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Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

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Friggin what the heck is going on? Out of 131 voters, the leading [Rune] vote is a paltry 43 and it's a generic "25 favor weapon." Like, not even a greatsword! Of all the things, why would not-a-greatsword ever be in the leading vote?!?

Feel free to tell me why I'm wrong and my face is ugly, but I'm not waiting to finish reading 20 pages to put down a vote.

[X] [RUNE] Ranger's Greatsword 15 Favor
[X] [RUNE] Ranger's Greatsword 25 Favor
[X] [RUNE] Greatsword
 
[X] [SPIDER] The We can be a powerful military ally against the greenskins.
[X] [SPIDER] The We can be a powerful military ally against the Skaven.
[X] [SPIDER] The We can be a welcome addition to the multispecies community of Karak Eight Peaks.

[X] [UNDUMGI] Francesco Caravello, Tilean ex-merchant

[X] [ARMOUR] It should be reforged into a worthy commemoration of the Karak's rebirth.

[X] [LIBRARY] Imperial Texts: Extensive/Esoteric Skaven, Extensive Skaven Magic, Extensive Greenskin Magic, Antiquarian Grey Magic (2 College Favor), Extensive Amber Magic, Extensive/Esoteric Romance Novels, Extensive/Esoteric Linguistics, Extensive Warpstone, Extensive Morr, Extensive Karaz Ankor. Dwarf Texts: Extensive Greenskin Magic, Extensive Skaven Magic, Extensive Romance Novels, Extensive Linguistics, Extensive Daemons. Brettonian Texts: Extensive Romance Novels. Tilean Texts: Extensive Romance Novels.
 
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Actually, an item of Talk with Beasts could be tremendously useful for a spy/infiltrator anyway. Imagine the value of interrogating the rats, conventional or giant, in a skaven warren.
 
Zysek said:
[X] [ENCHANTMENT] An item enchanted with Talk With Beast to give to the spiders (3 favors)

I think this is needed for any SPIDERS option beyond just letting them go, unless we get Amber wizards to permanently reside in K8P (and I would like an enchatment like this even then).
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That'll be a thing we deal with next turn... Also, somewhere or other QM has stated (I think a few times now) that we can literally teach them to write. Which would easily solve the communication problem without requiring an item.
 
jjffjhjf said:
second toughest material in the setting from what I understand, beaten out by Glimril, the stuff the White Dwarf has in his armor... also, maybe whatever Ghal Maraz is made out of??? Both I think beat out Gromril for toughness/strength. Then the weapons of the ancestor Gods of the Dwarfs are likely also made out of something at least better than normal Gromril.
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I think Glimril is supposed to be Gromril in another form, there's supposed to be different levels that Gromril can be refined to and IIRC the dwarves only have knowledge of how to refine to the first level any more.
 
[X] [SPIDER] The We can be a powerful military ally against the Skaven.
[X] [UNDUMGI] Oswald Oswaldson, Imperial veteran
[X] [ARMOUR] It should be returned to the Hold it was stolen from, to build strong ties among the Karaz Ankor.

My reasoning over the Spiders is as such. Skaven are natural prey to the Spiders, the only problem lay in the Skaven organizing themselves to purge their nest. We can mitigate this threat by providing a safe refuge for the Spiders, guarded by Dwarven fortifications, from which they can launch raids in the Skaven's own dens. Orcs can be a bit too hard of a target for them, and Skaven are more easily terrified by Spiders--more terrified than humans would be, and that's saying something considering we're talking about giant man-eating spiders.

Now, as amusing as the mental image is, jumping into integrating the Spiders with the Dwarves would be a very bad idea at this point in time, in my opinion. They are still carnivores. They require Amber wizards to be on hand to translate for them. If there is ever a food shortage, they will look for it, and Dwarves will be the ones to suffer for it. It is far too soon to be pushing for that kind of interaction with just this kind of preliminary data. If we give them some time to adjust to this, we can see how their relationship develops, preferably into a symbiotic one. Iron out the kinks as they come rather than making a risky judgement call right now.

Undumgi? They're all solid choices, but I like the cut of Oswaldson's jib. He seems to be a reliable choice. No real reason than that.

My armor choice is simple. The Karaz Ankor are not our enemies. They're not our friends, either, sure, but I don't much fancy a future in which there are Grudges between the holds Old and New. Belegar threw down the gauntlet to Thorgrim, and Thorgrim's response was to tell Belegar to put his gold where his mouth is and prove his way was better. Peaceable relations require someone to make the first step; might as well be us, bearing a gift of goodwill snatched from the clutches of the filthy Thaggoraki.

