The problem is that so far as I know, we have no direct reliable means of tracking subterranean tiberium other than "drill a borehole." Seismography should help but it only gets you so far.

So I'm not worried about baselines.

I think I'm mainly worried about prioritizing Blue Zones near, as noted, actual subduction faults. Since we're committed to building three Blue Zone inhibitors anyway. The Red Zone inhibitors are a separate issue because they're gated behind MARV hubs.
I suspect that, as we do more phases of vein mines, we may well get targeted abatement programs to work on managing underground Tib spread.
And I also suspect that they will help more than hurt with establishing baselines for the effects of inhibitors.
 
The problem is that so far as I know, we have no direct reliable means of tracking subterranean tiberium other than "drill a borehole." Seismography should help but it only gets you so far.

So I'm not worried about baselines.

I think I'm mainly worried about prioritizing Blue Zones near, as noted, actual subduction faults. Since we're committed to building three Blue Zone inhibitors anyway. The Red Zone inhibitors are a separate issue because they're gated behind MARV hubs.

Well I was looking at some of those sites and thinking might be dust up's with Nod as opposed to building on the clay we own. But fair enough.

Also for more long term thought.

-[ ] Yellow Zone 11 (Progress 0/130: 30 resources per die) (+2 Yellow Zone Abatement)

Doesn't require power and is in an area where Tiberium growing slowly would probably help. Anything to make SA Nod play hard mode is a bonus.
 
[X] Plan Forging the Golden Spike
[X] Plan Feed Zocom, Orbital VI
 
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I now present my first-ever plan. It underinvests in Infrastructure and Services to divert resources to Orbital, Tiberium and the military (Navy + Zone Armor) to meet the plan goals there. I have opted to put dice on the Assault Ships due to how long it takes to build those things, so as to get those ready for Karachi. It is my hope that the heavy Tiberium investment will allow future plans to activate dice and higher-cost projects faster. I opted for Particel applicators to get a foot in increasing the efficiency of industry.

[X] Plan Rush K(arachi)
-[X]Infrastructure 5 dice +36 2/5 20R
--[X] Communal Housing Experiments 0/150 2 dice 20R 87%
-[X]Heavy Industry 4 dice +33 4/4 65R
--[X] Advanced Alloys Development 56/120 1 die 15R 90%
--[X] Chicago Planned City (Phase 4) 529/550 1 die 20R 100%
--[X] Low Velocity Particle Applicator Development 1 die 20 R
--[X] Personal Electric Vehicle Plants 1 die 10 R
-[X]Light and Chemical Industry 4 dice +28 4/4 50R
--[X] Civilian Ultralight Factories 0/190 2 dice 30R 34%
--[X] Isolinear Peripherals Development 0/160 2 dice 20R 70%
-[X]Agriculture 4 dice +28 4/4 30R
--[X] Wadmalaw Kudzu Plantations (Phase 3) 56/450 3 dice 30R
--[X] 1 die for security review
-[X]Tiberium 7 dice +38 14/7 355R
--[X] Red Zone Border Offensives (Stage 2+3+4+5) 101/1000 7 Tiberium dice + 1 Free Dice 200R
--[X] Deep Red Zone Tiberium Glacier Mining (Stage 1 + 2) 0/255 4 Free dice 120R
--[X] Intensification of Green Zone Harvesting (Stage 7+8) 78/200 2 Free dice 30R 96%
--[-] Tiberium Harvesting Claw Deployment 363/380 0 dice autocompletes end of turn
-[X]Orbital 6 dice +30 5/6 100R
--[X] Station Bay 248/400 2 dice 40R 79%
--[X] Leopard II Factory 152/400 3 dice 60R 57%
-[X]Services 5 dice +31 4/5 70R
--[X] Advanced Electronic Video Assistant Deployment 0/200 3 dice 60R 88%
--[X] Specialist Isolinear Programming Development 0/120 1 die 10R 32%
-[X]Military 8 dice +30 8/8 150R
--[X] Infantry Recon Support Drone Development 0/40 1 die 10R 100%
--[X] Island Class Assault Ship Deployment (New) 0/180 2 dice 50R 47%
--[X] Ground Forces Zone Armor (Set 1) (Phase 3+4) (Updated) 0/360 4 dice 80R 35%
--[X] Unmanned Support Ground Vehicle Development 0/80 1 die 20R 71%
-[X]Bureaucracy 4 dice +28 4+E 0R
--[X] Recruitment Drives max DC 200: 3 dice + Erewhon 96%
--[X] Security Reviews: Agriculture DC50 0/50 1 die 94%
 
