Voting is open
Looking at this, the Victorians will be utterly depleted if they lose here. Chicago has a source for more ships and F-16s, but they do not. If losing them helps win this fight, it's a good trade.

There's a limit to how many ships can mutually support each other in AAA, and only the howitzer ones will be useful in shelling the Victorians. Keep the howitzer ships shelling, load their Marines on the autocannon ships, and send those to salvage. Put the two remaining F-16s on CAP over the salvage operation. If the Victorians chase them they aren't attaching ships and the Chicago planes can flee before they close. If they don't, they'll expose themselves to attack while lining up on the ships. If they send anything at the salvage operation at all that's something they aren't sending at the important ships.
 
No, because you still need to bring the equipment out into the field, even if you don't use it. The question is "Do we bring our Abrams out, or leave them sitting back in the rear area maintenance bays?"
Just to be clear, your understanding is that @PoptartProdigy will charge us for a use of Old World Equipment even if the enemy restricts themselves to probing attacks for which Old World Equipment is not required to contain the situation? I'm pretty sure that's the opposite of what they said.

Relevant quote from update that I think people haven't paid enough attention to.

We're dealing with rather less Heavy equipment then what left Toledo
Still probably more than we can handle without Old World Equipment.

Also, bear in mind that realistically a lot of the armored vehicles the Victorians will have "lost" in the past week or so will be tanks that hit a mine and broke a track, or that got bogged down in the mud and can't be dragged out easily. A "killed" tank doesn't necessarily stay 'dead' unless you overrun its location and stop the enemy from salvaging it. A "mission-killed" tank definitely doesn't.

Looking at this, the Victorians will be utterly depleted if they lose here. Chicago has a source for more ships and F-16s, but they do not. If losing them helps win this fight, it's a good trade.
Chicago does not have a clear source for more airplanes, and Victoria definitely has a potential source for military equipment.

Russia.

There's a limit to how many ships can mutually support each other in AAA, and only the howitzer ones will be useful in shelling the Victorians. Keep the howitzer ships shelling, load their Marines on the autocannon ships, and send those to salvage. Put the two remaining F-16s on CAP over the salvage operation.
Two F-16s can't maintain a continuous combat air patrol; they'll have to touch down to refuel regularly. And the enemy will be able to freely pick a time to strike.

Moreover, three gunboats will not be able to put up the volume of air defense fire required to repel a large strike. There is a limit to how many ships can mutually support each other with AA gunfire, but it's a lot lower than "three."

This is just a plan for getting assets picked off uselessly by dangling them out where the enemy can hit them.
 
Honestly, the 3rd may well earn a new nickname for themselves. Something like the Anvils or some other name that denotes their toughness? The 3rd may well become our defensive/siege warfare specialists while the Big Red One is the flashy hammer.
3rd Division... Rock of the Marne Detroit? :)

[ ] Plan Shoot, Loot, & Scoot
-[ ] Hold the 1st Division as a reaction force to counter any dangerous crossings, most especially in terms of Victorian armor.
-[ ] No. The decisive moment has not come, and the 1st Division remains your most fearsome assets even without their usual gear.
-[ ] You will leave the bridge standing until blowing it presents the opportunity to split the Victorian force in half. The Victorians will almost certainly find and defuse the charges; leaving the Navy on call to bombard the bridge is highly recommended if you intend to use this tactic.
-[ ] The Navy will divide and conquer. The fleet's marine contingent, escorted by three gunboats, will take the stranded freighter. The other eight ships keep guns and pressure on the advancing Victorians.

Keep 1st Div in reserve until needed. We certainly want a fast, mobile force to contain any bridgeheads. And we definitely don't want to touch the bridge until and unless we absolutely have to, and even then we wait until there are Vickies on top of it and partly across. As long as the bridge is up, they will try for it, and that gives us some degree of control of where they focus their attention. So we wire it up, nice and obviously... and make sure there are at least 2 more sets of charges to do the job when the big main obvious one is 'safed' by the CMC, if they get that far. Then we drop the bridge when they're halfway over it, or have the Navy do it. Or even just Field Arty. That bridge isn't moving, and they can turn it into a killing alley with pre-sighted fires.

