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Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

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[X] Plan Research

[X] Plan Means Motive Opportunity

Renegotiation also calls attention to it on top of wasting an action
Penny wise, pound foolish
 
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But what are putting on the table to renegotiate with Mira? That we're going to do what? Stop Alric in his plan to stop Chaos plot? Stop the plot ourselves? What if we're forced, by circumstances, to work with Alric anyway?
 
[X] Plan Means Motive Opportunity
-[X] Research: Murder Rituals
-[X] Research: Alberich's Life
-[X] Investigate Krieglitz Manor

Lets build a picture of our key suspect; how is he killing them, how is he picking his targets, and where and when is he doing it (we already know the when).

Happy to swap out "Life" for "Fate" or "Form", I had difficulty picking the best one to start with.
 
Chopak said:
But what are putting on the table to renegotiate with Mira? That we're going to do what? Stop Alric in his plan to stop Chaos plot? Stop the plot ourselves? What if we're forced, by circumstances, to work with Alric anyway?
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Working with Alric is sabotaging him by splitting the credit:
Boney said:
[ ] Approach Alric directly
Working with him means splitting the credit, which would partly fulfil your implied objective and let you be on hand to perform your actual objective. But while refusing your assistance would put him in an uncomfortable position should he fail, it does mean he'd know you're involved, and he may work against you.
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The only way we end up not sabotaging Alric is if we do nothing and leave. Regardless of what we do, if we minimise the credit he gets by helping him do it, we've sabotaged him.
 
Chopak said:
But what are putting on the table to renegotiate with Mira? That we're going to do what? Stop Alric in his plan to stop Chaos plot? Stop the plot ourselves?
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Stop Alric from being able to ride back into power from claiming full credit for stopping a Chaos plot and saving a noble family.

Chopak said:
What if we're forced, by circumstances, to work with Alric anyway?
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Then you don't get the agreed-upon payment.
 
[X] Plan Research
-[X] Interrogate the hunting lodge Unfahigers
-[X] Research: Murder Rituals
-[X] Investigate Krieglitz Manor

[X] Plan Means Motive Opportunity
-[X] Research: Murder Rituals
-[X] Research: Alberich's Life
-[X] Investigate Krieglitz Manor
 
Renegotiating isn't just for getting extra benefits by the way. It allows us to bring over Horstmann and Elrisse into the investigation without having to navigate the fact that we implied something to Regimand that was not true. Making the implication true resolves that complication and removes the downside of bringing over the Lights.
 
Hm. My big concern with renegotiation is that unless we can come up with a very good excuse, Mira will probably pick up that we have some special interest in what Alric's turned out to be doing, since it's not like it's the sort of thing we'd need to stick our nose in for the good of the Empire. & given the whole "Matriarch of the Revealing-Truths Order" thing, I'm extremely reluctant to have her looking in the direction of things we want staying secret.
 
Wiadi said:
Hm. My big concern with renegotiation is that unless we can come up with a very good excuse, Mira will probably pick up that we have some special interest in what Alric's turned out to be doing, since it's not like it's the sort of thing we'd need to stick our nose in for the good of the Empire. & given the whole "Matriarch of the Revealing-Truths Order" thing, I'm extremely reluctant to have her looking in the direction of things we want staying secret.
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Alberich Haupt-Anderssen was the EC of Stirland before the Van Hals. Mathilde is a Stirlander. Mathilde spent 7 years as a Councillor in Stirland. The conclusion she is likely to come to is more likely that it's a Stirland thing than a Ranaldite thing.
 
Wiadi said:
Hm. My big concern with renegotiation is that unless we can come up with a very good excuse, Mira will probably pick up that we have some special interest in what Alric's turned out to be doing, since it's not like it's the sort of thing we'd need to stick our nose in for the good of the Empire. & given the whole "Matriarch of the Revealing-Truths Order" thing, I'm extremely reluctant to have her looking in the direction of things we want staying secret.
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She's not going to pretend that she's volunteering to do it out of the goodness of her heart, she's going to be angling for some sort of payment. Wanting to be paid is an extremely believable motivation.
 
