@egoo, @Deliste @Goldfish @TalonofAnathrax @Duesal

Still working on it, will try to include actual plan formatted posts after proofreading.

[] The Imperial Times, Draft #3, included in the link is a variation of that logo with a depiction of Viserys in Dragon-form and Planetos guarded by his wings during his rest, depicted upon the title page.
-[] Details: The Broadsheets will each have an Arcane Mark differentiated with each Issue #. This will make tracking them with a proper ritual and foci (the Marker key) simple for any properly trained mage or expert. The Broadsheets will be hardened by sorcerous means, the batches not being overly bulky, enough that there's no reason that Viserys couldn't do it himself to maximize potential Hardness rating.
--[] Finally, while true that many of these will be pointlessly lost, or at least have access restricted as people either cast them aside from baseless superstition, or the enemy gets better at disposal, that doesn't mean that attempts to maximize its spread and retention shouldn't be made. We have Inquisition assets in two of the locations they are bound for. Where possible, they will ensure some of them stay in circulation.
-[] Foreword from Viserys: TBD
-[] Editorials: In addition to statements from yourself above, as well as other information collated together seeking to inform people of the state of the world, nothing that a well-traveled sailor could not pick up in a port, but purged of the most outlandish inaccuracies and seeking to educate and inform--hopefully the fact that most of what is happening in the world is actually quite riveting when given the right prose will keep people passing it along as-written.
-[] You will also try to include an editorial on the Grand Tournament, since everyone else got a foreword about the Traitor's Tourney, why not regale the continent on the mighty deeds of daring that the visitors accomplished over that month instead of whispering and screaming of abandoned duty? After all, you are the rightful King, not Robert. Why should he get the final say?
--[] Create a serialized set of stories and fables, supported by visually expressive art.
---[] They would tell about Fey, the kind we deem acceptable, about how to spot Devil/Demon/Daemon cultists, about the spheres and so on and so forth (the point is twisting the narrative of those supernatural creatures that are seriously affected by it, to more sensible and useful direction, while also giving general population a minimal understanding of basic concepts we want them to know).

--[] Propaganda Posters: Pro-Imperium propaganda along the lines of recruitment for the the imperial institutions—Legion, the Scholarum, the Inquisition, the Imperial Administration, the Diplomatic Corpse, etc. These will come in the form of illustrated posters captioned by truespeech.
-[] For the Inquisition the posters will be along the lines of security and trust, focusing mainly on the need for citizens to cooperate and share intel for the good of the empire. (the Inquisition recruits on their own, that shouldn't be messed with). The themes of this poster will focus on the various threats that the Inquisition regularly squares off against -- mainly fiends, but also Deep Ones.
-[] For the Legion the posters will focus on the need citizens to cooperate, but also on recruitment. These will be images of glory and righteousness, of liberation and justice. Your basic army recruitment stuff, but embellished as much as we can. They'll illustrate how the Legion defends the Imperium, brings law to godforsaken cities, frees whatever slaves they come across, etc. It's a rallying cry to join in, to see the nearest recruiter, etc.
-[] For the Scholarum again the need to cooperate, but this one is more an advertisement that they're a legal and certified means of magical expertise, be it for crafting or other things. This could be split in two different approaches—the first being like some university's advertisement, detailing the courses and the resources (geared towards those who are more interested in learning and research), and the second being a call to duty for all eligible mages to rise to serve (this would mirror the Legion posters in a way, with an obviously arcane bent to it).
-[] For the Diplomatic Corps and the Imperial Administration the general idea is to portray how vital their jobs are and what lives they touch. For the latter, for example, focus on the imperial works in progress, how the materials are being shipped there, the roads being built to connect the Imperium in full, etc. "One Empire". It basically writes itself.
--[]
Create a series of politically charged caricatures: Varied by region.
-[] 1. The Warlock of the West
Description: The picture shows Tywin Lannister sitting on the Rock. In his hands is a small person in robes, standing for a mage, to which he wants to affix a collar with chain. Nearby stands a huge cauldron with many mages chained to it and reluctantly tending to it. In it bubbles a repulsive liquid, with bones and skulls being seen inside, and it splashes goop all over the Westerlands, with a large glop landing square on Lannisport.
Caption:
"They will do as they are told."
Locations: Lannisport, Kayce (trade harbor), Crakehall (trading city on the Ocean Road)
-[] 2. Thirst
Description: Tywin Lannister and Robert Baratheon loom over the Red Mountains, looking down at Dorne. Both of them carry a goblet from which Robert drinks, while Tywin holds his one down to Gregor Clegane, who stands there and lets the blood running from a peasants severed head drip into the goblet.