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Well I was looking at some of those sites and thinking might be dust up's with Nod as opposed to building on the clay we own. But fair enough.

Also for more long term thought.

-[ ] Yellow Zone 11 (Progress 0/130: 30 resources per die) (+2 Yellow Zone Abatement)

Doesn't require power and is in an area where Tiberium growing slowly would probably help. Anything to make SA Nod play hard mode is a bonus.
The YZ-11 MARV hub is good from the point of view of "try to stop liquid tiberium from ever falling into a subduction zone," but probably doesn't make things harder for South American Nod. Stahl's forces are pretty much entirely concentrated on the south side of RZ-6, and there is effectively no remaining population or stuff up north aside from GDI's own facilities.

It's part of the subtle distinction between "Yellow Zones that are geopolitically Nod's" and "Yellow Zones that are geopolitically GDI's, usually because they're an isolated bubble reclaimed from a Red Zone, but that are so empty that there's no real civilian activity, just the harvesting presence mining away at all the tib around them." We have three other pockets like that in South America alone, plus the one around the Anzio glacier mine in Italy. Can't think of any others, though.



So, a quick comparison of the leading plan, @Crazycryodude 's Forging the Golden Spike, and my own plan, Attempting To Invade The Tiberium. Both plans reflect broadly similar visions for what GDI ought to be doing, and speaking for myself, I have approval-voted both, though I slightly prefer my own.

In heavy Industry, Golden Spike commits a single die to finishing Chicago Phase 4. This is a respectable and logical course of action, which I had planned to postpone until 2062Q2 myself. As a side effect, Golden Spike cannot complete the electric vehicle factories this turn, whereas there is at least a slim chance of this happening under Invade The Tiberium.

Golden Spike is, to my great surprise, more aggressive about tiberium than my own plan, which I had expected to be the most aggressive, and to lose for that reason instead of winding up trailing behind an even more aggressive plan. Whereas I 'only' commit fourteen dice to the Tiberium fields, Crazycryodude also assigns Erewhon to Intensification of Green Zone Harvesting. Furthermore, while I 'only' commit twelve dice to Red Zone operations, he commits all fourteen. I had in a previous iteration of the plan flipped two dice to vein mining as a cost-saving measure, and I don't plan to go back on that because I don't want to be all fiddly like that.

Crazycryodude does not bother with Orbital Cleanup this turn, which in turn enables him to make more progress. Whereas I cannot manage to have a reasonable chance of finishing both the station bay and the Leopard II yard this turn, he does have a decent chance on each. In my defense, the odds of him getting both projects combined and clearing the way for us start Columbia in 2062Q2 are only about 40% or so.

Cryo and I take identical approaches to Services. But in Military, the differences open up a bit. Cryo wound up with less money to play with for the Military (and he spends all 855 R we have, whereas I spend only 825 out of 855). Since Cryo's total Military budget is only 100 R instead of 110 R, he saved money by cutting a couple of military development projects. While I work on design for the GD-3 rifle (which isn't a Plan requirement) and ultralight glide munitions for the Air Force (which are), Cryo converts both of those projects into Ferro-Aluminum Armor Refits dice to save money.



Suppose that both our plans perform boringly (that is, all income-granting projects perform in a strictly average manner, and the income value of a project is scaled down according to the probability of getting it, with extremely high probabilities rounded up to 100%).

