- Location
- barking
True but at the same time this is puppet varian granted if anything makes the puppet more like true varian this is it
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Orc Quest; or, A Critical Examination of Agency Through in Interactive Fiction (Warcraft)
- Thread starter FractiousDay
- Start date
- Fantasy
To explain the settlement thing. It's already brought up in the updates about issues of food and settlement problems.
Now I'm in favor of just digging deeper into Alterac which can include carving a settlement out of alterac's mountains and then deep underground once the Breaker research tree has been unlocked.
We have a good thing going in Alterac's position so Grok should best keep at it and Gregor also wants him there.
Though it doesn't mean Grok can settle his horde in other places. Though as said possible place means investing resources and people, it means more research trees towards said investment which is where I notice with dark shamanism as the research tree followed by possibly arcane magic lies a solution towards said settlement for a future settlement tool kit.
Let's say the dark shamanism research tree is thoroughly researched, Grok can effectively terraform a most inhospitable environment into a hospitable one. There's the issue of the elementals themselves but we're going to have to just see what happens exploring it.
Now I'm in favor of just digging deeper into Alterac which can include carving a settlement out of alterac's mountains and then deep underground once the Breaker research tree has been unlocked.
We have a good thing going in Alterac's position so Grok should best keep at it and Gregor also wants him there.
Though it doesn't mean Grok can settle his horde in other places. Though as said possible place means investing resources and people, it means more research trees towards said investment which is where I notice with dark shamanism as the research tree followed by possibly arcane magic lies a solution towards said settlement for a future settlement tool kit.
Let's say the dark shamanism research tree is thoroughly researched, Grok can effectively terraform a most inhospitable environment into a hospitable one. There's the issue of the elementals themselves but we're going to have to just see what happens exploring it.
Another point to consider is that due to the many recent wars depopulating the region, Grok has been able to expand Alterac's borders repeatedly with little to no contention.
Alterac is larger now than it likely has ever been and we have not exhausted all possibilities yet. With every expansion, more resources fall under our remit and make moving less desirable.
Alterac is larger now than it likely has ever been and we have not exhausted all possibilities yet. With every expansion, more resources fall under our remit and make moving less desirable.
I wouldn't move Grok anywhere permanently when he made his mark on Alterac and is best kept there.
Sending his new horde to settle other areas though? That's within the margin of possibilities especially once there is sufficient preparation for it.
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- United Kingdom
Indeed, and if Grok was more interested in maintaining his standing etc he'd be more concerned about that.
And as Gregor has noted, no other appointment would make Alterac as secure or influential as it is now
The issue is of course that Grok is implicitly gaining lands and territories, and making his own military governors etc, which makes disentangling all that if Grok leaves very difficult
Grok doesn't really understand the whole Defias situation. To him it seems that they have a legitimate grievances, but that it's all become quite complex too. He wouldn't be able to resolve the situation with peace really, but I'd also note that the Stonemason element of the Defias are relatively few of them. Not all of them are old guildsmen, maybe only the senior ranks.
They would indeed probably (roles dependent etc) be interested in deescalation or a road away without them all getting executed.
Also if Grok turned up and said 'I don't mean you any particular ill will but I'm supposed to kill you and you can't stop me, give me a reason now to, I don't care about your past crimes' then that would also be a persuasive argument.
I may or may not push this at some point to note the issue more presently. Eg have Kalaran show up and discuss it
Complicated really. There is competition between Onyxia and Neferian, so they're not entirely aligned. If Grok takes over it may secure Blackrock Mountain better because it stops the Alliance attacking and probably reduces Rag and the Dark Irons as a threat. However, if Grok is supporting the Alliance to contest the Scourge then they're unlikely to have time to oppose the Black Dragons building up. Getting all the way to Icecrown could take years and will weaken the Alliance, that's a useful thing to do for Onyxia and Neferian both.
Not to 'sort out' but certainly he has the connections to call on to get the Defias out for exmaple
Quite an interesting question. Given Bold!Varian is dead, does that mean Meek!Varian could 'grow' into the role? Or does that mean he's doomed to meekness because he's just missing that part of himself?