Basically, we dangle the bridge as bait, and we can safely rely on the Vickies' not having the restraint to not use the bridge. (BTRs are amphibious, but they're not great at it, and any river crossing against opposition is a nightmare even with nominally amphib vehicles.) Even if they somehow do refuse the bait, that leaves us no poorer but a little demo charges, and we can disarm them and use the bridge ourselves if desired in a counterattack. (If the Vickies do ignore the bridge, it will be a likely shock to them when the bridge they've labeled 'unsuable' in their heads turns out to only be so for them.)

And oh yes do we want to loot that 80,000 ton ship of goods. Not just to have it, but if we can get some down on the line, letting the Vickies see their own captured hardware coming back at them will be glorious.
 
Last edited:
-[ ] Ready the Old World Equipment, but only deploy it if the Victorians gain a substantial bridgehead north of the Raisin, including threatening levels of Victorian armor. Their infantry alone isn't a big enough threat to justify using it- but an armored breakout is.
Gonna have to nix this one. You're talking about swapping out the equipment being used by over ten thousand soldiers; you can't do it on demand like that. It's a fairly intensive operation, which is why you're making the decision now, as the Big Red One rotates through its supply dumps in Detroit.
-Our gunboats have been in two battles.
Thats more than most navies can claim in this day and age, but a long way from experienced.
The bulk of their experience comes from years of anti-piracy and customs operations along the Chicago river systems. Remember, this navy is inherited from the city-state of Chicago.
COMMENT
Regarding the cargo ship:
We don't have the marines to storm it. A Des Plaines has a total crew of 63 officers and men.
That comes up to roughly 700 men across 11 gunboats. Total. In the navy.
They can't spare the troops. And we don't have special forces.

Alternative Suggestion: We left a brigade of regulars watching the East. A brigade has several battalions. A battalion has several companies. Draw two or three companies of men from the brigade, each numbering 80-150 men.
Add a couple platoons of combat engineers to sweep for traps.

Use some civilian boats and heavy machine guns to provide long range fire support as our men in other civilian boats approach the ship. An M240 SAW has a maximum effective range of 1.1km, so we can simply fire over the heads of our troops until they get close and storm the ship.
If you wanna throw Quality 1 troops with no training in boarding operations, boat technicals as their fire support, and rowboats as their landing craft at the cargo ship, be my guest.

Personally, I advise the Quality 2 marines who have years of experience in anti-piracy and boarding roles and have purpose-built landing craft, supported by twenty-two 20mm autocannons.

When I called for designs, I made sure to specify that the Des Plaines should have sealift capacity adequate for small-scale amphibious assault. It's in there; I simply imagine that the marines whose job in no way interfaces with the operation of the ship are not included in the crew count.
 
3rd Division... Rock of the Marne Detroit? :)

[ ] Plan Shoot, Loot, & Scoot
-[ ] Hold the 1st Division as a reaction force to counter any dangerous crossings, most especially in terms of Victorian armor.
-[ ] No. The decisive moment has not come, and the 1st Division remains your most fearsome assets even without their usual gear.
-[ ] You will leave the bridge standing until blowing it presents the opportunity to split the Victorian force in half. The Victorians will almost certainly find and defuse the charges; leaving the Navy on call to bombard the bridge is highly recommended if you intend to use this tactic.
-[ ] The Navy will divide and conquer. The fleet's marine contingent, escorted by three gunboats, will take the stranded freighter. The other eight ships keep guns and pressure on the advancing Victorians.

Keep 1st Div in reserve until needed. We certainly want a fast, mobile force to contain any bridgeheads. And we definitely don't want to touch the bridge until and unless we absolutely have to, and even then we wait until there are Vickies on top of it and partly across. As long as the bridge is up, they will try for it, and that gives us some degree of control of where they focus their attention. So we wire it up, nice and obviously... and make sure there are at least 2 more sets of charges to do the job when the big main obvious one is 'safed' by the CMC, if they get that far. Then we drop the bridge when they're halfway over it, or have the Navy do it. Or even just Field Arty. That bridge isn't moving, and they can turn it into a killing alley with pre-sighted fires.