Our current base income is 710 RpT. My plan leaves us with 20 R of savings; Golden Spike leaves none of the savings we started the turn with. The 2062Q2 budget looks like

Golden Spike
710 + 9.4 (Green Zone) + 25 (RZBO 2) + 20.25 (RZBO 3) + 150 (Super Glacier 1+2) + 46.17 (Super Glacier 3)
961 R

Attempting To Invade The Tiberium
710 + 20 (reserves) + 16.9 (Vein Mining 2) + 25 (RZBO 2) + 20.25 (RZBO 3) + 75 (Super Glacier 1) + 72 (Super Glacier 2) + 4.25 (Super Glacier 3) + 12.5 (Cleanup 11) + 7.25 (58% Cleanup 12)
963 R



[squints at @Crazycryodude , panting from fatigue]

"...A most worthy opponent."
 
Just don't vote for me on the grounds that the expectation value of our 2062Q2 budget works out to 2 R higher statistically speaking, because that's meaningless. For income maximization purposes our plans are very, very similar. His might have noticeably better 2062Q3 outlook, but at that point everything depends on whether we go ahead and try to rush build up through Phase 5 of both RZBO and super glacier mining in Q2, which might not be feasible even with the best will in the world. If, for instance, the naysayers prove correct and this massive Red Zone expansion causes ZOCOM to start squeezing the handbrake.

I now present my first-ever plan. It underinvests in Infrastructure and Services to divert resources to Orbital, Tiberium and the military (Navy + Zone Armor) to meet the plan goals there. I have opted to put dice on the Assault Ships due to how long it takes to build those things, so as to get those ready for Karachi. It is my hope that the heavy Tiberium investment will allow future plans to activate dice and higher-cost projects faster. I opted for Particel applicators to get a foot in increasing the efficiency of industry.
Very interesting. Some bold moves here, daring ones.

Hm.

If I were trying to maximize the likelihood of getting Karachi done quickly (that is, a 'rush' project), I would probably want to prioritize the projects most likely to be ready in time for a 2062Q4 kick-off date, something we could theoretically choose to do. An interesting intellectual exercise.

Let me think. If I were trying to do what you were doing- that is, maximizing preparation for Karachi while ignoring any factor not relevant to making us as ready as possible... And this is a purely hypothetical draft plan... Hm. I'm gonna work on that.
 
Looking at plan Attempting To Invade The Tiberium I can't help but think of Erewhon's reaction.

Orbital Cleanup - It's not enough that you made me count beans, now you're making me pick up your trash.
 
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[X] Plan Feed Zocom

I'd like it better if it worked on orbital AEVA, but I do like that it works on drone technology.
Mine works on drone technology as well.

-[] Military (8/8 dice, +30 bonus, 105 R)
--[] GD-3 Rifle Development (0/30) (1 die * 10R = 10R) (100%)
--[] Ground Forces Zone Armor (Set 1) (Phase 3) (2 dice * 20R = 40R) (47%)
--[ ] Ferro Aluminum Armor Refits (0/350) (3 dice * 5R = 15R) (3%)
--[ ] Buckler Shield Development (0/100) (1 dice * 20R = 20R) (51%)
--[ ] Unmanned Support Ground Vehicle Development (Tech) 0/80 (1 dice * 20R = 20R) (71%)
 
This is NOT a serious plan as such. Inspired by @ramdomperson , this is an attempt to build a Karachi-optimized plan, with a target 'GO' date of 2062Q4.

IMPLICATIONS

1) The assault ships simply cannot be ready in time no matter what we do, nor will a fresh tranche of frigates built in the Seattle yard.
2) Orca and Hammerhead wingman drones for the Navy's carriers are critical, because without them, our light carriers significantly underperform relative to their design role.
3) For fighting the Bannerjees' biomonsters, the GD-3 and power armor are desirable, and railgun munitions are valuable. More generally, glide munitions arguably desirable because they increase aircraft's standoff range. However, we have to prioritize, because there simply will not be time to deploy all these weapons in the time available.
4) Rudimentary SADN coverage around our most critical targets is important because Nod may retaliate in unforeseen ways.
5) Buckler shields MAY be a viable way to refit warships with better protection schema in time for Karachi. MRASP, by contrast, is useless. Infernium lasers would be an attractive choice but the project is just too big and expensive to complete in 2062Q2-Q3 in my opinion unless we do practically nothing else expensive.