Achievable but difficult given the capability gap
It certainly is though that's what the research tree is for.
He had a lot of problems to deal with closer at Alterac than at stormwind unfortunately.
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- barking
I mean to be fair meek varian did mange to die in a brave way so I think that was always something he could of done just didn't have the right moment which to be fair again anduins death could of done
Kufufu
Adequate at best
- Location
- What's it to ya?
If the "Bold" Varian is dead, then that means it's impossible for the other half to be reforged into a single person again, which means he's Doomed to remain as is. A person may grow and change, but he's only half of a person, so he's stuck as is.
Also, I saw that someone said Varion's son was dead, who killed Anduin and when? That's a massive ripple, Onyxia could just marry her puppet Wryn, become queen, and birth a black dragon to take the throne that way.
Once the child is born, Varian can slowly decline from a "slow acting illness" and then Queen Onyxia can step in as regent for her husband and child, This time with even more authority/ trust because the keys to power in Stormwind will know she's been the one actually running the kingdom and that she's the devoted wife of the current/ former king, and the mother of the future King. At that point she would be so entrenched that there would be nothing to throw at her unless her detractors wanna be really obvious about their personal dislike for the lady and thinking that somehow justifies a coup.
TLdr: I expect an invention to a royal wedding in the near future.
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- barking
it was revealed in the rolls the deifies brotherhood killed him during last turn also your a bit late onyxia married puppet varian like 5 turns ago shes the queen of stormwind and alterac
and as for the varian part well meek varian died and he well that didn't make bold varian half a person in fact it might even be a case of it returning to bold varian so maybe the reverse happened as well just meek vairan doesn't have as much reason to be bold really as his kinda well meek his son death just might do it like in cannon with anduin being kidnaped meek varian went to save him and meek varian even jumped in front of a attack meant for bold varian so like I said he always had the potential just well he I feel is the embodyment of varian who felt lose with the death of his wife
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- Cave
This is in the process of happening right now, she's queen, the rest is probably roughly as you state. Unfortunately,
This is accurate.
I think now the time will be upon us to involve ourselves in the Alliance.
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- United Kingdom
That would imply some sort of emotional essentialism?
People seem to get split into different bits a lot actually it happened to Thrall too
Basically her plan yes
@FractiousDay take this as a compliment but in another life I can you see making a video game with samurai orcs with a cool story like this and lovely world building.
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- United Kingdom
Im glad you think so, I'd have to actually be an author for that though so unlikely to happen any time soon.
That it would. Doing a quest while having fun doing it is hard enough.
I saw that already with vagrus.
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- United Kingdom
More rolls, discard first.
Is Kalaran being proactive? 57, yes
Nef escalation? 91, yes
New Kargath? 22, escapes? 12 nope.
As general questions, what do you want to get from Dalaran and the Crusade? You helped both, Dalaran combined a few actions on getting magical support, but are there specific things you want to negotiate for? I've no interest in writing this out as some sort of currency system where you 'buy' stuff, but if you start from the point of 'what do we want' then we can discuss how much you'd be willing to pay for that etc. For example, for the Crusade they're willing to give you quite a lot if what they give continues to support their war effort. Dalaran meanwhile wouldn't be willing to give you, for example, some mage trainers, but would be willing to fob you off with a few magical artefacts perhaps. There's lots of stuff you could get so just have a think before I get to the bit in the writing where it's relevant. I mentioned various possibilities so you can have a read over the threadmark on it. You can also use your favour to get one group to pressure another if relevant, for example getting Dathrohan to transfer Hillsbrad to you, and getting him to also pressure Stromgarde to agree to a similar deal.
Is Kalaran being proactive? 57, yes
Nef escalation? 91, yes
New Kargath? 22, escapes? 12 nope.
