Threads Of Destiny(Eastern Fantasy, Sequel to Forge of Destiny)

Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
Towns growing past their walls is a pretty normal thing to happen.
Yes, but that's typically over generations, where most barons don't make it past one. Granted, part of that is being absorbed into other clans, but there's still a high casualty rate, and I'm sure a decent number of those absorptions happen because their holdings got wrecked and so they need to turn to a bigger clan.

In that context, building bigger walls is not a good move. It costs more, and you don't have enough cash already. That's both to build and maintain. It also takes longer, and half a wall is not anywhere near half as good as a full wall. And it takes more manpower to man and maintain, which you're also short on. For most new barons, the first generation will be a holding action, until you're children start being able to contribute, and the land/spirits have gotten used to you and adapted to your presence. And you probably killed some of the closest gribblies.

I imagine most barons will not build a village wall at all, just one around their own mansion and having something like a motte and bailey. That gives you time to create some cultivator pop organically, and to work on your arts (most people don't have LQs near ducal level stuff, they have whatever scraps they could get at the sect).
 
I imagine building walls with excessive optimism for future growth is a more common rookie mistake, considering both the drive to succeed and the material circumstances of most rookie barons.
Yes, maintaining large walls is expensive in manpower and materials, because the bigger the walls the more it has to deal with spirits, animals and general wear and tear degrading it.

You only want to build walls larger than what you have stuff to fill if:
-You had the wealth and protected access to resources encompassed by the walls outweighs the logistics of keeping the walls in repair(i.e. you need a dedicated wall upkeep rather than just fixing it whenever something breaches).
-You are growing at a far higher rate than is natural, given how we're building, we'd probably fill this wall within years, but a regular baron would probably find it more economical to build a wall just slightly beyond their occupied space, and then expand it as they add structures. Note this will ALSO do terrible things to Feng Shui, Wall Spirits, and generally the town layout will look like crap.
-You're allotting space to organic growth. It happens anyway, but accounting for that rather than letting said growth generate unhealthy conditions is something that many administrators let slip.
 
(most people don't have LQs near ducal level stuff, they have whatever scraps they could get at the sect).
Not even near Ducal, the best of LQ's arts are fully ducal grades. Like I would be very surprised if LFWT doesn't rival some ducal arts.

It probably has to do with fact that many normal barons get most of their art from Sects and the like, or inheritance them. Meanwhile, LQ learned her best arts from spirits, often very powerful ones.
 
Last edited:
Yeah, I'm pretty sure that Songseekers is Ducal Tier. I'm not sure whether there aren't tiers within Ducal Tier, as far as Cultivation Arts go, but at the very least it's, like, the best she could possibly expect to get for her level?
 
Yeah wind thief in particular is the type of shit ducals only give to their most promising scions. It's an art directly designed and modernized by a great spirit describing their own ascension. That's the kinda stuff that ducals have in their most protected vaults that they'd never dream of leaking. The type of stuff they'd send assassins after if there ever was a hint it would get leaked. And yeah yrs did confirm that song seekers ceremony is also ducal tier, though customized to fit Qi specifically so hard to pass down.
 
Yeah, I'm pretty sure that Songseekers is Ducal Tier. I'm not sure whether there aren't tiers within Ducal Tier, as far as Cultivation Arts go, but at the very least it's, like, the best she could possibly expect to get for her level?
The issue is how specific her arts are. I had asked in a Q&A about a successor for Songseekers Ceremony, and even made into a starter art a part of the Moon still has like you. That's what made Lightning God's Ladder a big deal, getting multiple higher tier arts with different wierd requirements.

Personally I want to see newer lower tier versions of Ling Qi's variant of Forgotten Vale Melody and the new persistence art, since the requirements for those should be less esoteric. Cyans can make jade Slips after they get their Brain Pearl, and we have a small suite of stuff we've been upgrading that don't require a higher power thinking someone is neat.
 
Last edited:
Of course, Lightning God's Ladder doesn't necessarily seem Biyu either... though it should be noted that Ling Biyu is a very little kid.

You don't know who will get into Heavy Metal, or Punk, or Counterculture or whatever and fall into "It's not just a phase!" until they're preteens/teens.
 
You only want to build walls larger than what you have stuff to fill if:
It should be noted that "stuff to fill it" historically included a lot of relatively open space, such as light agriculture (orchards, gardens) and light mining (clay is the only explicit example that comes to mind), and these things remained inside the wall even when general buildings spilled far out of the city.

