Changing Destiny (Kancolle)

Uh. Right. I'm at work, so I don't have the time to go into this, but here's a key difference.

Iowa's belt is inclined outwards. That's to optimize against high-angle long-range fire, which increases the effective thickness of the belt at range. (How much? To give an example, fire coming in at 45 degrees has to penetrate 24 inches of KCA.

Her armor decks are thicker than Hood's, and the first, sacrificial one is meant to trip the fuze of plunging AP bombs and shells.

To be blunt, Iowa is designed to take advantage of her ability to fight at long range, and her armor scheme reflects that. Bismarck's armor scheme is optimized for the close-in brawl, and she's slower than Iowa. Significantly. (Which is a damn funny thing to be saying about a 30-knot battleship. But I digress.)

Iowa, therefore, will be dictating the terms of engagement, and will choose a range that benefits her, rather than benefiting Bismarck.

Huh, didn't know that, well I knew about the speed. Didn't know about the armor being angled. But Bisko could probably take a North Carolina or South Dakota class on and win and she could probably fight off a Standard rather easily.
 
Huh, didn't know that, well I knew about the speed. Didn't know about the armor being angled. But Bisko could probably take a North Carolina or South Dakota class on and win and she could probably fight off a Standard rather easily.
maybe the Standards as they were originally laid down, but the modernized ones would give her one hell of a fight, and the Nocals and especially the Sodaks beat her on every category except speed.
 
Actually, the Iowas only have a three knot advantage. Bisko can go 30 kts at flank, while Iowa's going 33

Officially.

Unofficially? New Jersey reached 35.2kts and maintained it for 6 hours. Not when she was new, either. Nope, this occurred in 1968 after coming out of mothballs.

There are rumors that some of the other Iowas were able to go faster, I've read on several spots where people claimed 39kts out of Wisconsin, but that just doesn't seem reasonable. The 35.2kts for New Jersey though? That's a Guinness Book of World Records verified number.

Wisconsin is the only Iowa that ever did a "Barn Door Stop" though. 33kts to stop in less than the length of the ship. The rudders, reportedly, weren't ever quite the same again.
 
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Unofficially? New Jersey reached 35.2kts and maintained it for 6 hours. Not when she was new, either. Nope, this occurred in 1968 after coming out of mothballs.

Yes. Under light load.

With combat load, you have more draft, which means more drag, which means less speed.

Huh, didn't know that, well I knew about the speed. Didn't know about the armor being angled. But Bisko could probably take a North Carolina or South Dakota class on and win and she could probably fight off a Standard rather easily.

No, NorCars and SoDaks have the same armor scheme as Iowa. They're slightly slower than Bismarck, but they're more maneuverable, and their guns only barely lose to Iowa's in penetration. In fact, at certain ranges the 16/45 is slightly more effective than the 16/50, because it falls at a steeper angle, and is thus more likely to hit deck armor than the shell from the 16/50.

So really, Bismarck is boned if she is forced into action against any USN fast battleship.
 
Yeah, from what I've read, the Bismarck's hull shape made her a very good, stable gunnery platform for the rough waters of the north atlantic and north seas. It also made it so she needed tugs to actually dock, since she was pretty unwieldly
 
Yeah, from what I've read, the Bismarck's hull shape made her a very good, stable gunnery platform for the rough waters of the north atlantic and north seas. It also made it so she needed tugs to actually dock, since she was pretty unwieldly

She also couldn't steer with her screws if she lost her rudder for shit. Which ended up contributing significantly to her demise.
 
No, NorCars and SoDaks have the same armor scheme as Iowa.
Not... quite. The North Carolinas were originally designed as 14" battleships (with quad turrets!) and armored accordingly; the invocation of the gun caliber escalator clause in the Second London Treaty didn't occur until construction was too far advanced to alter their armor arrangements.

Pretty much the only reason we built the SoDaks at all instead of more NCs was that very reason. And increasing the armor thickness to resist 16" fire over a reasonable immune zone was so heavy that we had to shorten the ships a hundred feet compared to the NCs to get them within the 35,000-ton treaty limit. (And then, when the tonnage escalator clause was invoked, we spent the extra ten thousand tons to get six more knots out of the Iowas with the same protection as the SoDaks...)
 
Not... quite. The North Carolinas were originally designed as 14" battleships (with quad turrets!) and armored accordingly; the invocation of the gun caliber escalator clause in the Second London Treaty didn't occur until construction was too far advanced to alter their armor arrangements.