Basically, we dangle the bridge as bait, and we can safely rely on the Vickies' not having the restraint to not use the bridge. (BTRs are amphibious, but they're not great at it, and any river crossing against opposition is a nightmare even with nominally amphib vehicles.) Even if they somehow do refuse the bait, that leaves us no poorer but a little demo charges, and we can disarm them and use the bridge ourselves if desired in a counterattack. (If the Vickies do ignore the bridge, it will be a likely shock to them when the bridge they've labeled 'unsuable' in their heads turns out to only be so for them.)

And oh yes do we want to loot that 80,000 ton ship of goods. Not just to have it, but if we can get some down on the line, letting the Vickies see their own captured hardware coming back at them will be glorious.
My big concerns with your plan:
1) The 1st Division may struggle to deal with the CMC amphibious armor even with the advantage of trying to hold a river crossing. Among other things, the fact that it's being held in reserve makes it likely that the CMC will have already secured a beachhead with its BTRs before they arrive, unless the frontline troops do an unusually good job holding the line of the river. If several dozen amphibious AFVs are already on our side of the river, we've got a threat that's going to be hard to contain.

2) Your vote is to let a large fraction of the entire Victorian army cross the bridge before blowing it up, but it sounds like your actual pan was to blow up the bridge while the Viks have at most reached it and started crossing. If we followed your plan as it's written, we'd be resolving to let the Viks force a whole division or two across the bridge and only THEN start trying to cut it.

3) Dividing our gunboat fleet makes them more vulnerable to air attack. The fleet as a whole, and the army as a whole, both have enough aggregate air defense that I can be pretty confident of them handling a twenty-plane attack with some measure of grace. A three-ship detachment, not so much.

-Our gunboats have been in two battles.
Thats more than most navies can claim in this day and age, but a long way from experienced.

-Just checked.
At least some of our gunboats have MANPADs.
Makes me feel better about the whole thing, regardless of how the vote turns out.

-Japanese A6Ms don't have a 100% hit rate.
A Falcon jet with surface search and fire control radar is likely to be a very different proposition.
Especially when the target is a coalburning gunboat with a max speed of 14 knots.

And they don't need a 100% hit rate at our relative numbers.
The wild card is NCR sabotage. And pilot morale.

- They can afford to lose all their aircraft.
Won't change their offensive campaign strategy any. Not now the ASMs are gone.


-Yes, they could try rigging up a radio.
Do they know how, though? Serious question. The Vic education system has....deficiencies. They're smart and committed, but their ideology emphasizes.....different things than technical proficiency for the average grunt.

-I suspect we have actually shot down most all their Cessnas.
The planes themselves are relatively cheap and easy to repair, the pilots are not. And those biplanes are vulnerable to aimed 5.56mm rifle fire. Let alone a good MG. Scouting low level over land against people prepared to ambush scouts must have been painful.

Given that the area of need is the land, any surviving planes wont be on the lake anyway.

-Mark One Eyeball recon is really not easy on water.
Easier with our coal smoke gunboats, but finding a group of boats that dont want to be found is hard.
Demonstrated during WW2.

-It's been a week with the southern force under artillery bombardment from the water.
If they still had ASMs theyd have used them by now. They could beg Alexander for a rush delivery, but Russian munitions are not compatible with Falcons unless domething big has changed.

-Fishing boats with radar reflectors.
It's both cheap and viable. Not like the navy doesn't have the waters plastered with scouts.
And like I said, the laker is big enough to hide anything from it's offside in it's sensor shadow.

I mean, left to me, I'd take advantage of that to set up a couple mousetraps several times, with a couple fishing boats towing radar reflectors to look like a strike mission, and other fishing boats lying doggo, only holding one man with a radio to Detroit Air Radar and a second guy with a MANPAD.

Now if they asked, Alexander could probably provide realtime intel coverage.
But they wont ask.
Not this time.

-That's why their armor is a priority target, sho gbo?
Hard to fight a battle of maneuver with light infantry after trashing your vehicles.

-We've actually been hammering their logistics all week.
I worry about scaring them off prematurely. We did just destroy almost half the army in a week.
And there are no good reports about what happened. Just a blast of panicked voices, then silence.

Almost like a horror story.

Insensitive munitions.
Kind of a new thing outside of nuclear weapon initiators, but the US is replacing TNT with IMX101, a type of it. It's not absolute, but it makes improvised explosives a tad more difficult than laying a trail of gunpowder. :p

Else there is no reason they wouldn't have taken the ship's boats and escaped to shore after blowing the ship.
Victorian doctrine prizes initiative after all, and they have been listening to what happened to the eastern AoC.
If the ship is still there, it has to be because they can't blow it up.

