Threads Of Destiny(Eastern Fantasy, Sequel to Forge of Destiny)
- Thread starter yrsillar
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Then why don't we warn her to flee instead of 'invite her to join the performance as she sees fit?' I'm fine introducing ourselves, but that bit just does not fit the current situation at all. Joining the performance is either really bad for us (she fights us) or largely superfluous for us with strong potential to go badly for her later (she helps us). Her leaving ASAP with just enough information to make her want to come back for more is probably the best outcome, but the current vote doesn't really encourage that.
In conclusion I just hate the way the write-in is written.
Hounding Ling Qi for answers is arguably tactically acceptable (she is de facto helping to guard the starstone and is bleeding her qi, weakening her) and untenable in the long term (either because our allies will drive her away or chekov's storm makes this whole area a kill zone)
A battlefield is simply not a good place for this conversation and she would be better served trying to arrange some way of communication with the extra time instead. Perhaps a mutually agreed upon time to scry each other?
In my opinion, neta-narratively, that last sentence is basically saying that the decision will be punted back to the DM. All of the given choices pressure Elsa to make a decision in some direction. Your envisioned scenario reads to me as: they have an introduction and... something happens. Not sure what. At least with the given choices, I can see a direction to the events that is unique to the choices.
Given that she walked into the middle of a fight to have this forced conversation, she clearly decided that a battlefield is a fine place for this conversation.
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I mean, it's less "let go" and more "She is more than capable of leaving under her own power"
If Not!Elsa tries to push the issue, it's going to be the worst possible timing given that the Sect reinforcements are about to arrive, and this fight is already untenable for the Cloud Barbarians as is.
Theres an option to vote for that, and you're free to.vote for it.
I approval voted for both that and Alectais write-in. As far as.Im concerned that argument has nothing to do.with me
A fight Ling Qi was clearly dominating, and from the Cloud barbarians perspective she just saved them from losing
While Ling Qis domain weapon is still interfering with their buff chains as the Sect forces arrive in full
This opening wont last forever. Or even very long.
But while it lasts it looks very good for her from the perspective of the other barbarian factions present
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If she feels like she can continue the conversation here indefinitely then she is wrong. A Violet couldn't, there's no way a Green can.
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Zwobot
Pure Lazy
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Ugh. The write-in is non-commital and wishy-washy in classic Ling Qi fashion. If it had to be a write-in I'd suggest something like this:
[] I'm [Winter's Muse] student and guardian of her child. Please lend aid now; in turn, I'll owe you a talk later. But I can't speak for my allies and reinforcements.
There. Namedropping Zeqing. A clear request for aid with a promise for a meeting later since now is not the time (TM). Rounded of with a warning and clarification. Sincere and committing to a clear exchange, but promising nothing more. Rounded off with a warning so Else won't feel betrayed.
Edit: This is actually one clause too many to pack into a write-in.
[] I'm [Winter's Muse] student and guardian of her child. Please lend aid now; in turn, I'll owe you a talk later. But I can't speak for my allies and reinforcements.
There. Namedropping Zeqing. A clear request for aid with a promise for a meeting later since now is not the time (TM). Rounded of with a warning and clarification. Sincere and committing to a clear exchange, but promising nothing more. Rounded off with a warning so Else won't feel betrayed.
Edit: This is actually one clause too many to pack into a write-in.
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Alectai
Speaks Words of Wisdom... On occasion
Problem is that it's definitely two clauses there beyond the introduction, which isn't really doable.
The whole point is that "You get at best one sentence, and you don't get to include detailed context because there's no time or ability to compress that in the time you have"
The whole point is that "You get at best one sentence, and you don't get to include detailed context because there's no time or ability to compress that in the time you have"
Good thing it isnt then, since the point of being noncommittal is to avoid stepping into any cultural landmines while leaving the ball in Not!Elsa's court
Zwobot
Pure Lazy
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Well, I disagree with that. And here I thought Ling Qi wanted to stop being ruled by fear? Gaining Elsa's aid would be a win, tactically and strategically. Taking a risk should be worth it.
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Additionally saying 'Do what you want' to an offer of aid does not avoid stepping on cultural landmines. For all we know behaving non-commital is an insult in itself. Once you actually talk to someone you simply cannot avoid communicating.
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Inserted Tally
I don't think we could step on any cultural landmines when accepting the help she's offering and giving her what she wants in exchange. We're given the opportunity to convey our meaning through a language barrier and Yrs himself gave us this option, do you really think the DM would decide she was insulted by our agreeing to her offer in the only way he presented agreement? Yrs gave us this write-in for if we came up with something clever but being clever demands having a goal in mind and achieving it.