[X] Plan Research
-[X] Interrogate the hunting lodge Unfahigers
-[X] Research: Murder Rituals
-[X] Investigate Krieglitz Manor

[X] Plan Means Motive Opportunity
-[X] Research: Murder Rituals
-[X] Research: Alberich's Life
-[X] Investigate Krieglitz Manor
 
Codex said:
Stirlander is significantly older than Mathilde. She was described as middle aged many years ago. Regimand is an older guy, but he's not a fossil like Melkoth or Alric.
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5 or 6 years ago.

Fayhem said:
It should be noted that the effects of the Coin would stop anyone from following us, but it wouldn't make anyone forget we were there if we got busted in the act. And Alric knows where we live and work, so he could literally just show up at the Waystones Project and go "so, about you breaking into the spa I was guarding to interrogate people I was protecting."
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Mathilde can just reply with 'Yeah, that sounds like something I'd do' and leave it at that.

Alric isn't in our Order and Mathilde isn't a Journsywoman or even a regular Magister.

As an LM she can investigate freely and the only people who can order her around are Algard, Dragomas and Luitpold.


Codex said:
The only way we end up not sabotaging Alric is if we do nothing and leave. Regardless of what we do, if we minimise the credit he gets by helping him do it, we've sabotaged him
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There's also the case where he manages to stop whatever is happening before we can.

Wiadi said:
Hm. My big concern with renegotiation is that unless we can come up with a very good excuse, Mira will probably pick up that we have some special interest in what Alric's turned out to be doing, since it's not like it's the sort of thing we'd need to stick our nose in for the good of the Empire. & given the whole "Matriarch of the Revealing-Truths Order" thing, I'm extremely reluctant to have her looking in the direction of things we want staying secret.
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So she'll know that Mathilde has special imterest in stop a Chaos plot.

That's not unusual - for the matter getting the credit is enough to be a special interest since Alric shoring up his position is likely Great Deed territory.
 
Codex said:
Alberich Haupt-Anderssen was the EC of Stirland before the Van Hals. Mathilde is a Stirlander. Mathilde spent 7 years as a Councillor in Stirland. The conclusion she is likely to come to is more likely that it's a Stirland thing than a Ranaldite thing.
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Hm, I suppose Mathilde is a sufficiently chronic meddler in Stirland-related affairs that aren't strictly her job (see: Alkharad) that that should be believable enough. Still not perfectly safe but hell, what is.

That said, even with renegotiation, bringing in Horstmann & Elrisse could still lead to stories not lining up in terms of order of events - they'll know what terms Mathilde originally agreed to & that said terms wouldn't compel interference here.
 
Boney said:
She's not going to pretend that she's volunteering to do it out of the goodness of her heart, she's going to be angling for some sort of payment. Wanting to be paid is an extremely believable motivation.
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Wanting to be paid is a believable reason to meddle but she could've gotten paid for promising interference earlier, so that'd at least loosely imply that her interest in meddling increased upon discovering what she'd be meddling in, no?
 
[X] Plan Find Suspicious behaviour
-[X] Approach the hunting lodge Unfahigers
-[X] Research: Murder Rituals
-[X] Research: Underworld Turbulence
 
Wiadi said:
Wanting to be paid is a believable reason to meddle but she could've gotten paid for promising interference earlier, so that'd at least loosely imply that her interest in meddling increased upon discovering what she'd be meddling in, no?
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She could simply say she didn't want to make a promise without any idea of what she was promising, and having evaluated the situation she thinks she can tackle it. You can probably believe me when I say that Mathilde can convincingly sell this.
 
[X] Plan Means Motive Opportunity

I guess there's no hurry to talk to witnesses until we look into the suspect, the motive and the scene of the crime?

[X] Plan Renegotiation
 
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Wiadi said:
Hm, I suppose Mathilde is a sufficiently chronic meddler in Stirland-related affairs that aren't strictly her job (see: Alkharad) that that should be believable enough. Still not perfectly safe but hell, what is.
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She's a noble in Stirland as well as a shareholder in one of Stirland's largest trading ventures and a fromer council member.

That's leaving aside being a LM, being a Grey LM and having actually brushed past the plot early in her career.

Codex said:
I'm 22 years old. 5 or 6 years is an incredibly long time to me.
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6 years ago I would have still been older than 22 (even if not by much).

Now I feel old - positively ancient.
 
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