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Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

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Bringing her in to the circle of trust here is the best way to avoid her being (credibly) implicated in a chaos ritual. It does run a higher risk of Magic Dad and any other witnesses learning she's not a Haupt-Andersen but Magic Dad is not really an info risk and Alric dying "in the line of duty" is our most positive outcome anyway.
 
Redshirt Army said:
I expect there to be a decent synergy between bringing in Heidi and renegotiating with Mira - Mira will be able to say that this was an assignment from the highest levels to her faction, and thus steal a great deal of Alric's thunder.
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that's the other thing, I just dont like the 'renegotiate with Mira', its not part of the goal, and its not clear that we really want more lights enough to muddy the water like this.
 
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[X] Plan: Ritual Centre

Seems like a solid way to narrow things down.

[X] Plan Info
[X] Plan: Survey & Surcharge
[X] Plan Dig Up Info + Deniable Looting
 
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Angelform said:
If they have laundered all their stolen stuff into mere money (unlikely) then we just hand the money back to the Imperial Palace that Dieter robbed and be done with it.
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How do we prove the money is ill gotten, for that matter how to we prove any goods are ill gotten? That sounds like a complicated process at best, one that will eat time and make us enemies we can ill afford IMO.

No noble wants the precedent of 'surprise Grey Wizard Inquisition' over mere theft.
 
BurnNote said:
Because someone getting set up for a framing is a great reason to bring them in to counter it?
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Assuming everyone involved trusts that it is a frame job or the person being framed doesn't mind intense scrutiny. Neither is the case if we involve Alric

Lupercal said:
Alric dying "in the line of duty" is our most positive outcome anyway.
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Not really and especially not if we have to kill him, that would be straight up treason against the empire. Best case scenario would be Alric being so utterly discredited he has no nope of holding onto the patriarchy while remaining alive to keep fighting against chaos. Guy is a serious asset when not in the patriach's seat and we want him alive for the sake of the empire.
 
Jreengus said:
How does it waste an action? If we survey one we don't know whether the centre is with the other group of with the Albric. If we survey both we know for certain where it is. Surveying one provides little actionable info unless the one we pick happens to be the centre and even then it doesn't tell us if the centre is split between both groups. only surveying one is the wasted action, surveying both gives us good actionable intel for stopping the next murder.
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I don't mean it figuratively, I mean it literally. I didn't mean the benefit of a 50/50 taken twice. If one is right, that means the other isn't. Unless you mean surveying the wrong one gives some tangible benefit, then sure.
Valmond said:
Neither is Alric, and considering that even after the night of way too many vigorous debates he keeps on hanging on as the patriarch, i would not bet on him, not finding a way to make anything he is involved in look good for him given a tiniest change.
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But the scenario given implied Alric's competence over Mira. I am aware that wasn't literal. But while I do think the dice decide the outcomes, saying that will happen is discounting Mira's competence.

My point was that she's at an advantage in terms of info, with it rising with our contributions. It's fine to think that Alric can still spin this, but to give her no chance at all is wrong.
 
I think it would be for the best to coordinate things with Mira, the loot is tempting tho.

[x] Plan: Ritual Centre with Mira
- [x] Surveil the spa Unfahigers
- [x] Surveil the hunting lodge Unfahigers
- [x] Renegotiate with Mira
 
Swantree said:
I don't mean it figuratively, I mean it literally. I didn't mean the benefit of a 50/50 taken twice. If one is right, that means the other isn't. Unless you mean surveying the wrong one gives some tangible benefit, then sure.
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I believe the point they were making is that if we survey one and it's not the center, that still leaves us two possibilities- that the center is the other one, or Alberich.

If we survey both, we know for sure where it is.
 
We should just get a message to Heidi to make sure she does not leave altdorf for the next 3 months and remains in the public eye as much as possible.

Swantree said:
I don't mean it figuratively, I mean it literally. I didn't mean the benefit of a 50/50 taken twice. If one is right, that means the other isn't. Unless you mean surveying the wrong one gives some tangible benefit, then sure.

But the scenario given implied Alric's competence over Mira. I am aware that wasn't literal. But while I do think the dice decide the outcomes, saying that will happen is discounting Mira's competence.

My point was that she's at an advantage in terms of info, with it rising with our contributions. It's fine to think that Alric can still spin this, but to give her no chance at all is wrong.
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Again, Alric remained the patriarch after the night of lengthy disagreements, and so far Mira has been unable to oust him.
When it comes to remaining the patriarch or clawing credit out of a situation, i would expect him to be more competent than Mira.
bringing Alric in gives him a better change of getting credit than if we don't, and so far it is not sure we need to do so.
 
Swantree said:
I don't mean it figuratively, I mean it literally. I didn't mean the benefit of a 50/50 taken twice. If one is right, that means the other isn't. Unless you mean surveying the wrong one gives some tangible benefit, then sure.
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It isn't a 50/50 it is a 33/33/33, except two of the options could be right if the centre covers both groups. So if we only survey one regardless of the results we can't say for sure which of the groups is a valid target.
 
Mopman43 said:
I believe the point they were making is that if we survey one and it's not the center, that still leaves us two possibilities- that the center is the other one, or Alberich.
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Jreengus said:
It isn't a 50/50 it is a 33/33/33,
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Both Nurgle and dedication with Alric as sacrifice would very likely be centered on the spa. Ruling out the spa would almost certainly mean revenge.

