Pretty sure the part of the reason vampire territory is so often rundown compared to the empires is that, they infact, can't/won't do the paperwork.
Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest
- Thread starter Boney
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- warhammer warhammer fantasy fantasy be gay do crimes (gay) female protagonist pansexual protagonist ck2 quest divided loyalties mountain vietnam ranald is real this is a dwarf quest (dwarfs) this is maybe an elf quest this is not a vampire quest this is not an empire quest try it and find out open voting
Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
I do think an unintended, but very interesting thing is that in explaining the colleges to Eike, we will actually get an in quest option from Mathy on want they and their members are like on average.
so far it's been most WoBs, thread members talking about canon and an institutional hate boner for light and celestial that she doesn't really feel... but kind of does at times.
so far it's been most WoBs, thread members talking about canon and an institutional hate boner for light and celestial that she doesn't really feel... but kind of does at times.
Turn 34 Results - 2486.5 - Part 3 - Eike's Fate
Eike's time with the Halflings goes well, and on several occasions you watch through Wolf's eyes as she sheds the fretful student guise to play with children her own age and half her height. You get the feeling she doesn't often get the opportunity to simply be the child she still is, and if anything that's going to become even more the case in the future.
The law gives all Magisters the power to unilaterally take into custody and escort to Altdorf anyone with the ability to use magic, but the Orders very much prefer to be less disruptive and seek the technically unneeded permission of the recruit or their guardians, both for the sake of their public relations and for not traumatizing would-be initiates with an abduction. When the guardian of that initiate is one's business partner, a tactful approach becomes even more important. So you prepare and hone a few key arguments and when it comes time for Eike to leave the Karak, you tell her that you've got business in the Empire, so she might as well fly back with you by Gyrocarriage. She's quite excited at the prospect, and though you can't deny the view can be amazing, passenger compartments that were originally bomb racks aren't the most comfortable way to travel. You advise her to dress warm and bring something to plug her ears with.
---
A series of hops between Karaks later, you arrive in Stirland, touching down in a clearing of the gardens outside the EIC offices. It's an effective way to announce your arrival, and by the time you reach her office, Wilhelmina is already waiting for you, and as you enter glances to either side of you. "What is it? Is Eike okay?"
"She's fine, I told her to go bug the kitchens for lunch so we can talk. Here's the reports from the Karag Nar branch, one was marked time-sensitive." You hand over a slightly rumpled pile of papers, which she skims through with a distracted frown.
"I've been trying to convince the Dwarves to let us rent the use of the Gyrocopters for information that needs to travel quickly, but they're dubious about it. Military assets not for civilian use, especially human civilians. Knowing this piece of news before anyone else on this side of the Black Mountains will make us a nice bit of money." She looks up. "Anyway, what is it that brings you here?"
"I believe Eike has the potential to use magic."
Wilhelmina puts the papers down and turns her full attention to you. "Why do you think that?"
"She was able to identify and distinguish concentrations of magical energy. Having Magesight doesn't always indicate the potential to be a magic-user, but Magesight that sharp at her age almost certainly does."
She exhales. "I finally have an heir worth a damn, and... what are the odds?" You nod in commiseration. "No, I'm seriously asking. Tell me what the odds are. I thought it was supposed to be one in a thousand of one in a thousand, or something like that."
"I've heard the same, but it's nowhere near that. Maybe it's artistic license. If that was the case, the Empire would have maybe thirty Wizards, and that's including recruiting from Tilea and Estalia-"
"How many are there?" she interrupts.
"About four hundred fully-qualified Magisters or higher. If you include everyone in the Colleges - Apprentices, Journeyman, Perpetuals, Sealed, Minor Talents, everyone - maybe five thousand total. But as for odds... well, maybe one percent of people have some degree of usable Magesight. For most people, they never even know it. Maybe they get hunches, maybe they just know things. Some people can always tell when a storm is coming, some people are good at 'reading' people, some people have a 'knack' for dice or cards." You nod to her. "What made you a good trader? Why are you ruling a trade empire, when so many end up dead in a ditch or penniless or just scrape by their whole lives?"
