Finally, I think we should also add those Anti-Tampering effects that we received from the Shaitan, that keep people from just blasting a hole through a wall, melding through it, or tunneling under it, to all of our government buildings making heavy use of stone, not just our infrastructure.

All of that is not trivial magic, but it's not super rare, either.
 
To add to the above, @Duesal, I think there's two uses for this spell. One, you can apply it to a 40-ft Radius area, or two, you can ward the whole site.

If your goal was to just create a check point in and out of a building, you could use 40-ft increments when planning the checkpoints themselves.

But if you want to ward a whole building with the other use of Hallow, you can't overlap effects.
Fair. Magic Circle Against Evil could easily be spread across the whole area. Others would have to be strategically placed. Invisibility Purge is probably top priority, though other effects would be nice in surprise locations.
Finally, I think we should also add those Anti-Tampering effects that we received from the Shaitan, that keep people from just blasting a hole through a wall, melding through it, or tunneling under it, to all of our government buildings making heavy use of stone, not just our infrastructure.

All of that is not trivial magic, but it's not super rare, either.
Didn't we try to get it, and they gave us the requisite lore but also told us it was useless because Prime Material earth was "dead earth"?
 
Fair. Magic Circle Against Evil could easily be spread across the whole area. Others would have to be strategically placed. Invisibility Purge is probably top priority, though other effects would be nice in surprise locations.

Didn't we try to get it, and they gave us the requisite lore but also told us it was useless because Prime Material earth was "dead earth"?

The way to work around it is import earth from PoE, silly.

I'm actually astonished no one has suggested doing that yet. We can move massive amounts of Earth and we only have to do a thin layer of it to have that warding effect.

And I think with some research we can do the same to"dead earth", maybe by making our roads and bridges and canals and such a Genius Loci like DP suggested? You can't call that "dead earth".
 
The way to work around it is import earth from PoE, silly.

I'm actually astonished no one has suggested doing that yet. We can move massive amounts of Earth and we only have to do a thin layer of it to have that warding effect.

And I think with some research we can do the same to"dead earth", maybe by making our roads and bridges and canals and such a Genius Loci like DP suggested? You can't call that "dead earth".
If the fix is that simple I'll be banging my head against the wall. This entire time I thought the earth in Prime Material was conceptually dead for some reason, and that it'd need a Mythic fix of some sort at minimum.
 
If the fix is that simple I'll be banging my head against the wall. This entire time I thought the earth in Prime Material was conceptually dead for some reason, and that it'd need a Mythic fix of some sort at minimum.
I doubt it will be so easy as all that.

As for using Dany's Hallow SLA, I argued for that months ago, but didn't get much traction at the time and soon forgot about it. I managed to get its use included in part of the Snare, at least.
 
Our plans to invade Westeros are currently pretty vague as we're determined to handle Tiamat and the Illithids in one way or another before giving them such an obvious opportunity to stab us in the ass, and who knows how much that'll change. There are some things we can be almost certain about, though.

Uniting Essos: Volantis and Braavos will both voluntarily join our realm (along with Pentos, but who cares). That's huge. Both of them can seriously claim to be medieval superpowers, and each one of them increases our power by an order of magnitude. If people are sweating about us uniting the Three Daughters, they'll start actually losing their shit once we can claim with a straight face to rule Western Essos. Lorath, Norvos, and Qohor are a bit of a question but it ultimately doesn't matter that much, same thing with Slaver's Bay. We are going to need a significant amount of time to turn all of that into an empire, and it's that period in which wrenches will undoubtedly be thrown into the works.

The Military: The current estimate for the force we need to raise is ten legions, which more than anything is what's causing things to drag out. Training that many professional soldiers takes a lot of time and recourses. On the other hand, they're going to be easily the best army planetos has ever seen. Our naval advantage will be similarly obscene, with Braavos' fleet alone being the best in the world. With the Iron Isles, the Arbor, and Gulltown in our domain, we'll literally rule the seas with utter impunity all across Westeros which gives us a lot of options. We have the best military in the world and the ability to deploy it more or less anywhere.

Baratheon-Lannister War?: Kicking the canon war off early has been discussed. The problem would be making it happen, which may or may not be plausible or worth the effort. Right now we don't even know about the twincest, so we'll see what happens.