Heidi x/+ Mira: Isn't intermingling of college and imperial politics frowned upon? I was under the impression that bringing in Heidi was an emergency option to hinder the investigation due to this incompatibility. If we're publicly bringing in multiple colleges and Heidi then she'll be under a lot of scrutiny specifically in terms of Haupt-Anderssen heritage.
 
You know, Mat is the most obvious and perceptive Grey Wizard in the world. So let's:

[X] Play to our Strengths.
-[X] Surveil the spa Unfahigers
-[X] Approach the hunting lodge Unfahigers
-[X] Ransack Krieglitz Manor

If Alric is at the spa, it's because he thinks the ritual is going to hit there. So let's see what we can see. The approach bit is Reginald's prefered option, and it's good for spiting Alric's credit. And gets our foot in the door for other stuff. Like the Ransack and watching them for targets.
 
I think bringing Heidi in is a bad idea, she would draw waaaaaay too much attention that we could not dispell, it would make people suspicious of her and people know she's friends with us and so implicates us too. Just too much stuff.
 
Lampshade said:
Both Nurgle and dedication with Alric as sacrifice would very likely be centered on the spa. Ruling out the spa would almost certainly mean revenge.

Heidi x/+ Mira: Isn't intermingling of college and imperial politics frowned upon? I was under the impression that bringing in Heidi was an emergency option to hinder the investigation due to this incompatibility. If we're publicly bringing in multiple colleges and Heidi then she'll be under a lot of scrutiny specifically in terms of Haupt-Anderssen heritage.
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No why would it be frowned on? The emperor is literally our boss.
 
…I love how Mathilde just gets continuously more and more capable of completely fucking the empire over if she ever wanted to. It's a hilarious thought.
 
Wait... if the current estate isn't the focus of the ritual because it's too recent, has anyone looked at the grounds of the family's previous estate?
 
[x] Plan: Ritual Centre
-[x] Surveil the spa Unfahigers
-[x] Surveil the hunting lodge Unfahigers
-[x] Research: Alberich's life
 
Lampshade said:
Both Nurgle and dedication with Alric as sacrifice would very likely be centered on the spa. Ruling out the spa would almost certainly mean revenge.
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I'm not sure how you're getting that. My read is that Empowerment and dedication are centered on Alberic as he is the focus of the ritual while revenge is centered on the victims but could be either group as the ritual is focused on the conspiracy and he is just carrying out the ritual.
 
[x] Plan: Ritual Centre
-[x] Surveil the spa Unfahigers
-[x] Surveil the hunting lodge Unfahigers
-[x] Research: Alberich's life
 
Your actual objective: Ensure this matter is resolved without revealing the Empress is not a Haupt-Anderssen, and without the Empress being implicated in a Chaos Ritual of Vengeance.



-[ ] Research: Alberich's life
For all the time you spent cleaning up the mess he made, you never learned much about Alberich as a person. Find out what sort of ruler he was, and that might give you insight into whatever he is now.

knowing habits will give more clues on where he is than if he has a tentacle mole on his ass that he can cover-up and who would be good for the Scouring the city. was he a good woodsman and hiker? then the cult of Taal or the Longshank would be helpful in finding him. was he the time that couldn't last a day without the find things in life? then we might need the Elector Count of Talabecland to let us turn over any fancy hotels.

-[ ] Surveil the spa Unfahigers

the absolute worst thing that could happen is that Alric saves them, gets back in power, but still thinks that Hidi was involed.



Ideally, we can catch the culprit before something happens but to do that most effectively we need to give a good bio to a search party while still making sure the people stay alive.

this plan is based on adding as much bonuses to [ ] Scour the city: specify who with next turn.

edit: because im blind.
[x] Plan: Ritual Centre
-[x] Surveil the spa Unfahigers
-[x] Surveil the hunting lodge Unfahigers
-[x] Research: Alberich's life
 
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Valmond said:
Again, Alric remained the patriarch after the night of lengthy disagreements, and so far Mira has been unable to oust him.
When it comes to remaining the patriarch or clawing credit out of a situation, i would expect him to be more competent than Mira.
bringing Alric in gives him a better change of getting credit than if we don't, and so far it is not sure we need to do so.
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That's finding patterns where there shouldn't be. You have every evidence to say this is right. But this implies that when it comes to this type of situation where it is Alric vs Mira, Alric wins. That's the part where I disagree.

Jreengus said:
It isn't a 50/50 it is a 33/33/33, except two of the options could be right if the centre covers both groups. So if we only survey one regardless of the results we can't say for sure which of the groups is a valid target.
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We're arguing on different premises then.

[ ] Surveil the spa Unfahigers
If the ritual is centred on them, enough observation will tell you what sort of ritual it is.
[ ] Surveil the hunting lodge Unfahigers
If the ritual is centred on them, enough observation will tell you what sort of ritual it is.

My stance took both of these literally.

The interpretation is this:
"If you take this option and are correct you learn everything, if wrong, you learn nothing"

Hence why taking both at the same time means wasting one action. Because while it means we'll hit, it also means one action misses at the cost of certainty.

I use waste because I don't think it's necessary to take both the same turn. If you pick Hunting and miss, take Spa next turn. Don't know how to write in words the math for this, but I at least hope my intuiting is right.
 
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