"I guess..." Her frown deepens. "Well, a lot of things, but I see what you're getting at. I always said, if I shake a man's hand and look him in the eye, I can get the measure of him. And my husband... he'd get a bad feeling sometimes, and we'd go a different route or take a different cargo and sometimes we'd hear later that..." She shakes her head. "Are you saying that's magic?"
"I'm saying, maybe you and he could sense magic. Not consciously, but if you could sense the Ulgu drawn to someone trying to misdirect, or your husband could sense the Shyish drawn to a path lurked by bandits or Beastmen, that could manifest as a 'measure of a person' or a 'bad feeling'. If you both had it, maybe you passed it down." You consider what you've heard of her sons. "And maybe it skipped a generation.
"So, we estimate one in a hundred people have Magesight. About one in ten of those will have some ability to actually use magic - so, one person in a thousand. That's any ability at all. A lot of people will never actually use it, sometimes the ability lies dormant their entire lives, sometimes they have one bad experience and consciously or subconsciously slam the door on it. A lot of people react by turning to the priesthood. Those left over - about a third of those one in a thousand - end up at the Colleges.
"From there, we shave away even more. There's Minor Talents - people who can only do one thing or a narrow range of things with magic. Clairvoyants, telekinetics, weather-seers, whatever. There's people who don't want their magic, if we can't convince them to even try it we give them jewellery and trinkets to dampen their magical ability. There's people who can't control their magic at all, and they get the trinkets too. Both are just called Sealed. Some of them stay on at the Colleges as assistants or administrative staff, some return to their previous lives. There's Perpetuals, Perpetual Apprentices, people who have the ability to manipulate magic into different forms but can't channel enough power to do more than basic cantrips. Once all those are winnowed out, maybe another one in ten or less reach the rank of Magister."
"One in thirty thousand." You nod. "And my Eike is one of those."
"I think she has the potential to be. Some people do just have strong Magesight, but they usually get it by honing it through decades of tough living. Eike's eleven and she's able to identify and distinguish Winds, without even knowing that's what she's doing. It's more likely that she's a regular Wizard-to-be than her having Magesight that strong and no other magical ability."
Wilhelmina is silent for a while. "What if the odds were different?" she asks quietly.
You look at her a while, and nod. "What if I reconsidered the matter and reached a different conclusion about her ability to use magic, you mean?" She nods. "As an entirely theoretical exercise, in that case I would no longer be bound by the Articles to recruit, report, or destroy her. She would continue on in life with the beguiling light of the Winds dancing just within reach. And if that reconsideration was incorrect, it's very likely that one day she would reach out to those Winds, and from there there's a thousand different ways it could go horribly wrong." You shake your head. "Some that avoid the Colleges seek education outside them, but there aren't many benign teachers left outside the Colleges these days. That leaves grimoires full of traps for the unwary, and Sorcerers and forbidden Cults that would be all too happy to get their hands on a malleable young thing like her, and worst of all, Daemons of every stripe that would fight each other for the chance to whisper temptation into her ear. It's the same reason we don't like putting people in dampeners unless the person is completely against using magic in any circumstances, either because they're completely opposed to it or because they've been traumatized by it."
She considers that. "So unless you do... reach a different conclusion, you're bound by your laws to bring her in or report her."
You consider the wording of the Articles. "Technically she's not covered by that Article until she actually uses magic, so I could leave the matter be until that changes. But the first time someone uses magic can so easily go badly, and it would be much better for her if she is able to take her first steps in a safe and controlled environment. And besides that, sometimes the magic a person first uses can shape their future with it. Up north I worked with a Wizard who first developed magic when she was attacked by Beastmen, and defended herself with the fires of her charcoal pile. Because of that she ended up with the Bright College, where she might otherwise have been a better fit for another."
"Wouldn't you just take her in to your one, since you discovered her?"
"No, they're supposed to go to the Order that they're most suited to. But someone of her age who hasn't actually touched any of the Winds is a lot more malleable than most, and she could probably do well in any Order. I was a year younger than her when I was taken in, and the main reason I ended up in the Greys is the Wizard who brought me in was a Grey and I'd grown attached to him. So it's really a decision to be made, rather than something inherent."
"To be made by who?"
