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A Sword Without a Hilt: A Song of Ice and Fire/D&D 3.5 Crossover

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TotallyNotEvil said:
???

What's gotten into you? The weight is mostly a trivial matter to address. You are saying it's either all in or fold, as if there could be no middle ground.
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Look, if we start poking one thing or another for it's 'realism,' we're opening a hole with no end. The entire thing is completely nonsensical, so for the love of sanity and our time, just don't think about it. Lord knows I just pretend our legionaries use halberds.
 
LonelyWolf999 said:
Look, if we start poking one thing or another for it's 'realism,' we're opening a hole with no end. The entire thing is completely nonsensical, so for the love of sanity and our time, just don't think about it. Lord knows I just pretend our legionaries use halberds.
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Well said.

And on a totally different subject, whose hyped for the mage duels coming after the jousts? I think Valaena should compete in them, too. She's got the magical chops to do it without needing to bring out the chain.
 
Reading back, Lya will end up with two main apprentices.

Leila Goldhammer will be the Archivist apprentice, learning all the divine magic.

Samwell Tarly will be the Wizard apprentice, learning all the arcane magic.
 
I wonder what sams build will look like when he gets more levels, has there been any discussion about that? If he did become Lyas apprentice wonder if he would do the same prestige classes.
 
@Goldfish the misfits only get their gear next month, right?

It'd be incredibly unfair decking them out in 11th-13th level WBL on the team fight, that's a tonne of cash tipping the scales.
 
sum ergo cogito said:
I wonder what sams build will look like when he gets more levels, has there been any discussion about that? If he did become Lyas apprentice wonder if he would do the same prestige classes.
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Probably not the same prestige class since that's unique to Lya, but certainly something good.
Snowfire said:
How old is Leila? Asking for a friend.
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A bit older than Lya was what I recalled. So around 20 something? Definitely young, but still grown into her power for being one of the very first mages we taught in our realm.
 
sayeftyfirst said:
Idk, I mostly just think good necromancers should be much more common than the NEVER that is standard in D&D.
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Necromancy relies on literal anti-life to work - negative energy. There is, in fact, a reason that Necromancers are almost always evil. Or highly morally questionable, at the very least.
 
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TotallyNotEvil said:
@Goldfish the misfits only get their gear next month, right?

It'd be incredibly unfair decking them out in 11th-13th level WBL on the team fight, that's a tonne of cash tipping the scales.
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All of that stuff is scheduled for next month.

Criston and Ting could each finish 3rd in their respective divisions, however, which would make some gear available to them before the team event. That would benefit Criston a lot more than Ting, though. Ting could give his winnings to Ceria for her use until the custom stuff is finished.
 
I think this post got lost in the province naming shuffle;
Anyone else see Samwell as a Specialist Wizard, specifically an Abjurer?

Maybe even take it one step further and have him practice the Thassilonian version of Specialization which came to be known as Sin Magic. He could give up Evocation and Necromancy spells, but gain two bonus Abjuration spell slots per spell level.
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@TotallyNotEvil @Everyone What do ya'll think of asking DP to let Samwell be the equivalent to a Thassilonian Specialist Wizard?
 
Goldfish said:
I think this post got lost in the province naming shuffle;

@TotallyNotEvil @Everyone What do ya'll think of asking DP to let Samwell be the equivalent to a Thassilonian Specialist Wizard?
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Doesn't Conjuration have some pretty decent blasting options? In which case I can see why your choice was exclusion of Evocation and Necromancy (and you stated love for spellslot converter items means he can sidestep those restrictions somewhat).
 
Crake said:
Doesn't Conjuration have some pretty decent blasting options? In which case I can see why your choice was exclusion of Evocation and Necromancy (and you stated love for spellslot converter items means he can sidestep those restrictions somewhat).
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There are some very good offensive Conjuration, Illusion, and Transmutation spells which can fill in for those lost from Evocation and Necromancy quite well. And yes, the Raiment of the Four makes it cheap and easy to give someone the ability to use Magic Missile and Fireball spells even if they couldn't normally use them.

I'm not deliberately choosing to drop Evocation and Necromancy, though. The Thassilonian Sin Magic type of Specialist Wizard takes specialization a bit further than normal. They don't get to choose which schools become prohibited; an Abjurer, for example, loses access to Evocation and Necromancy, while an Evoker loses access to Abjuration and Conjuration.

It would be rough to be an Evoker, losing the ability to cast all Abjuration and Conjuration spells, but an Abjurer can get by well enough and there are plenty of good Abjuration spells to put in the two bonus slots per spell level that are gained.
 
Goldfish said:
There are some very good offensive Conjuration, Illusion, and Transmutation spells which can fill in for those lost from Evocation and Necromancy quite well. And yes, the Raiment of the Four makes it cheap and easy to give someone the ability to use Magic Missile and Fireball spells even if they couldn't normally use them.

