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NorseQuest (A Norse Xianxia)

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Well getting a hilarious amount of money is always nice.

[X] Take the deal
[X] Listen to the local Skalds, learn what news there is in Denmark

Seems like a good idea to get the lay of the land a bit before doing anything else. Might give us an idea of what to get for trading going forward.
 
Hey Halla do you know if you can put multiple Experiences into an object?

Hey Halla what stage of Odr cultivation is Jarl Iwan on?
 
Shard said:
How do we convert our massive amounts of money into power?
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Use it to buy prestige and build alliances through gift-giving and generosity, and maintain a retinue of warriors with the best equipment. Wear lots of bling, and give lots of bling to our retinue as a social display of our wealth. This is the way that actual historical Jarls and powerful landowners used their wealth, and it's something we could be doing more of.

Look at the orthstirr gain and prestige we got from helping save the Hading from famine. We're not going to get as big a boost as that from any one thig, but holding a regular feast for our neighbours would be a great way to earn acclaim from our neighbours. The tournament we're organising would be a great opportunity for this sort of thing.
 
Skippy said:
This is the way that actual historical Jarls and powerful landowners used their wealth, and it's something we could be doing more of.
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With the exception of Kurt (who we'll definitely get to, and soon), all our huscarls are ridiculously decked out in Wondrous level weapons and armor, with runes providing it very cool abilities. I actually think we are doing this pretty well.

Not that I disagree in general that this is a thing, mind you, I'm just saying for the record that it's something we're already doing.
 
alexthealright said:
Well that's weird
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I don't think it is. Most people aren't Odr cultivators at all and we don't know this guy at all. He might be very new to this gig, or powerful in other ways and his Odr cultivation is therefore less developed because he hasn't needed to develop it. It's also possible you can't develop your Realm any more after becoming a Steelfather...you can definitely still get more Odr, but advancing in Realm might be impossible.
 
DeadmanwalkingXI said:
With the exception of Kurt (who we'll definitely get to, and soon), all our huscarls are ridiculously decked out in Wondrous level weapons and armor, with runes providing it very cool abilities. I actually think we are doing this pretty well.

Not that I disagree in general that this is a thing, mind you, I'm just saying for the record that it's something we're already doing.
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We have not done much gift-giving with our neighbours or allies as yet. The stuff we've given to our huscarls is good, but weapons and armour are a bit utilitarian and do not really reflect generosity between hearth-lord and warrior as it is expressed in heroic literature and poetry. At the present time, as far as I'm aware we have given them no golden or silver rings to our huscarls. Given the sheer quantity of praise poems, stories and kennings that feature the theme of the lord as ring-giver, we can absolutely be doing better here.


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x-H1T7ny2Uw

To the historical Norse or Anglo-Saxons, saying you were a generous landowner and leader of warriors without having given a single golden arm or neck ring as a gift would be like a modern person claiming to be a qualified pilot without being instrument rated. It's an oxymoron. In the setting of the Quest things may not quite be so strict, but honestly we're lucky we're not getting more consequences for this IMO.
 
Skippy said:
In the setting of the Quest things may not quite be so strict, but honestly we're lucky we're not getting more consequences for this IMO.
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I, uh, I forget sometimes.

Also, your huscarls aren't really the kind of people who, generally, care about that sort of thing. Vagn would, but, as your forces grow, more people who care about that would join your ranks
 
Our retinue are all pretty chill to be fair, and it's only relatively recently that we've come into enough wealth that hoarding it starts to look bad in Norse warrior culture. Before when Halla's wealth was mostly in food and her crafts, she certainly did her best to share that amply, which helps. But yeah, if you were on Dorri's level and not giving out gifts to your the best guys in your Hird, I think you could legitimately be at risk of Nidheart or Odrengskapr.

Lack of generosity in a Jarl or King is one of the worst things you can say about them in Saga literature. It erodes the fundamental social contract between warrior and lord.
 
Skippy said:
We have not done much gift-giving with our neighbours or allies as yet. The stuff we've given to our huscarls is good, but weapons and armour are a bit utilitarian and do not really reflect generosity between hearth-lord and warrior as it is expressed in heroic literature and poetry. At the present time, as far as I'm aware we have given them no golden or silver rings to our huscarls. Given the sheer quantity of praise poems, stories and kennings that feature the theme of the lord as ring-giver, we can absolutely be doing better here.
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To be clear, I'm not saying we shouldn't do that, but we didn't just give them gear, we gave them ridiculously expensive custom made gear of metals that are probably more valuable than silver with expertly crafted runes. Giving them more visible wealth going forward is probably a good call, I won't disagree, but saying the armor and weapons are too utilitarian seems to me to ignore the nature of the armor and weapons in question. To say nothing of the Fylgja unveiling offers and the offer to permanently empower them we made (something, in context, it sounds like only Ironmasks get normally).

