Voting is open
Is there a fic snippet or ideas thread for Victoria because I have a cursed prompt
 
Why isn't New Jersey or at least Newark Victoria aligned didn't it get taken over by a fDominionist cult back during the collapse the kind that hanged "gang members" and prostitutey? Seems like the kind of thing Victoria would prop up to Surround FCNY
 
Why isn't New Jersey or at least Newark Victoria aligned didn't it get taken over by a fDominionist cult back during the collapse the kind that hanged "gang members" and prostitutey? Seems like the kind of thing Victoria would prop up to Surround FCNY
IIRC it was mentioned later that that polity collapsed because "that is the destiny of urban states". Take that with a grain of salt until someone pulls up a cite for that. But nevertheless I wouldn't be surprised if whoever is there now is influenced by Victoria.
 
Hypothetical situation. Magical Girl world but no Monster Attacks, and history carries on as usual aside from a few minor butterflies that won't be noticable till like the 25th century. Without any existential threats many magical girls live normal ish lives, while the rest become fire fighters, police or the military. The latter group are well known for bravery, strength and absolutely crushing any resistance. While not super ceding regular armies they do tend to demolish any side that doesn't have any MGs as the Taliban can attest, and usually are defeated by other Magical Girls
You are William Lind, and you think that modern society isn't good to say the least. So you decide to write a book about 4th generational warfare, but there's a problem: you have traditionalist views on women and would likely not have any Magical Girls on your side, nor would you want any. How would Lind rectify this imbalance?

I've asked this in two other places and my thinking was that all the MGs with actual experience are conveniently stuck on another continent leaving only the civilian ones where he's free to impart sexism on
 
Last edited:
You are William Lind, and you think that modern society isn't good to say the least. So you decide to write a book about 4th generational warfare, but there's a problem: you have traditionalist views on women and would likely not have any Magical Girls on your side, nor would you want any. How would Lind rectify this imbalance?
The same way he has his fraction of reactionary luddites who openly and proudly flaunt their atrocities defeat all their enemies, regardless of their obvious technological, industrial, and material inferiority. By having them be the True Americans 🇹🇲 , and having their enemies being irrational idiots that follow a deranged ideology instead of the Only True Path(which is Lind's deranged ideology).

It would probably just be a repeat/replacement of Azania and its 'feminism' , except with magic instead of technology. Maybe Victoria has its own MGs that decide that Rumford is absolutely correct that they are the inferior and weak-willed gender and decide to follow Victoria because...I don't know, Lind will let his men marry them or something?

I feel dirty just writing this.
 
Hypothetical situation. Magical Girl world but no Monster Attacks, and history carries on as usual aside from a few minor butterflies that won't be noticable till like the 25th century. Without any existential threats many magical girls live normal ish lives, while the rest become fire fighters, police or the military. The latter group are well known for bravery, strength and absolutely crushing any resistance. While not super ceding regular armies they do tend to demolish any side that doesn't have any MGs as the Taliban can attest, and usually are defeated by other Magical Girls
You are William Lind, and you think that modern society isn't good to say the least. So you decide to write a book about 4th generational warfare, but there's a problem: you have traditionalist views on women and would likely not have any Magical Girls on your side, nor would you want any. How would Lind rectify this imbalance?

I've asked this in two other places and my thinking was that all the MGs with actual experience are conveniently stuck on another continent leaving only the civilian ones where he's free to impart sexism on
As above, Azania 2.0. The MGs are indeed theoretically powerful weapons, but they are foolish and simpering women who do not understand the realities of war and thus are effortlessly wiped out by the workmanlike soldiering of the glorious Victorians.

In short, they make as many mistakes as they must for Lind's preferred outcome to win out.
 
