fictionfan
Please sir, may I have some Meows?
- Location
- Tempe, AZ
The waystones are going to be made by centralized experts. They shouldn't need wizards to install them besides to say the magic passcode. Now for tributaries that might apply.
Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest
- Thread starter Boney
- Start date
- Fantasy Users' Choice!
Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
We are not certain all parts of a waystone can be done beforehand and it might be that for some you need someone there to do the work.
Also generally I would add to any waystone deployment a armed guard strong enough to hold for evacuation or rescue.
Tasoli
Life is for Living
- Location
- Behind the Keyboard.
Your gut feeling is wrong as GM already said that 10 waystones was what needed to put an actual expiration date to bad shitTM in Praag.
- Location
- Utrecht
pucflek
Verified simpleton
- Location
- Czech Republic
Not really.
Whats in the update trumps WoG on the quest canonicity chart. And whats in the update says that there is already a waystone, possibly Nexus, in Praag. And yet its still the hellhole that it is.
We kinda really need to shake Ice Witches for what the fuck thats about and how to actually go about plugging this all in. I have a feeling this will be either politically or logistically complicated.
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I think Mathilde graduated to fixing horrible problems in or on the border of the Empire a while ago.
I'd forgotten that Realms of Sorcery doesn't mention reagents, so that seems likely.
Why spend the actions? I don't like the proposal in and of itself, but that would surely have a significant action cost.
That Praag has a nexus is one of the most basic facts about waystones and Praag. I don't see why we need to assume there even was a retcon.
pucflek
Verified simpleton
- Location
- Czech Republic
I mean that just because Boney says in relatively casual conversation that it could be fixed by slapping ten waystones in the area and connecting them to the Nexus doesn´t mean that its really that simple, because Praag still has nexus and it is still literally Praag. So clearly, there is something off.
chocolote12
A Penguin Flailing Against The Keyboard Of Life.
Maybe one.
Ten is a lot more than one. Compared to one ten is, in the same city, absurd overkill. It's positively unreasonable. It's roughly the same amount of geomantic engineering as the entirety of Altdorf, except instead of creating a good environment for apprentice wizards it's going to be set to 'Vacuum'.
There's no mystery behind Praag's existing infrastructure not being able to handle the issue, but ten Waystones having the capacity.
The easiest assumption here is that Praag's nexus cannot absorb as much energy as ten waystones can. We know Praag is recovering. It is just recovering slowly.
I cannot speculate as to whether the Praag nexus's absorption capability was always that low or it was crippled during the Great War against Chaos.
The first few major projects are going to require a lot of work on Mathilde's part. Maybe financially, politically, and militarily. Mathilde is probably going to have to do a lot of favor trading and negotiating. Like Pragg would not be that bad but we would need staff , military support and logistics. Most of that can probably be waved with Boris. Which means when we get that down and can show proof Means the Count of Ostermark would believes Mathilde when she says she can make Mordenhiem livable again.
In that scenario you'd expect attempts to communicate what it is they're perceiving, even if they're incoherent to people lacking that sense. But people with intuitive Magesight generally aren't doing that. It's possible that it's a distinct sense but the interpretation of what it perceives is happening at the subconscious level and the conscious mind is only receiving the end result, but if so there's nothing that could be used to argue for or against whether that sense is the same that Elves have.
pucflek
Verified simpleton
- Location
- Czech Republic
There is because Athel Yenlui has enough thoroughput to warp the magical make-up of enormous chunk of entire province.
Praag is just an early modern city. Its tiny. It makes no sense that it couldn´t rid it of this corruption in hundred fifty years.
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Interesting. If this were Eike quest I would probably still be tempted to go ask an elf in case they have some applicable insights, it would be a bit of a coup to have figured something like this out, but it's not so I'm content with this.
Thanks for the reply.
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The capacity a nexus has to absorb ambient magic should theoretically be different than its capability to route magic energy from one nexus and onto the next nexus.
I wouldn't be surprised if nexuses were mostly designed to just route energy between nexuses, with absorption capacity being minimized. The other possibility is that the Praag nexus was crippled during the Great War against Chaos and the Ice Witches focus on repairing the routing capacity.
Mopman43
Mountain-Hermit of Nitpeak
- Location
- Vermont
The streets of Pragg literally bleed every night. They have to clean it up in the morning.
I'm sure there are other locations that are somewhat corrupted that a single Nexus in the area could fix them right up.
Pragg's level of corruption really is unmatched in the Old World outside of like, Hellpit or something.
pucflek
Verified simpleton
- Location
- Czech Republic
Thats kind of my point. Its been century and half and its still like this.
I am willing to concede Mr Hobbits point that its possible Nexuses aren´t really all that good for absorbtion, but that seems dubious to me because Boris even remarks that they act up hard during Storms of Magic (at least i think it was that, maybe i misremembered). Ultimately, i guess we don´t know enough about Nexuses for me to to be so sure about my conclusions, but i still don´t see much that disproves them either.