I wouldn't be considering sending ship marines there otherwise.
Abandoned, or manned by soldiers who can't blow it up, and are too conscientious to abandon it.

Not a pilot either.
-Wooden fishing boats lying doggo, with a man covered by blankets and armed with a radio and a MANPAD.
Put several of them a couple miles out from the main body of gunboats, and aircraft looking to jump the gunboats get ambushed by MANPADs they didn't see coming.

Repeat a couple times and the survivors get more cautious. Hence not repeatable.

-It's been a week.
That cargo ship should have been abandoned by now. Taken the ship's boats and run after the eastern rout happened.
Don't Vics prize initiative?

COMMENT
Regarding the cargo ship:
We don't have the marines to storm it. A Des Plaines has a total crew of 63 officers and men.
That comes up to roughly 700 men across 11 gunboats. Total. In the navy.
They can't spare the troops. And we don't have special forces.

Alternative Suggestion: We left a brigade of regulars watching the East. A brigade has several battalions. A battalion has several companies. Draw two or three companies of men from the brigade, each numbering 80-150 men.
Add a couple platoons of combat engineers to sweep for traps.

Use some civilian boats and heavy machine guns to provide long range fire support as our men in other civilian boats approach the ship. An M240 SAW has a maximum effective range of 1.1km, so we can simply fire over the heads of our troops until they get close and storm the ship.
Uju, I think you're making a lot of unsupported or poorly justified assumptions about what will and won't work, or what is and isn't possible, or how effective This One Neat Trick will be. One neat trick COULD ambush a scout plane that gets careless, so it has done so, so the enemy doesn't have scout planes anymore or can't see our gunboat fleet's movements across the lake. Things like that.

I could go into more detail, but this is starting to seem like a recurring pattern, and I'd like to suggest that you maybe adjust downwards the level of certainty you apply. In situations where you're thinking "this will probably work somewhat," you often seem to be thinking "this will definitely work super-effectively." Or thinking "I can think of a narrative that explains why it's impossible for someone to do X, so clearly they haven't done X."

Some of the time, things like this are going to be cases of you being right and me being wrong, but I'm finding enough specific cases where I know for a fact that you've overlooked something important, that I'm starting to feel like getting down to ground level with you on it would be unproductive without addressing the broad issue of excessive certainty.

Gonna have to nix this one. You're talking about swapping out the equipment being used by over ten thousand soldiers; you can't do it on demand like that. It's a fairly intensive operation, which is why you're making the decision now, as the Big Red One rotates through its supply dumps in Detroit.
Er, hat's not what I meant by that write-in.

What I was aiming for was "prepare the Old World Equipment for use, but don't do anything with it until the Victorians stage a massive breakthrough or a lot of their armor shows up on the battlefield." So like, yes, prepare a reserve force armed with Old World Equipment, but then don't use it until and unless a large, threatening target appears that's worth using it on.

Can we have a write-in that says "Prepare Old World Equipment for use as a reserve force, but be unusually conservative about committing that reserve," and if circumstances justifying committing the reserves don't arise, avoid expending the OWE charge?

I know it's likely we'll need to commit that reserve to hold the Raisin Line, but I still want to make sure it's saved for worthy targets and not expended on just mowing through a bunch more Victorian infantry.
 
Er, hat's not what I meant by that write-in.

What I was aiming for was "prepare the Old World Equipment for use, but don't do anything with it until the Victorians stage a massive breakthrough or a lot of their armor shows up on the battlefield." So like, yes, prepare a reserve force armed with Old World Equipment, but then don't use it until and unless a large, threatening target appears that's worth using it on.

Can we have a write-in that says "Prepare Old World Equipment for use as a reserve force, but be unusually conservative about committing that reserve," and if circumstances justifying committing the reserves don't arise, avoid expending the OWE charge?

I know it's likely we'll need to commit that reserve to hold the Raisin Line, but I still want to make sure it's saved for worthy targets and not expended on just mowing through a bunch more Victorian infantry.
Could you define, "large, threatening target?" I'm trying to get a handle on the level of conservativeness for which you're aiming, here.