As above, Azania 2.0. The MGs are indeed theoretically powerful weapons, but they are foolish and simpering women who do not understand the realities of war and thus are effortlessly wiped out by the workmanlike soldiering of the glorious Victorians.
I'm guessing he would attribute their hyper lethality to male handlers, and woops the Magical Girl warlord state got rid of all their men so I guess they're stupid now
 
IIRC it was mentioned later that that polity collapsed because "that is the destiny of urban states". Take that with a grain of salt until someone pulls up a cite for that. But nevertheless I wouldn't be surprised if whoever is there now is influenced by Victoria.
Having skimmed trough Let's Read, I can confidently say that New Jersey collapsed from the all too common cause of "Lind forget about the shite he wrote previously". I'm pretty sure the destiny of urban states is somewhere in the novel, though. In chapter 20, New Jersey is mentioned as being controlled by black religious sect that executes supposed gang members via hanging and necklacing (of course, they are the good guys). I would like to apologize for exposing the forum to even such a minor amount of Lind's writing.
Lind said:
On July 27, 2027, the blacks of Newark, New Jersey rose against their oppressors and took over the city.
[...]
The preacher, one Rev. Ebenezer Smith, delivered an unusual sermon:
"It is time for us to fight our real oppressors, the drug dealers, the whore-mongers, the gang members. The fact that they are black makes no difference. They are our black oppressors. They are not our brothers. They are worse enemies than whites ever were. It is time for us to battle them, and to take our city back from them."
New Jersey is only mentioned again once in chapter 23:
Lind said:
In the east, the federals were now reduced to a narrow belt made up of Pennsylvania, Maryland, New Jersey, and Delaware, connected by a thread through New York City with Connecticut and Massachusetts. That connection was lost on July 15, when Connecticut seceded.
The in-universe explanation: A group of religious extremists terrorizes the local population for a while and is dealt with after the national guard/ US army arrives. Since Rumford is desperate for token African-Americans to legitimatize his northern confederacy, he creatively rewrites it as the local black population restoring law and orders in his memoirs. The part about the downfall of the group is edited out by later censors, since you can't have incompetent 3rd generational warfare beat good christian hwhite militias that come to defend it, but they can't bring themselves to add their own writing to Rumford memoir, so the plothole is created.
 
Having skimmed trough Let's Read, I can confidently say that New Jersey collapsed from the all too common cause of "Lind forget about the shite he wrote previously". I'm pretty sure the destiny of urban states is somewhere in the novel, though. In chapter 20, New Jersey is mentioned as being controlled by black religious sect that executes supposed gang members via hanging and necklacing (of course, they are the good guys). I would like to apologize for exposing the forum to even such a minor amount of Lind's writing.

New Jersey is only mentioned again once in chapter 23:

The in-universe explanation: A group of religious extremists terrorizes the local population for a while and is dealt with after the national guard/ US army arrives. Since Rumford is desperate for token African-Americans to legitimatize his northern confederacy, he creatively rewrites it as the local black population restoring law and orders in his memoirs. The part about the downfall of the group is edited out by later censors, since you can't have incompetent 3rd generational warfare beat good christian hwhite militias that come to defend it, but they can't bring themselves to add their own writing to Rumford memoir, so the plothole is created.
Or alternatively the Dominionist cult was limited to Newark and the general vicinity of the City. Either way I'm betting Warlords get worse the closer you get to Victoria.
 
Or alternatively, it was a Black liberationist group that Rumford claims was driving out the "scum". Because, as usual, Lind does not understand what liberals actually believe.

This would actually follow another weird early incident in the novel where some Black tenants seize control of their own housing project in defiance of the authorities with the support of liberal congregations, and somehow they're okay with the nascent white supremacist group giving them assistance.

I figured this was, you know, an actually radical leftist project that the Christian Marines used as cover to assassinate a federal judge, which is what happens.

Point is, either way Rumlind is trying very hard to tie himself to early anti-government movements regardless of their actual politics.
 
Or alternatively the Dominionist cult was limited to Newark and the general vicinity of the City. Either way I'm betting Warlords get worse the closer you get to Victoria.
Also possible. The cult might have been purged and the remanentes folded into CORN. Victoria probably expects strict compliance with their laws close to their borders, so the polities there are either occupied by victorian soldiers or controlled by warlords that act just like Victoria.
Or alternatively, it was a Black liberationist group that Rumford claims was driving out the "scum". Because, as usual, Lind does not understand what liberals actually believe.

This would actually follow another weird early incident in the novel where some Black tenants seize control of their own housing project in defiance of the authorities with the support of liberal congregations, and somehow they're okay with the nascent white supremacist group giving them assistance.
I find that explanation less likely, since later, in order to stop an african-american revolt in a southern city, Rumford drops a nuke on them. Rumfords memoirs are incredibly hostile to any liberal or left group, especially among minorities. If black liberationists were to seize a city, I would expect him to decry them as gangs that needed to be put down or communist instigators.
 