Opening Moves: There are a few opening gambits we'll almost certainly take. King's Landing will undoubtedly be the first city to fall in any scenario. It gives us immediate legitimacy for holding the Iron Throne, decapitates the enemy's leadership, has a central location to all of Westeros, and makes the greatest statement. There'll be another salvo of opening moves made as our loyalist lords take up arms. Legions will land in Gulltown, Saltpans, march through the Boneway and the Prince's Pass, while we finally scry and die a bunch of inconvenient targets. Oldtown houses both the Maesters and the Faith, two major foes we need to handle, so Oldtown will quickly be occupied although the 'how' will depend on if the Hightowers bend the knee or not. The Iron Fleet will attack the Westerlands, either raiding the coast or trying to burn Lannisport again, depending on how we judge it at the time. Attack from everywhere, take the major cities, and give our enemy no chance to organize any sort of coherent resistance.

The Campaign: There'll be two stages to this: the high-level PCs dancing around Westeros while the armies occupy the land and crush resistance. I can't predict this with much accuracy due to how many variables there are, although the broad strokes can be predicted. The Vale would be a hard campaign, led by the Royces, Redforts, and Graftons. Our naval and aerial dominance will pay huge dividends but ultimately the majority of the lords there will fight bitterly, so it's just going to take time and blood to pacify. The Reach will also be a mess but the land there means that things will come down to several massive battles rather than a protracted campaign, although with the Seven and the Fey throwing down they won't be simple or easy. The Riverlands will either be a mess or surprisingly easy, it depends on what Bloodraven's been up to. I can't say how the Westerlands or Stormlands will go down, too many variables and not enough information.

Does that give you a good idea of what our plan is, @mrsean22?
 
I doubt it will be so easy as all that.

As for using Dany's Hallow SLA, I argued for that months ago, but didn't get much traction at the time and soon forgot about it. I managed to get its use included in part of the Snare, at least.
There shouldn't have been opposition to it, just like there shouldn't have been opposition to the contingency spells like Stalwart Pact and Pact of Renewal. It was probably just lost in the speed of discussion.
 
Speaking of the Deep Ones, did we ever get a chance to vote on whether to do some actual research on the Githzerai? Or even cast some knowledge boosters to see what's up with them in general terms?

I think we know about one of the Gith groups from either our PoA or PoE contacts, but were informed in the same breath it'd result in them turning the Material Plane into an Outsider battle/playground, the thing we tried to avoid with the Concord of the Spheres meeting.
 
From Worm to Rat

Fourteenth Day of the Sixth Month 293 AC

Of all the tasks you have ever needed to undertake, waiting is still the most taxing. It is not in your nature to sit still no more than it is in the nature of flame to be contained, yet wait you must. Rather than stare at the jumbled contents of the tent for hours, you take the time to speak with Zherys about his rule, his life, and more beside, to try and get a measure of the man behind the mask of distant civility.

What you find is in some ways heartening. The High Speaker is a man who takes great pride in his work, be it sorcerous studies or the mundane minutia of administration. Though he is far from inspirational, he understands how to lead with a steady hand and his skill at intrigue is matched by a certain disdain for hollow courtly games. However, as his reaction to Garin shows, he possesses the full measure of Volantine pride, and perhaps most troublingly he does not seem to have close friends or associates whom he trusts implicitly. Once or twice he mentions a brother lost to war, a mentor slain by some strange illness, but in this hour where he is lord in all but name over the fates of Volantis Zherys has no kin, no confidants or friends to anchor him against the worst impulses born of Valyria's blood. Reason will carry a man far of course, but...

Perhaps you could serve the role... The thought is not new of course, but now of all times you can take the chance to speak to him as more than just a lord to a vassal. If nothing else you have already earned his respect, no easy feat for certain.

Reminder that we have an opportunity to befriend someone who is increasingly almost as fun to read about as Malarys.

And by the looks of it he needs it too, no high level PC should have to do all the work alone, Viserys often comments about how he would go mad if he had to.

He's not wrong.
 
GUYS GUYS WE ARE ALL FORGETTING WHATS REALLY IMPORTANT. how are we going to kill peter I would like to vote for making him eat his own dick.
 