I'm not deliberately choosing to drop Evocation and Necromancy, though. The Thassilonian Sin Magic type of Specialist Wizard takes specialization a bit further than normal. They don't get to choose which schools become prohibited; an Abjurer, for example, loses access to Evocation and Necromancy, while an Evoker loses access to Abjuration and Conjuration.

It would be rough to be an Evoker, losing the ability to cast all Abjuration and Conjuration spells, but an Abjurer can get by well enough and there are plenty of good Abjuration spells to put in the two bonus slots per spell level that are gained.
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Yeah, I read up on it a little. I agree, giving up Conjuration is a No Go for any Reality Warper AKA Wizard.

If you're giving up Conjuration, whatever you're gaining from it isn't good enough. And if you're giving it up to be a better blaster, you are actually just gimping yourself from any and all Phenomenal Cosmic Convenience. A wizard's quality of life actually goes down without access to that school, never mind combat situations.
 
Snowfire said:
Necromancy relies on literal anti-life to work - negative energy. There is, in fact, a reason that Necromancers are almost always evil. Or highly morally questionable, at the very least.
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The standard cosmology is bullshit and shiting on Necromancy for the sole reason that it's not supposed to be used by the Good Guys.

Which is not to say that you are wrong, but that the framework that makes you right is bad.
 
TotallyNotEvil said:
... Don't you mean, a Focused Specialist?

Abjuration sounds good for him.
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Not quite. That takes it even further in some ways than what I'm talking about.

I like the Pathfinder version which locks in the schools of magic you have to give up and just gives you two bonus spell slots from your chosen school.
 
Azel said:
The standard cosmology is bullshit and shiting on Necromancy for the sole reason that it's not supposed to be used by the Good Guys.

Which is not to say that you are wrong, but that the framework that makes you right is bad.
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This is sort of generally my point. I find it frustrating that a school that is supposed to be about life and death, and offers true resurrection and other massively useful spells, gets dumped in the evil bin because "anti-life... don't fuck with souls... animating corpses is evil..."

I mean, we constantly feed souls to gods, Lya has been fucking around with souls and we have been using the corpses of our enemies and turning them into loyal monstrosities. Based on almost all justifications we fall under the same sort of "evil" as a well-intentioned necromancer.

That and we have used a fair bit of necromancy to resurrect people... So.....
 
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Goldfish said:
Not quite. That takes it even further in some ways than what I'm talking about.

I like the Pathfinder version which locks in the schools of magic you have to give up and just gives you two bonus spell slots from your chosen school.
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If it'd drop Conjuration, I'd rather not. Also, 3.5 wizard over PF wizard, as is the guideline.

Make him a Focused Specialist of Abjuration or Transmutation, which I feel fits him, and dro Necromancy, Enchantment, and one of Evocation or Illusion.

He can enter a PrC at 3rd or 4th level, too: Master Specialist. Pretty good.

And it fits that his super early, unguided study would allow him a path to power that, while being very powerful (we are talking as many spell slots as a sorcerer here), is not without its flaws.
 
I still want a pet Lich one day.

The problem is finding a Lich that doesn't hate being a Lich. It's an annoyingly common problem.
 
TotallyNotEvil said:
If it'd drop Conjuration, I'd rather not. Also, 3.5 wizard over PF wizard, as is the guideline.

Make him a Focused Specialist of Abjuration or Transmutation, which I feel fits him, and dro Necromancy, Enchantment, and one of Evocation or Illusion.

He can enter a PrC at 3rd or 4th level, too: Master Specialist. Pretty good.

And it fits that his super early, unguided study would allow him a path to power that, while being very powerful (we are talking as many spell slots as a sorcerer here), is not without its flaws.
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If DP lets us use the Thassilonian version, he would be losing access to Evocation and Necromany schools, gaining two bonus Abjuration spells per spell level.

Focused Specialist is too specialized, IMO; three bonus Abjuration spells isn't awful, but losing one regular spell slot per spell level really cuts into a Wizard's versatility, especially when you have to lose access to three schools of magic to do it.

I only mentioned that Thassilonian Evokers gave up Conjuration and Abjuration, both of which I consider too important to lose access to.
 
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Little side note in the discussion on potential Sam builds -- given that he's probably ending up as Lya's apprentice, I'd like to teach him Runecrafting when he's strong enough for it to actually be useful.
 
I've been refining my plan for infiltrating the City of Brass when the tinkering urge strikes me.

Here's what I have so far, if ya'll are interested. It really relies on Maelor to shoulder a lot of weight for the shop. Hopefully the responsibility will do him some good (and be worth a bunch of XP).
 
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