You'd been turning that over in your mind a fair bit in the past few days. Half of you wants Eike to end up in the Grey College, both so you can take her under your wing and so the EIC remains firmly under Grey Order control. But the other half wants Eike to be able to make the decision herself. "The decision would be hers, and it's one I do think she should be allowed to make for herself. But... it is a huge decision, one that will shape the rest of her life. It might be justifiable to encourage her to make the right choice."
"That being the same choice you made?"
You nod unabashedly. "I have contacts in the other Orders so I could help her to some extent wherever she ends up, but I could do orders of magnitude more for her in the Grey Order than anywhere else."
She considers that, and nods. "Otherwise I might say the Alchemists or the Seers, but you're right, patronage would make all the difference. And if she is a Grey Wizard... well, it's going to disrupt her education, but if she can do the things you can do..." She looks at you. "She'd still be able to have children of her own, wouldn't she?"
"Only the Lights and Amethysts are required to be celibate."
"How long would her training take?"
"The first stage of her training would take three to five years, and would require her to stay within the confines of her College. After that it would be possible for her teachings to be continued elsewhere - the EIC would easily have the resources to organize facilities and tutors."
"Three to five... probably closer to three than five, she's sharp. So she'd be fourteen or so... that... shouldn't disrupt things too much..." She closes her eyes for a while, her brow furrowed in thought. "Okay. I'll have a talk to her, let her know. Will you take her to Altdorf?"
"If that's what you want." You'd already checked the range, the Gyrocarriage can make it to Altdorf and then reach Karak Ziflin in the Grey Mountains to refuel.
"She's already packed, and I can have the rest of her things sent downriver easily enough. Are Apprentices allowed non-Wizard visitors?"
You have to think about that one. "I think so."
She looks at you, and you're pretty sure you know the questions she's not asking, but then she simply nods. "We'll find out." She rises, taking a deep breath, and takes a moment to collect her thoughts before walking out of the room.
---
An hour later, after you'd gotten tired of waiting and gone off to follow Eike's example in bugging the kitchens for lunch, Eike finds you leafing through various reports scattered throughout the building. "Can I talk to you?" she asks, her voice small.
"Of course. Let's chat outside." You return the report to the extremely nervous clerk you had pilfered it from and lead her out into the gardens, where the only company is the Gyrocarriage, its pilot engaged in his own search for sustenance. You'd recommended Wurtbad's wines to him, but Dwarves don't seem to trust wine.
"I'm going to be a Wizard?" she asks you as you take a seat on an ornamental bench.
"I think you can be, yes."
"Do I have to be?"
"If you are, it's very hard not to be." You nod towards the Gyrocarriage. "It would be like trying not to hear anything while we were flying in that."
"Oh." She's quiet for a while. "Oma says it's my choice which, but that I should choose yours."
"Do you know much about the Colleges?"
"Only yours. There's eight, right?"
"Right." You think for a moment, and then smile. You'd thought there were no practical uses for your experiments in trying to indirectly manipulate Winds, but you might have been wrong. "Do you feel the sun on your face?"
She looks up, squinting. "Yes."
"Do you feel the part of it that isn't just the warmth? The same way you felt what Panoramia was doing out in the fields?"
She closes her eyes and concentrates. "It feels... like a complicated thing that's been made simple."
"That's a very good way to put it. That's Hysh, the White Wind of the Order of Light."
You walk her through the other Winds, herding in sufficient amounts for her to sense from the ambient energies that the world is forever awash with. The Golden Wind of Chamon reminds her of the sums and tables she's spent years grappling with, the Blue Wind of Azyr a sense of anticipation, the Red Wind of Aqshy a tense escalation ready to burst, the Amber Wind of Ghur makes her shift uneasily and imbues a sense of claustrophobia, which you believe to be a result of her sensing in the middle of a city. The Jade Wind of Ghyran reminds her of Panoramia, which you suppose makes sense, since that was probably the first time she encountered it in large amounts. The Amethyst Wind of Shyish has her go quiet, and you allow it to pass without prodding her for her impression of it. Then you summon Ulgu once more, and she sits there for some time, staring into space.
"Does it always feel like that?" she asks.
