This is comparing potatoes and thermonuclear explosions. If it's less than the Aspect of a Archduke, Viserys dunks on it. If it's a Physical God with physical scaling invulnerability powered by literal narrativium (literal) then Viserys doesn't get into Melee range of it, he finds the McGuffin with his tactical prowess and shoves it into the right keyhole.
How about "how to handle the cap on aspirant size VS the cap on initiate size" ?
We should be running into the max number of magelings each teacher can teach pretty soon, yet the number of aspirants whose magic we can try to awaken should not be a problem yet.
How shall we chose which students get a chance to learn? Money? Raffles? Or shall we stop levelling Hedge Mages and focus on levelling PC classes, despite it being slower? Or do we keep awakening a shitton of magelings, despite knowing that most of them won't have teachers and so will never get beyond level 1? That's sure to create resentment and competition for slots in our classes...
How about "how to handle the cap on aspirant size VS the cap on initiate size" ?
We should be running into the max number of magelings each teacher can teach pretty soon, yet the number of aspirants whose magic we can try to awaken should not be a problem yet.
How shall we chose which students get a chance to learn? Money? Raffles? Or shall we stop levelling Hedge Mages and focus on levelling PC classes, despite it being slower? Or do we keep awakening a shitton of magelings, despite knowing that most of them won't have teachers and so will never get beyond level 1? That's sure to create resentment and competition for slots in our classes...
We can get ourselves huge amounts of teacher at this point.
Level 6-8 mages are fairly avaliable thanks to Djinn and Shaitan being amenable and us having the finances.
And their little war is slated to end in 6-7 months anyway, so we're very unlikely to get over our numbers before then anyway.
Our current teacher-numbers for SD are:
Teana (Sorceress 5/Shadow Sculptor 5/Shadowcraft Mage 2) (counts for 2 people)
Velen (Phoenix Bard 7/Sublime Chord 1)
Sarah of Pentos (Witch 7)
Leila Goldhammer (Archivist 5)
Valeria (Arcanum)
1 Lotus Leshy (Advanced, Druid creature)
2 Treants (Druid Creature)
2 Raptorans (Oracles)
Alas the Whisperer (Witch 7)
Avariel Hunter (Ranger(?) 7)
3(?) Guardian Nagas
How about "how to handle the cap on aspirant size VS the cap on initiate size" ?
We should be running into the max number of magelings each teacher can teach pretty soon, yet the number of aspirants whose magic we can try to awaken should not be a problem yet.
How shall we chose which students get a chance to learn? Money? Raffles? Or shall we stop levelling Hedge Mages and focus on levelling PC classes, despite it being slower? Or do we keep awakening a shitton of magelings, despite knowing that most of them won't have teachers and so will never get beyond level 1? That's sure to create resentment and competition for slots in our classes...
Won't all those level 5 casters we're already training be able to provide at least basic training to all those level 1 casters we can awaken? They need jobs anyway so why not teach?
TAs are a thing even if they can't do all the work.
That's my point, Snowie. Refer back to my original statement: the Knights aren't that big of a threat, even a lot of them. They plain and simply don't have the throughput and innate abilities to be a challenge in and of themselves, because if you can't survive ~30d6+30 from a simple, successfully saved SotD, you aren't in the big boys table with the likes of Dragons, Fairy Queens and fallen gods.
A simple fireball from Viserys is 19d6+19, before anything else comes into play, about 30% more than a direct hit from an M1A2's cannon. That's a fireball. It's a useful comparison for simply reading the magnitude here. Anyone who can be even temporarily stalled by a mid-caliber assault rifle just doesn't have any business anywhere near a fight where a stray hit in the equivalent of a rocket launcher to the face. And remember that even Big Ugly hesitated when he thought Karin had one, even if it wouldn't kill him it'd fuck him up pretty bad if it hit.
What I said was: you are correct that it's a good thing the Fallen Angels are essentially demigods. Because you have something to reasonably put out to play that won't make any and every fight the Knights of the Denarians had so far a bad joke.
The Knights of the Denarians can be rolled over by someone in Viserys weight-class. But the Fallen Angels themselves are another case entirely.
I don't think Viserys could remotely take thirty fallen angels at once.
But these fuckers just challenged the entire supernatural community. So Viserys can bring in Odin, Ares, the Senior-Council grade wizard of the White Council, your odd master-level hermits, and on and on.
And thirty fallen angels vs a few dragons, faerie queens and fallen gods is a much, much more even fight.
But these fuckers just challenged the entire supernatural community. So Viserys can bring in Odin Santa Clause, Ares, the Senior-Council grade wizard of the White Council, your odd master-level hermits, and on and on.
I am not over-dramatising. I am not making shit up. It's a mechanical issue inherent to the system, and to real-world education. It's easy to teach someone the basics, but getting really good is long and hard.