Also, holy fuck, this thread moves way too fast! And it's all because BoneyM is such a damn good and prolific QM! I love it!
 
Derpmind said:
Friggin what the heck is going on? Out of 131 voters, the leading [Rune] vote is a paltry 43 and it's a generic "25 favor weapon." Like, not even a greatsword! Of all the things, why would not-a-greatsword ever be in the leading vote?!?
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It says "sword", not "weapon". That's why it's the leading vote, it's the simplest, most basic way to word it, much like "talisman, protection".

Least we describe it, the better it is.
 
LeafBug said:
I don't see why the idea is so grotesque to you if we intend to use that sword for the good of the Karak and dwafkind as a whole. Like yeah it's not totally selfless, but we're not exactly taking advantage of some inexperienced beardlings here. The dwarves are smart enough to know what they're getting into if they go along with our suggestion of using it as a commemoration.
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It feels disingenuous to me.
 
Derpmind said:
Friggin what the heck is going on? Out of 131 voters, the leading [Rune] vote is a paltry 43 and it's a generic "25 favor weapon." Like, not even a greatsword! Of all the things, why would not-a-greatsword ever be in the leading vote?!?
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Because Kragg knows her, and knows what kind of sword to make for Mathilde, and maximum freedom is apparently best. He also knows Mathilde's fighting style and history on the campaign. Also, it's not a generic 25 favour weapon. It's a 25 favour sword. That's quite different.

Also, any sword we get will be mechanically one handed, even though it'll be fluffed as a bastard sword and her skill will be applicable.
 
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Zysek said:
[X] [SPIDER] The We can be a powerful military ally against the Skaven.

Another way to disrupt the Skaven and prevent them from focusing on us is very useful, and this option is surely going to be more palatable to the other inhabitants of the Karak than full on integration.
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I don't get why people are voting for this (Not picking on you, you where just the most recent post for this vote when I started this reply). Per the update the We are better at fighting Greenskins then Skaven.

BoneyM said:
. With that you're able to get at least a vague account of its origins - for as far back as it knows, it lived around and preyed upon the furred-four-legs who are usually-food, and it would relocate regularly to prevent an organized retaliation. Then one day it must have passed from the Skaven-occupied Underway to the greenskin-occupied Karag Lhune, and found that while the green-four-legs were less reliably prey, they were also less prone to organizing, so it could build up a nest/web/nursery/home to its liking without being dislodged.
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Lazurman said:
My armor choice is simple. The Karaz Ankor are not our enemies. They're not our friends, either, sure, but I don't much fancy a future in which there are Grudges between the holds Old and New. Belegar threw down the gauntlet to Thorgrim, and Thorgrim's response was to tell Belegar to put his gold where his mouth is and prove his way was better. Peaceable relations require someone to make the first step; might as well be us, bearing a gift of goodwill snatched from the clutches of the filthy Thaggoraki.
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Belear would know if this was grudge worthy, and if it was he wouldn't do it. He may be a pragmatist, but he's not an iconoclast. He's still a dwarven king. Dwarves keep dwarven loot they recover all the time. Thorek is famous for 'recovering' lost runes and runic items from fallen dwarven holds and settlements. We've also been told that gromil is too precious not to be reused, and that they've even recycled broken Anvils of Power, which are far more valuable than a suit on unruned armour.
 
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Lupercal said:
I don't get why people are voting for this (Not picking on you, you where just the most recent post for this vote when I started this reply). Per the update the We are better at fighting Greenskins then Skaven.
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Actually, they're less reliably prey, they just never clean house.

The Spiders with some dwarves behind them to stop them getting swept out get to do the most damage.
 
Alratan said:
Actually, an item of Talk with Beasts could be tremendously useful for a spy/infiltrator anyway. Imagine the value of interrogating the rats, conventional or giant, in a skaven warren.
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Mmm, well, so long as the Skaven can't do the same, or the damn rats don't go to them for whatever reason. The relationship between "regular" rats and Skaven is uncertain but it's there.
 
jjffjhjf said:
That'll be a thing we deal with next turn... Also, somewhere or other QM has stated (I think a few times now) that we can literally teach them to write. Which would easily solve the communication problem without requiring an item.
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You are right, I was probably editing my post when you were writing this. Thought of it just after hitting submit.
 
