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A Sword Without a Hilt: A Song of Ice and Fire/D&D 3.5 Crossover

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Takesis said:
@DragonParadox, and thread-voters. Today I learned that the World of Ice and Fire has expanded on Lyseni culture.

They have a Goddess of Love depicted on their coinage as a naked, wanton figure.



Anyone else want to nom that goddess of false love?
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Eh, most goddesses of love tend not to be great. Whether they are based in the real or a fictional world. E.g Aphrodite, Ishtar, Sune. Selfish, vain and capricious. They'd fit in great in Lyseni culture.
 
Diomedon said:
We don't need to go out of our way to make enemies out of even more gods. We're already going to have difficulties with our relative religious intolerance of forbidding worship of Drowny, Tiamat, not!Dionysus, and likely R'hllor eventually.
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As far as I'm concerned worship of anything is not banned, but there are laws to follow and if worshipping your God causes you to break those rules well then that's just too bad but it's a Legal thing, not a Religious thing, pick a better god or worship differently.
 
Takesis said:
Anyone else want to nom that goddess of false love?
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Depends on if she's indeed a fake goddess of love, or a true goddess of love whose church has been corrupted, the world had a long period, of the gods not being able to communicate with their followers, it's entirely possible that she was just a normal goddess of love, still probably not that great a god, but not this caricature that is how she's portrayed nowadays, if that's the case I want to help her restore her church, if that's not the case I'm fine with nomming her.
 
Helo89 said:
Eh, most goddesses of love tend not to be great. Whether they are based in the real or a fictional world. E.g Aphrodite, Ishtar, Sune. Selfish, vain and capricious. They'd fit in great in Lyseni culture.
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And Aphrodite differed from her contemporaries how exactly?
The other Greek gods weren't exactly known for their generous, humble and level headed approach to... well, anything at all.
 
Helo89 said:
Eh, most goddesses of love tend not to be great. Whether they are based in the real or a fictional world. E.g Aphrodite, Ishtar, Sune. Selfish, vain and capricious. They'd fit in great in Lyseni culture.
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Freya is a decent goddess as far as I remember, not that I remember that many legends with her in them, but I don't think the legends say much bad about her.
 
if we end up killing Garin we will just dedicate some time to raid Burny plane and try to get him back. Epic level stuff, but somewhat doable.
 
Deliste said:
As far as I'm concerned worship of anything is not banned, but there are laws to follow and if worshipping your God causes you to break those rules well then that's just too bad but it's a Legal thing, not a Religious thing, pick a better god or worship differently.
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Yeah, that's not going to fly. Not when worship literally empowers our foes and extends their vision and reach to new places when new shrines are built. We are Viserys Targaryen, and we will hold even gods to account if they cross the line. Otherwise we'll start having Tiamat worshipers who are absolutely just worshiping legally and we wont be able to touch them, despite them empowering the person who keeps sending aspects to kill us.

Like, it might be worth trying to forcefully change larger gods via changing worship, because it's cheaper than stamping them out, but some gods just have no value.

Drowny, if he is even real, is likely a puppet of the Deep Ones and his practices are terrible from start to finish. The drunken god disproportionately punished people, and not even the people who set up the transgression, but the unknowing innocent. Tiamat is personally trying to kill us. R'hllor owns slaves.

Contrast with the Seven, who would be fine if they stopped trying to enforce their tenets on others. If they don't want their worshipers to use magic...okay. It's the insistence that they need to bother people who don't worship them that's the problem. Break them of that habit (and humble them due to our own purposes) with their various tenets and they are fine. Not great, but fine.
 
Duesal said:
I'd rather spend a few turn actions for Lya to research how to break out of a Favor. We know it's possible since we got the Unravelling.
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Do we even know what kind of debt Garin incurred to Burny? I know it's "a favor" but that doesn't really mean much. Gods have very little ability to directly influence non-worshipers, short of manifesting an Avatar or sending believers after someone.

It wasn't a Geas, and there was no magical exchange that I can recall.

