Skywalker_T-65
Writer with too many ideas.
- Location
- United States
- Pronouns
- Plural/They/He/Her
Lex is cute and all, but she's not Sara.
Changing Destiny (Kancolle)
- Thread starter Skywalker_T-65
- Start date
- Location
- Perth, Western Australia
Sara too cute, so op, plz nerf:
Dark Mage
Sanity is really overrated...
- Location
- Out of My Mind
Sara too cute, so op, plz nerf:
Maruyu, I think that belongs to Sky.
- Location
- Canada
Maruyu, I think that belongs to Sky.
Maruyu would like to inform you that she's not there to listen, because she's discovered the location of Asshai as described by GRRM. It's pretty high relative to her, and it's-- *is fed to Sara as modernization fodder for horribad pun*
Mega1987
A TTK somewhere at Kancolle's Iwagawa Airfield
- Location
- somewhere at Kancolle's Iwagawa Airfield
*Saves maruyu from being fed to Sara....
just to be fed to my Yuudachi.*
what? she only need at least 4 more luck for max luck... XD
Chloe Sullivan
Subdefective
- Location
- 1630 Revello Drive, Sunnydale CA
That being swept from the sky had fat more to do with arrogance, poor intel, and prior training having been in the wrong direction on the part of the pilots than any defect in the plane.
I don't think the sea hurrican underperforms the Tomahawk by much, and good doctrine allowed the P-40B to do faily well against Japanese fighters under the AVG
- Location
- Nashville
Uh, there's a problem with that patch.. i.e. High Command...
- Location
- Pacific Northwest
Actually, Hurricanes accounted for about 60% of the Nazi planes shot down during the Battle of Britain. The general consensus was that, while they couldn't dogfight like Spitfires, they were much easier to handle for inexperienced pilots and were a much more stable gunnery platform. Perfect for going after bombers and twin engine fighters, while the Spitfires engaged the ME-109s. I think the Hurricanes use team tactics, and not try to fight the Zeros individually, if they want to have a chance against them.
The AVG with the P-40Bs, had their success in not fighting the Zero's fight, preferring to "boom and zoom" instead of attempting to turn with them at low and medium altitudes. It also helped that the P-40s were considered to be heavily armored compared to the Hurricanes, which had fabric on the wings and fuselage, at least in the early Marks.
In these cases, pilot quality and training make a huge difference, being able to utilize the plane's strong points and minimize its vulnerabilities.
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Chloe Sullivan
Subdefective
- Location
- 1630 Revello Drive, Sunnydale CA
There seems to be a misunderstanding here.
By "swept from the skies" i refered to how a bunch of Battle of Brittain vets were sent to fight in the asian theatre. Flush from their relative success agains the germans, the brits boasted that they would sweep the Japs from the skies. It took the Japanese less than a month to wipe them out.
Doctrine really really matters. Chennault had the benfit of watching and learning from all of the Chinese Nationalist mistakes in air combat, and set doctrine for the AVG that worked. Zoom and Boom tactics being consistently used is a result of that sound doctrine.
Chenault did try to warn the British, but well....
- Location
- Meycauayan, Bulacan, Philippines
Where did this happen? Any links I can read?
Also, Hurricanes were a fairly durable fighter - easily more so than a Zero. They could take punishment would allow a pilot to land (at least around the time of the Battle of Britain). Also, didn't hurricanes, despite lower speed and acceleration, have some performance advantages over spitfires early war? I know by the time the Mk.V was around Spitfires were the better fighter, but early in the war from what I've heard and read pilots preferred the Hurricane. I'll need to go back and check, but there was one area they out-performed other fighters at the time in - better turning, I believe.
It's been a long time since I've read anything on it, and this actually makes me want to go back over it - I have a deep affection for the Hurricane from reading about the Battle of Britain.
It's been a long time since I've read anything on it, and this actually makes me want to go back over it - I have a deep affection for the Hurricane from reading about the Battle of Britain.
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- Location
- Mountains of Appalachia
Also at most the Japanese would have A5M4 Claudes as escort, the direct predecessor to the Zero with an open cockpit, fixed landing gear, and considerably worse performance (at this point only the Kido Butai airgroups and Tainan Kokutai had the A6M Zero, the Claudes were being phased out as production caught up to requirements, some still served on Shoho at Coral Sea). Since IOTL, the Japanese bombers were unescorted because of distance from the base in Saigon, they would be in major trouble against any kind of fighter CAP which was British doctrine by this point, especially with all the experience they got defending against LBA attacks on Malta convoys in 1939-41 plus the Channel stages of the Battle of Britain (and Crete come to think of it).
