Changing Destiny (Kancolle)

If you wave a magic wand and give the USN Shinano to pick apart, you get a more detailed section in the post-war Technical Mission report on IJN carrier construction. Yamato still gets smashed flat by overwhelming airpower. The reason she took so long to sink is she got hammer-and-anviled, and 70,000 tons of ship takes a long time to sink. The detail design plans for the ship wouldn't do a thing about that. Musashi sunk faster because she only got hit on one side and capsized.
Well, you also get a more detailed section in the report on the Yamato class in general, since Shinano's hull was essentially unchanged from her battleship form. Not that it really matters; about the only place where the Yamatos were more advanced than American battleship design was their main battery turrets (almost fully automated, as opposed to the power-assisted manual operation of American ones--which the NTMJ said seemed to be very effective and reliable, but also cripplingly heavy at about twice the weight of a US turret design)... so even if the US were to build more battleships post-war (not gonna happen!), there wouldn't be any real improvements to be gleaned other than "Hey, BuOrd, see if you can try and make the 8"/55 Mark 16 autoloaders work in battleship caliber, the Japs made it work, so you guys shouldn't have any trouble!" (Followed by many small, heavy objects being thrown very hard at the person demanding it by BuOrd personnel.)

Also, minor point of order, it was Musashi that got hammer-and-anvilled to death at Leyte; Yamato was the one sunk at Ten-Go by hitting her on only one side so she'd capsize.
 
Honestly, I see two ways Shinano ends up in USN hands. The first way is simply through them claiming her as a warprize. Sense the post war Japanese constitution forbids Japan having a carrier, the USN could simply claim her before she is scraped. Thus, allowing her to participate in crossroads... yay. The second way is significantly more unlikely, and it's if the IJN ditch Shinano after she breaks down while underway, and then the USN grabs her while no one's looking. Unfortunately, the Japanese would likely just scuttle her, or tow her back to port if that happens. Not to mention the fact that the USN wouldn't know she's abandoned.
 
In story the IJN has only lost one carrier (Kaga) so far in exchange for 'killing' Saratoga. I'm pretty sure the survivors of that strike overestimated the damage that Sister Sara took (a notable RL problem for everyone but especially the Japanese). Combined with their success at Pearl Harbor and the IJN morale should be pretty high at this stage of the war in December 1941/January 1942.

So it seems "Coral Sea" moved to Wake Island for the carrier vs. carrier fight. Different participants, but rather similar results, with a carrier taken out of action on both sides. Japan's morale will likely be pretty high, maybe not as high in real life, as they suffered heavy losses in aircraft and airmen, as well as failing to capture Wake Island. On the other hand, there are now Japanese crewmen who can see their ship spirits, which may improve morale. Japan may be the first to go public with the news, as such an occurrence probably makes the most sense to them.
 
Honestly, I see two ways Shinano ends up in USN hands. The first way is simply through them claiming her as a warprize. Sense the post war Japanese constitution forbids Japan having a carrier, the USN could simply claim her before she is scraped. Thus, allowing her to participate in crossroads... yay. The second way is significantly more unlikely, and it's if the IJN ditch Shinano after she breaks down while underway, and then the USN grabs her while no one's looking. Unfortunately, the Japanese would likely just scuttle her, or tow her back to port if that happens. Not to mention the fact that the USN wouldn't know she's abandoned.

It is a really moot point because right now she is being built as a battleship. The IJN only ordered her carrier conversion after Midway to make good the carrier losses.

Since it is less likely that Repulse and PoW are going to get sunk in the way that they did this time because they are not yet in the South China Sea and critically also have a carrier escort, that means that it is less likely that Shinano will be carrier converted versus completed as planned as the third Yamato-class BB for KANTAI KESSEN.

It was only after the sinking of Repulse and PoW that the Japanese started to reevaluate the relative importance of carriers over battleships and that has not happened yet. As far as the IJN or anyone else not named Thompson or Shreiber 'know', Battleships at sea are relatively immune to air attack and therefore the theories about the Jutland-style Decisive Battle between battleships still hold water.
 
Minor point of order.

In story the IJN has only lost one carrier (Kaga) so far in exchange for 'killing' Saratoga. I'm pretty sure the survivors of that strike overestimated the damage that Sister Sara took (a notable RL problem for everyone but especially the Japanese). Combined with their success at Pearl Harbor and the IJN morale should be pretty high at this stage of the war in December 1941/January 1942.