Really, it seems like all Burny should be able to do is put Garin on his shit list if he chooses to disregard a request. If that is the case, Burny will probably make a very reasonable request, which seems harmless. That's when we'll need to be at our most paranoid.
 
Deliste said:
And Aphrodite differed from her contemporaries how exactly?
The other Greek gods weren't exactly known for their generous, humble and level headed approach to... well, anything at all.
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I wasn't discussing her in comparison to other Greek gods but, in relation to other goddesses of love. But, in relation to other 'love' goddesses. Where the trend seems to be 'do whatever I want and damn the consequences', with only a few outliers. While that attitude seemed to have been pretty prevalent among the Olympians, that doesn't take away from my point about these particular deities in general. Besides, whats the likelihood that a love goddess that was also the patron of a city built to breed sex slaves would break the trend instead of following it?
 
@Diomedon, DP has ruled that Xor is free from building the waterworks, right? How about we get him to start with the Merling King's temple facade? The one facing the sea, I mean.

We'll need it to be a pier of sorts, and we can get Lya and Viserys to do the indoor chambers/walkways through fabricate, into where the bloodstone altar, rests.

We need the temple to be ready for the Thirteenth Day of the Second Month, when Breath Taker is free, so that we can get his aid in dedicating the temple using the Driftwood Crown.


Also, proposals for the first week of the Second Month before the Twelfth:

*Braavosi visit. Vee for the Hydra, her orphanages and if she wants to check on the deaf boy from her village. Us, for finalizing the joint project with the Iron Bank, and discuss what they want for security measures.
*Quick visit the The Wall again, Lya for Castle Black, us to chat with the giants.
*Armun Kelisk? Perhaps?
*Mantarys (For divine item trade) and Tolos (for Breath Taker and Relath's trade deal on SD goods)
 
@DragonParadox the
Diomedon said:
[X] Admit that you were already impressed with how relatively experienced with magic she was and her general competence, and were interested in offering her employment. That she is Lysene nobility and your distant cousin as well is just both of your good fortune and the whims of fate, you suppose. You had actually given some thought to seeking out if any of the Rogares were still in Lys, but you ended up having to waste a good deal of time cleaning up other people's messes last time you were in Lys.
-[X] You'd be willing to offer her entire family your personal protection, promise a quality education, including in magic if they were so inclined, as well as opportunities in the future to improve her house's fortune. Oh, and your normal employment stuff, like money, supplying her with magical equipment, that sort of thing. The exact details can be settled later.
-[X] As she said, the entire city must be...alarmed, so you'd greatly appreciate her acting as your messenger to those in power. You'd be willing to send along your companions Lord Malarys and Ser Richard to both ensure her safety and attest to the veracity of her claims.
-[X] As to the message, explain the location of the meeting as that you dare not leave the tree unattended until the matter is settled, lest some fool endanger the city by trying to set fire to it or chop it down.
-[X] Have Dany use her ideas to cast Windwalk on the party and Shara, and explain the spell's abilities to Shara. Let her decide if she should fly or walk as a normal person, she is your local expert. Worst case it will be a way for her to escape and fly back to you if the locals are being truly foolish.
-[X] After they depart, have Lya and Dany teleport back to SD to inform Ser Gerold that he is to put what Legionnaires are battle ready on alert and gathered near the shadow tower and to inform Teana to make preparations for the tower to teleport if need be, before teleporting back to Lys. Have someone recontact Dany via Brazier every ten minutes in case there is more to pass on.
-[X] While Viserys is waiting, begin surveying the surrounding area in anticipation of trying to build an enclave or some sort of enclosure to help protect the new godswood here if all goes well. Idly play with the wayfinder and search for Illyrio.
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Lya really should keep her teleport slots open imo, viserys should drop them off and they come back with Vee unless she's at a sensitive bit in her work?

Possibly also a golem. Or maybe save it/them for later for stationing in the outpost.
 