Pretty much the only reason we built the SoDaks at all instead of more NCs was that very reason. And increasing the armor thickness to resist 16" fire over a reasonable immune zone was so heavy that we had to shorten the ships a hundred feet compared to the NCs to get them within the 35,000-ton treaty limit. (And then, when the tonnage escalator clause was invoked, we spent the extra ten thousand tons to get six more knots out of the Iowas with the same protection as the SoDaks...)

Most of the extra armor weight of the SoDak/Iowa armor scheme is the Class B armor lower belt designed to protect against large caliber underwater hits.

The SoDaks only gain .2" of primary belt thickness, and .125" on the STS backing plate. That said, it is inclined further from the vertical (19 degrees vs 15), further emphasizing the long-range engagement envelope.

That said, that effective thickness number I used was against the North Carolina. I can calculate relative immune zones later, but the point is all three US fast battleship classes are a really unfortunate matchup for Bismarck.
 
Eh, I'd give Biscuit evenish odds if the showdown happens in the north atlantic. And a slight favor if the weather is anything less than calm.
 
Bismarck could win against a US Fast Battleship if she gets close. Her guns in theory according to the data charts on Navweps could punch through the belt of an Iowa class, hell if anything. The armored deck arrangement that Iowa class has is very similar to the armored deck of HMS Hood granted it has STS steel but it's three separate armor decks of decreasing thickness, but if Bisko can get a deck penetration, her rounds ought to bore deep into the ship, probably not into the Citadel unless they get extremely lucky but deep enough to give her a seriously hard knock. But Bisko will still likely loose unless clever maneuvering is used.
Iowa does not have the same armored deck arrangement of Hood. Hood's deck arrangement was a 2-3" turtle deck connecting to the lower edge of the belt, a 1-2" middle deck adjoining the top of the belt, and a .8"-2" upper deck above that. Iowa's consists of a 6" main deck connected to the top of the armor belt, with a 1.5" upper deck to initiate bombs and a .6" lower deck to catch splinters. In both thickness and concentration Iowa's deck armor is vastly superior to Hood's. That 6" deck? Impenetrable to Bismarck's guns out to 35,000 yards, a range at which even Yamato and Iowa are going to be lucky to hit anything.

A South Dakota, having the same armor scheme, is going to be in the same position, and while a North Carolina isn't going to be as well off due to the 5" main deck, that still comfortably puts the penetration point at 30,000 yards.

And getting close is a problem against an Iowa, given they're faster and quite nmible.

Huh, didn't know that, well I knew about the speed. Didn't know about the armor being angled. But Bisko could probably take a North Carolina or South Dakota class on and win and she could probably fight off a Standard rather easily.
A Bismarck could take on a SoDak or NorCar and win, but it'd be a matter of luck and I'd give it to the American ship best out of ten. The Standards are tighter, due to their low speed, but I've looked at the Bismarck class fighting the Tennessee class, and it's a surprisingly even matchup. Granted, a modernized New Mexico isn't the radar aimbot a modernized Tennessee is, but they're still good shooters and I'd give them good odds against Bismarck.
 
Question for all.
Just to be clear, the USS enterprise and the USS Arizona are based on the shipgirls designs seen in the pacific? Correct?
Is there a list that shows the descriptions and pictures that sky is using for his shipgirls?
Such as the USS Maryland and the USS Iowa and etc?
I'm kind of hoping that the USS Maryland is like the USS Maryland in the Pacific because she is probably the only shipgirl who would relate and be acceptable to 1940s America.
 
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I mix and match. Sometimes I use Pacific as a base (though Little E isn't exactly Pacific!E) and sometimes I use Warship Girls. Other times- such as Yorktown -I use my own designs and, as such, there are no pics.

And Iowa hasn't even been launched yet.
 
I mix and match. Sometimes I use Pacific as a base (though Little E isn't exactly Pacific!E) and sometimes I use Warship Girls. Other times- such as Yorktown -I use my own designs and, as such, there are no pics.

And Iowa hasn't even been launched yet.
Oh okay.
Just one more question,
Do you already have a design in mind for the USS Maryland and the other US Navy battleships?
 
I can get behind this...
It would make sense, firearms have a far greater cultural significance in the American psyche the just about any other ranged weapon, just like how the Japanese CVs use bows because Samuri were historically known for being mounted archers IIRC. British CVs would likely use longbows too, or maybe Lee Enfields for a more modern touch.

On that note maybe the reason canon Sara uses a tommy gun because she was built in the 20s during golden age of the gangsters when the gun was most prominent
 
On that note maybe the reason canon Sara uses a tommy gun because she was built in the 20s during golden age of the gangsters when the gun was most prominent
I say canon Sara has no sense of style.

*Dives into air raid shelter*

I like muskets better. For something slightly more modern, the Springfield or the Sharps rifles.
 
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