Because if I'm reading you correctly, what you are proposing is just the default, "use the 1st Division as a reserve," option.
 
Unless we prepare OWE at the start of the engagement and thus use up a charge we won't be able to contain a breakthrough by CMC if they cross the river.

OWE isn't just ammo and missiles. Its the spare parts and other materials needed to get the M1s and other high tech equipment ready for combat.

We aren't going to be able to get the best of both worlds. We either need to commit to using up a charge and blunt the enemy armored forces if they try something or accept that if we guess wrong and not use the charge we risk allowing a breakthrough that will allow the CMC to inflict heavy casualties on our defenders and make it a lot harder to disengage to fall back to the second line.

@Simon_Jester the OWE use option specifically targets the Victorian tanks. I'm rather doubting that it'll be wasted against infantry.

-[ ] As a reaction force to counter any dangerous crossings, most especially in terms of Victorian armor.

-[ ] Yes. You have confirmed some mission kills on Victorian armor, but you haven't eliminated them as a force. You needs the Abrams tanks in place.

The reaction force option *also* stresses Victorian armor units.

I'm really not getting why you think that the OWE will be wasted if we use it and do reaction force. I'd understand it if the idea is to add the 1st Division to the line instead of acting as reaction force. But both the Reaction and OWE options pick out the Victorian armor as priority.
 
Last edited:
Could you define, "large, threatening target?" I'm trying to get a handle on the level of conservativeness for which you're aiming, here.
Either:
1) Large amounts of Victorian armor (the Waffen CMC or the Savior Division, and not just a few armored platoons detached from same), OR
2) A Victorian infantry attack so successful that it's threatening to overwhelm our forces before they can fall back.

The big thing is that if the Victorians try to lead with a 'pawn attack' instead of leading with their heaviest units, I'd rather hold the OWE in reserve and withdraw in front of them. What's got me a bit mixed up is whether just getting the OWE ready to use ON the Victorian mechanized units expends a charge even if said mechanized units never show up and all we're fighting is big waves of infantry that make only gradual headway.

Unless we prepare OWE at the start of the engagement and thus use up a charge we won't be able to contain a breakthrough by CMC if they cross the river.
@PoptartProdigy

If we stipulate for the sake of argument that our troops can't contain a breakthrough by the CMC without Old World Equipment, is this true? I may be confused about how the OWE rules work.
 
Either:
1) Large amounts of Victorian armor (the Waffen CMC or the Savior Division, and not just a few armored platoons detached from same), OR
2) A Victorian infantry attack so successful that it's threatening to overwhelm our forces before they can fall back.

The big thing is that if the Victorians try to lead with a 'pawn attack' instead of leading with their heaviest units, I'd rather hold the OWE in reserve and withdraw in front of them. What's got me a bit mixed up is whether just getting the OWE ready to use ON the Victorian mechanized units expends a charge even if said mechanized units never show up and all we're fighting is big waves of infantry that make only gradual headway.

@PoptartProdigy

If we stipulate for the sake of argument that our troops can't contain a breakthrough by the CMC without Old World Equipment, is this true? I may be confused about how the OWE rules work.
The option to hold the BRO in reserve is in line with your hoped-for tactics.

OWE expends a charge if OWE is used. If you use OWE and the BRO needs to engage in combat, a charge is expended. If you use OWE and the BRO (miraculous_ never needs to lift a finger, no charge is expended. If you elect to use the equipment and then other circumstances intervene to make that unnecessary, I'm not going to punish you for thoughtcrime.
 
The Erie Campaign: Down But Not Out
The Erie Campaign

Down But Not Out​

General Daria Franks never expected to command her forces in a conventional war.

The head of the Chicagoan Air Patrol has always known her position to be something of a fig leaf. Officially, her job has always been search-and-rescue operations and scouting work for the Navy.

Unofficially, her forces are a counter-insurgency unit meant to support the navy in pirate suppression missions.

Right up until the frenzied, desperate race to arm up for the war with Victoria, Franks only commanded piston aircraft which Victoria would dismiss as simple observer planes. No self-respecting Victorian actually pays attention to air craft; none of them looked closely enough to find that the planes were armed. Press reports on piracy operations could regularly be relied upon to talk up the Chicagoan Navy's contributions to operations and minimize the Air Patrol's -- after all, having a true navy, and so formidable a navy, was a matter of considerable prestige abroad. However, that does not change the Patrol's achievements.