I think we know about one of the Gith groups from either our PoA or PoE contacts, but were informed in the same breath it'd result in them turning the Material Plane into an Outsider battle/playground, the thing we tried to avoid with the Concord of the Spheres meeting.
Here is we were told about the Githzerai:
"The Githzerai shape their homes from the twisting eddies of Limbo by will alone. There you may find them still sharpening their minds as a warrior does his sword awaiting battle against their ancient foe," Hajar Rebys explains. "There are traders who make the journey there docked at the Drake's Perch almost every day. I warn you, though, that they are relentless in seeking their quarry. They will enter your world to give battle in strength."
So, yes, they would come to our world "in strength," but considering these are the guys who live in Limbo by choice I find it incredibly unlikely that they would stay or attempt any kind of conquest. It made sense to be concerned about the Genies exploiting the Prime Material because that is what they do in their home planes, but the Githzerai are a race of ascetic monks doing the equivalent of sitting in a volcano to make themselves heat resistant.

Now, I could be wrong here, obviously. It might be that "relentless" in this case means that the Githzerai eradicate everyone with even a hint of Deep One taint. Which is why I believe it to be a good idea to know more about them so we as a thread can make an informed decision as to whether they would make good allies if we need them.
 
Here is we were told about the Githzerai:

So, yes, they would come to our world "in strength," but considering these are the guys who live in Limbo by choice I find it incredibly unlikely that they would stay or attempt any kind of conquest. It made sense to be concerned about the Genies exploiting the Prime Material because that is what they do in their home planes, but the Githzerai are a race of ascetic monks doing the equivalent of sitting in a volcano to make themselves heat resistant.

Now, I could be wrong here, obviously. It might be that "relentless" in this case means that the Githzerai eradicate everyone with even a hint of Deep One taint. Which is why I believe it to be a good idea to know more about them so we as a thread can make an informed decision as to whether they would make good allies if we need them.

Worth pointing out, the very real concern of Aberration tainted people or creatures is that they are all collectively susceptible to being vulnerable to Deep One control or subversion, and that's not just marginally lower saves, but all that might be wrought of their flesh. Potential to exploit, or why else twist what they consider cattle? Because not all of it is food.

On the scale of war they are used to waging against Illithid and similar ilk, it is a valid point that removing as many potential enemy assets from the board is good doctrine, but it's likely more a point of practicality rather than pure zealotry, meaning if we can assure them we will take full responsibility for such subjects that we do have, it's one less taxing distraction and a minor one at that in the face of support for their real mission eradication of mutual enemies, ones they are dedicated to wiping out.

Of course we need to confirm all that, just saying that I think the real danger is actually not that, it's that Githzerai coming in force would stir up a huge hornet's nest and immediately take us from cold war about to burn hot, to "everyone throwing around their super weapons if they got 'em, and launching constant raids around the clock as soon as the resources for them are freed up".

We would basically need a dedicated Anti-Deep One task force set to rooting them out. We're somewhat past the point of having no one to handle dealing with the chaff and lower leveled threats, meaning we can delegate just as the Deep Ones often do, but our time for dealing with their champions and dangerous experiments turn toward war are limited, which is why we're focusing on consolidating first.

We also realize we have to strike out at the Deep Ones before we invade Westeros, so I also see us reaching out to Githzerai around that time, less than a year from now... but not "soon" as far as quest time goes.
 
Worth pointing out, the very real concern of Aberration tainted people or creatures is that they are all collectively susceptible to being vulnerable to Deep One control or subversion, and that's not just marginally lower saves, but all that might be wrought of their flesh. Potential to exploit, or why else twist what they consider cattle? Because not all of it is food.

On the scale of war they are used to waging against Illithid and similar ilk, it is a valid point that removing as many potential enemy assets from the board is good doctrine, but it's likely more a point of practicality rather than pure zealotry, meaning if we can assure them we will take full responsibility for such subjects that we do have, it's one less taxing distraction and a minor one at that in the face of support for their real mission eradication of mutual enemies, ones they are dedicated to wiping out.

Of course we need to confirm all that, just saying that I think the real danger is actually not that, it's that Githzerai coming in force would stir up a huge hornet's nest and immediately take us from cold war about to burn hot, to "everyone throwing around their super weapons if they got 'em, and launching constant raids around the clock as soon as the resources for them are freed up".