Last edited:
It is quite simple, Rumsfeld's book is not so much an accurate account of history but much more a propaganda work. It is comparable to Mein Kampf or the Red Bible.
An attempt by a successful warlord who, with the help of foreign support, overthrew his government to create a state according to his political ideas.
In order to give legitimacy to his actions, he has to delegetimise the previous government and present himself as the first revolutionary to lead the uprising against the old order.
Therefore, it is unfortunately not possible to draw conclusions from this book about the real events of the time.
 
It is quite simple, Rumsfeld's book is not so much an accurate account of history but much more a propaganda work. It is comparable to Mein Kampf or the Red Bible.
An attempt by a successful warlord who, with the help of foreign support, overthrew his government to create a state according to his political ideas.
In order to give legitimacy to his actions, he has to delegetimise the previous government and present himself as the first revolutionary to lead the uprising against the old order.
Therefore, it is unfortunately not possible to draw conclusions from this book about the real events of the time.
What we've usually done is try to work backwards from knowing that he is a successful warlord who (et cetera, et cetera) to infer what must have actually happened, because the shape of the truths can sometimes be inferred from the kinds of lies he saw fit to tell.

It's a moderately interesting exercise and it's given us a backstory for the setting that hangs together rather well.
 
Or alternatively, it was a Black liberationist group that Rumford claims was driving out the "scum". Because, as usual, Lind does not understand what liberals actually believe.

This would actually follow another weird early incident in the novel where some Black tenants seize control of their own housing project in defiance of the authorities with the support of liberal congregations, and somehow they're okay with the nascent white supremacist group giving them assistance.

I figured this was, you know, an actually radical leftist project that the Christian Marines used as cover to assassinate a federal judge, which is what happens.

Point is, either way Rumlind is trying very hard to tie himself to early anti-government movements regardless of their actual politics.
-Unlikely. White supremacist ideologies have never tolerated Black organizations that are either uppity or inclusive.

Its true that black Americans can be quite socially conservative, but even a street gang has the political awareness to recognize that Vics are essentially a white supremacist group, and black Americans history with that political ideology would have remained entirely too recent. Not to mention the sheer pragmatism of not pissing off the close neighbors.

Especially given that their neighbor is pre-Collapse New York City's 8 million plus to Newark's 300k.

-The other incident is quite plausible, because I can see an eviction crisis breaking out during the Collapse, with the local courts ruling in favor of the banks or real estate concerns/slumlord that hold the mortgage papers or outright own the rental buildings in a majority Black area and being actively resisted by the local residents.

Neither ideological nor racial uniformity is needed or likely.
At which point this fringe group of white supremacist proto-Vics jump in to take the opportunity to assassinate the local judiciary.

Also possible. The cult might have been purged and the remanentes folded into CORN. Victoria probably expects strict compliance with their laws close
We know that the New York City area is explicitly an exception, with the roughly hundred kilometers around FCNY being mentioned as somewhere the Vics have avoided overt military activity compared to what they're doing in Pennsylvania.

The most likely explanation is the simplest:
Some organization with a significant number of black people popped up in the area; its ideological bent is not important, and it might not have one. It attempted to claim territory/seize power from the municipal govt with terror tactics like street executions, and promptly got focused down and crushed in the chaos of the Collapse.

I mean, Newark is literally across the Hudson from New York City. NYC's port facilities are shared with Newark; Port Newark Elizabeth Marine Terminal is part of the Port of New York And New Jersey, and is the primary container terminal. Its politics and security is literally an existential issue for FCNY. Some group destabilizing their logistic lifeline would get a very quick reaction.

Before things settled down into the current lines, NYC would have acted to secure its food importation port, and Victoria was quite stretched in its power projection and ability to establish information networks in the early days.
There's gonna be a lot of stuff that slipped through the cracks up and down the eastern US.

I would not be at all surprised that even in the worst of the Collapse, FCNY exerted significant influence on the politics of New Jersey, regardless of what the treaty they were obliged to sign said. Just economics would have been enough; FCNY is the largest agricultural market for fresh food in the area, and access to First World services like medical care.