Scouting, yes, support of SAR missions when necessary, but the missions playbook was COIN operations from cover to cover. Every plane was armed with cannons for ground attack. All the pilots trained extensively for that role. And they dealt death from the skies reliably and precisely. It was not an air force to contest the skies. It was not a truly formidable force. However, more than once, it made the difference between a hard fight and the Navy looking really fucking good. That job went on without a blip once the Commonwealth was incorporated, the Chicagoan Air Patrol becoming the Commonwealth Air Force and eating the tiny forces of other signatories in the process. Normal operations continued. If anything, they intensified.

And now, in less than a day of dogfighting with jet fighters, it's dead.

Franks goes over the casualty report again. It's not doing any good. She knows it isn't. But it makes her feel...not better, but it makes her feel not worse. She'll take it.

It's not that she didn't know it was a suicide mission. She knew. Her pilots knew. Turboprops, at best, going up against F-16s flown by pilots specialized in air combat? It was never going to end any other way. They all went up anyway.

So very few of them came back down in one piece.

Franks leans back in her chair. It could be worse. It could always be worse. Some of the actual planes from the old Patrol survived. Most of them went up with the sortie, but a fair few stayed back. A lot of what went up was the restored old jets, never useful to the Patrol and too provocative to fly until open war was on their doorstep. The Patrol craft that did fly for the engagement over Erie were only up there because they could not find another functioning air frame, no matter how creaky, for any cost. The rest are back in Chicago as insurance. But every pilot from the Patrol flew.

Optimistically, once all of the recoveries are done, less than half of them will be coming home. That's assuming that every single pilot on the books as MIA is alive and free to return to friendly lines.

It's not going to be that good. There were too many reports of Vees strafing parachuting pilots. It's not going to be anywhere near that good.

But she has to hope.

Seven planes returned intact enough that at least one of their pilots survived. Ten pilots in total, most wounded. Four planes came down just fine, returning four pilots alive and uninjured. One of those, Second Lieutenant Harrelson, flying a Skyraider of all things, is actually claiming gun kills. Amazingly, her camera footage is bearing her out. That's one to watch, there. Finally, the search-and-recovery efforts have brought back five downed pilots.

Out of an air force comprising seventy-three pilots with combat wings -- most of them veterans, albeit with precious little experience or training in air-to-air combat -- General Franks can currently account for nineteen.

And this, over the past few days, as the army fights and dies and the navy waits to once more cover itself in glory, is what Daria Franks has been doing -- coordinating endless SAR efforts in the hopes that she can get the number of pilots brought back just a little bit higher. At least she doesn't need to coordinate another sortie. It would be her air force's last.

Instead, she can focus on that number. Nineteen. Nineteen.

Oh, hey. Twenty.

He'll never walk again, but twenty.

* * *
"-General?"

Franks blinks, looking up from her reports. "Twenty-seven," she croaks, eyes bloodshot.

The Lieutenant in the door leans back. "Er...ma'am?"

Franks stares at him for a moment. "What?" Then she shakes herself. "Hang on. You said something. What?"

"General Burns has sent a request for you to come to the command center, ma'am," says the young man. "We expect the Victorians to launch strafing runs in the near future. He wants your advice on how best to counter them."

Franks looks down at the papers in front of her. Twenty-seven.

She looks back up. "Send word back that I'm on my way," she says, standing up and reaching for her coat.

* * *​

When the Victorians come, it is slow and steady, flying perfectly level and straight, and in radar signatures that appear to denote absolutely massive airplanes. Twelve of them.

General Burns's jaw drops slightly. "I don't believe it."

"Victorian doctrine calls for this for AA evasion," says Franks, eyes fixed on the radar display. "Four or more planes fly in diamond or box formation, close enough that they return as one radar signature. The idea is that radar-guided missiles seek the center of the formation and miss the planes." She snorts. "It's stupid, makes them sitting ducks. They're right on top of one another in order to keep this effect, so a single missile is going to knock several of them out of the air. And wouldn't you know it, it was Rumford's idea in the first place." She scowls. "Really tells you that they never fight anybody who can make them pay. Nobody whose job actually prepares them to interface with the ground would have this dumbfuck idea."