Think about it this way:
Let's say a teacher awakens around 1/2 class of magelings each roll, so we regularly we have a whole new class of magelings that needs a teacher. Except that their new teacher will immediately take on another 100 aspirants and start awakening them... This is exponential.
We cannot "just have the level 5 guys teach the newbies". It's incredibly slow to level people to level 5, and we want our level 5 magelings for so many better jobs than being shitty teachers. The math also doesn't work out: the number of level 5 magelings will always increase far slower than the number of newly awakened magelings needing a teacher.
This is a realistic decision that we now have to make.
How about "how to handle the cap on aspirant size VS the cap on initiate size" ?
We should be running into the max number of magelings each teacher can teach pretty soon, yet the number of aspirants whose magic we can try to awaken should not be a problem yet.
How shall we chose which students get a chance to learn? Money? Raffles? Or shall we stop levelling Hedge Mages and focus on levelling PC classes, despite it being slower? Or do we keep awakening a shitton of magelings, despite knowing that most of them won't have teachers and so will never get beyond level 1? That's sure to create resentment and competition for slots in our classes...
Also, the curriculum for the initial ones is super rushed. You will have to take a lot of time to round out things like literacy, basic arithmetic, history. And those can be taught far more easily than magic.
Also, the curriculum for the initial ones is super rushed. You will have to take a lot of time to round out things like literacy, basic arithmetic, history. And those can be taught far more easily than magic.
[shrug]
So do we want to keep rushing out magelings? Or do we want to focus on fully training those we have?
People, the system makes it hard to get people to level 5 but makes it very easy to vastly increase mageling numbers. If those magelings want to grow over level 1, then they'll need teachers. But every new teacher also increases mageling awakening rate...
This problem will require a policy decision to resolve, IMO. There are a whole bunch of ways around that, but we do need to choose one.
We cannot "just have the level 5 guys teach the newbies". It's incredibly slow to level people to level 5, and we want our level 5 magelings for so many better jobs than being shitty teachers. The math also doesn't work out: the number of level 5 magelings will always increase far slower than the number of newly awakened magelings needing a teacher.
Actually, we can. People do it IRL all the time, it's a common job for university students and graduates. We can't have all of them be teachers of course but that'd not work anyways. But if a few posts are offered some of our mages will take them, and they'll be useful if only to save our main teachers time so they can teach bigger classes.
They'll grade assignments and teach the more time consuming, less complex practical lessons.
I am not over-dramatising. I am not making shit up. It's a mechanical issue inherent to the system, and to real-world education. It's easy to teach someone the basics, but getting really good is long and hard.
Think about it this way:
Let's say a teacher awakens around 1/2 class of magelings each roll, so we regularly we have a whole new class of magelings that needs a teacher. Except that their new teacher will immediately take on another 100 aspirants and start awakening them... This is exponential.
We cannot "just have the level 5 guys teach the newbies". It's incredibly slow to level people to level 5, and we want our level 5 magelings for so many better jobs than being shitty teachers. The math also doesn't work out: the number of level 5 magelings will always increase far slower than the number of newly awakened magelings needing a teacher.
This is a realistic decision that we now have to make.
What TNE said, but also:
That ritual that Alysande (?) used to get in her class, the wisdom-draining one?
I proposed using it, or rather an upgraded version of such, for just that.
If we cannot do that (I've not gotten an answer from DP, or anyone else on the thread when I asked for that interlude(?)), then I'd rather keep doing what we are doing.
Numbers matter more in case of our empire, imo, as even a low-level mages are still educated members of Scholarum, and can do things mommies can't.
Like alchemy, and using magical items.
And serving as lore-looters wherever we set up a scholarum (for a bigger student's stipend, ofc)
or halping out Legions. Etc.
[shrug]
So do we want to keep rushing out magelings? Or do we want to focus on fully training those we have?
People, the system makes it hard to get people to level 5 but makes it very easy to vastly increase mageling numbers. If those magelings want to grow over level 1, then they'll need teachers. But every new teacher also increases mageling awakening rate...
This problem will require a policy decision to resolve, IMO. There are a whole bunch of ways around that, but we do need to choose one.
Actually, we can. People do it IRL all the time, it's a common job for university students and graduates. We can't have all of them be teachers of course but that'd not work anyways. But if a few posts are offered some of our mages will take them, and they'll be useful if only to save our main teachers time so they can teach bigger classes.
@TalonofAnathrax doubling that, I, as a student myself, have felt the pain of being a temporary teacher just the last week.
Or rather, being one for past 2 weeks.
It is fine way to teach basic stuff.