- Location
- North Carolina
In other words we are looking at a Turkey Shoot?
- Location
- Pacific Northwest
The early marks of the Spitfire were a handful, even for experienced pilots. The characteristics that made the Spitfire an excellent dogfighter made it unstable, twitchy and generally "nervous" to fly. By contrast, the Hurricanes were far more stable, forgiving and predictable in handling, and that made it a far better choice for new pilots or for those preferred a stable gunnery platform. As such, the Hurricanes handled most of the bomber intercepts during the Battle of Britain, while the Spitfires went to dogfight the Bf109s.
I regard the Hurricane and all of its variants as Sydney Camm's masterpiece of aeronautical design and engineering.
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- Location
- Pacific Northwest
Think Midway in the OTL, where the American torpedo bombers attacked the Japanese with no fighter escort. The "Nells" and "Bettys" sent against Force Z would be even less maneuverable than the Devastators, even if they were better armed.
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- Location
- Canada
Also much, much, MUCH more flammable.
Against 8x .303 sprayed in their direction with reasonably correct lead at under 300m, they're deader than chunky salsa.
- Location
- Mountains of Appalachia
On 8 August 1942, during the second day of the U.S. Marine landings on Guadalcanal, 23 IJNAF torpedo-carrying G4M1s attacked American ships at Lunga Point. 18 of the G4M1s were shot down, by very heavy anti-aircraft fire and carrier-based F4F fighters.
Unescorted 'Nells' and 'Betty's against a CAP? Yeah, pretty much that kind of result if the Brits are on the ball and have fighter cover. Keep in mind that the bombers in the example I quoted were from one of the same air units that sank Force Z, and I'd say that a Sea Hurricane is a rough analogue to a F4F.
Dirtnap
Kanmusu Affecionado
Nates would be able to escort, though they'd have to use drop tanks and even then it'd be stretching their legs a lot.
There was the experimental Tojo unit (Ki-44) of some 8 planes. They had the legs to reach with tanks and still have some gas left to dogfight.
- Location
- Arizona
Problem is the Ki-44 unit is based out of Indochina and has only *just* been formed at the time of the story, so very unlikely to be available. Plus the Ki-44 is an interceptor, it barely has the legs, but it's actually less agile than the Sea Hurricanes and would be chewed to pieces. Plus it's an *army* design.
- Location
- North Carolina
Basically, bottomline if the Brits are smart then the air raid is so boned. Which means that ABDA Float won't be as boned, having a pair of capital ships would help with that.
- Location
- Mountains of Appalachia
Exactly. The IJN won't willingly ask for help from the Army, and the Army won't willingly offer 'help' for the navy. Besides sinking ships is the Navy's business after all, says Army HQ, they have other things to do with their planes. So no Nates or Tojos for escorting the IJN bombers.
- Location
- Canada
You mean if the Brits don't have an Idiot Ball.
Chloe Sullivan
Subdefective
- Location
- 1630 Revello Drive, Sunnydale CA
Well, in real wars, there are a lot of idiot balls going around.
It turns out that all this obvious-in-hindsight stuff isn't so obvious when you're operating relatively new warmachines with untested doctrine and scrambling to respond to a war that came on faster than you'd expected.
Burning Baron
This position needs more entrenching.
- Location
- In here, not out there.
If Force Z is still in the area, the Idiot Ball is already firmly in hand.
- Location
- Canada
The British have operated in the Mediterranean, yes? And understood the value of a CAP? That's sailing in waters with hostile-controlled coasts.
South China Sea is near a Japanese-controlled coast.
There will be a CAP unless we go full Author Fiat Idiot Ball Avalanche, which Sky has shown no tendency to do to date.
How, exactly?
If they link up with the US Asiatic Fleet they can do a huge amount of damage in the month or so before the Japanese carriers are ready to back another push, because they have air cover now and can pose a significant threat to Japanese shipping.
Singpore might have held with one or two supply convoys successfully attacked, and a mite less stupidity ashore. The Japanese were on that much of a shoestring.
Sending Force Z east to Singapore and thinking that piddly bit of stuff would dissuade the Japanese was incredibly foolish, but since they're there already, putting them to use in defence of Singapore should not be so foolish (the Swordfish can be anti-submarine CAP, and Hurricanes only need to accept tactical advice from Chennault to shred Japanese planes).