Caption: "We will get our fill!"
Locations: Sunspear, Hellholt, Godsgrace
-[] 3. Stolen Legacies
Description: Looming like a giant, his head sticking out of a lion's mouth, the head mounted upon the shoulders of a Golden Shield knight, one giant brazen hand lifts the top of Dragonstone's castle and reaches down and up to pull away a fistful of tabards, tapestries and keepsakes marked with Targaryen heraldry and regalia. Dragon Eggs fall between fat fingers and smash themselves on top of Duskendale, King's Landing and Storm's End lain upon a tableau like a map, tiny figures scurrying around and chased by stampeding stags and prowling lions.

Caption: "The legacy of a thief."
Locations: King's Landing, Duskendale, Dragonstone, Driftmark
-[] 4. Important Matters
Description: Robert Baratheon sits in a tavern hall, which is richly festooned in hunting trophies and with various frippery. He is busy ogling a whore that fills his wine cup. Behind his back, Cersei sits on the Iron Throne and torments various people with sorcery and laughing at them, while a few of the people in the hall are dragged away by demonic figures reaching out of the shadows. Beneath them all, there is a scene of starving peasants knifing each other in the streets.

Caption: "What could be more important then this?"
Locations: Kings Landing, Duskendale, Dragonstone, Driftmark
-[] 5. The Great Rulers
Description: A large picture of the whole Riverlands, with three giants standing on it, their steps having left deep craters in it. One can only see the legs of the giants, but they are clearly marked by the house sigils of Tully, Lannister and the Crowned Stag. Meanwhile, the peasants and lords look upward in fear for where the giants will step next.

Caption: "The dance of the high lords."
Locations: Riverrung, Saltpans, Maidenpool, Harrenhall, Seaguard
-[] 6. Absent
Description: A depiction of the Vale, with the Eyrie in the center. Upon it stands and empty chair. Around it, both Andals and Hill Folk are locked in combat with Demons and Devils.

Caption: "Everyone for himself."
Locations: The Eyrie, Gulltown
-[] 7. No Help Coming
Description: A depiction of the North, including the Wall. There is a massive breach in the Wall and the Night's Watch rushes to fill it in, aided by what is clearly Legionnaires under the Targ banner, and is trying desperately to close it off, while directly ahead of it a forest with clawed hands and slavering jaws peers southwards. To the South itself, Jon Arryn, Hoster Tully, Tywin Lannister and Robert Baratheon stand opposite of Ned Stark. Robert clutches a Targ banner and is clearly yelling at Ned.

Caption: "How dare you to let my enemies in?"
Locations: Winterfell, White Harbor
-[] 8. Dragging You Down
Description: A depiction of various smallfolk interrupted from seemingly idyllic work and ordinary life, dragged screaming into the sea by tentacles and enormous webbed hands, while distinctive figures in their heraldry gather around a witch's pyre to burn a small girl, with tears in her eyes, a golden-haired witch holding back their mother nearby.
Caption:
"Get back into line."
Locations: Coastal Communities, North, East, South and West
--[] Start serializing a "Monster's Manual", focusing on common threats to the individual regions. Ideally, these segments could be bound together to eventually form a complete manual around the time space for it is given to some other document.
-[] "An Exile's Journey, Part One" In addition to the mentioned free informational document section, we will produce a serialized re-telling of our adventures, putting our utter genius with words and public address to use.
--[] "Greetings, gentlefolk of Westeros. My name is Viserys Targaryen, though I am known by many others. If you would give me but a moment of your time, I would like to tell you a story, a story of a young boy and his infant sister, cast out into the world to fend for themselves."
---[] In short, explain how we were forced into exile by Robert Baratheon, carried to safety in far off Braavos by the loyal Ser Willem Darry in order to avoid the horrific fate which befell our kinfolk when King's Landing fell to Lannister treachery.
----[] We grew up in Braavos, untroubled by the events of the world as children so often are. Eventually Ser Darry passed and magic returned to the world. We struggled, faced hardships and monsters, but grew strong. We gathered friends, loyal companions all, and we helped to defend Braavos from inhuman threats which now plague so much of the world.
-----[] And then we had to leave our comfortable home in Braavos, not for any wrongdoing on our part, but due to threats levied against the city that had welcomed us. Jon Arryn, the Hand of the Usurper, threatened the well being of Braavos, to block its traders from all Westerosi ports. Rather than force our friend the Sealord to decide whether to defy the Usurper and watch his city wither, or cast us out of our home, we voluntarily departed, going once more into exile.
------[] All was not lost, however, and soon we set foot upon unfriendly shores, the pirate's haven of Torturer's Deep. Through force of arms and powerful magic, the island was cleansed of the cutthroats infesting it, so that a new city could rise, one founded on principles we learned growing up in Braavos. We had a new mission, to rid the Narrow Sea and Essos of slavery.
-------[] Our successes came quickly, wiping slavers from the Narrow Sea that had previously gone unopposed for centuries. That success attracted the Usurper's fearful gaze once more, and for a third time he sought to chase us from our home, this time with a grand fleet, one bought and paid for with Lannister gold. This time we chose to make a stand.
--------[] To Be Continued
 