And we did, pointedly, teach basic stuff a lot of the time to a lot of people in our scholarum courses
In a few years the education will get better. Thanks to universities and schools, and we'll be probably getting much more scholarum-attention on actual magic.
[] Agree
-[] You did not plan to attack or provoke Lucan in this place and at this time. If he should somehow find out about our presence and start a fight over it we will answer in kind, but we'll do our best to avoid such an outcome
[] If Baelor seems willing to share after our revelations, ask him the following questions;
-[] What can he tell us in detail about the various disasters that have plagued Oldtown since magic's awakenings? This is asking for a brief chronological history of the disasters and how each one was resolved.
--[] In particular what can he tell us of what he knows about the Deep Ones' incursions?
---[] What kinds have been spotted?
---[] Does he know who leads various branches?
---[] Does he have knowledge of where various fortresses are located?
---[] What active plots is he aware of?
-[] Aside from the Lantern Bearers and the heroes on Greyshield, are there any other notables in the Reach who have shown the strength to stand against the dark?
-[] Regarding the Court of Stars, what fey princes is he aware of he operate within his territory, and what is their disposition? (alongside basic questions on loot, deeds, known pacts, etc.)
-[] What can he tell us about the Underdark entrance under the Hightower?
--[] What creatures lurk there? How strong are they?
--[] What threat of invasion is there?
-[] Ask about the Lantern Bearers
--[] Ask for more details on their general makeup, their numbers, the strength of their members (what class they have), what equipment they have, etc.
--[] Ask what aid the Lantern Bearers would like. Hypothetical for the moment since you need to determine what you can spare, but the organization does good work, and the Deep Ones are enemies to all.
--[] Out of curiosity, where did his Mind Blank come from?
-[] What can he tell us about Danelle and Lucan? Spies and divinations are best complemented by personal impressions.
"You have my word, my lord. I will not fight Brother Lucan within the confides of Oldtown unless I have no other choice," you reply without a moment's hesitation, never having any intention of forcing a fight with the lunatic here. Ideally you would hand him enough rope to hang himself before his fellows at the Conclave so that they may leave in disgust. The world is far wider than Oldtown, and wards or no you have no doubt you could pick up his trail again.
Lord Hightower sighs in relief before the first genuine smile since beginning this whole harrowing discussion lights up his expression. "Excellent, then let us all take a seat again. I suspect you have far more questions than can be comfortably answered on one's feet."
Hearing this, Yrael explains that he has much yet to do today in Mantarys and bids you all farewell before vanishing in a brief pillar of golden light.
"That was not a spell," Baelor notes, the words not really a question.
"No, it's an aspect of what he is, a guardian ever in the right place," your mother replies anyway.
"That could make Brother Lucan troublesome to deal with..." he trails off, looking a touch disturbed, perhaps at how easily he had come to speak of angels as potential foes.
So you decide to remind him of less ambitious foes, the Deep Ones and their raids, the better to understand the peril to the city.
Lord Hightower explains that for all the madness of form and function that the Farspawn have shown there are two different forms of attacks from below distinct enough to call for very different responses. First there are the petty infiltrators, the stranglers, the mantle beasts, the corpse defilers, and others what the lord cannot describe well enough for you to remember memories not your own. They seem to practically grow out of the stones or else sweep into the city with every tide. These the Lantern Bearers kill with cold effectiveness and even the ordinary people of Oldtown have learned to defend themselves against them somewhat, or at the very least know when to run.
Then there are the true raids that always come in pairs, one from the depths and one from the sea as though dictated by some alien clockwork. Here the foes are mightier and more cunning by far, fish-like monstrosities that sing songs of impossible beauty to twist the minds of their prey even as their foul slime defiles their bodies, the eaters of minds armed with strange magics no mortal mage can match. By far the most perilous of such raids had been when they had brought with them broken mewling things of utter madness and despair that infect other living things with the same corruption. Though obviously not a man with a weak stomach, Lord Hightower pales as he describes the sight of one Lantern Bearer who had been so afflicted.
Thankfully such an attack had only occurred once and even less horrific raids generally only occur about once every two or three months. 'Only' he says, you shake your head at how dreadfully the Crown had failed House Hightower and Oldtown. At least the Tyrells had sent aid from their Fey allies. True the guardians of nature make poor fighters battling the denizens of the Far Realm strength against strength, but they have helped in no small measure in teaching the Lantern Bearers their art. The order has little of true sorcery within its ranks, relaying instead on hexcraft, steel, and fire to win the day, sometimes a bit too much of the former for Lord Baelor's tastes at times from what you can infer.