Reality has yet to set in for Japan, although by the time the Kido Butai is combat-ready after their airgroup losses, it will likely be about a 5-5 CV fight in the Pacific with Akagi, CarDIv 2, and CarDiv 6 versus Lexington, Yorktown, Enterprise, and potentially a repaired Saratoga and newly commissioned Hornet or Wasp. So 1942 promises to be just like OTL filled with carrier battles until the Essex swarm arrives in 1943.

So it seems "Coral Sea" moved to Wake Island for the carrier vs. carrier fight. Different participants, but rather similar results, with a carrier taken out of action on both sides. Japan's morale will likely be pretty high, maybe not as high in real life, as they suffered heavy losses in aircraft and airmen, as well as failing to capture Wake Island. On the other hand, there are now Japanese crewmen who can see their ship spirits, which may improve morale. Japan may be the first to go public with the news, as such an occurrence probably makes the most sense to them.

There is one more significant factor about this that only becomes applicable because of Thompson: Kaga Sank Content this time round. She was not unhappy with her Fate. No Anger, no Frustrated Hopes; No unfinished Business, in other words.

That may mean no Abyssal Kaga in the Future, which in turn may mean no Shipgirl Kaga in the Future.

Simply altering Kaga's mental state at the time of her sinking may have wildly derailed Thompson's Future, and therefore his metaknowledge.
 
Except oxygen torpedoes, kickass as they are, tend to explode when they're shot at. Akizuki. Chōkai. Chikuma. All of them went down when their torpedoes were hit and cooked off. How many American destroyers suffered that fate?
I'll give you that but given the IJN only lost 3 ships to that fate IIRC. If the US had their own Long Lance how many early battles could've gone differently? Honestly though it's a moot point as the US has gone all in on the Mark 14 and until BuOrd gets its shit together and fixes them so many opportunities will be lost.
 
Right, so I asked an airplane engineer about converting a b-25 into a tiltrotor. His first response was "that's stupid". After a bit of talking, he said you can turn anything into a tiltrotor... as long as you have the money for it.
I think Vianca forgot to look at how loooooooong it took to research the tilt rotor.

And the production cost ...

And the maintenance cost ...
 
I recently checked out "Neptune's Inferno" from the local library it's proven an interesting read so far regarding all the hurdles the US navy had to cross early in the pacifc war. After reading about the battle of Savo Island; I feel the whole thing was a debacle and scape goating the austrailian ship was disgraceful. If anyone should have axed it should have been Admiral Turner.

if any positive outcomes came from this trajedy it would be that Admiral King set about making the neccessary reforms.
 
I think Vianca forgot to look at how loooooooong it took to research the tilt rotor.

And the production cost ...

And the maintenance cost ...

Honestly, tiltrotor aircraft in the 1940's is a rather silly idea. The only way that can happen is if a Zipang scenario occurs and the Mirai winds up in the Pacific. Essentially, Vianca wants the 1940's US military to invest Lord knows how many dollars into an idea that has no real reason to be pursued. Especially with a plane that has no busy being a tiltrotor.
 
I'm sure this isn't actually story relevant, but with that Avatar Image I must ask. Could a Ha'tak become a Ship Girl if it was sunk to the bottom of the ocean?
 
I recently checked out "Neptune's Inferno" from the local library it's proven an interesting read so far regarding all the hurdles the US navy had to cross early in the pacifc war. After reading about the battle of Savo Island; I feel the whole thing was a debacle and scape goating the austrailian ship was disgraceful. If anyone should have axed it should have been Admiral Turner.

if any positive outcomes came from this trajedy it would be that Admiral King set about making the neccessary reforms.
Except it was USS Chicago that got scapegoated... And the reason the admiral aboard Australia gets flak now is that what he did during the battle (sailing away to the middle of nowhere to get some beauty sleep) is text book deriliction of duty.
 
Except it was USS Chicago that got scapegoated... And the reason the admiral aboard Australia gets flak now is that what he did during the battle (sailing away to the middle of nowhere to get some beauty sleep) is text book deriliction of duty.

(sigh) should not post when tired. gonna have to re read that section of the book to get my bearings straight.
 