Though I'll admit to very little study of "city as initially founded on a frontier".
 
In regards to the Defense Rating (DEF) four of our fifteen (just shy of one-third) unlocked projects lower DEF. I personally view DEF as having a solvency at 100, and any excess above that as "spendable" towards projects. Hopefully the dice will be kind this time, and we can get that extra 50 DEF which will 'pay' for the current unlocked projects.

As a related aside, I think next turn we should skip the rare resources again, and then run all three simultaneously the following turn. Each one provides a unique unlock bonus, and at worst we will be asked what out preference is. If we can see all the mystery prizes we can make an informed choice instead of a guesstimate.
 
In regards to the Defense Rating (DEF) four of our fifteen (just shy of one-third) unlocked projects lower DEF. I personally view DEF as having a solvency at 100, and any excess above that as "spendable" towards projects. Hopefully the dice will be kind this time, and we can get that extra 50 DEF which will 'pay' for the current unlocked projects.

As a related aside, I think next turn we should skip the rare resources again, and then run all three simultaneously the following turn. Each one provides a unique unlock bonus, and at worst we will be asked what out preference is. If we can see all the mystery prizes we can make an informed choice instead of a guesstimate.

The most promising of the special resources requires a Cultivator working it, so I'm not sure if I'd put a Cultivator on the walls in that case.
 
The most promising of the special resources requires a Cultivator working it, so I'm not sure if I'd put a Cultivator on the walls in that case.

We can still build the facility, we have quite a bit of empty slots for personnel as is. There is no listed penalties for empty workshops. I think the direct next turn and thereafter Population Drive should be a viable option to discuss. At least having three options will hopefully help cohesive planning, as more people can get everything they want out of less plans.
 
We can still build the facility, we have quite a bit of empty slots for personnel as is. There is no listed penalties for empty workshops. I think the direct next turn and thereafter Population Drive should be a viable option to discuss. At least having three options will hopefully help cohesive planning, as more people can get everything they want out of less plans.

No? Like, you don't get what I was pointing towards:

The problems of collecting the mist are many and require a heavy investment upfront, but the potential uses are many and valuable. Methods for now are ad hoc and personal requiring attention from several cultivators to manage

Cost 35 Material. 1 Month
0/1 Cultivation Manpower
Production 1 wealth per assigned Manpower
Upkeep -0.5 Wealth

Unlocks Clearwater Mist Distillery, Unlocks Minor Tradepost and Tiny Alchemy Workshop if first cultivation reagent developed.
 
Yes, but that's typically over generations, where most barons don't make it past one. Granted, part of that is being absorbed into other clans, but there's still a high casualty rate, and I'm sure a decent number of those absorptions happen because their holdings got wrecked and so they need to turn to a bigger clan.
Yrs on new barons:
I'd say its not an outright meatgrinder as in most new barons die... probably like 1 in 8 maybe on average?
but like half or more probably end up giving up and folding themselves into another clan through marriage. or adoption
 
No? Like, you don't get what I was pointing towards:

The problems of collecting the mist are many and require a heavy investment upfront, but the potential uses are many and valuable. Methods for now are ad hoc and personal requiring attention from several cultivators to manage

Cost 35 Material. 1 Month
0/1 Cultivation Manpower
Production 1 wealth per assigned Manpower
Upkeep -0.5 Wealth

Unlocks Clearwater Mist Distillery, Unlocks Minor Tradepost and Tiny Alchemy Workshop if first cultivation reagent developed.
And the other two make 0.1 wealth, so a total cost of -0.3 wealth. I cannot find the post, but I recollect that whatever the first unlock is affects the specialty of the alchemists shop to start, and I think -0.3 wealth is worth finding that out for all three and making an informed decision.

Of course that depends on the CMP roll, since we have no idea what the maintenance fee would be when we finally roll up another cultivator to watch our stuff. That math changes a lot if the fee is two wealth or more.

I would really dislike winning the gacha and it making us broke in the process. And that would shift my opinion quite a bit.
 
And the other two make 0.1 wealth, so a total cost of -0.3 wealth. I cannot find the post, but I recollect that whatever the first unlock is affects the specialty of the alchemists shop to start, and I think -0.3 wealth is worth finding that out for all three and making an informed decision.

Of course that depends on the CMP roll, since we have no idea what the maintenance fee would be when we finally roll up another cultivator to watch our stuff. That math changes a lot if the fee is two wealth or more.