"Of course," growls Burns.

"I'm guessing you never really dealt with Vees while you were on the run?" asks Franks.

"Russian jets," replies Burns, his tone clipped. "Vicks never stooped to ground runs."

Franks lets the topic go. Instead, she turns to the radar. "And now we wait."

"I don't feel good about letting them get this close to my ships," snaps Admiral Romano over the radio.

"Don't worry about it, Admiral," sighs Franks. "When we spring this, the Vicks will have other things on their mind than bothering your ships. Trust me."

He doesn't respond to that, and Franks returns to watching the displays.

The Victorian jets close, slow and steady, lining up into their approach corridors for the strafing runs. Franks waits as they get nearer and nearer, slowly drifting down to their starting altitudes for the actual attack runs. She knows what the attack profile on an F-16V is. She's studied their performance characteristics until they're now seared into her eyelids. She knows exactly when the jets will start their dive.

A little over a minute before the first jets reach that point, when they're all roped well into range of the Army and Navy's SAM network, flying slow and increasingly low Franks leans forward. "Now. Send out the command; all batteries need to fire now."

Orders go out; radio officers chant instructions into their headsets. Orders go out to gun crew leaders who've been waiting for just this command.

And, over the course of a minute, all of the SAM launchers embedded in your ground and naval forces launch their missiles.

The Victorians stutter. Some of the radar signatures on the screen briefly resolve into multiple returns before the pilots tighten back up. They abort their attack runs, continuing to fly straight in their formations. This, after all, is their doctrine. Fly tight, in a box, and the missile will miss. This is simply how reality works.

Missiles burst in the center of four different formations, knocking several planes out of the sky and leaving a bare handful intact enough to still be limping through the air, before the Victorians realize that their doctrine is wrong.

The gigantic contacts on the screen break up into a swarm of rapidly-dispersing dots as the pilots panic and scatter in every direction. Missiles start homing in on individual planes, but for many, it's far too late. More planes fall. Several shudder and jerk, almost certainly mortally wounded. The Victorian strike dissolves, and their pilots sprint home.

Franks grins, a feral thing that looks hungrier than it looks pleased.

Burns huffs in laughter and slaps her on the back. "Nicely done. You were right."

She shakes her head, still grinning. "It won't work again. Even Vicks aren't that stupid. But this? This is all we needed." She leans on a table, sighing. "I needed that. Shoot down my planes, fuckers. I'll get yours, too."

Raising a hand, she flips off the ceiling, and through it, the sky.

She studiously ignores Burns's laughter.



So, that's what went down. Franks studied her opponent in detail.

In addition to the votes from the previous update, I have one more for you.

Some of the detained foreigners in Detroit have come forward as either journalists or foreign observers from other governments. They are requesting that you allow them access to information on the battle for the purposes of their reports. Please add the following items to any plans currently under consideration:


-[ ] Deny them all. They may remain in lockup and look at the aftermath, just like everybody else.
-[ ] Allow the journalists to observe. You want your side of the story out there, and the press is one way of doing that. You'd still have central security restricting them to good things, after all.
-[ ] Allow the foreign observers to observe. You want to set up lines of communication with the outside world; extending a friendly hand here, and making a positive impression, could yield dividends.
-[ ] Allow them both to observe.

MORATORIUM REMAINS; WILL OPEN TOMORROW. APPROVAL VOTING REMAINS.

And there you go. Half-update for you. Hope you enjoyed. :D
 
Last edited:
[ ] Plan Hold the Course
-[ ] As a reaction force to counter any dangerous crossings, most especially in terms of Victorian armor.
-[ ] Yes. You have confirmed some mission kills on Victorian armor, but you haven't eliminated them as a force. You needs the Abrams tanks in place.
-[ ] Retreat across the river and blow it now. Clever tactics are not worth the risk of the Victorians managing to seize and hold the bridge.
-[ ] The Navy will withdraw from Monroe; you don't think you need them. Instead, they will go to that grounded laker ship and have their marine complements board it, clearing out the Victorian soldiers and making it so civilian vessels from Detroit can begin looting the vessel.
-[ ] Allow them both to observe.