Goldfish said:
Do we even know what kind of debt Garin incurred to Burny? I know it's "a favor" but that doesn't really mean much. Gods have very little ability to directly influence non-worshipers, short of manifesting an Avatar or sending believers after someone.

It wasn't a Geas, and there was no magical exchange that I can recall.
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Ask fellow piscine, and I shall "fish" it for you!

DragonParadox said:
It is Garin you worry about the most. He tells you he offered a his service to the Red God in one matter of that one's choice in exchange for its forbearance regarding Wyla. What that task will be or even when he will be asked to undertake it he does not yet know.
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Behold! The Anglerfish, strikes again!!!

Also,

DragonParadox said:
"And which of them would you not offer onto me?" the god asks, his deep and resonant as if he were branding them into the very fabric of the world. "Is there some sorcerous rite you would rather use their foul essence in rather than offering it onto me?" Something that you could swear is amusement is creeping into the inhuman voice, as Haldon's head begins to sag to the left.
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Why, the ones that we grow trees with, R'hllor. Like the one we just grew under your nose.
 
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Diomedon said:
We are Viserys Targaryen, and we will hold even gods to account if they cross the line
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How is this in conflict with my stance?

The Law is the Law even for Gods, if they break it they suffer the same consequences any entity would in our Kingdom. Seizure of assets etc.

Your hypothetical legal Tiamat worshippers are equivalent to employees of a company, say a Shipwright, they don't just get to continue construction because they didn't know it was for an illegal war fleet.

What I'm saying is Religion should not be banned for being a religion, but on the merits of it's practices as is just and would apply to any organisation.

Tiamat worshippers will be informed that their God has made an enemy of the state. We would not trade with Lannister merchants either.

Right now we dislike Burny but have little to no grounds to limit his worship provided they stay within the bounds of the Law and he does not make himself an enemy of the state.

The Seven have also made themselves enemies of the state, same applies.
 
It's the elephant in the room, but we need to talk about what we'll do if the resurrection doesn't work.

I don't question Tyene's loyalty. She's hung her coat on our coatrack, she's hitched to our rising star, and more importantly "it's where I keep all my stuff".

I do worry about her calling her dad and uncle pig-headed idiots for taking it personally that Elia does not in fact want to come back to the shithole that currently is Planetos. Much as it would be true, I care more about her getting hurt by their snubbing of her thereafter.

So, as cool as it would be to bring her back in front of Doran and Oberyn... anyone think we should do it away from Dorne, so we can reevaluate our strategy going forward if it doesn't work?
 
Takesis said:
@Diomedon, DP has ruled that Xor is free from building the waterworks, right? How about we get him to start with the Merling King's temple facade? The one facing the sea, I mean.

We'll need it to be a pier of sorts, and we can get Lya and Viserys to do the indoor chambers/walkways through fabricate, into where the bloodstone altar, rests.

We need the temple to be ready for the Thirteenth Day of the Second Month, when Breath Taker is free, so that we can get his aid in dedicating the temple using the Driftwood Crown.


Also, proposals for the first week of the Second Month before the Twelfth:

*Braavosi visit. Vee for the Hydra, her orphanages and if she wants to check on the deaf boy from her village. Us, for finalizing the joint project with the Iron Bank, and discuss what they want for security measures.
*Quick visit the The Wall again, Lya for Castle Black, us to chat with the giants.
*Armun Kelisk? Perhaps?
*Mantarys (For divine item trade) and Tolos (for Breath Taker and Relath's trade deal on SD goods)
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We're going to be pretty tight. It's the month after Tyrosh where we stop being on such a deadline and can wander more freely about (though we'll likely have less time to do so, until it settles down). If this current business pushes Runestone, both it and Elia take precedence since there are diplomatic advantages to the timing. We'll also want to have finished the basics for the beginning of our propaganda push so we can just hit go after Tyrosh. Most actions that aren't time sensitive for being cleared before Tyrosh or are not related to Tyrosh are going to be hard to fit in.