You could answer with strict honesty, and say that you have no way of knowing how her relationship with a specific Wind would evolve. Every Wizard's relationship with a Wind is deeply personal, and even beyond that, your own Windsight is visual and hers is either emotive or intuitive. But there's another answer that comes to your lips, one that's arguably equally honest. "It used to when I was young, but to me now, it feels more like something I know, but nobody else does. Like a fog that I can see through, but nobody else can."
She considers that for a while, then thanks you and gives you a small sidelong hug before going back inside. The next morning she has made her decision, and the Gyrocarriage lifts off to take the two of you to the Grey College, which is to be Eike's home for the next few years and, you hope, for the rest of her life.
- Remainder of Turn 34 to come.
- Canonical note: The numbers Mathilde gave to Wilhelmina are my own back-of-the-envelope maths. Canonical population numbers for the Empire are absurdly small with some provinces having as few as ten thousand citizens, so I've given them the 15 million of the mid-1600's Holy Roman Empire and doubled that for magical recruitment purposes to account for Tilea, Estalia, the Border Princes, and smuggled male magic-users from Bretonnia and Kislev. Something I've seen said in the fandom a few times is that 'one in a thousand can see magic, one in a thousand of those can use magic', and I've got no idea where that comes from and suspect it's a misremembering of something from 40k about psykers. 2e Realms of Sorcery outright says 'the most learned agree that perhaps one child in a thousand has the potential to become a spellcaster.'
- The mainstream theory is that there's three magical senses - 'Intuition' or 'Aethyric Attunement' that all humans are believed to have to some degree, 'Witchsight' that a minority have that manifests as an entire sense, and 'Channelling' which is what makes someone a full-blown magic-user. Mathilde simplified things for Wilhelmina's benefit, and for obvious reason does not like the 'Witchsight' terminology.
- Each College has an official name which can be found in the Collection of Important Information threadmark under 'The Winds of Magic, and the organizations authorized to study them', but like many Wizards, Mathilde uses 'the X College' or 'the X Order' interchangeably for all of them most of the time.
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That would be interesting and I might have to keep an eye out for opportunities to have that happen, but Mathilde saw it not as choosing an organization to join, but as choosing a Wind to enter into a partnership with.
- Location
- Earth
What an apt way to describe our ongoing Mastery of the Fog of War.
NuclearConsensus
Herald of the Thorned One
- Location
- the Philippines
The section where Mathilde walks Eike through the various Winds was very informative. I like it.
- Location
- France
I'm not sure I understand what Eike is thinking in that final scene. Is she currently choosing the Grey despite disliking the way Ulgu feels?
Although I suppose none of the Winds must feel great to someone who isn't attuned to them like a Wizard is.
It's nice that Wilhemina is thinking of visiting Eike. She probably isn't planning on continuing her education during her first three years, so this is IMO a good sign regarding their relationship.
Although I suppose none of the Winds must feel great to someone who isn't attuned to them like a Wizard is.
It's nice that Wilhemina is thinking of visiting Eike. She probably isn't planning on continuing her education during her first three years, so this is IMO a good sign regarding their relationship.
Doomed Wombat
Let's go Darling!
- Location
- Dancing on wires!
mmm...
For the EIC I'm getting the feeling that Grey may not be the best choice.
Or potentially its the best choice we shall see.
For the EIC I'm getting the feeling that Grey may not be the best choice.
Or potentially its the best choice we shall see.
Aranfan
Team Plasma Grunt
The best choice for the EIC would be Celestial for the future sight. The best for Eike, would be either Gold Wizard who could use the piles of dosh from the EIC to fuel magic stuff, or Grey cause she'd have the personal patronage and attention of a lord magister.
- Location
- Massachusetts
Fascinating stuff. I'm thinking that back of the envelope maths would be just about appropriate for someone from Warhammer's educated elite who doesn't care too much given the calculative capacity of the average person.
I'm really liking the story with Eike so far. It'd make a good main story too if Mathilde wasn't currently trying to save the world.
I'm really liking the story with Eike so far. It'd make a good main story too if Mathilde wasn't currently trying to save the world.