And now that the Vics are currently occupied with internal discussions on their , that influence is probably being converted to a hard reality as they vore their way south past Philadelphia.
 
Non-Canon Omake: A Partially Comprehensive Guide to Religion in the City of Chicago
A Partially Comprehensive Guide to Religion in the City of Chicago

It was only recently, the previous season in fact, that a comprehensive census of the Commonwealth's population was taken. While the main goal of this census was to get an accurate counting of the population, as well as their distribution across this new country. Yet as a side effect, this census has given a good look at the religious composition of both Chicago and the Commonwealth at large though it is far from a comprehensive counting. This gives a basic overview of religion as it exists within the city of Chicago, as the capital has the largest population of the Commonwealth by far.

As one might expect, Christianity remains dominant in Chicago, as it does with much of the Commonwealth. In Chicago, this takes the form of a fascinating mixture of Protestant, Catholic, and Orthodox traditions, with a small scattering of sects that do not consider themselves part of the big three. The number of different sects number in the hundreds, many old pre-collapse beliefs that managed to survive, others newly born in the post-collapse world. There's a branch of the Catholic Church, one of the few large-scale social institutions to survive the Collapse. A number of Orthodox groups, mainly among the descendants of eastern and southeastern European immigrants. And, of course, what feels like a hundred different groups of Protestants. Yet despite their majority, it is not as big as some might suspect. Unlike Old America, where the second-largest religion, Judaism, numbered at a whopping 2%, Chicago actually has a sizable minority of non-Christians, though there is no exact percentage at the moment, I believe it to be around 30%, maybe more, at this current time, and constantly growing as more individuals arrive with the flood of refugees. This is, I imagine, a direct result of the city being a sort of beacon to safety, drawing in religious minorities like moths to a flame. While I have no doubt that there has been immigration to other parts of the Commonwealth, Chicago being Chicago means that it gets most of the refugee population. But I digress, I am here to talk about religion.

Following Christianity in prominence are its fellow Abrahamic faiths. Most notable are Judaism and Islam, who were the second and third largest faiths in pre-collapse America, both followed by, at the very least, a whole percentage of the population. They still retain such prominence, despite often being targets of hatred, not just by Victorians but other groups with similar views of the world. It is a sad fact that nearly all the Temples and Mosques in the city were either destroyed or heavily defaced during the whole Nazi conflict, and most congregations either practice in those ruins or converted dwellings. Most followers of Judaism are ethnic Jews, with a smaller number of converts. Muslims are found among both various immigrants and their descendants, as well as many African Americans, who make up a good number of Muslims, a result of the cities deep history with African American Muslims, going as far back as the 1920s. In addition to the more common and well-known faiths, there are also small communities of Baháʼí and Rastafari, two faiths often overlooked even before the collapse. Both communities, despite their small size, are surprisingly prevalent, which indicates that both have seen a number of conversions in the past decades. Like their larger, more numerous counterparts, neither have a dedicated religious building (Though the Baháʼí actually did have a full-on House of Worship in Chicago, big one too, before the Nazis got their hands on it), making do with makeshift and converted structures.

The next minority of sorts are the Dharmic faiths, born from the Indian Subcontinent and brought over by immigrants and missionaries. They have always been a minority, yet surprisingly prevalent and widespread, found across the country, even in some places without a sizable Indian population. Most numerous is Buddhism, which seems to have actually grown following the collapse. Its practitioners are not just Asian immigrants, but White and even African Americans. This seems to be tied to how Buddhism is, compared to some faiths, relatively easy to syncretize with other belief systems. The most common type of syncretization I have found is a fascinating form of Jewish-Buddhism, a result of the fact that neither faith really contradicts each other (since many forms of Buddhism do not believe the Buddha to be a god). Besides this, in general, Buddhism is an appealing belief system that seems to have drawn in a number of North Americans, not just the descendants of immigrants. After Buddhism is Hinduism, which is mainly found among immigrants from South and Southeast Asia, as well as their descendants. The primary exception to this seems to be, of all things, the Hare Krishnas. While their organization, at least in North America, was shattered by the collapse, I have found that enough practitioners survived that there are current attempts to reform their organization in Chicago, around their old building on Lunt Avenue, though I do not know how successful they will be.