That sounds nice in essence but I wouldn't want to put a target on their backs. I wouldn't use names or anything that could link them to their current whereabouts or doings, which "being a beekeeper, a niche profession, on Sorcerer's Deep" would probably be.

Not a bad idea though. And yes, I know, you'd be given out Darwin Award's to anyone stupid enough to target retribution on an Imperial Citizen in the heart of our power, much less find anyone willing to do it, but I guess I just mean more in principle than anything else.
Right, obviously keep the names obscured. But that kind of story can be exceptionally powerful propaganda. We can make all of Westeros viscerally aware of how bad things are, and then cast ourselves as the solution to those problems. Basically make ourselves out as the Good King, come to put things right again.

Here's another one: a story from the perspective of one of the Golden Shields, bound against their will to slaughter blameless peasants, unable to speak or even think discontent at their lot until freed by Good KIng Viserys.

Reading a story from someone's perspective does a great job of getting people to empathize with them, so let's use that empathy to cast our enemies is as horrible as light as we can. Basically we should write our own version of The Jungle.

Edit: obviously we make the mind control as viscerally horrifying as possible here.
 
Last edited:
You know.... if we make illustrations for the scenes of our quasi biography we could have it basically become.... thhe very first comic book.

Have it be a modified depiction of our life for propaganda purposes with comic books style illustrations and i suspect it would be fairly popular.

Heck, even without it it would be popular but having illustrations to aid in visualization would likely make it more so.
 
Are tattoos a thing in ASOIAF? Beyond Lya's Advanced Tattoo Guardian Construct, I mean.

Just sitting here watching Ink Master on TV and I'm wondering if our Legion soldiers are sporting dragon tattoos. I can see that becoming a common practice.
..... That might actually make for a good omake.

An omake about the tattoo and body art developing around the empire and maybe touch a bit on some parts that arent part of the empire like yi ti and Westeros
If tatoos weren't a thing before, they are certainly now that Elaheh's shop is open.
That would be the very first and simplest bodymod she could offer.
 
If tatoos weren't a thing before, they are certainly now that Elaheh's shop is open.
That would be the very first and simplest bodymod she could offer.
Good point. Though i doubt anyone would go for the more extreme ones for a while. It is still to new so they will likely stick with what is familiar
 
@Goldfish, tattoos were a thing in ASOIAF... among slaves and pirates.

Volantis for example had an old tradition where slaves are tattooed right on their face according to their occupation.

That said, Legion tattoos would be great. One on the shoulder with your Legion number and your rank.
 
Nah, best to keep it relatively uniform.
It would still be uniform but it would also give some character and would help differentiate it from the branding used on slaves..... Just a rank and legion number would probably call back to many bad memories for a lot of them so a legion symbol, possibly with some kind of imdividual variation, would likely be good for their mental health and show their individuality.
 
It would still be uniform but it would also give some character and would help differentiate it from the branding used on slaves..... Just a rank and legion number would probably call back to many bad memories for a lot of them so a legion symbol, possibly with some kind of imdividual variation, would likely be good for their mental health and show their individuality.
I highly doubt that would be the case. The legionnaires are proud to serve in the Legion. Making the tattoos uniform would in no way be poor for their mental health.
 
I highly doubt that would be the case. The legionnaires are proud to serve in the Legion. Making the tattoos uniform would in no way be poor for their mental health.
There is a difference from being proud of serving something and having something merkedly similar to some serrious trauma done on purpose.


I am just saying that, considering the history of most of the legion, just a ranking and legion number seems very unlikely due to similarities to slave branding. More likely they will go for a common theme but have individual differences accentuating the ability to choose something different and show that while they are part of one group they are ALSO individuals.
 
If this is morphing into outright newspaper spreadsheets, maybe we can add some educational material beyond monsters.

Like Advice on improved farming techniques and how To Guides for stuff peasants have a use for.