We would basically need a dedicated Anti-Deep One task force set to rooting them out. We're somewhat past the point of having no one to handle dealing with the chaff and lower leveled threats, meaning we can delegate just as the Deep Ones often do, but our time for dealing with their champions and dangerous experiments turn toward war are limited, which is why we're focusing on consolidating first.

We also realize we have to strike out at the Deep Ones before we invade Westeros, so I also see us reaching out to Githzerai around that time, less than a year from now... but not "soon" as far as quest time goes.
Remember that the Githzerai themselves are the products of the Illithids tampering with their ancestors. I don't think they'd be that ruthless against people in the same position they used to be in.

As for the rest of your post, I agree? It is nowhere close to time to approach the Githzerai directly. What I was hoping for was more on the order of looking for histories of past wars between them and the Deep Ones in the Shaitan's libraries, that sort of thing.
 
Our plans to invade Westeros are currently pretty vague as we're determined to handle Tiamat and the Illithids in one way or another before giving them such an obvious opportunity to stab us in the ass, and who knows how much that'll change. There are some things we can be almost certain about, though.

Uniting Essos: Volantis and Braavos will both voluntarily join our realm (along with Pentos, but who cares). That's huge. Both of them can seriously claim to be medieval superpowers, and each one of them increases our power by an order of magnitude. If people are sweating about us uniting the Three Daughters, they'll start actually losing their shit once we can claim with a straight face to rule Western Essos. Lorath, Norvos, and Qohor are a bit of a question but it ultimately doesn't matter that much, same thing with Slaver's Bay. We are going to need a significant amount of time to turn all of that into an empire, and it's that period in which wrenches will undoubtedly be thrown into the works.

The Military: The current estimate for the force we need to raise is ten legions, which more than anything is what's causing things to drag out. Training that many professional soldiers takes a lot of time and recourses. On the other hand, they're going to be easily the best army planetos has ever seen. Our naval advantage will be similarly obscene, with Braavos' fleet alone being the best in the world. With the Iron Isles, the Arbor, and Gulltown in our domain, we'll literally rule the seas with utter impunity all across Westeros which gives us a lot of options. We have the best military in the world and the ability to deploy it more or less anywhere.

Baratheon-Lannister War?: Kicking the canon war off early has been discussed. The problem would be making it happen, which may or may not be plausible or worth the effort. Right now we don't even know about the twincest, so we'll see what happens.

Opening Moves: There are a few opening gambits we'll almost certainly take. King's Landing will undoubtedly be the first city to fall in any scenario. It gives us immediate legitimacy for holding the Iron Throne, decapitates the enemy's leadership, has a central location to all of Westeros, and makes the greatest statement. There'll be another salvo of opening moves made as our loyalist lords take up arms. Legions will land in Gulltown, Saltpans, march through the Boneway and the Prince's Pass, while we finally scry and die a bunch of inconvenient targets. Oldtown houses both the Maesters and the Faith, two major foes we need to handle, so Oldtown will quickly be occupied although the 'how' will depend on if the Hightowers bend the knee or not. The Iron Fleet will attack the Westerlands, either raiding the coast or trying to burn Lannisport again, depending on how we judge it at the time. Attack from everywhere, take the major cities, and give our enemy no chance to organize any sort of coherent resistance.

The Campaign: There'll be two stages to this: the high-level PCs dancing around Westeros while the armies occupy the land and crush resistance. I can't predict this with much accuracy due to how many variables there are, although the broad strokes can be predicted. The Vale would be a hard campaign, led by the Royces, Redforts, and Graftons. Our naval and aerial dominance will pay huge dividends but ultimately the majority of the lords there will fight bitterly, so it's just going to take time and blood to pacify. The Reach will also be a mess but the land there means that things will come down to several massive battles rather than a protracted campaign, although with the Seven and the Fey throwing down they won't be simple or easy. The Riverlands will either be a mess or surprisingly easy, it depends on what Bloodraven's been up to. I can't say how the Westerlands or Stormlands will go down, too many variables and not enough information.

Does that give you a good idea of what our plan is, @mrsean22?