We need to stick to the plan. Our defending division holds the line. BRO acts as QRF to contain any landings and breakthrough attempts. Our artillery fucks any of their attempt to take a breather hard since we've presighted all potential mustering points. I prefer to blow the bridge now after all our forces have been pulled back. It'll prevent the Vics from being able to use their numbers advantage as much as they would have been able to otherwise and makes it a bitch to try to cross over. Forcing them to rely on their CMC division to try to make a landing. Which we'll counter with the BRO.

We just need to bleed them hard. Every day they are delayed is them running out of food and fuel.
 
Hey, just figured it'd be something worth having spelled out expressly. :p

I mean, yes. But opposite side must have Russian observers anyway, so odds are, Russia and Japan are going to know truth about us and our tactics anyway. Having spies on our side too refines the info they get, sure, but I think the help with getting our message out more than compensates for it.
Otherwise Vicky propaganda machine might well severely curtail diplomatic benefits we might get from defeating them.
 
I mean, yes. But opposite side must have Russian observers anyway, so odds are, Russia and Japan are going to know truth about us and our tactics anyway. Having spies on our side too refines the info they get, sure, but I think the help with getting our message out more than compensates for it.
Otherwise Vicky propaganda machine might well severely curtail diplomatic benefits we might get from defeating them.

Getting the message out is more something for the journalists than the observers honestly? We could just allow those.

The observers are mostly if we want to spread our tactics and counters to Victorian ones while convincing potential allies (and enemies, probably) that we know what we're doing. Basically, do we want people to underestimate us... Including our potential friends?

I'm down for allowing journalists, not sure on the observers.
 
Getting the message out is more something for the journalists than the observers honestly? We could just allow those.

The observers are mostly if we want to spread our tactics and counters to Victorian ones while convincing potential allies (and enemies, probably) that we know what we're doing. Basically, do we want people to underestimate us... Including our potential friends?

I'm down for allowing journalists, not sure on the observers.

OTOH observers will allow us to generally make a good impression with specifically governments. We kind of need it as much, if not more, as appeal to public via journalists.

After all, if we want to go for diplomatic route to victory at least in part, we need to show the people that be that we know what we are doing: to impress some into joining, to intimidate others into not getting in our way.
 
[ ] Plan "Show the world that Americans can defeat Victoria"
-[ ] As a reaction force to counter any dangerous crossings, most especially in terms of Victorian armor.
-[ ] Yes. You have confirmed some mission kills on Victorian armor, but you haven't eliminated them as a force. You needs the Abrams tanks in place.
-[ ] Retreat across the river and blow it now. Clever tactics are not worth the risk of the Victorians managing to seize and hold the bridge.
-[ ] The Navy will remain, and continue to provide artillery cover over Monroe. You could use it to slow down the Vicks.
-[ ] Allow them both to observe.
 
[ ] Plan "Show the world that Americans can defeat Victoria"

I like this plan. I am somewhat sad about the opportunity cost of not grabbing the freighter, but the PR of putting the hurt on the Vics is too good to pass up on.
 
There are other plans I like, but this is one of them.

[ ] Plan "Show the world that Americans can defeat Victoria"

They're Victorians. They don't do 'knowledge', really.
I think what's meant is "does the CMC know that he's been captured, or not?"

Because their obvious next move if he has, frankly, is to start shooting his family "pour encourager les autres" and deterring any future officers in a bad position from thoughts of surrender.

Our single biggest bargaining chip is to tell General Whatshisnuts "if you cooperate, we'll let Victoria continue to believe that you died fighting."
 
The one risk I can see with allowing journalists and government agents to look around is that it may get Russian Attention much more quickly. But honestly that may be a risk worth taking so that we can start boosting our tech and infrastructure as fast as possible.
 
The one risk I can see with allowing journalists and government agents to look around is that it may get Russian Attention much more quickly. But honestly that may be a risk worth taking so that we can start boosting our tech and infrastructure as fast as possible.

It gets everyone's attention, that's the idea.
Which includes Russians too, sadly. Meaning we need to prepare for spetznaz spooks, intel spooks and their advisors making Vickies less incompetent in warfare.

Thing is, Vickies losing 12 divisions would lead to all those anyway.
 
Voting is open
Back
Top