I would really dislike winning the gacha and it making us broke in the process. And that would shift my opinion quite a bit.
Gonna go out on a limb and say it's probably one wealth. If we want to unlock access to the alchemy workshop and the trade center, I think the scrimshaw carver is a better bet: it's cheap, shows respect to Snowblossom's preferences (she really likes making fishes and seeing us use them will make her day) and it doesn't require a resource we don't have yet,can't be sure we will have soon and need more urgently elsewhere (as things stand, if we don't get a cultivation manpower to man the wall for the ith war, assuming everyone leaves again, Snowblossom will be at an uncomfy 75 defense)
We probably want to do the snowblossom shrine ASAP, and maybe even start the forestry to see of the Hunter shrine will give us cultivation manpower hiring chances... Though we'll also want to call on Cai wealt very soon, since we're already unable to foot the bill for 5 projects in the medium to high end of ressource cost.
 
It should be noted that "stuff to fill it" historically included a lot of relatively open space, such as light agriculture (orchards, gardens) and light mining (clay is the only explicit example that comes to mind), and these things remained inside the wall even when general buildings spilled far out of the city.

Though I'll admit to very little study of "city as initially founded on a frontier".
Chinese Chengs are probably the best basis. They had to be built chonky and fortified off the bat due to exposure to steppe nomads doing a driveby.
 
And the other two make 0.1 wealth, so a total cost of -0.3 wealth. I cannot find the post, but I recollect that whatever the first unlock is affects the specialty of the alchemists shop to start, and I think -0.3 wealth is worth finding that out for all three and making an informed decision.

Of course that depends on the CMP roll, since we have no idea what the maintenance fee would be when we finally roll up another cultivator to watch our stuff. That math changes a lot if the fee is two wealth or more.

I would really dislike winning the gacha and it making us broke in the process. And that would shift my opinion quite a bit.

The mists themselves seem to have been a result of a Natural 100, so I'm pretty sure it's the most spectacular of the three Mats.
 
Gonna go out on a limb and say it's probably one wealth. If we want to unlock access to the alchemy workshop and the trade center, I think the scrimshaw carver is a better bet: it's cheap, shows respect to Snowblossom's preferences (she really likes making fishes and seeing us use them will make her day) and it doesn't require a resource we don't have yet,can't be sure we will have soon and need more urgently elsewhere (as things stand, if we don't get a cultivation manpower to man the wall for the ith war, assuming everyone leaves again, Snowblossom will be at an uncomfy 75 defense)
We probably want to do the snowblossom shrine ASAP, and maybe even start the forestry to see of the Hunter shrine will give us cultivation manpower hiring chances... Though we'll also want to call on Cai wealt very soon, since we're already unable to foot the bill for 5 projects in the medium to high end of ressource cost.

I maintain that we can leave Cai Wealth for the turn after next.

We have plenty of Ag so that's not a concern.

After paying for Walls and Expand Adm, we'll be left with 94.5 Mat, and we get 5 more per turn.
Snowblossom Shrine costs 25, Forestry 15 and Boats 20 for a total of 60.
So if we chose those for the next turn, we would start the one after that with 39.5 Mat.

Which doesn't sound that a lot. But we would be taking Cai Wealth then, so we only need to pay for two projects.
Bai Soil doesn't cost any Mat, Jadehelm Carver costs 10, Fields Preservation 15, Chillgrasp Clay 25 and so on.

So we have options to do Cai Wealth then.
 
Year 45 Month 12 Arc 3-1 Cathedral
"Qiiiiiiii!"

Sixiang's impact against her chest would have bowled her over if she were a mortal. As it was she nearly floated off her feet as they spun once around. Her cheeks warmed at the flagrant contact, but she embraced the muse back. It felt strange, for Sixiang to have this much weight and solidity.

"O-oh dear, Ah you really shouldn't do that kind of thing in public," Li Suyin sighed, climbing down from the steps of her carriage.

"Well, its fine once in awhile. Beside's there's no one here to be scandalized.

Because the workers and clerks at the temporary hitching post were probably not looking at her getting hugged.

Li Suyin's carriage was bone white, with deep matte black paneling, carved to seem as if it were made from the bones of a large beast, including a many toothed squared off jaw serving to hold the drivers bench. Which, naturally was occupied by one of her skeleton automatons. This one had a horse's skull.

