets handed out to incompetents and layabouts. I'd trust a random LM with a lot more than I would a random Magister.

I'm not saying that I think Paranoth is giving us his highest priority, most critical task, to be clear. Just that I find the idea that it'll be a junk assignment unrealistic. The Empire has a sharply limited number of magic users and an even more sharply limited number of LMs; having the opportunity for one of the latter to do a job for you isn't something you squander.

The reason I said magister is because it is one tier down from us, as we are a tier down from Paranoth as Patriarch.
 
The reason I said magister is because it is one tier down from us, as we are a tier down from Paranoth as Patriarch.
That doesn't change the fundamental fact that Mathilde is a LM, and as such has a significantly higher level of base trust than a Magister. And that is what matters here, as the question is not 'what would someone trust a random Magister to do' but 'what would someone trust a random LM to do'. And the answer is: a lot. LM is the rank where you can pretty much just throw the person at any job that doesn't require a true specialist, and expect a decent result.
 
Aren't their Hedgewise in the Forest of Shadows? If we play this right, we could end up using this to get on the goodside of both the Ice Witches and the Hedgewise. I think Pannoth is suggesting that with his whole "Grey's can find friends there that we can't" thing.
There are indeed Ostlander Hedgefolk, but well...
The Ostland Hedgefolk were almost entirely wiped out in a skirmish with a necromancer in the Forest of Shadows, and the few survivors refused (and, as far as you know, still refuse) any assistance in restoring their numbers as the 'foreign' Hedgefolk were not dedicated to their patron Goddess Halétha, which all but guarantees that the Hedgefolk will go extinct in Ostland within a generation or two.
That is what happened to them. Thankfully there's also this:
The Nordlanders are Haléthans and as such are largely concentrated east of the Salz to watch over the Forest of Shadows, so they don't really have any bad blood with the Elves."
The Nordlander Hedgefolk are focused on Nordland's section of the Forest of Shadows, so they're pretty far from Ostermark. They would likely still appreciate it.

The Hedgefolk that we would most likely satisfy would be the Ostermarkers, which ironically enough is where Kurtis Krammovitch is from. Also thankfully, Mathilde is a woman. The Ostermarkers share the Hag Witches disdain for male mages and tend to have a matriarchical structure. You might wonder how Kurtis was a prodigy despite that, the reason is likely that they don't really forbid it so much as look askance at it.
 
That doesn't change the fundamental fact that Mathilde is a LM, and as such has a significantly higher level of base trust than a Magister. And that is what matters here, as the question is not 'what would someone trust a random Magister to do' but 'what would someone trust a random LM to do'. And the answer is: a lot. LM is the rank where you can pretty much just throw the person at any job that doesn't require a true specialist, and expect a decent result.

And the tasks of a Magister Patriarch are judged (by themselves) to be so important as to deserve the eye of someone who has only 6 peers across the whole of the Empire. That is why i think that of those tasks we would be handed the one he considers least important.
 
It could be Melkhior/Zacharias, since Melkhior's Tower is in the Forest of Shadows. It could be Urzen the Unrelenting, a Strigoi Vampire Lord with a grudge against the Lahmians who lives in the Forest of Shadows. It could be Ragush of the Bloody Horn, a vicious Doombull who lives in the Forest of Shadows. It could be the Doomlord Dieter Helsnicht, coming back from the dead as Necromancers are sometimes known to do. It might be the Blood Fane in the Forest of Shadows acting up. It might be Taurox the Brass Bull, Malagor the Dark Omen, Moonshadow the Lunatic Prince. It might be some completely original character. It could be Vampires, Necromancers, Beastmen, Chaos, Dark Elf infiltrators, Skaven etc. the possibilities are endless.
How is the forest still standing, with so many powerful and violent people in it?:V
 
How is the forest still standing, with so many powerful and violent people in it?:V
They usually mind their own business and only wreak havoc occasionally. Like, let's take Melkhior and Zacharias. They spend most of their time experimenting and furthering their understanding of magic, so they tend to lay low for the most part. Urzen is building an army so he can storm the Silver Pinnacle and destroy Neferata and the Lahmian Sisterhood. Ragush is there, but he doesn't tear everything apart all the time, since even Beastmen have limited numbers and tend to wax and wane, and know better than to attract too much attention. Dieter is presumed dead, but his body was never found, so if he's still "alive" then it's to his benefit that he lays low. The Blood Fane is a sacred spot, but the people guarding it don't go marauding and keep the location secret. They don't want it disturbed, although it's likely to activate with a Chaos Invasion.

There's a lot of that kind of stuff, and the people who live near those forests know better than to venture too deep. It's a very scary place, and it drives many Ostlanders to alcoholism to cope.
 