6) We want to not need our Infrastructure and Tiberium dice for anything else during the "Karachi Sprint," which in turn means making sure we're not dangerously short on any other indicator. This includes Logistics, because while Karachi itself will provide plenty of Logistics, a sudden spike of Nod hostile naval activity may occur, bringing back the 'raiding' malus, and we'll be engaged in heavy combat operations that will themselves cost Logistics. So we want to make sure Housing and Logistics are squared away. We also want to do lots of mining so our income is solid without need to do any further mining in 2062Q4-2063Q1, but that, uh... that's pretty well covered for as-is. :p

CONCLUSIONS:

1) In Infrastructure, the best thing to do is to do everything we can to thicken the Housing buffer (accomodating current and future refugees) while minimizing impact on Logistics. Thus, one die on apartments, but not two, because that last phase of apartments is a bridge too far and it would be better to just bite the bullet and build more LQ housing in the "lesser arcologies" after that point. Also, make sure Logistics stays up or at any rate does not plummet.

2) Advanced Alloys may ease construction around Karachi. Personal Electric Vehicles is cheap per die and insulates us a bit against political shocks, but is nonessential. An alternative would be to beeline for Improved Fusion in the expectation that we will have to start building second-generation fusion plants ASAP. Completing Chicago a little faster does make sense in the context of an aggressive push on planned cities.

3) Significant rearrangement of military options, as outlined above. Really hoping to get Orca wingmen in 2062Q2, so there's time to deploy and train with at least the initial production run (hopefully routed to the carriers) in Q3 before taking them into battle in Q4.

4) Budget cost surges. Orbital AEVA becomes unsupportable for price reasons. This leads to more direct investment in the station bay... but much, much less in services, as 60 R and three dice are deactivated and only 10 R and one die are reactivated, to make the budget come out evenly.

BUDGET: 850/855 R

[] Plan Attempting To Prepare For 2062 Karachi.
-[] Infrastructure (5/5 Dice, +36 bonus, 55 R)
--[] Blue Zone Apartment Complexes (Phase 9) 82/150 (1 die, 10 R) (74% chance)
--[] Communal Housing Experiments (2 dice, 20 R) (87% chance)
--[] Green Architecture Risk Assessment and Testing 0/90 (1 die, 10 R) (67% chance)
--[] Urban Metros (Phase 4) 0/150 (1 die, 15 R) (2% chance)
-[] Heavy Industry (4/4 Dice, +33 bonus, 75 R)
--[] Advanced Alloys Development 56/120 (1 die, 15 R) (90% chance)
--[] Improved Continuous Cycle Fusion Development 0/120 (2 dice, 40 R) (96% chance)
--[] Chicago Planned City (Phase 4) 529/550 (1 die, 20 R) (100% chance)
-[] Light Industry (2/4 Dice, +28 bonus, 20 R)
--[] Isolinear Peripherals Development 0/160 (2 dice, 20 R) (70% chance)
-[] Agriculture (4/4 Dice, +28 bonus, 40 R)
--[] Wadmalaw Kudzu Plantations (Phase 3) 56/450 (4 dice, 40 R) (14% chance)
-[] Tiberium (7 Dice + 7 Free Dice, +38 bonus, 375 R)
--[] Tiberium Vein Mines (Stage 2) 5/195 (2 dice, 40 R) (52% chance)
--[] Red Zone Border Offensives (Stage 2+3+4) 101/750 (5 dice, 125 R) (Stage 2, 81% Stage 3)
--[] Deep RZ Tiberium Glacier Mining (Stage 1+2+3) 0/750 (7 dice, 210 R) (Stage 1, 96% Stage 2, 7% Stage 3)
-[] Orbital (6/6 dice + EREWHON!!!, +30 bonus, 120 R)
--[] Station Bay 248/400 (2 dice, 40 R) (79% chance)
--[] Orbital Cleanup (Stage 11+12) 32/170 (1+E dice, 20 R) (Stage 11, 58% chance Stage 12)
--[] Leopard II Factory 152/400 (3 dice, 60 R) (57% chance)
-[] Services (3/5 Dice, +31 bonus, 35 R)
--[] Specialist Isolinear Programming Development 0/120 (1 die, 10 R) (32% chance)
--[] Gene Clinics (New) 0/120 (2 dice, 20 R) (88% chance)
-[] Military (8/8 dice, +30 bonus, 130 R)
--[] Orca Wingmen Drone Deployment (Phase 1) 0/275 (1 die, 20 R) (1/3.5 median)
--[] GD-3 Rifle Development 0/30 (1 die, 10 R) (100% chance)
--[] Railgun Munitions Factories (Phase 1) 0/200 (2 dice, 20 R) (29% chance)
--[] Ground Forces Zone Armor (New Sevastopol) (Set 1 Phase 3+4) 0/360 (3 dice, 60 R) (94% Phase 3, 2% Phase 4)
--[] Buckler Shield Development 0/100 (1 die, 20 R) (51% chance)
-[] Bureaucracy (4 Dice, +28 bonus)
--[] Recruitment Drives DC 200 0/200 (4 dice, 0 R) (98.97% chance)
 