The Fey will kick up a fuss in the Reach during the Conquest, guaranteed. Whatever forces we deploy to pacify it, I suggest we augment them by 50% as a way of emergency padding. I have little doubt in my mind they'll attempt something in the midst of all the confusion, with the aim of presenting us with a fait accompli that'll hold some nice stuff (bribes/shiny's) and a lot of other stuff that will undoubtedly leave our more politically minded players puking their guts out.

Whether that means a semi autonomous Fey Kingdom ruled from Fey-Space Highgarden, permanent positions in the administration, or changes to local Feywyld space is anyone's guess, but having enough boots on the ground to preempt that is a must.

The opening of the opening stages of the war will probably be the navy and assorted loyalists like Velaryon taking over all the remaining rebel Houses of the Narrow Sea. We need to control the approaches if we are to invest King's Landing from the sea, and that should ideally happen at the same time as the landings in Saltpans.

The interesting question is what to do with Doran. On one hand, having him strike the Stormlands would tie down a significant portion of Baratheon rebels, though it would risk allienating Fenly and Stannis. On the other, having ten thousand extra spears on the Reach would go a long way to preempting possible Fey shenanigans and would likely initiate a domino effect of lords declaring for us as the Army of Dorne appears over the hill accross the local keep... as long as we have at least a Cohort or such there to recieve surrenders and oaths. No Reacher likes surrendering to Dornishmen, after all.
 
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The Fey will kick up a fuss in the Reach during the Conquest, guaranteed. Whatever forces we deploy to pacify it, I suggest we augment them by 50% as a way of emergency padding. I have little doubt in my mind they'll attempt something in the midst of all the confusion, with the aim of presenting us with a fait accompli that'll hold some nice stuff (bribes/shiny's) and a lot of other stuff that will undoubtedly leave our more politically minded players puking their guts out.

Whether that means a semi autonomous Fey Kingdom ruled from Fey-Space Highgarden, permanent positions in the administration, or changes to local Feywyld space is anyone's guess, but having enough boots on the ground to preempt that is a must.

The opening of the opening stages of the war will probably be the navy and assorted loyalists like Velaryon taking over all the remaining rebel Houses of the Narrow Sea. We need to control the approaches if we are to invest King's Landing from the sea, and that should ideally happen at the same time as the landings in Saltpans.

The interesting question is what to do with Doran. On one hand, having him strike the Stormlands would tie down a significant portion of Baratheon rebels, though it would risk allienating Fenly and Stannis. On the other, having ten thousand extra spears on the Reach would go a long way to preempting possible Fey shenanigans and would likely initiate a domino effect of lords declaring for us as the Army of Dorne appears over the hill accross the local keep... as long as we have at least a Cohort or such there to recieve surrenders and oaths. No Reacher likes surrendering to Dornishmen, after all.

As to the Dorne portion, we are all but guaranteed to have at least one full Legion accompanying the Dornish for precisely the reason that nobody will want to surrender to an army comprised mostly of Dornishmen.

Having a full Legion there is not only SUPER intimidating, it is more palettable. "We can't beat the Legion of Doom. It's just too... doomy."

It's basically a "well my manhood is intact, no one is more manly than Viserys" kind of situation, not a "FUCKING. NO WAY IN HELL... AM I SURRENDERING TO A DORNISHMAN!"

There's "stupid" and there's "Dornish revenge scheme" stupid. People really don't like the Dornish, but they hate burning to death even more. People don't associate the latter with Dornishmen, unless it's Targaryens burning them. Point made clear.

As for Stannis and Fenly, the REAL REAL plan is to get them onsides or sitting neutral at least, and thus trying to tie down the Stormlands similarly to the North.

Strategically, we want to keep the Vale busy internally fighting among themselves, we want the North and Stormlands to sit pretty, and we want to send forces comprised mostly of our own men and agents to the Riverlands and the Reach after securing King's Landing, and ideally simultaneously.

Getting House Hightower practically guarantees we will be all but completely entrenched in the Reach as far as strategic gains go, if we get Redwyne onsides at the same time it will be impossible to dislodge us since they will have no naval forces worth speaking of either.

The Riverlands will either be pathetically easy and straight forward depending on Brynden, or a messy mire. Same with the Crownlands depending on Lannister influence.