And the tasks of a Magister Patriarch are judged (by themselves) to be so important as to deserve the eye of someone who has only 6 peers across the whole of the Empire. That is why i think that of those tasks we would be handed the one he considers least important.
If you're judging things off that metric, then 'least important' for a Magister M/Patriach is still extremely important by Magister or LM standards. He's not going to hand us his most critical job, sure, but it's not going to be junk or worthless.
 
The reason I said magister is because it is one tier down from us, as we are a tier down from Paranoth as Patriarch.
The differences in ability between Patriarchs and lord Magisters seems much less clean cut then between Magisters and lord Magisters. Just about every Magister wants to be a lord Magister or at least would not turn it down. Plenty of lord Magister don't want to become Patriarchs or could become one if they actually wanted to.
 
If we are going to recruit the Jade Order, and it seems like we might not, which representative are we going for?

Two of the options I just don't like:
[ ] Lady Magister Arburg
Doesn't seem like se has much relevant expertise to actually studying the Waystones, the explanation is all about how she might be useful from a PR standpoint.
[ ] Magister Cyrston von Danling
Doesn't seem like he has any specific expertise, the explanation is all about how we get along with him and he's generally capable.

The other two options seem better:
[ ] Magister Tochter Grunfeld
If there is anything in the Druidic rites that we want she might be a good choice. But note that she is an expert on rites that descended from those original traditions, and who knows how many 'uncorrupted' Druidic rites she is aware of.
[ ] Perpetual Apprentice Culloch
From Panaroth's explanation it seems that if there is anything at all to be gained from the Jades it is the original traditions of the Cult of the Mother, not the modern Teclis inspired practices. Someone with knowledge of the history of the Cult might be our only chance to uncover original Cult traidtions, where most other Jades only know the traiditions that supplanted them.

So for me it's Magister Tochter or Perpetual Culloch, and I actually lean towards Culloch, though I might just approval vote both.

@Boney, if we do vote to investigate Gryphon's Wood, are we obligated do it next turn? Also, will there be an option to bring Johann with us?
 
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Maybe instead of giving us his least important job, he's giving us a job suited for our skills and connections. He's almost certainly hinting at befriending the Hedgewise with his "Grey's can find friends we can not" thing, and he outright said we already have friends in the region with the I e witches—who are both factions we want to recruit.

He's giving the job to us because there is no one in his order who can do it.
 
Hey, I know everyone is talking about the vote right now but I had a crazy idea that I wanted to interject with. I was thinking about the mystery of Ranald's daughters. Well there is a rather famous duo of maybe gods, definitely at least semi-devine, sisters. We were just maybe looking at the wrong realms. What about the sisters of twilight. Two sisters, none know their origin they just seemed to show up, they have somewhat opposing personalities but stick together no matter what. The painting had one daughter be mostly Shallya with a bit of Ranald(Naestra, the sister who is reserved who reigns in her sister) and the other be mostly Ranald with a hint Shallya(Arahan, the sister who is wild that draws her sister into action). They protect Athel Loren(Ranald) and they heal completely as long as one survives(Shallya). How to test this idea is tricky indeed. Let me know if someone already guessed this but I didn't see many mentions of the sisters in nearly the entire thread so I don't believe so.
As the self appointed Head of Ranald Daugther Research I can confidently tell you that no, no one came up with this so far. I'll add it to my theory post later on. If will be super helpful if you could try and summarize the points for and against the theory, I'll try and do it myself but I know literally nothing about this piece of lore and I'm sure you can do a better job.
 
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Moratorium is over.

[X] Egrimm, to celebrate his imminent promotion and gauge his reaction to it.
[X] Belegar, to discuss who has been made Loremaster after you.
[X] Panoramia, to talk about how well her project in the Eastern Valley seems to be going.
[X] Roswita, to get a sense for who will control Sylvania after you turned down the position.
[X] Stirland, to see for yourself how the war against Sylvania is progressing.
 
[X] Yes
[X] Magister Tochter Grunfeld

I think she probably knows more than she lets on, or at least has some connection to the druids. Perhaps she only has what is advertised, her knowledge for context isn't useless, but maybe not worth an ap.

[X] Egrimm, to celebrate his imminent promotion and gauge his reaction to it.
[X] Elrisse, to get to know the most recent contributor to the Project.
[X] Panoramia, to talk about how well her project in the Eastern Valley seems to be going.
[X] Pay a visit to your fief, to see if anything has changed. It probably hasn't.
 
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[X] Egrimm, to celebrate his imminent promotion and gauge his reaction to it.
[X] Elrisse, to get to know the most recent contributor to the Project.
[X] Cython, to talk obliquely of what it means for a God to have offspring.
[X] Kasmir, to see how partnership with Sylvania's native faith has been going.
[X] Julia, to see what she has gotten up to as Stirland's most experienced spy master.
 
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