As general questions, what do you want to get from Dalaran and the Crusade? You helped both, Dalaran combined a few actions on getting magical support, but are there specific things you want to negotiate for? I've no interest in writing this out as some sort of currency system where you 'buy' stuff, but if you start from the point of 'what do we want' then we can discuss how much you'd be willing to pay for that etc. For example, for the Crusade they're willing to give you quite a lot if what they give continues to support their war effort. Dalaran meanwhile wouldn't be willing to give you, for example, some mage trainers, but would be willing to fob you off with a few magical artefacts perhaps. There's lots of stuff you could get so just have a think before I get to the bit in the writing where it's relevant. I mentioned various possibilities so you can have a read over the threadmark on it. You can also use your favour to get one group to pressure another if relevant, for example getting Dathrohan to transfer Hillsbrad to you, and getting him to also pressure Stromgarde to agree to a similar deal.
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Dalaran I suppose could be something Grand Feldad would like?
Initially I thought of something to understand how to do dealing with demons or ancient beings better but I suppose it could be some random trinkets or artifacts that could help with infrastructure, blademasters or something else with conjuring up food?
Crusade I think would be smoothing out Alterac's position diplomatically. Maybe get more light experts. More food shipments?
@FractiousDay will the Forsaken favor come rewarded one day?
Initially I thought of something to understand how to do dealing with demons or ancient beings better but I suppose it could be some random trinkets or artifacts that could help with infrastructure, blademasters or something else with conjuring up food?
Crusade I think would be smoothing out Alterac's position diplomatically. Maybe get more light experts. More food shipments?
@FractiousDay will the Forsaken favor come rewarded one day?
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- United Kingdom
So I was basically trying to think about how many and who among the various political communities would be thinking what. You've got some older style Blackrocks who basically don't think anything Blackhand was doing was bad, and that the Orcs should basically continue as they have been, although perhaps understanding that they can't throw their weight around as much anymore.
The New Clan Radicals will therefore be a group of disenfranchised poor orcs who want radical action to resolve the various issues in Orc politics and society. They're not content to progress moderately like the Frostwolves are, or to go back to Old Horde institutions, they want new stuff. They're not politically unified because they want a lot of different things like political representation but also aggressive conquests to get new stuff and lands.
A few thouand probably. Like most tribes they'll actually be a series of subtribes etc
It depends what you mean really. They don't have much now in terms of resources but you've got a few thousand of them now who can work for you etc. Grok isn't necessarily doing it to be rewarded, he's helping out because he feels obliged to. Certainly, if he wanted to get the Forsaken to help him out at some point he could note that he'd helped them etc. It's more useful I suppose because people can deploy it and he can get support. Same for the Reventusk, he doesn't 'get' much there but he's still receives the intangible good of honour because he's helped out people who he was obliged to.
Again depends what you mean really. In mechanical terms I could award a autosuccess bonus to an action for example to represent the use of such magical items, if that's what you wanted to go with.
Something like maybe get some knowledge of necromancy from them or just get their status as undead for something they're suited for.
For example while I'm not asking for a horn of plenty something like a magic artifact that can churn out refined material better like a magic oven or something to help with farming or building could be nice.
Like these ones for example
Treasures
Treasures are valuable items your clan acquires through trade, war, adventure, exploration, heroquests and offerings. If you wish to see an alphabetical list, then go here. If you want a handy list for the location of the treasures in the PC version, go here Your traders say that most treasures...
Treasures
Treasures are valuable items your clan acquires through trade, war, events, exploration, and rituals. A treasure described “(use in battle)” must be chosen before the start of combat. There is a risk that such treasures will break once used. You may only use one treasure per battle. Treasures...
Kiln of Plenty
"Makes fine pots." What this actually means is that you will get a few extra goods every sacred time, about 5 or so. It is unclear what effect, if any, having the Greenware Exotic Goods has on this production Another clan will start with it. You can trade for it. It should not be possible to...
So Grok has problems setting up some industry. Maybe there's a magic artifact that can speed it up.
Or for food problems it's something like this that can make food out of almost anything but it's the best tasty food but it'll churn out edible provisions.