The Reach is where the war will really be fought. It is the one where, practically speaking, we simply won't have the time to invest as many resources in, not in the timeframe we've laid out, and all the opposing and different actors moving around and needing placating.

The Reach is where it'll be decided, the Westerlands is where it'll end.
 
people or creatures is that they are all collectively susceptible to being vulnerable to Deep One control or subversion, and that's not just

Copy pasta

On the ritual side.

Mmmmm that could happen? Not for mindflayers though?

That would be more of a concern of we were fighting a great old one or outer god.

How to explain...

Remeber when Xor said "aberration" was actually a generalization of hundreds of completely different and unrelated species?

Mindflayers dont have the conceptual "in" on the idea of aberration that would make what you describe possible.

Almost nothing does because of how fucking broad the category is.

The connection is there certainly, but it's so weak it would basically be 9th circle magic to effect them through it, and if your going to go that far you might as well just use that power to hit useful targets.

Also they mostly do bioengineering and psionics.

(God bless remove disease and its incredibly broad effects)

Just living near aberrations causes mutations. They cause people to mutate just by being near them.
Also, as Azel helpfully pointed out, they already have the ability to remotely mind control multiple non mutated targets from miles away.

Worry about our low level functionaries and beuracrats being mindcontroled, not randos.

Speaking of mind control, did we ever execute that guy who was mind controlling the scholarium students?
 
You sound very authoritative, and yet you are incorrect.

If I have my way in the votes/final planning, the Westerlands are where it will start. This isn't a videogame, and we shouldn't be leaving the final boss for last. We get Lanna + Golden Shields + Tywin first, so that they can't interfere as we round up the other kingdoms.
 
Copy pasta


Also, as Azel helpfully pointed out, they already have the ability to remotely mind control multiple non mutated targets from miles away.

Worry about our low level functionaries and beuracrats being mindcontroled, not randos.

Speaking of mind control, did we ever execute that guy who was mind controlling the scholarium students?

I don't disagree?


If you hadn't picked out one part of my post you would have helpfully shown anyone reading yours how I picked apart that argument in that very post citing it as an example of how little importance it should hold.

Ass.
 
You sound very authoritative, and yet you are incorrect.

If I have my way in the votes/final planning, the Westerlands are where it will start. This isn't a videogame, and we shouldn't be leaving the final boss for last. We get Lanna + Golden Shields + Tywin first, so that they can't interfere as we round up the other kingdoms.

That's all very nice, but strategically the Westerlands will find it hardest to project power from the very directions we intend on coming in and focusing on, and should focus on, and it doesn't take an army to take out selected HVTs and agents. And for that matter, if Tywin is intelligent, he will conduct the entire war in a Demiplane or offplane entirely, appearing only with PCs at his side to take council with his lords or to intrigue.

Rendering prioritization of the West as a bad idea, esp. if we are already tying down their sea power with the Ironborn.

But do go ahead and continue insulting my intelligence, Snowfire is sick and thus his manipulative and dark mind hasn't provided the whetstone I so crave.
 
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I don't disagree?


If you hadn't picked out one part of my post you would have helpfully shown anyone reading yours how I picked apart that argument in that very post citing it as an example of how little importance it should hold.

Ass.
My bad then, I did not read your post because I was lazy. Still my bad.

edit:
I think its time to go actually. Cya'll next time.
 
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That's all very nice, but strategically the Westerlands will find it hardest to project power from the very directions we intend on coming in and focusing on, and should focus on, and it doesn't take an army to take out selected HVTs and agents. And for that matter, if Tywin is intelligent, he will conduct the entire war in a Demiplane or offplane entirely, appearing only with PCs at his side to take council with his lords or to intrigue.

Rendering prioritization of the West as a bad idea, esp. if we are already tying down their sea power with the Ironborn.