There are roughly thirty Lantern Bearers in all of Oldtown, and of them only a handful are mages, either former hedge mages who had decided that the best way to be at least marginally veiled from the Lantern Bearers' suspicions was to join the order or veterans who found that their repeated dabbling in borrowed magic had awoken some deeper power. The reason why they are so few in spite of the great use more mages could have is that all too often a mage offering to join is a ploy of the enemy which is why only the most skilled or outright suicidal Lantern Bearers are given mages as apprentices.
Roughly 30 Full-Fledged Members and 20 Apprentices
5 mages currently in the order:
2 Hexblades (lvl 8)
2 Witches (lvl 9)
1 Hunter (lvl 11)
Lord Hightower goes on to explain that the Lantern Bearers themselves could probably give you a better accounting of their numbers and abilities, but warns that you should be careful when approaching them—their calling hones suspicion to a fine edge, never more so then now with all the delegations and strange mages walking the streets openly. With regards to what aid they might desire, magics to better find their quarry before they can do harm would likely be best greeted alongside healing magics and some manner of armor that can be worn stealthily while retaining as much protection as possible. Some have managed to trade for Fey-craft, but many disdain doing the bidding of the Fey to gain their favor.
Speaking of Fey, you discover that there is no proper court currently in Hightower lands, though a troupe of Water-Fey do patrol the mouth of Honeywine against invasion by the Deep One's slaves. Ser Baelor hastens to add that he would not risk introducing you to them, fearing that word of your presence here and the aid he has given you will quickly reach Highgarden, not that you would have wished such a thing regardless.
When Dany asks of the entrance to the depths he sighs and draws out a small book from his drawer—penned by a maester from the words of the Heroes of Oldtown, the book is filled with thick spidery writing, crude maps, and sketches of monsters, rendered far more faithfully, you suspect, because they were made based on corpses brought to the surface.
Gained Account of the Binding of the Black Gate
"Thank you, my lord," you sister says solemnly, taking the book. It is easy enough to guess why he would not wish to give an accounting of the expedition that had set off in search of his father and recovered only the sword that now hangs at his side.
Idly you glance at him with the eyes of power and see no auras at all, not even of the spellsteel. A sensible protection for one in his shoes to be sure, but you are most curious to know the root of just the same. "From whence did you obtain such wards, Ser Baelor?"
"Ah, you noticed," he smiles a touch proudly. "I am told it can be quite disconcerting to witness. My family have been patrons of the Citadel for a long time indeed, enough to be granted requests that others would be denied out of hand, if they even knew enough to make them."
What do you do next?
[] Try to discover the strength of the various factions
[] Attempt to gain a better understanding of the objectives of one of the main factions already present
-[] Most Devout Kyle
-[] Most Devout Ollidor
-[] Most Devout Aglantine
[] Try to discover the mood/position of the Citadel
-[] Write in
[] Write in
OOC: I'll do a write up of what the Westerosi adventurers found in the dark beneath the Hightower in the morning.
Despite how cathartic it would be to burn the old fools to the ground, I personally always preferred to loot them all and only use the recalcitrant ones for fertilizer.
Unless by "this place" you mean "the institution of Maesters and their organizational structures", in which case it will be all set alight, disintegrated and then the ashes set on fire again.
@DragonParadox, I think informing him of the Toad Island as we'll inform the Latern Bearers should be a given here.
[X] Inform laternbearers of Oldtown and your Ironborn allies of the newfound way to treat the physical corruption of Illithids via holy waters of Merling King on Toad Isle, for you allstand against the Mindflayers.
-[X] If needed, offer help for transportation across waters, which clearly won't be safe for such individuals.
-[X] Also warn of the perils such treatment carries, and offer powerful magical healing for worse cases out there.
Had. Had a supply.
I'm throughly sure now, that with their Lord having one, evey important member of The Conspiracy also got one. Or at least a few of them. Fuck.
More likely, they gathered such items over millennia, especially as magic waned and they lost their effectiveness, finally becoming nothing more than mundane jewelry.
Hell, the one the Maesters have Baelor might have once belonged to the Hightowers.
@DragonParadox, I think informing him of the Toad Island as we'll inform the Latern Bearers should be a given here.
Just so that he keeps that in mind.
[X] Try to discover the strength of the various factions, with special attention dedicated to the Citadel. The Maesters made themselves out enemies when they sent a spy to steal from us, then aid others in infiltrating our Scholarium.
Despite how cathartic it would be to burn the old fools to the ground, I personally always preferred to loot them all and only use the recalcitrant ones for fertilizer.
Unless by "this place" you mean "the institution of Maesters and their organizational structures", in which case it will be all set alight, disintegrated and then the ashes set on fire again.
With regards to what aid they might desire, magics to better find their quarry before they can do harm would likely be best greeted alongside healing magics and some manner of armor that can be worn stealthily while retaining as much protection as possible. Some have managed to trade for fey-craft, but many disdain doing the bidding of the Fey to gain their favor.