Maybe ask some of the peasants that came to our lands to write (well, dictate) some experiences on how their lives improved. Give a groundside view on the Imperium.

Another hit piece I thought of was Gregors habits: A Lannister Knight raping and murdering random peasants without being punished.

That should be a bit closer to home for many peasants than what their lords get up to.

In general it should keep within their sphere of interest. Which is mainly safety (covered by the hitpieces depicting roberts uselessnes), food security (issue here is that we are sorta attacking theirs...) and taxes.

What is taxation like in the Empire anyway? Or food security? We can certainly show that we got housing covered by raising entire cities and mega engineering projects.

Actually, do levies still exist in the Empire or is that all folded under the Army? That may be another good piece. They won't be drafted for war anymore.
 
There is a difference from being proud of serving something and having something merkedly similar to some serrious trauma done on purpose.
And I'm saying you're exaggerating a lot. None of them are going to associate the Legion with their past trauma.
I am just saying that, considering the history of most of the legion, just a ranking and legion number seems very unlikely due to similarities to slave branding. More likely they will go for a common theme but have individual differences accentuating the ability to choose something different and show that while they are part of one group they are ALSO individuals.
That's the thing -- this isn't going to be something the legionnaires randomly decide, this would be policy set from the top. It's a mark of the Legion as a whole. If they want individual variations or whatever they're free to get more tattoos in different places, but the Legion tattoo should definitely be regiment and uniform. Making it a mess of individuality just muddles it up.
 
If this is morphing into outright newspaper spreadsheets, maybe we can add some educational material beyond monsters.

Like Advice on improved farming techniques and how To Guides for stuff peasants have a use for.

Maybe ask some of the peasants that came to our lands to write (well, dictate) some experiences on how their lives improved. Give a groundside view on the Imperium.

Another hit piece I thought of was Gregors habits: A Lannister Knight raping and murdering random peasants without being punished.

That should be a bit closer to home for many peasants than what their lords get up to.

In general it should keep within their sphere of interest. Which is mainly safety (covered by the hitpieces depicting roberts uselessnes), food security (issue here is that we are sorta attacking theirs...) and taxes.

What is taxation like in the Empire anyway? Or food security? We can certainly show that we got housing covered by raising entire cities and mega engineering projects.

Actually, do levies still exist in the Empire or is that all folded under the Army? That may be another good piece. They won't be drafted for war anymore.

The draft doesn't exist in Essos. It sort of exists in Westeros as a technicality, but we will slowly erode that holdover and encourage Lords to only field professional soldiers to extend their influence on their lands. With an enormous professional military following the Crown they will want to concentrate their force projection anyway.

The base end-state for military affairs is an all-voluntary professional military. Lords can be called upon by the Crown to contribute troops or supplies to any on-going war effort as per normal (it will be part of their formal obligations, whereas currently in Westeros it is largely informal and vassals can reticently withhold some of their strength. They will not want to try that against Viserys--or at least not after the first few examples are made).
 
Last edited:
And I'm saying you're exaggerating a lot. None of them are going to associate the Legion with their past trauma.

Not the legion but the tattoos. They action of having them marked with their rank and legion is very very similar to the, surpsingly common practice historically, of branding slaves with the name of their owner and "their number" which was often used to identify them.

You are basically trying to have that done to a bunch of former slaves and expect it to go well?

That's the thing -- this isn't going to be something the legionnaires randomly decide, this would be policy set from the top

Yeah, that just makes it worse as it adds another layer of parallels to the whole thing as the higher ups (the masters) are ordering for yheir bodies to be marked (branded) with their legion (owners) and rank (their number).

Tell me you do not see the similarities.

EDIT: It would be better if we treat it the way the military treats such things. Have a symbol which identifies your group, make it prevalent and identifying and have them be proud of said symbol.

Naturally the soldiers will want to mark themselves to show said pride.

Simple and effective.

And it lacks the cold unfeelingness of the uniform rank and number system which would be better done via dog tags or similar.
 
Last edited:
To add to that, that's another thing I'd address during a hypothetical House of Lords meeting. Standards for troop contributions. Just set it so that the Crown won't accept soldiers as a tithe who aren't trained to at least Household Guard standards (MAA). This will naturally make people reorganize their logistics and cut-out levies, even as the Legion starts fulfilling some of the duties they'd ordinarily be responsible for (patrolling the land for banditry/monsters). So it's not like they get nothing out of the arrangement, either.
 
Not the legion but the tattoos. They action of having them marked with their rank and legion is very very similar to the, surpsingly common practice historically, of branding slaves with the name of their owner and "their number" which was often used to identify them.