But do go ahead and continue insulting my intelligence, Snowfire is sick and thus his manipulative and dark mind hasn't provided the whetstone I so crave.
I disagree. I think that the Westerlands can make the whole thing a mess through PC and magical support, but also through fucking over the center of Westeros. Their canon prowess indicates that they can relatively easily rampage through the Riverlands, for example, thus making North-South supply lines a massive pain and being able to attack us.
You seem to see Tywin as being "boxed in" by the inferiority of his fleet and the shape of the land. Yet canon evidence shows that he isn't and can easily cut through all those lords that are in the way. And of course now he has magic and wand-makers as well as PoE contacts: I don't expect him to have any trouble steamrolling a bunch of castles, gathering hostages and troops by force, and throwing them all at the Legion with emergency extraplanar support or something.
I don't want to leave him time to gather that support (so PC strike!) and want to be sure to neutralise him militarily (Legion intervention).
And of course, after a PC decapitation strike we will need to occupy the territory and keep proper order. Especially considering the amount of petty devil-callers and mages around, who are a destabilising influence. This means bringing in the Legion (maybe through Shadow Tower?).
If we do this we will be attacking from the South, the West and the East. That's not a bad strategy either, as long as we can keep good lines of communication open.

Crake, please don't feel as if I'm insulting your intelligence. I just happen to disagree with you. If can happen without someone being stupid, you know.
 
That's all very nice, but strategically the Westerlands will find it hardest to project power from the very directions we intend on coming in and focusing on, and should focus on, and it doesn't take an army to take out selected HVTs and agents. And for that matter, if Tywin is intelligent, he will conduct the entire war in a Demiplane or offplane entirely, appearing only with PCs at his side to take council with his lords or to intrigue.

Rendering prioritization of the West as a bad idea, esp. if we are already tying down their sea power with the Ironborn.

But do go ahead and continue insulting my intelligence, Snowfire is sick and thus his manipulative and dark mind hasn't provided the whetstone I so crave.
not trying to be mean just trying to make sure you don't get reported or something for double posting. If you could possibly join those two together it would be appreciated.
 
I disagree. I think that the Westerlands can make the whole thing a mess through PC and magical support, but also through fucking over the center of Westeros. Their canon prowess indicates that they can relatively easily rampage through the Riverlands, for example, thus making North-South supply lines a massive pain and being able to attack us.
You seem to see Tywin as being "boxed in" by the inferiority of his fleet and the shape of the land. Yet canon evidence shows that he isn't and can easily cut through all those lords that are in the way. And of course now he has magic and wand-makers as well as PoE contacts: I don't expect him to have any trouble steamrolling a bunch of castles, gathering hostages and troops by force, and throwing them all at the Legion with emergency extraplanar support or something.
I don't want to leave him time to gather that support (so PC strike!) and want to be sure to neutralise him militarily (Legion intervention).
And of course, after a PC decapitation strike we will need to occupy the territory and keep proper order. Especially considering the amount of petty devil-callers and mages around, who are a destabilising influence. This means bringing in the Legion (maybe through Shadow Tower?).
If we do this we will be attacking from the South, the West and the East. That's not a bad strategy either, as long as we can keep good lines of communication open.

Crake, please don't feel as if I'm insulting your intelligence. I just happen to disagree with you. If can happen without someone being stupid, you know.

Tywin slipped in mounted riders going as fast as possible, a small force led by Gregor Clegane, and took months to prepare a host to beeline towards the pass going by Golden Tooth, and Hoster Tully (impressively I'll admit) rustled up 10K troops to try to bar his path.

We can take Golden Tooth with far less attention than a full scale invasion warrants, and then funnel troops south towards where our armies are already currently gathering, forcing a confrontation rather than using personal attention or higher circle magic to circumvent the need for protracted sieges, or giving opportunity for Tywin to fight on ground he has been given full leave to prepare ahead of time in whichever manner he thought best if he suspected war of some sort was inevitable, and some of it might hit his Kingdom at some point.
 
Also, fair, just to shout out to both @TalonofAnathrax and @zxzx24 if I seemed too ornery, one, you might have just made an honest mistake of little to no real consequence. That's fair. Don't take leave of the thread on my account, I'm not really angry.

To Talon, your video game comment was irritating so I felt free to be equally dismissive, which might have been counter productive, but I've been getting bullied IRL by friends lately so I've been snarking with bite a lot these days.

Nothing to worry about. Double posting isn't actually against the rules in SV, IIRC.

I don't know if it's "not against the rules or not", but we only get one moderator in here on a regular basis, who is a reader and sometimes poster themselves, and they don't seem to think it's hurting anyone.
 
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