Next is Jainism, the peaceful transtheistic religion which is mainly found among individuals of Indian descent, be they immigrants or their descendants. There's actually a Jain temple, not in Chicago itself but around Arlington Heights. Intact to, it seems like the Nazis overlooked it for some reason or another. Luckier than their Buddhist or Hindu counterparts, whose places of worship received the same treatment at the hands of Nazi as the Jewish temples and Muslim mosques. And finally, there's Sikhism, the youngest of the Dharmic religions, and one of the youngest major world faiths period. Now, most Sikhs live on the west coast these days. Their numbers have always been largest on both coasts, and most on the east fled west following the rise of Victoria. Most good Victorians probably can't even tell a Sikh or Muslim apart, much less know what a Sikh is, and even before the collapse, they suffered discrimination at the hands of idiots that couldn't tell the difference. However, our city has always had a notable population of Sikhs, and I have found that a surprisingly large number have returned to their ancestral home after they heard about the founding of the Commonwealth. Unlike the Jains, the Sikhs had several Gurdwara (That's what the Sikhs call their places of worship) in Chicago, and like most non-Christians, the Nazis made a mess of them, if they left them standing.

There is no unified name for the myriad faiths of East Asia beyond "East Asian Religions". They range from a variety of polytheistic folk religions to complex philosophical beliefs, and they are one of the rarer types of religion in North America. Before the collapse, they were decidedly centered on the west coast, which was where the bulk of East Asian immigrants reside, as well as some of the larger cities on the east coast. While East Asians never suffered a direct attack under Victoria, as far as I know, they were among the types of people that were targets simply because they were different. Unless you were in New York City, most fled west to escape Victoria, and while most only passed us by, some decided to stay. Others, such as those who had spent their entire lives in the city, came back to their homes after the Commonwealth was founded. It might surprise some, but a large number of East Asians, mainly Chinese and especially Koreans, are actually Christian, as were many of their parents. In some cases, it's because their parents, who may or may not have been Christian themselves, raised them as such to better fit in, or maybe they converted of their own choice. The trend of this continued after the collapse, especially here in the Midwest, where there was always the threat of Victoria or one of their clients. Followers of Taoism, Confucianism, or Chinese Folk Religion, are all relative minorities, and never had a heavy presence in or around Chicago, but they still very much exist and are slowly growing as more and more refugees arrive.

The next "group" of religions is Neopaganism, though they are still incredibly decentralized, as they always have been. Neopagan is less a group as it is an umbrella term referring to a wide variety of traditions and in many cases practices unique to specific individuals. Their scattered nature, and habit of being quiet about their beliefs, meant that when Victoria rose, most either abandoned their practices for the sake of survival or quietly slipped away. There are exceptions, such as damned white supremacists who claim such beliefs, but most knew better than to chance it with Victoria. The number of neopagans in Chicago is surprisingly high. Before, the population was scattered across the entire continent, cast away to the wind during the collapse. Yet Chicago gives them a place to gather, and it seems that every damned Neopagan in the midwest, and perhaps beyond, has picked up their bags, if they had any, and moved to the big city. Every type one can think of, Druids, Wiccans, Asatru, Hellenists, witches, occultists, pretty much any form of reconstructionist polytheism one can think of. It is an awkward thing, as few are used to gathering in such numbers. Many rarely saw more than a dozen of their fellows at a time, even before the collapse, and now that they have apparently all gathered in one place, they don't know what to do. At least they seem to be happy.

There are other religions that do not fall under a single category, being their own unique systems of belief. Some are tiny old minorities, others are recent, post-collapse. One such is Zoroastrianism. Many tend to forget that the United States is home to a third of the world's followers of Zoroastrianism. Of course, this was just around six thousand people, but still. Most live in New York City, a result of the two major Fire temples in the country being in New York State. As one can imagine, most fled to the Big Apple when Victoria started to make moves on New York. I hear they have a new Fire Temple there now. Some, however, did not get the chance and decided to risk the journey west, to get as far west as they could. In the process, some settled in Chicago, though most simply moved on further west. Others have arrived after the founding of the Commonwealth. Their population is tiny, but it is there. Now, in contrast to the ancient nature of Zoroastrianism, there is a faith that emerged after the collapse, born in Chicago itself. Yes, I speak of the Baseball Cult. For those who have only recently arrived in Chicago, the Baseball Cult is exactly as it sounds, a small religion based around playing and venerating the sport of Baseball. Being called a cult implies a sort of malevolence, but they are nice people if a bit obsessed with playing their game. I myself don't see the appeal, but they seem to be attracting a following, having grown twice as large since the beginning of this flood of refugees. Understand, it might sound like a great increase in size, but it isn't. Remember, when a group with one person gets another member, they've grown twice as big. The Baseball cult is still very, very small, mostly restricted to dedicated teams of the sport.