Giving them arm and neck rings going forward does seem more or less correct, don't get me wrong, I'm just noting that what we've already given them is kind of ridiculously valuable on the face of it. And self-evidently so to anyone looking at it.

Like, I think if we give Kurt some Wondrous armor after we get home, plus the offer to Infuse his Hamr and a fylgja unveiling, an arm-ring on top would be a bit over the top even by Norse standards for at least a little while. Our other huscarls and Vagn are definitely hitting the point where some additional gifts are likely warranted, though...we can maybe buy some stuff, or start making stuff this winter once the tournament is over.
 
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Part of problem is action economy. Unless there is an efficient way to give out rings and armbands to our retainers, doing so will be competing with everything else we need to get done.
 
DeadmanwalkingXI said:
To be clear, I'm not saying we shouldn't do that, but we didn't just give them gear, we gave them ridiculously expensive custom made gear of metals that are probably more valuable than silver with expertly crafted runes. Giving them more visible wealth going forward is probably a good call, I won't disagree, but saying the armor and weapons are too utilitarian seems to me to ignore the nature of the armor and weapons in question. To say nothing of the Fylgja unveiling offers and the offer to permanently empower them we made (something, in context, it sounds like only Ironmasks get normally).

Giving them arm and neck rings going forward does seem more or less correct, don't get me wrong, I'm just noting that what we've already given them is kind of ridiculously valuable on the face of it. And self-evidently so to anyone looking at it.
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Yeah, in fairness, swords, arms and armour are absolutely also prized possessions in Saga literature, and are often very prestigious gifts given between wealthy men. One of Egil's swords, either Adder or the-other-one-whose-name-I-forget, is a gift from Best Bro For Life Arinbjörn. Or one of his other friends, I forget. The point is it was a gift from a dude of similar social rank and the Saga continually points out what a great gift it was.

Weirdly, you see weapons and armour often given as gifts between friends, neighbour, or family members, but whilst it definitely happens, it's less of an established trope lords and their warriors and retinues? The trope there is more about giving precious metals (with arm or neck rings being the most common form, but also just straight-up giving silver and gold is not uncommon). I wonder if that's because swords are more of a gift between equals, whilst payment with silver and gold reflects more of a lord-retainer relationship?

A fine sword will also probably be more expensive than a small silver arm ring, so that's another factor to consider. All that being said, I think we do want to get into the ring-giving game as our own retinue expands and we get wealthier, because it's such a strong poetic trope for landowners and other lordly people. Plus practically thinking, we've already got the weapons and armour covered.

Oshha said:
Part of problem is action economy. Unless there is an efficient way to give out rings and armbands to our retainers, doing so will be competing with everything else we need to get done.
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We can make a paired set of arm rings for one crafting project, and we get two crafting projects per action. So potentially that lets us give one ring each to four of our guys for one crafting action. Our current arm rings give us the equivalent of a shapeshifting slot each, so it's also not an inconsiderable boost for our huscarls.
 
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Skippy said:
A fine sword will also probably be more expensive than a small silver arm ring, so that's another factor to consider. All that being said, I think we do want to get into the ring-giving game as our own retinue expands and we get wealthier, because it's such a strong poetic trope for landowners and other lordly people. Plus practically thinking, we've already got the weapons and armour covered.
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Yeah, I think the first year of people's employment we get them geared up then we start in on the precious metal-based gifts.

Oshha said:
Part of problem is action economy. Unless there is an efficient way to give out rings and armbands to our retainers, doing so will be competing with everything else we need to get done.
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Well. Starting this Winter we'll be able to make Grand items with Work Dice, which, since we're slow playing the deal with Dorri especially, lets us make very nice jewelry for people at 5 Work Dice a piece, no need for actions spent on it. Actual actions spent on jewelry are also possible, but not needed every time...though arm-rings to jack up our retainers stats aren't crazy (we have a pair).
 
Oshha said:
Part of problem is action economy. Unless there is an efficient way to give out rings and armbands to our retainers, doing so will be competing with everything else we need to get done.
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I mean this is part of why most lords probably don't craft all these rings and armbands and etc themselves. They have people on their payroll to do it. I doubt this Jarl goes out and forges everything his Hird wears, he just pays for them to get the stuff.

Our stuff is ridiculously cost effective because we craft it ourselves and thus pay for raw materials only (and we mostly get that via food and dwarf-friend status). But that silver cost effectiveness comes at the cost of our own time effectiveness. The silver we are saving by making stuff ourselves isn't Free, it's just paid in time instead.

That said with how good we are at crafts, making things ourselves is probably for the best. I kinda doubt we could get a single wondrous arm-ring for only 1200 ounces of silver. Let alone armor or weapons.
 
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