Honestly, tiltrotor aircraft in the 1940's is a rather silly idea. The only way that can happen is if a Zipang scenario occurs and the Mirai winds up in the Pacific. Essentially, Vianca wants the 1940's US military to invest Lord knows how many dollars into an idea that has no real reason to be pursued. Especially with a plane that has no busy being a tiltrotor.
True, but he or she should have noticed the time it took to research it and promptly wizened up. To make something, it isn't just about money after all but rather also time. Since time IS money.
 
Rule 4 Don't be Disruptive and Rule 5 Don't Make Our Jobs Harder - When a mod says stop, you must stop.
Sorry about that one, was more thinking on how the SI Admiral might try to prevent some future bad ends for Saratoga and potentially Enterprise.
It is not like the public or most of the military knows or even believes in the existence of shipgirls, so altering certain events would be hard to do.
Added to this is that some of the technological development that could have potentially prevented this, started way to late thanks to several reason, one of them being lack of money to do the needed research.
Then a lack of interest or simply not yet thought up yet.

That was my the core of my thought behind it, what for butterflies could prevent those ending from happening.
Realising it needed to be several things stacked together to even make a change, at all.

I will admit Admiral SI is probably more focussed on the more direct future, like making sure Saratoga still exist next week or so.
I guess that the SI admiral just hasn't had the time to really think long term, yet.
Then ad the mind fog slowely starting to hide the future memories of events, thanks to the butterfly effect or something like it... (not remembering how Saratoga or Enterprise had their ends, could.....)
Wonder how boared(?) he will be by his forced bed-rest, though or how long it will be.
Well, atleast the few shipgirls that exist already, will help with this all, if it doesn't start a faith war in the shadows, that is.
People are people, after all.

Part of me is just wondering how many things the SI Admiral will be documenting in terms of technological concepts, but never ever showing this to anybody, for various reasons.
Then years or even decades later, somebody finding this, when everything has been developed naturally as it has in our own world.
Could such a thing be used for a omake or a afterword portion, by change?
Guess only time can tell that one.

I will (try) not (to) bring it up in the future.
Honestly, can we get some prove this future event knowledge based mind fog is also clouding future tech development knowledge?
Would make things simpler, you know.

So back to the last chapter, Admiral SI is out of it for now.
What does thin mean for him and Saratoga?
How long will they both be out of action, for one and could it potentially have unwanted after effects, like say his recovery time being too long and thus getting assigned to some other ship or so?
Or did something like this actually happen to Saratoga, for real???
If so, what did happen, then?
 
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Vianca. Every single question you just posed, bar none has already been answered. Repeatedly. Thompson will not be affecting tech development because he lacks the specialist knowledge required. "Mind fog" (whatever that is) has fuck-all to do with it. Every single technology that can be developed has already been conceptualized.

Thompson is not a SI. Sky has said that repeatedly.
 
Vianca. Every single question you just posed, bar none has already been answered. Repeatedly. Thompson will not be affecting tech development because he lacks the specialist knowledge required. "Mind fog" (whatever that is) has fuck-all to do with it. Every single technology that can be developed has already been conceptualized.

Thompson is not a SI. Sky has said that repeatedly.
Sorry, forgot the F in that, meant it as in Future Self Insert, he was thrown into the past, so in his eyes, it should come across as some wacko self insert story, you know.
How we should call it from our side of the screen, I have no clue.
Hell, would self insert stories be know, back then, because if not and he is ranting about it all sounding like a bad SI story...

And it IS already canon he is forgetting future events that still have to happen, possibly from all the butterflies they FSI's are generating.
So a Mind Fog
Would make it simpler if it also include tech know-how, like what the hell a pc mouse is or so.
 
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....

No. There is no "mind fog". He's forgetting details because that's how memory works, Vianca. There have been no indications that he has come close to forgetting the important things, the major events. Saratoga and Enterprise's fates definitely fall under the "major events " category.

There is no supernatural effect reducing the acuity of his memory or eliminating them.
 
Well, thats how forgetting events that you know by heart, came across in that particular chapter, you know.
Especially since that was part of his job in the future, but I rather stop with this.

Honestly, how would you think this hit to Saratogo will end up effecting things.
THAT seems way more story focussed to me.
If you want to continue this with me, take it to pm, would you.
 
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Jesus christ. You've had every single person in this thread along with a mod telling you to stop, Vianca. It isn't happening.
 
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