Next is a surprisingly large minority, the Cult of Santa Muerte, mainly found among many Latin Americans, especially individuals of Mexican descent that have fled northward for some reason or another. The veneration of Our Lady of the Holy Death was born pre-collapse as a result of the hardship faced by many Mexican people and was considered the single fastest-growing religious movement in the Americas. Her origins go even farther back, to the ancient Aztec goddess Mictēcacihuātl, queen of the underworld and patron of the festivals which would later evolve into the Day of the Dead, and can perhaps be seen as a continuation of such worship. Either way, worship grew as a result of hardship. It is no surprise, then, that worship would grow in an event as catastrophic as the Collapse. From the rumors I have heard, the cult has a sizable following in much of Mexico, even controlling some remnants, which trickled north alongside both refugees and missionaries, and can now be found among many Latin Americans now living in Chicago. One noticeable fact about the cult is that there seems to have been a reversal of doctrine at some point during the collapse. Where once Santa Muerte was mainly venerated as a folk saint, with a minority seeing her as a full-on deity, this seems to have reversed in some cases, with a large number fully worshipping her as a goddess and a sizable minority venerating her as part of folk Catholicism. This minority makes up the majority in Chicago, where many of Mexican descent are strict Catholics, but as more and more refugees come they bring with them their own beliefs.

Last but not least are the Satanists. Yes, actually Satanists, though despite what Victoria might claim they do not actually worship the Devil. The Satanic Temple is Nontheistic, not believing in any supernatural entity, and merely uses satanic imagery in their aesthetic. Before the collapse, they used satire alongside such imagery to bring attention to religious inequality and hypocrisy in the United States. It might surprise you, but members of the Satanic Temple are some of the nicest people one might meet since their doctrines revolve around compassion, justice, free will, and forgiveness. I had long believed that they would have dissolved following the Collapse, yet they have stubbornly resisted such a fate. The current members seem to be made up of the former Illinois, Ohio, and other east coast congregations, as well as members of the formerly rogue Detroit Chapter who fled west. I have been told that members of more distant congregations have been known to pop up from among the river of refugees, but it is still a rare thing. They were never populous, even before the Collapse.

While I am sure that a number of other faiths exist in the City of Chicago, those mentioned above include the most populous, even if they only number in the mid-hundreds. I'm also sure that, as more people move to Chicago, these numbers will change, though I can only guess how. Most likely they will continue to grow unless something happens to cause some massive paradigm shift.

Authors Note. Something that has been occupying my mind for a while. Not as detailed as I was hoping, but it's a good foundation of sorts, at least I believe it to be so. Please give your opinions, in case I accidentally wrote something offensive.
 
Last edited:
Authors Note. Something that has been occupying my mind for a while. Not as detailed as I was hoping, but it's a good foundation of sorts, at least I believe it to be so. Please give your opinions, in case I accidentally wrote something offensive.
Nicely done, though I would recommend dividing some of the larger blocks of text into smaller paragraphs, just to make them easier to read.
 