[X] [SPIDER] The We can be a powerful military ally against the greenskins.
[X] [RUNE] 25 Favour Sword
[X] [ARMOUR] It should be reforged into a worthy commemoration of the Karak's rebirth.
[X] [ENCHANTMENT] No purchase
[X] [LIBRARY] Imperial Texts: Extensive/Esoteric Skaven, Extensive Skaven Magic, Extensive Greenskin Magic, Antiquarian Grey Magic (2 College Favor), Extensive Amber Magic, Extensive/Esoteric Linguistics, Extensive Warpstone, Extensive Morr, Extensive Karaz Ankor. Dwarf Texts: Extensive Greenskin Magic, Extensive Skaven Magic, Extensive Romance Novels, Extensive Linguistics, Extensive Daemons. Brettonian Texts: Extensive Romance Novels. Tilean Texts: Extensive Romance Novels.
 
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SuperSonicSound said:
Gromril is pretty much the next best thing to indestructible. It can be broken but you're talking the kind of punishment that would break pretty much anything in existence it's the toughest material in the setting iirc.
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We don't know why it's like that though. It could just be Gromril is inherently basically indestrucible, or it could be it's something in the forging, combined with the properties of the metal itself. Which would make sense to me, especially given the fact there's apparently three different ways to make the stuff, each of which gives it different properties.

NSMS said:
That's... pretty much what I said?
Zweihanders won't actually make it through serious armour (proper plate or even decent chainmail, though they'll probably break bones in the case of the latter). Swords are just poor weapons in general against armour, and making them bigger doesn't really solve that problem.
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I thought you were talking about what most people see on TV and call a longsword. Which were secondary weapons.
Cut through it? No, but they can still hurt someone in plate, unlike a shortsword which will pretty much just bounce off without really doing anything. Zweihanders and the like are mostly for giving unarmoured enemies a really bad time, while still not leaving yourself helpless against an armoured opponent like a smaller blade would.
 
EVA-Saiyajin said:
Mmm, well, so long as the Skaven can't do the same, or the damn rats don't go to them for whatever reason. The relationship between "regular" rats and Skaven is uncertain but it's there.
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If we look like a skaven at the time though, it would make it seem even more likely that we were the skaven agent of a rival.
 
[X] [UNDUMGI] Soizic, Bretonnian Questing Knight
[x] [SPIDER] The We can be a powerful military ally against the Skaven.
[X] [SPIDER] The We can be a powerful military ally against the greenskins.
[X] [RUNE] 25 Favour Sword
[X] [ARMOUR] It should be reforged into a worthy commemoration of the Karak's rebirth.
[X] [ENCHANTMENT] No purchase.
[X] [LIBRARY] Imperial Texts: Extensive/Esoteric Skaven, Extensive Skaven Magic, Extensive Greenskin Magic, Antiquarian Grey Magic (2 College Favor), Extensive Amber Magic, Extensive/Esoteric Romance Novels, Extensive/Esoteric Linguistics, Extensive Warpstone, Extensive Morr, Extensive Karaz Ankor. Dwarf Texts: Extensive Greenskin Magic, Extensive Skaven Magic, Extensive Romance Novels, Extensive Linguistics, Extensive Daemons. Brettonian Texts: Extensive Romance Novels. Tilean Texts: Extensive Romance Novels.

I was initially planning on going for a ~15 Favor Greatsword, but a number of the arguments made have swayed me.

But what really did it was the description of us reading the Libris Mortis. We got absurd traits out of it, and we literally just started. We're playing in the big leagues now - we should get a weapon befitting that position.





Also, getting Kragg to make his greatest masterwork a sword for a human sounds like a hilarious prank Ranald would approve of. :V
 
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SuperSonicSound said:
I think Glimril is supposed to be Gromril in another form, there's supposed to be different levels that Gromril can be refined to and IIRC the dwarves only have knowledge of how to refine to the first level any more.
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Yeah, but they'd apparently never seen anything like Glimril before, so I'm guessing it's not just refined gromril which would be something that'd be part of something else they'd seen in at least their oldest holds I'd think.
 
Lazurman said:
My armor choice is simple. The Karaz Ankor are not our enemies. They're not our friends, either, sure, but I don't much fancy a future in which there are Grudges between the holds Old and New. Belegar threw down the gauntlet to Thorgrim, and Thorgrim's response was to tell Belegar to put his gold where his mouth is and prove his way was better. Peaceable relations require someone to make the first step; might as well be us, bearing a gift of goodwill snatched from the clutches of the filthy Thaggoraki.
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Gromril is more than a stupendously useful and rare metal. It's an embodiment of Dwarven virtues, an outright cultural icon. That's why Boney says it's at its most valuable when used as a symbol.

Forging physical symbols of his victory, physical symbols that his way is right, out of gromril?

Priceless.
 
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