Mostali Mill
"Dwarf-made artifact can make food out of almost anything in a pinch". This treasure can be obtained through exploring the Imther Mountains.
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- St. Petersburg
So they are a bunch of permanently discontent folk that are impossible to please because they all want something different.
What can Dalaran mages do that our shamans and warlocks can not?
Can they provide mercenary aid when called upon? Which of our tactical deficiencies can they cover?
We lack ranged weapons. I am still planning to shore that weakness up by making forges and starting on handcannon production, but I welcome alternatives. If they can build forges for us as a free action, or enchant the weapons somehow, I'll take that too.
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That's my take too.
Well then, they aren't a large component of Grok's Horde so we either just accept it....
ooor, we keep a large portion of them in the Warbands that we use for dangerous mercenary jobs. They stay occupied and their numbers will shrink naturally over time.
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- barking
I don't think its will be that easy to get rid of them cause the way groks horde is it will create more of them cause well we are not really dealing with the issues that create them atm
See if any of them want to start a clan of gunsmiths?
As for what we'd want from dalaran... Information on their interactions with elementals might be useful sort of a neutral middle ground between thrall's shamanism and dark shamanism, might give us a way to make it more sustainable and infrastructure friendly.
As for what we'd want from dalaran... Information on their interactions with elementals might be useful sort of a neutral middle ground between thrall's shamanism and dark shamanism, might give us a way to make it more sustainable and infrastructure friendly.
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- Cave
What I want from Dalaran other than things mentioned is esoteric lore on demons or elementals, useful in developing our personal skill in binding or banishment or whatnot.
Ultimately fine with some artefacts that helps us stabilize Alterac. Or useful combat artefacts to hand out to the lieutenants(no idea what mechanically that looks like)
Ultimately fine with some artefacts that helps us stabilize Alterac. Or useful combat artefacts to hand out to the lieutenants(no idea what mechanically that looks like)
But they also provide internal pressure for us to leverage when if they do coalesce on something we'd like to do.
Maybe wands haven't been patched out just give everyone one of those.
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- Texas
I'd be interested in spreading our aegis over Hilsbrad and Eastern Strand for the Economic opportunities. Perhaps some infrastructural aid committed. From Dalaran, scholastic lore and magical trinkets seems fine.
Chimeraguard
We do deserve to exist.
Hmm, from Dalaran I think magical artifacts are best. We're setting up our own homegrown magical traditions of Dark Shamanism that I don't think Dalaran really has an equivalent for. And Magical Artifacts can do things like boost our characters that we want to keep alive yet generally go to where the fighting is thickest.
Looking at the details for the mercenary contract and diplomatic situation, it seems that helping the Scarlet Crusade directly was said to primarily offer rewards in terms of territory transfers and diplomatic recognition, and direct military equipment and supplies. If that's still true, then maybe instead of industrial aid, what we really want is the territory and a large amount of military equipment and supplies that can be rapidly used to bolster the quality of Grok's warband. That's something the Scarlet Crusade might be able to cheaply afford, and greatly increasing the overall quality of our forces would mean we take far less losses in future engagements.
Land is something that we can use to settle our 20,000 or so Orcs on and support them in. If we can get land that's Alliance-recognized as belonging specifically to the Breakers' Horde, then that I think goes a long way into establishing our legitimacy.
Looking at the details for the mercenary contract and diplomatic situation, it seems that helping the Scarlet Crusade directly was said to primarily offer rewards in terms of territory transfers and diplomatic recognition, and direct military equipment and supplies. If that's still true, then maybe instead of industrial aid, what we really want is the territory and a large amount of military equipment and supplies that can be rapidly used to bolster the quality of Grok's warband. That's something the Scarlet Crusade might be able to cheaply afford, and greatly increasing the overall quality of our forces would mean we take far less losses in future engagements.
Land is something that we can use to settle our 20,000 or so Orcs on and support them in. If we can get land that's Alliance-recognized as belonging specifically to the Breakers' Horde, then that I think goes a long way into establishing our legitimacy.
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