[X] Plan Forging the Golden Spike

Although I have mixed opinions about using Erewhon for Green Zone Intensification.
Could be a really good experience for learning about optimising complex systems.
Could be really dull.
 
When we do want to do Karachi, shouldn't we make the Yellow Zone-1 West MARV Hub? It creates a good landing area and/or defense against some land units. I don't know if any other MARV Hub would be directly beneficial.
 
Might not be a bad idea to try it, but it'd be something to do the turn after we get the city started.

Because we'll want a nearby base of operations and to make sure the initial GDI landing forces succeed in clearing the immediate area of any hostile Nod warlords first.

This is assuming we can get away with doing this without nuclear war. I hope the fact it hasn't been removed from our docket by the rest of GDI's government reflects the belief that this is the case, not just them somehow forgetting the same issue that's led us to cancel any thought of further Yellow Zone Harvesting phases.
 
Cost kicks up to 400 Progress, as I thought.

Simon are you alright?:

[ ] Leopard II Factory
The Leopard II, as developed by the SCED, is a general upgrade, both in size and performance over the original design. With the need for more launches, and substantially more complicated flight profiles, another major fusion yard is required, this one located near Kagoshima to expand the sites of fusion production away from Mehretu.
(Progress 152/400: 20 resources per die) (5 point lunar discount, 5 point station discount) [11, 62, Nat 1]

Cause I already pointed out last turn that this is what the Nat 1 was about. Do you want me to quote it? I'm kind of worried about you not noticing a detail in this quest.
 
[X] Plan First Quarter Blues Mk III (Orbital AEVA Remix, Final Rev)
[X] Plan Forging the Golden Spike

I'm voting for it because I love going full steam ahead on glacier mines, but I don't like that Plan Forging the Golden Spike does Infantry Recon drones q1. We're already going to be turning our pockets inside out looking for money to deploy the island class q2, we just are not ready to add another deployment to the pile and unlike unmanned ground support drones, infantry recon drones are not a tech and will not benefit us in any way until we do that deployment project.

I'm too tired to make a plan variant right now though, but just - honestly, you could legitimately do better by just moving the die over to ferro-aluminum. That's probably not the best alternative, but it's still an improvement!

Ech. Maybe somebody's already explained the rationale, I've been too busy to go through the thread as a whole so I'd have missed it if they did...
 
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