- Location
- Germany
Considering that the light design starts with 10 slots I have some strong doubts about the ability to go above say 7 total slots on an ultra light design and there isn't really anything we want at that number.
A Different Breed (Warhammer 29K)
Considering that the light design starts with 10 slots I have some strong doubts about the ability to go above say 7 total slots on an ultra light design and there isn't really anything we want at that number.
- Location
- Utrecht
It could be interesting to see if the suit link can compensate for not putting a holo fields on the vehicle and using a grav shield instead.
- Location
- Seattle, Washington
[X] Plan: Vulkhari Fighting Vehicles Continued
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Some people have expressed interest in adding a infantry weapon mount, a needler rifles for saturation fire a plasma heavy weapon for power armor, and it would have space for a compact conversion field to be added later. This likely wouldn't make it in until our third go at chassis, so there would be time for a shot at conversion tech again to become available.
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So far every iteration has had options the others lacked thus far, even ultralight bike. I can only imagine that's even more pronounced in from scratch, but it should give us some measure of the difference I suppose.
Melee jetbike would just fit 7 slots exactly - heavy grav sheer + 2 melee slot grav-scythes + a holo-field.
I like three out of four decisions on Alectai's plan but I'd prefer a cheap and specialized sturdy transport chassis to a more expensive many-slots make your own vehicle build. That means
- medium armor
- Fighting Compartment and Armored Engine Cowlings
- 5 slots for shields (holo+1 grav)
- 1 heavy and couple ranged weapon endpoints
- 13 slots for a squad + attachment encolsed transport capacity in case we want enclosed
- smoke grenades launcher
- refractor shields
It doesn't need a bigger engine, light vehicle has enough slots.
Crystalline is close enough.
[X][Light Grav-Vehicle] Plan: Crystalline light grav vehicle
Btw, did we get clarification what that means? Only engine has this wording. Everything else is +x EP to cost of manufacture. What is the cost of slot?
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- Germany
Yeah, i also vastly prefer a specialized transport chassis over the light one he has in his current plan.
At least to me the light armor one has no idea on what it should be used for, and as such likely will only see very limited use at best.
Looks mostly good, but rather than putting in ranged weapon slots why not leave those slots for the probably-soon-to-be-developed firing slits Mechanis mentioned last in a previous vehicle design post:
The squad being transported is likely to be firing more (and better) weapons per system slot than anything we put in a dedicated transport's ranged weapon slot.
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Because it doesn't really work that well with the slots we have.
21 is the min just to get the transport covered + defenses for a sealed transport (Holo-Field, 2 Grav-Shields).
We also did not get that option at all yet even with us already having done a design (open-top) transport a while back.
So trying going well more system slots will let us do that when we don't even have the option yet to research that (and no idea when we actually get it) is well not the best idea ?
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- Location
- Utrecht
- Location
- Germany
I did that with my vote already.
Because I did like some of his options, but not all of them.
vsh's proposal I quoted had 18 slots for transport+defenses (13 slots for enclosed, 2 slots for 1 Holo, 3 slots for 1 Grav) "and couple ranged weapon endpoints". I'm simply saying those ranged weapon slots are a bad idea.
that depends on what the slot is used for it can be anything from a basic needler to a grav shield.
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- Germany
That we can agree on.
It's why in my own version i didn't go for the grav engines 2, the extra slots aren't needed for transport chassis and the 2 slots that are freed up from can be used for other stuff.
The crystal version goes even further goes without extra grav engines to grap all the nice juicy stuff we can only get in this phase for a pretty good-looking transport chassis.
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2 Grav Shields are an overkill IMO for a closed top medium armor transport. We'll have 4 defense systems on it with a single Grav shield: armor, refractors, holo-fields, grav shield, and everything squishy will be behind the armor.
My assumption is that we'll need to put a holo-field on the bikes, yes. It's possible that the Suit-Link means that VGW's integrated holo-field is sufficient to over the bike, in which case we'd put something else in; I figure we'll come up with extra systems to stuff in those slots eventually. I agree that fixed mounts would be better if we wanted to use those to mount guns; if I knew suit-link would work with holo-fields, I'd probably go with a different design of some sort, but I think this is still "good enough" in the case it does.
4 EP on a vehicle that's very likely to cost over 400 EP per didn't seem like a big deal, but I'm not offended if people don't want to pay it; I'm not exactly expecting much from the stuff.