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There is kinda a whole other point I was making. "The other possibility is that the Praag nexus was crippled during the Great War against Chaos and the Ice Witches focus on repairing the routing capacity."
We know that Praag has been recovering. It is just doing it incredibly slowly. Why are you assuming that the Praag nexus is operating anywhere near optimally? The Siege of Praag is just as close as you can possibly get to unoptimal circumstances. Combine a nexus that just went through the Siege of Praag with an area that has just had so much corruption run through it that it rivals the worst sections of the Chaos Wastes. So we have a probably crippled nexus that has to clean up I can't believe it's not the Realms of Chaos.
I also would not point to that quote as proof of nexuses having absorption capacity. I wouldn't be surprised if they were more capable than other waystones, but Boris was talking about blizzards. I think it is incredibly obvious why a nexus given over to the Ancient Widow, a spirit incredibly intertwined with winter and ice, would glow white during blizzards.
You're arguing against what Boney said. Perhaps you should think on the implications of that when you are asking people to disprove your point?
First, we don't actually know what role Praag's nexus is playing in the cleansing of the city. It's possible that a sole nexus isn't enough. It's possible that the nexus isn't even absorbing Dhar due to some quirk in either its construction or its modification by the Ice Witches.
Secondly, the Fire Spire is probably contributing to the magical pollution in Praag in some way, and in combination with the latent corruption is overwhelming the nexus—in which case additional waystones will only strengthen the network.
I don't think it's fair to point at Praag's nexus and say "well, it hasn't fixed anything, therefore the situation is unfixable", especially when we haven't even looked to see what's happening.
Secondly, the Fire Spire is probably contributing to the magical pollution in Praag in some way, and in combination with the latent corruption is overwhelming the nexus—in which case additional waystones will only strengthen the network.
I don't think it's fair to point at Praag's nexus and say "well, it hasn't fixed anything, therefore the situation is unfixable", especially when we haven't even looked to see what's happening.
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pucflek
Verified simpleton
- Location
- Czech Republic
Because i am assuming that waystones either work or they don´t.
Boney says a lot of things. If you look hard enough, you will find things that contradict themselves. That is why whats in the updates is the highest form of canon.
We know there is a Nexus, we know Praag is improving infinitesimaly slowly. That is enough for me to think there is something rather specific about the local network, and that adding onto it either won´t meet with Ice Witch approval or won´t directly work well. Neither of that contradicts anything that Boney said, it just builds hypotheses on back of what we do, in fact, know of the current situation and lore as presented in quest proper.
Not what i am really saying either. My personal opinion is that the slowness at which the nexuses appear to operate is inherent to the local network and that we may have to build a second one and route it all the way to the Empire. Which feels fraught politically, and difficult logistically. I can obviously also be incredibly wrong, but i weighed into the debate because i too feel that we should investigate before assuming we can "just" plug in the waystones and it will all work out because Boney said ten waystones will fix Praag in off the cuff comment.
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Tasoli
Life is for Living
- Location
- Behind the Keyboard.
Yeah what is off is that Chaos Wastes has expanded, by alot.
You are completely ignoring the fact that Chaos Wastes has expanded to the doorstep of Praag in the last Great War. Presumably those 10 waystones meant to push it back.
I don't know how Chaos Wastes effect nexus and its ability to absorb dhar but it might be overloading the intake of it either overmatcing its ability to absorb regularly enough creating excess Dhar or maybe trip some safeguard and shut it down for a short time every now and then which 10 waystones would solve.
pucflek
Verified simpleton
- Location
- Czech Republic
Karak Dum. Its far, far North of chaos wastes border constantly and it still saps enough to noticeably lower the ambient level.
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To expand on it, the Dum waystone/nexus whatever the fuck the dwarf adaptation is has cleared a sphere 25 kilometress across in middle of chaos wastes in two hundred years. In the same time Praag still has bleeding streets. Sure, Elven Nexuses with Ice Witch adaptations may not be exactly comparable but thats still really weird, isn´t it?
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- Location
- Earth
The tier list only needs to apply when there's a contradiction. There isn't one, since there's any number of ways to make both statements compatible.
The fuck is the proof for that? That is incredibly unintuitive. Even ignoring that the nexus had just gone through the Siege of Praag. These rocks have been warding the continent for four millennia. If disrupting one function would damn the whole thing, the Warhammer world would not have lasted millennia.
You are still arguing against Boney. If you want to argue against Boney, try finding substantial proof and not suppositions. None of this has been substantial. This isn't something directly stated in the updates. This is something you have made up entirely that pretty much everyone is disagreeing with you on.
We also know that ten waystones can give a firm date for Praag being Fine. Of all the places in the Old World, Praag suffered some of the worst horrors. It should be no surprise that its recovery would be difficult.
We have not been arguing over the possibility that there might be difficulties in connecting waystones to the Ice Witch network in Praag. We have been arguing over your claim that Boney was mistaken about whether Praag could be fixed with waystones. Do not try to move the goalposts. You know full well what people disagree with you on.
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