The temple doesn't require Xor though, it's actually a Viserys/Garin action, which we should be able to swing.

For Xor construction, we're going to be doing the Westhaven Training grounds, likely finishing the walls (unless we roll really well there), and maybe start on some actual residential construction.

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Crake said:
It's the elephant in the room, but we need to talk about what we'll do if the resurrection doesn't work.

I don't question Tyene's loyalty. She's hung her coat on our coatrack, she's hitched to our rising star, and more importantly "it's where I keep all my stuff".

I do worry about her calling her dad and uncle pig-headed idiots for taking it personally that Elia does not in fact want to come back to the shithole that currently is Planetos. Much as it would be true, I care more about her getting hurt by their snubbing of her thereafter.

So, as cool as it would be to bring her back in front of Doran and Oberyn... anyone think we should do it away from Dorne, so we can reevaluate our strategy going forward if it doesn't work?
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It's part of why I'm okay with Oberyn not being there, and in Essos instead. Doran is unlikely to do something rash, like try to kill us immediately. Particularly if Tyene tells him ahead of time that the one called can refuse to return, and discusses the possibility that, given the nature of Elia's death, that she wouldn't want to return to a world that had been so cruel to her.
 
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Noble Families in Sorcerer's Deep
  • Informational
    • Noble Families in Sorcerer's Deep (that we know about)

    Targaryen Royal Family (Viserys, Dany, Rhaella, Elia (neé Martell), Rhaenys & Laenor)
    Caleris (Saenena, Aelor, Aenie)
    Lonmouth (Ser Richard)
    Royce (Waymar & Ysilla)
    Vanor (Malarys)
    Drekelis (Garin & Selyse)
    Torchwood (Alinor & Ser Gerold)
    Strycos (Teana)
    Fairwind (Kyla & Jorel)
    Goldhammer (Leila)
    Velaryon (Valaena)
    Greyjoy (Asha & Theon)
    Bealus (Reva & Liset)
    Hermetia, formerly "Hermetia Nephaerys," now changed to "Hermetia Aerebalys"
    Rogare (Shara, Loreah, & Valyx)
    Crowl (Danar, Alyssa neé Grafton, their infant daughter, Thora (warg niece))
    Hightower (Lynese)
    Frey
    Squires/Pages or Legion:
    1. Robert Frey
    2. Alesander Frey
    3. Perwyn Frey
    4. Bryan Frey
    Mages, Administration, or Scholars:
    1. Marianne Vance
    2. "Fair" Walda Frey
    3. Arwyn Frey
    4. Malwyn Frey
    Religious Studies:
    1. Willaman Frey
    Umber (Mors, Elda (& husband Goram), and Elda's son)
    Tarly (Samwell)

    Voronys (Thoros, the one kid from the brewer family from Whispering Well, Laeris' descendant and thus the perfect excuse for us to mould him into a useful PC or noble)

    We've already made it clear we're all too happy to ennoble Tyene or any of the other party members. It's just a matter of them taking initiative like Maelor did back in Sallosh and outright telling us what they'd like and when they want it.

    That being said, we're approaching the time where we get to start building noble's estates and manses in Sorcerer's Deep. I'm pretty excited about that. Our core nobles will have the very best that magic and mortal craftsmanship can provide.
     
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  • Informational
    • DOOM fortress conference pending when we finish buying architectural treatises and our first series of conquests... :evil:
     
    Diomedon said:
    -[X] As to the message, explain the location of the meeting as that you dare not leave the tree unattended until the matter is settled, lest some fool endanger the city by trying to set fire to it or chop it down.
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    Azel said:
    If we don't stay to moderate the events at the tree, somebody might get the wrong impression of the Leshy.

    I would prefer to not sit on a throne made out of the skulls of the stupid when the Archon arrives.
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    But on the other hand, we could get a slasher-movie Interlude.

    "Leshies in the Mist", starring Jonny Aurane as Stupid Torchwielder #1 in the main role.

    [X] Diomedon
     
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