It was only recently, the previous season in fact, that a comprehensive census of the Commonwealth's population was taken. While the main goal of this census was to get an accurate counting of the population, as well as their distribution across this new country. Yet as a side effect, this census has given a good look at the religious composition of both Chicago and the Commonwealth at large though it is far from a comprehensive counting. This gives a basic overview of religion as it exists within the city of Chicago, as the capital has the largest population of the Commonwealth by far.
Interesting, although I feel like your segment on Catholicism still "organizing" itself in Chicago is inaccurate. The Midwestern Catholic Church is, per previous statements, already an organized force, being one of the only large-scale social institutions to have survived the Collapse intact. Furthermore, the pre-Collapse Archdiocese of Chicago, which should form the core of the organization, was apparently both one of the larger Catholic populations in America and one of the more notably progressive politically. This fact is, IIRC, reflected by the political influence of the Midwestern Catholic Church, being that the governing coalition partner Christian Socialist Party grew out of the Midwestern Catholic Church's organization and the fact that liberation theology and Christian socialism are prominent political ideologies at all are primarily the result of the ideology of said Catholic Church branch. Sure, there has been talk on the part of the CSP to rebrand, but that's not happened yet, their roots will not fhange regardless of their branding, and I personally am sceptical that the space between the rather broad tent Popular Progressives and Farmer-Laborers is sufficient to support a fully secularized CSP.

Ultimately, I think the Catholic Church in Chicago is more organized than is presented in this omake (thought that ultimately is a matter for the QM to decide), but also I feel like the lack of mention of atheism or agnosticism is a flaw for any survey of religion. While they are not religions per say, the absence of religion is itself a belief system withoutnwhich a description seems incomplete.
 
Last edited:
Interesting, although I feel like your segment on Catholicism still "organizing" itself in Chicago is inaccurate. The Midwestern Catholic Church is, per previous statements, already an organized force, being one of the only large-scale social institutions to have survived the Collapse intact. Furthermore, the pre-Collapse Archdiocese of Chicago, which should form the core of the organization, was apparently both one of the larger Catholic populations in America and one of the more notably progressive politically. This fact is, IIRC, reflected by the political influence of the Midwestern Catholic Church, being that the governing coalition partner Christian Socialist Party grew out of the Midwestern Catholic Church's organization and the fact that liberation theology and Christian socialism are prominent political ideologies at all are primarily the result of the ideology of said Catholic Church branch. Sure, there has been talk on the part of the CSP to rebrand, but that's not happened yet, their roots will not fhange regardless of their branding, and I personally am sceptical that the space between the rather broad tent Popular Progressives and Farmer-Laborers is sufficient to support a fully secularized CSP.

Thank you for the reply and information, I will add that into my post to make it more accurate. :D
 
The Bahia Temple is gone? Dang, that place is beautiful. And it was/is the only one in North America.

Would have thought the Nazis would have converted it instead what with their love of co-opting Northern European and Eastern religious symbols.
 
The Bahia Temple is gone? Dang, that place is beautiful. And it was/is the only one in North America.

Would have thought the Nazis would have converted it instead what with their love of co-opting Northern European and Eastern religious symbols.

At first, I thought to just have the Nazis attack Jewish temples and Muslim mosques, but then I asked, would bonified Nazis, with enough power and time on their hands to build gas chambers and concentration camps, actually leave religious places such as the Bahai temple alone? I figured if it's still standing, it's been heavily defaced. Coopting symbols is different than respecting places of worship.
 
Personally, I always figured that the Nazis' actual penetration into Chicago was a bit limited, if only because they ran into dense urban terrain and urban militias that had nowhere else to go and not a lot of reasons not to shoot back. Trying to take Chicago would have been about as bad an idea for the Wisconsin Nazis as trying to take New York City would have been for the Vicks, and there's a reason the Russians yanked hard on the Vicks' choke chain when they started thinking about taking New York City.

On the other hand, I'm sure they got up to plenty of terrorism and raiding, and targeting centers of worship would be right up their alley.

Now, in contrast to the ancient nature of Zoroastrianism, there is a faith that emerged after the collapse, born in Chicago itself. Yes, I speak of the Baseball Cult. For those who have only recently arrived in Chicago, the Baseball Cult is exactly as it sounds, a small religion based around playing and venerating the sport of Baseball. Being called a cult implies a sort of malevolence, but they are nice people if a bit obsessed with playing their game. I myself don't see the appeal, but they seem to be attracting a following, having grown twice as large since the beginning of this flood of refugees. Understand, it might sound like a great increase in size, but it isn't. Remember, when a group with one person gets another member, they've grown twice as big. The Baseball cult is still very, very small, mostly restricted to dedicated teams of the sport.
They have some interesting rituals.

:D
 
Voting is open
Back
Top