The horses were entirely carved wood, porcelain and silver, emitting a low but fragrant smoke from the joints and crevices of their mechanical forms.

"They're supposed to do that," Sixiang confided, giving her one more squeeze and releasing her. "It's the fuel."

Ling Qi cocked an eyebrow. "Do they not use spirit stones?"

"That method is too expensive for daily use," Li Suyin said primly, smoothing out her gown. "Since I have the freedom, I'm experimenting with different methods."

Ling Qi squinted at the construct horses, listening to the faint susurrus of whispers she could feel if she listened closely. "...Are there fairies in there?'

Li Suyin tilted her head."Yes? How did you know? I've bound them to the formations in the chest and stomach cavities, they're fed small amounts of mid grade wood to keep producing energy."

Well she supposed they didn't exactly sound upset. "My senses have improved a lot...You should watch out for when they get bored."

"That is a problem, the feed keeps them mostly docile but its not perfect, and the method really doesn't have great efficiency," Li Suyin huffed. "But! It is proof of possibility."

"They're way more expensive to feed than just grabbing a couple of real horses," Sixiang drawled.

Li Suyin shot her a betrayed look, the iris of her artificial eye glinting and spinning dangerously. "Hmph, your own body is based on similar principles you know."

"Yeah, well I'm not a little baby fairy who can't string two thoughts together. I don't need your doodads to run all the processes for me," Sixiang replied, leaning on her shoulder and sticking their tongue out at Suyin.

"Have you considered employing spirits that are…" Less stupid. Less stupid and feckless than red grade fairies, she wanted to say. "A little more advanced?"

"I considered it, but the containment and binding formations are a problem, not to mention the danger if they break free while around mortals," Li Suyin replied.

Ah, her own methods weren't the most normal,were they? "You may be able to convince a spirit to enter a contract to operate a construct."

"Possible, for a personal piece, but it doesn't work well for wider reproduction," Li Suyin said, shaking her head. "But! Regardless, It is good to see you again Ling Qi. Thank you for welcoming me to your home."

"Thank you for coming to assist on our little expedition. I know the prodigy of the Argent Peak Sect must be busy," Ling Qi replied teasingly.

"Oh stop,"Li Suyin replied, cheeks flushing. "... I have been given a break from deployment before the offensive."

"You're going?"

"Of course, I have to be on hand for maintenance of the purifying talismans and formations," Li Suyin replied.

She really did have to get used to the more determined Suyin.

"I understand," Ling Qi said, turning then to Sixiang. "And you, are you better? The flames…"

"Of, I'm good," Sixiang dismissed. Ling Qi narrowed her eyes, sensing the slight edge of falsity in their voice. It wasn't a lie, but… it definitely wasn't completely true.

"Managed to shave off the worst burnt bits, and I've gotten the rest patted out. Really, just been kinda bored the last month or two, working out more body stuff…"

"And being a pain in my ass," another voice grumbled. Su Ling emerged from the carriage as well, to Ling Qi's surprise. She hadn't actually noticed her… Li Suyin's security formations were getting good.

"Don't be like that Lingling," Sixiang smirked. "I know you haven't gotten rid of that painting I did on your ceiling, you know? I think I really got the flex just right."

Su Ling's ears stiffened, the long points standing out straight from her head. "Take your fuckin jester back Ling Qi."

"Don't worry, I will," Ling Qi said, amused. "Since when do you paint?"

"Since I needed to find more things to do," Sixiang replied, shooting her a grin. "Oh, who's the new girl?"

"Ah, this is Qiyi, she awakened under Sir Lin's care and repair," Ling Qi said.

Hi! Echo empty shore waiting left. Return? Silky cushion waiting. Keeping warm.

"That so? Well aren't you a cutie," Sixiang hummed, peering down. "I might not mind a bit of time there."

They looked at Ling Qi questioningly. Ling Qi lowered her head a little. She wouldn't mind that at all. As comical as it might sound to say, her head had really been too empty lately.

"Oof, jeez, your dress is a spirit now too? I don't know how your okay with… wearin' somebody," Su Ling said. "I don't even like keeping Cibei in my dantian that much."

The little black bat, still no more than a handspan in size, poking out of her bushy hair with a squeak, making Su Ling's tail flick.

I have said that it is fine Master!

"And I've said I don't like people in my head," Su Ling snorted.