The Write-In eschews choice as if that is a choice. Yrs offers a plotline and puts it up for a vote but by the arguments made the last few pages is supposed to be a non-answer. That despite how we all seem to want to pursue this plotline we don't actually convey that in favor of saying nothing. If we were being careful we'd try something simple, not something meaningless.
Alectai
Speaks Words of Wisdom... On occasion
We don't actually know what she wants
We can infer, but we don't know, only that she's talking something about 'Lineage' and pointing to us and the rock.
Zwobot
Pure Lazy
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Good thing we can clarify with our music. Saying 'do what you want' is actually counter-productive when we don't know what she wants!
Yeesh, how hard is it to commit to: "Help now, please. We'll talk later."
If people are so afraid of miscommunication we can change 'help' for 'protect' but that would be really nit-picky.
She asked a question in the middle of a battle and got.it answered
If.leaving her to.her own devices.afterwards is an insult, then that's true of literally every option for having the temerity to.demand something of her for nothing
Just because you're not afraid of committing to someone after sharing a sentence together doesn't mean other folks are crazy for exercising an abundance of caution instead
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And if she thinks we are a kidnapped barbarian? That would be awkward.
Setting some boundaries and saying we aren't going coordinate with her reduces the stakes. She knows what our side wants (to fight the 12 stars and the Y'lith'kai as well as the starstone) and can decide how much she wants to participate. The only reason why asking for help in order to talk later would help is if she is treating the latter as a payment for the former, which we potentially lack the ability to actually honor. She might think that we have more power than we really do.
It would be more honest to show that we are open to conversation and then leave the ball in her court.
(I'm not saying that it will hit our sincerity insight, letting people come to the wrong conclusions is fine. I just would rather clear up confusions as soon as possible in this case)
We know without a shadow of a doubt that she wants to talk to us and peacefully so by how she didn't hurt Zhengui. She wants something from us and is seemingly willing to offer some aid to get it. Yrs doesn't do trap options so assuming she offers to help is pretty much as safe as we can get and if there's a misunderstanding then we at least show her the general path she could pursue in approaching us. Where does asking for help feasibly go wrong?
Do you think Yrs would give us a seemingly straightforward option where instead we possibly get stuck in some Fae Bargain-type deal because we got invited to a diplomatic summit where verbal agreements would be considered binding with a high quality Art of some kind? When there's been no indication that that's a thing here? This isn't a reasonable fear, it's possible but not feasible and there's been no set up for it. I don't want to throw around accusations of fear mongering but do you really thing that would happen if we chose Help?
Zwobot
Pure Lazy
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Yeah, pretty much. That was my point! You can't avoid stepping on cultural misunderstandings no matter what you do! So choosing the non-committal answer is no better or worse in that regard as any other. Fearmongering about some Fae bargain is stretching way too far, though. Ling Qi can and will absolutely say no to things like that.
Ling QI would not be committing to Elsa. She would commit to making a request for aid and accept to owe her a talk in turn. That's a big deal since it's directly opposed to imperial doctrine, yes. But Elsa can't just enforce any 'fae bargain' - besides she has actually acted about with as much courtesy as the situation allowed.
There's literally nothing straightforward about this choice at all
Because we have no experience with what to expect from the southern cloud tribes
Dont attribute simplicity to alien cultures in this setting
Stuff like this is what lead to that weird push to make Ling Qi Meizhens handmaiden or try to get Zeqing to adopt Ling Qi way back when
How many times do we need to get beaten over the head that Ling Qis standards and assumptions are not shared by her surroundings before the lesson finally sticks?
Not if she bargains for aid and has no idea what the Ice Womans terms were outside a word or two.
Then she'd just as likely as not get conned instead
Saying its stretching too far just because you don't like it.doesnt make.my argument any less valid.
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Zwobot
Pure Lazy
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Again, that is why we clarify the bargain using our music. If Else expects more from us - like for example to hand over Hanyi, then we will simply decline. It's not like we're signing a contract that will be enforced by outside forces.
She approached us. She firmly established that she wasn't hostile. Even if we disregard the Lineage+Aid sentence she's already shown herself capable of foreign diplomacy, of reading us when she almost maced Zhengui, of communicating that she wants to talk. She's already shown that she isn't completely alien or uncomprehending of us.