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Asheram
Not quite altogether
- Location
- Δ Hidden Forbidden Holy Ground
Ah, my mistake. You were referring to the chapter before this one.
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She does care....it just doesn't come easily to her.
Asheram
Not quite altogether
- Location
- Δ Hidden Forbidden Holy Ground
Also, gods above and below, I dearly wish that all prospective Wizards would get a similar treatment as we have done with Eike. Letting them chose what suits them best.
Perhaps something to lobby for with Dragomas: Setting up a hall to test newcomers instead of just tossing them into the preferred school of their finder.
Perhaps something to lobby for with Dragomas: Setting up a hall to test newcomers instead of just tossing them into the preferred school of their finder.
It sounds like Eike is fascinated by Ulgu. All her life she's been told to learn and to study and to recite, and Ulgu is the mystery she can't explain... yet.
The jigsaw puzzle with no corners.
The riddle with no solution.
The crime with no clues.
The question with no answer.
And the Greys will teach her how to understand it.
The jigsaw puzzle with no corners.
The riddle with no solution.
The crime with no clues.
The question with no answer.
And the Greys will teach her how to understand it.
- Location
- Leeds
Its a touching scene watching two people bond over a sense others don't.
So the relations:
-Hysh - Complex rendered simple.
-Chamon - Mathemancy
-Azyr - Anticipation for the future
-Aqshy - Tension ready to erupt
-Ghur - Return to Monkey
-Ghyran - Panoramia
-Shyish - PROBABLY I'd say the moment her mother abandoned her. Fear, sorrow and partings.
-Ulgu - A mystery(and Mathilde, M&Ms), but who its for depends on you.
Ulgu probably wouldn't normally be her first choice, but your relationship with your Wind is intensely personal, and grows with you.
Side note, emotive windsight might actually be pretty good at working with the Mystical end of the spectrum, though probably ass at conveying to anyone else.
-Hysh - Complex rendered simple.
-Chamon - Mathemancy
-Azyr - Anticipation for the future
-Aqshy - Tension ready to erupt
-Ghur - Return to Monkey
-Ghyran - Panoramia
-Shyish - PROBABLY I'd say the moment her mother abandoned her. Fear, sorrow and partings.
-Ulgu - A mystery(and Mathilde, M&Ms), but who its for depends on you.
Ulgu probably wouldn't normally be her first choice, but your relationship with your Wind is intensely personal, and grows with you.
Side note, emotive windsight might actually be pretty good at working with the Mystical end of the spectrum, though probably ass at conveying to anyone else.
Nobody's been able to come up with any sort of one-size-fits-all test to see who fits best where. Current practice is that the person who finds them fills them in on the Colleges and lets them choose for themself when they reach Altdorf, and allowing Apprentices to switch if they're truly unhappy with their Order or Wind. This does mean that the one finding them is able to put their thumb on the scale by talking up their own Order, but it doesn't outright give the finder the right to dictate where the person they're bringing in ends up.
- Location
- Finland
Now what kind of person would even think of such a thing?
Gosh, who ever would do something like that?
Edit: Damn, I got Grey'd
Sinsystems
Patron Librarian
So we should make sure to spend social actions on visiting Eike semi-regularly, if only because the first time we visit the student dorms we go full ominous to terrify them before doing an emotional whiplash into quirky Auntie Mathilde.
- Location
- Leeds
This got brought up ages ago if I remember right, can I just check with someone in the thread my understanding is right:
- Once they get an Arcane Mark, they're locked into the order and can't change. They're bound to that wind and attempting another would just mean Dhar.
- There's an indeterminately long period of no magic while they let the old wind filter out of their system naturally.
Yes to the former, about a month at most for the latter.
Asheram
Not quite altogether
- Location
- Δ Hidden Forbidden Holy Ground
It's the last part of that has me concerned as we know at least one case of someone (Hubert) being unhappy with the school they were taught.
But, as you say, if there's no proper test or setup to make them chose impartially anyhow then things might as well stay as they are.
Also in Eike's case her having never touched the Winds before and extremely clear magesight gives her options others don't. Right?
Most finds already started pulling on the Winds and can hardly differentiate one Wind from another when they are found.
You'd need population wide canvassing for that.