You are basically trying to have that done to a bunch of former slaves and expect it to go well?



Yeah, that just makes it worse as it adds another layer of parallels to the whole thing as the higher ups (the masters) are ordering for yheir bodies to be marked (branded) with their legion (owners) and rank (their number).

Tell me you do not see the similarities.

EDIT: It would be better if we treat it the way the military treats such things. Have a symbol which identifies your group, make it prevalent and identifying and have them be proud of said symbol.

Naturally the soldiers will want to mark themselves to show said pride.

Simple and effective.
I disagree with you on a fundamental level. Yes, there are parallels, but they are overwhelmed by a massive difference in circumstance. Having uniform tattoos for the Legion will not go nearly as badly as you're declaring for multiple reasons, first among them being that the Legion itself is the institution that puts an end to slavery wherever it goes. It evokes the exact opposite reaction that say seeing a slave owner would. Simply having a regiment and uniform tattoo isn't nearly enough to overcome that.
 
To add to that, that's another thing I'd address during a hypothetical House of Lords meeting. Standards for troop contributions. Just set it so that the Crown won't accept soldiers as a tithe who aren't trained to at least Household Guard standards (MAA). This will naturally make people reorganize their logistics and cut-out levies, even as the Legion starts fulfilling some of the duties they'd ordinarily be responsible for (patrolling the land for banditry/monsters). So it's not like they get nothing out of the arrangement, either.

Alternatively, offer them they they either contribute troops directly or send money for the equivalents worth.

Because encouraging our vassals to not have troops of their own is a good thing.
 
Tattoos in the military are largely informally done, anyway, aren't they? Just leave them to it. What they do in their private lives doesn't concern the Crown nor the Legion, and Duesal is naturally right that many Legionnaires will get shared tattoos--which could mean they'll all get a Dragon Sleeve dashing through fire and flame, adding a little more to it every year until retirement where it gets completed, or alternatively just unit insignia.
 
Alternatively, offer them they they either contribute troops directly or send money for the equivalents worth.

Because encouraging our vassals to not have troops of their own is a good thing.

I think that will take longer. Encouraging them not to press-gang peasants is progress, basically not-so-subtly insisting that they "don't waste their time organizing troops" would impugn the martial aristocratic warrior nobility's honor, and also make them nervous as fuck.
 
I disagree with you on a fundamental level. Yes, there are parallels, but they are overwhelmed by a massive difference in circumstance. Having uniform tattoos for the Legion will not go nearly as badly as you're declaring for multiple reasons, first among them being that the Legion itself is the institution that puts an end to slavery wherever it goes. It evokes the exact opposite reaction that say seeing a slave owner would. Simply having a regiment and uniform tattoo isn't nearly enough to overcome that.
You are trying to explain feelings and trauma with logic while forgetting it is not logical.


Trauma doesnt go away after being explained that the circumstances for it to trigger dont require it. They still freak out regaurdless.

The similarities are enough that it is likely to cause problems in the mental and emotional health of our soldiers and thus is not worth it when a very good alternative is present. Dog tags hardened and engraved with their name, legion, rank, and so on seems much better than triggering traumatic memories.

It is a simple matter of "Is having all our troops marked worth triggering their own trauma and possibly interfering with their effectiveness worth it when there is an alternative that would work better available?"

EDIT:

Tattoos in the military are largely informally done, anyway, aren't they? Just leave them to it. What they do in their private lives doesn't concern the Crown nor the Legion, and Duesal is naturally right that many Legionnaires will get shared tattoos--which could mean they'll all get a Dragon Sleeve dashing through fire and flame, adding a little more to it every year until retirement where it gets completed, or alternatively just unit insignia.

I tried explaining that earlier but for some reason he seems really insistent on having all our soldier given a tattoo that says their rank and legion.... even though it risks triggering existing trauma and doesnt make much sense as they can be transferred and they can rise in rank making the tattoos need to be overwritten as tattoo removal doesnt exist yet.
 
Last edited:
Tattoos in the military are largely informally done, anyway, aren't they? Just leave them to it. What they do in their private lives doesn't concern the Crown nor the Legion, and Duesal is naturally right that many Legionnaires will get shared tattoos--which could mean they'll all get a Dragon Sleeve dashing through fire and flame, adding a little more to it every year until retirement where it gets completed, or alternatively just unit insignia.
I don't have a problem with a the legion developing a culture around tattoos, but I do have an issue with what @Duesal is suggesting, which are specifically mandatory tattoos with name, rank and the mark of the Legion.
 
Back
Top