[x][Jetbike] Plan: Refractor Jetbike
[x][Light Grav-Vehicle] Plan: Crystalline light grav vehicle
[x][Air Racer] Plan: Crystalline Air Racer
-[x][Air Racer] Chameleoline Plating
-[x][Air Racer] Basic Refractor Field Generator
-[x][Air Racer] 2x Further Improve Engine Size
-[x][Air Racer] 3x Vehicle Slots, 9x System Slots
[x][Novel Chassis Design] Heavy
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- Utrecht
[X][Jetbike] Plan: Engine Jetbike
-[X][Jetbike] Enhanced Grav-Engine
-[X][Jetbike] Suit-Link System
-[X][Jetbike] Improved Armor
-[X][Jetbike] 1x Heavy Weapon slot, 3x System slot
[X][Light Grav-Vehicle] Plan: Crystalline light grav vehicle
[X][Air Racer] Plan: Vulkhari Fighting: Air Racer
[X][Novel Chassis Design] Medium
@Skjadir you have a copy/paste error in your vote, in the refractor field line.
-[X][Jetbike] Enhanced Grav-Engine
-[X][Jetbike] Suit-Link System
-[X][Jetbike] Improved Armor
-[X][Jetbike] 1x Heavy Weapon slot, 3x System slot
[X][Light Grav-Vehicle] Plan: Crystalline light grav vehicle
[X][Air Racer] Plan: Vulkhari Fighting: Air Racer
[X][Novel Chassis Design] Medium
@Skjadir you have a copy/paste error in your vote, in the refractor field line.
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Refractors only work on energy weapons and mostly on low energy stuff.
Grav shield actually works on almost everything (excluding explosions/large scale aoe weapons) and are the main defense of the transport together with Holo-Field.
They are also notable to have a limit for the shot they can handle at once, it very much makes sense to go for the max amount we can in way most cases.
The Armor is the backup to tank explosions/aoes because the conversion shield likely costs way too many slots for the sealed tank.-
The issue I have with the light armoured iteration is, I think, the same as Skadjir's. What's it for?
Particularly, what would it be for if we're also designing another medium vehicle from scratch?
A medium armoured design intended to drive up in front of the enemy and disgorge a squad of infantry directly into combat has a definite niche. It can do that but also operate as a battle taxi or light SPG in high threat environment with lots of relatively indiscriminate artillery fire, such as when facing orks. It's worth noting that neither current chaos forces nor orks make major use of laser weapons for infantry, so the refractor shields aren't a substitute defence for a wall of orks blazing away with Shootas.
The fact that is an option does show, however, that Light armoured grav tanks are vulnerable to volleys from infantry calibre weapons.
If we also have a dedicated medium vehicle designed with vehicle weapon slots from the start, it seems likely that this will be the hull used for self-propelled guns.
The distinction between our existing medium vehicle and the iterated designs is also important. The more different they are the greatest the incremental value of the design is likely to be. We already have a poorly armoured design that can operate in permissive environments and behind the lines as the equivalent of SPGs based on trucks rather than tanks, or to transport infantry around away from direct combat. I don't think we get the best value by trying to make the existing design obsolete, but by retaining the old designs and doing something different with the iterated one.
I think we open up the most potential design space if we have a medium armoured medium vehicle and a heavy vehicle.
I din't think we need three medium chassis at the moment.
Particularly, what would it be for if we're also designing another medium vehicle from scratch?
A medium armoured design intended to drive up in front of the enemy and disgorge a squad of infantry directly into combat has a definite niche. It can do that but also operate as a battle taxi or light SPG in high threat environment with lots of relatively indiscriminate artillery fire, such as when facing orks. It's worth noting that neither current chaos forces nor orks make major use of laser weapons for infantry, so the refractor shields aren't a substitute defence for a wall of orks blazing away with Shootas.
The fact that is an option does show, however, that Light armoured grav tanks are vulnerable to volleys from infantry calibre weapons.
If we also have a dedicated medium vehicle designed with vehicle weapon slots from the start, it seems likely that this will be the hull used for self-propelled guns.
The distinction between our existing medium vehicle and the iterated designs is also important. The more different they are the greatest the incremental value of the design is likely to be. We already have a poorly armoured design that can operate in permissive environments and behind the lines as the equivalent of SPGs based on trucks rather than tanks, or to transport infantry around away from direct combat. I don't think we get the best value by trying to make the existing design obsolete, but by retaining the old designs and doing something different with the iterated one.
I think we open up the most potential design space if we have a medium armoured medium vehicle and a heavy vehicle.
I din't think we need three medium chassis at the moment.
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- Germany
I wouldn't say most cases - back line vehicles like SPGs that can't have the fire of entire enemy lines focused on them might be able to get away with less - but APCs are definitely one of the cases where I expect the second grav-shield to matter.
Yeah. It'll probably matter versus Ork Zzap Guns, but I get the impression those aren't exactly in use by most Orks.
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SPGs will have to deal with (a lot) counter artillery fire and if the enemy can get stuff through missile and airstrikes.
So that would be a case of 1 grav shield, 1 holo-field, 1 conversion field that likely will need more slots than 1 holo-field, 2 grav shields.
It doesn't help that we will likely be outnumbered pretty much all the time, which means our units need to be somewhat tankier than if we expected numbers to be more even.
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