"Qiyi is a dress," Ling Qi said with a shrug. "Even if she is a person, she is still a dress. I'm surprised you're here by the way. I don't mind, but…"

"Trips are suspended for a bit. I am still a member of the Argent Peak Sect," Su Ling replied.

"And she wished to visit sir Gan, for which I cannot blame her," Li Suyin sighed, resting her cheek on her hand.

Su Ling scowled at her. "He's coming along isn't it he? Figured I might as well come help."
"He is going to be our anchor, the tunnels don't suit him, but you said he could help operate your formations in your letter, didn't you Li Suyin?"

"Yes, I'll need to be on site to apply the impurity seals when we find the breach, so someone else will need to operate the short range transport formations, and provide me the data for the proper environmental flows from the surface," Li Suyin agreed cheerfully.

"And to guard against any interference to the surface equipment," Ling Qi said, amused. Even if they weren't hostile, it was a spiritually active site.

"Yes, that too," Li Suyin said. "It's best if no one is left alone in the operation though, no?"

Li Suyin sounded entirely too innocent.

Su Ling's unimpressed look said that she agreed with Ling Qi's assessment.

"Yep, buddy system all the way. Better safe than sorry," Sixiang chirped.

"Look, just because you're right doesn't mean I don't know what you're doing, you buncha degenerates," Su Ling grumbled. "We just gonna stand around here all day or what?"

"I suppose we should get moving," Ling Qi agreed. "Please follow me to the Shenglu manor, honored guests."

"Please," Li Suyin said. The jeweled clap tipped fingers of her gauntlet twitched and the low rumbled and rising smoke from the constructs ceased. Ling Qi sensed the fairies bound to them briefly struggle to stay awake, only to sink into a low energy torpor after a few moments.

The horse headed 'driver' meanwhile, leapt gracefully down from the bench to stand behind Li Suyin as they began to walk, every inch the obedient porter.

Except for being a more than two meter tall polished skeleton with spider silk muscle and sinew. Details.

Best to start inuring people to it now. She certainly wasn't going to stop having her friend over.

Tug and pull, Stretch and contract. Make the walk and swing? Testing. Testing, ribbons and bones.

Qiyi no.

Wearer no assist? Sad.

If she was ever disabled again, maybe then Qiyi could assist her.
No Qiyi not allow. Bad. Failure. Bad girl ribbons not deserve. Damage wearer.

Well she could walk and move on her own just fine otherwise.

Wearer sleep? Cultivate? Assist then? Work good!

No.

Sad.

"Looking a little distracted there, Qi," Sixiang said falling in beside her as they left the hitching post, followed the packed gravel path toward the road that led into Shenglu proper. In the distance, she could see the many workers swarming over the temporary palisade walls, carefully deconstructing their more valuable elements, and streaming out to the new perimeter, where the construction of proper walls of earth and stone was being begun. Watched over by the majority of their guard compliment, mortal workers dug alongside low cultivation earth movers, digging out the trench where the foundations would be set. Cai Renxiang wanted them up and finished, physically at least, before they left for Xiangmen.

It really is impressive how much you all have carved from the wilderness in less than a year," Li Suyin said, looking admiringly up at the colors shimmering in the mist that billowed from Snowblossom's falls.

"...Looks a little empty, but I guess you're plannin for growth," Su Ling said. "Well, looks nice for now at least."

"You've been busy for sure," Sixiang said. "Is the fam all settled in now? I stopped in to say bye when they left."

"Yes, everyone is here and safe. Mother's worked herself into a bit of a fret, but Biyu loves the manor gardens," Ling Qi said fondly.

"It's good to be able to keep your family close. I do miss Mother and Father sometimes," Li Suyin said wistfully. We keep up with the letters, and I've commissioned a speaking mirror so we can talk on occasion, but it just isn't the same."

"You'd get even more testy about getting dragged out of your lair."

"It's a laboratory, not a lair!" Li Suyin pouted. "Doing things with family is the same at all t-those frivolous gathering's you've dragged me too."

"I dunno, I think it was probably good for ya to talk to some other humans after a month locked up," Su Ling smirked. "And you got awfully flustered when..."

"No! You both promised not to talk about that!"

Well that was just unfair of them.

How was she supposed to tease her friend if she wasn't allowed to know? Truly the temptation to don the mantle of the Thief of Names had never been greater.

Sixiang met her eyes and grinned. She grinned back. She was glad they could still meet up like this.

AN: Splitting the intro here, hope folks enjoy the catch up banter.
 
Last edited:
Back
Top