Looking over our equipment, i do think we can use one of the actions to help speed up repairs.
Mostly because 5000 EP look like enough to build a war host or two with the units we can currently build.
 
I have a question

What level of understanding of the lore is required to participate? I only have a very vague understanding of things...
Just ask questions. People would be happy to offer their viewpoint on whatever you ask them about. But, broadly, most important details are going to be discussed, as people try to use everything to get others to vote for their plans.

+40K is notoriously contentious universe, lorewise, and just about every QM I saw goes with at least somewhat different set of background assumptions about the setting, their own spin on things. Aside from the basics, there is a lot to relearn every time.
 
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Looking over our equipment, i do think we can use one of the actions to help speed up repairs.
Mostly because 5000 EP look like enough to build a war host or two with the units we can currently build.
Do you mean reallocating the Stockpile Wargear AP, on the grounds that the Forge is so much more efficient than those AP that we should be spending them on something else (like fixing our engines)? That seems reasonable. It's basically 11 AP per turn spent on Stockpile Wargear already if we put both of its points toward EP production.

But if you mean that we should be switching the Forge away from EP production this turn, I think I'd strongly disagree. We can see from the ork war requirements that a warhost is not expected to be able to handle a war on its own- three to five is the minimum recommended allocation there. This means that if our warhosts are something like 2500 EP to refit (which seems reasonable based on the estimates made here) we've got to spend 10000 EP just to get one theater of operations to a combat-ready state. Our army is insanely EP-hungry and needs all the good gear we can build them yesterday, while the repair options largely do not.

Once we're building capital ships that will be more reasonable. Or once our army can be relied upon to win battles and we're looking at incremental improvements or expanding.
 
So I did some maths for my idea of making wargear for Meros.

For 2200EP and 80SC (lass than half the FoV's EP output and 1/10 of our per turn SC output) we could give them;
40 Starblaster Carbin
400 Hardsuits
and 360 Lasrifles/Carbins (they cost the same)

That is 40 ten man Hardsuit equipped squads with a squad support weapon as powerful as a lascannon and a fire rate of a Hellgun.

Not standing army level gear but for a crash build program it is a good boost to their immediate defense.
 
Looking at production costs for our warhost here and the baseline units:
Fire Squad:
Size:10
Wraithbone Trauma Plates 1 EP per
2 Flamer 2 Ep per
1 Screamer Granade 4 EP per
7 Lasrifles 2 EP per
Total:32 EP

Assault Squads:
Size:10
Wraithbone Trauma Plates 1 EP per
melee weapons 1 per + potential Laspistol 1 per
Total:-> 20-30 EP

Militia Marine Squad:
Size:8
Wraithweave Voidsuits 2 EP per
Fatesplitter Carbines 7 EP, 1 Scope per
Total:72EP,8 scopes

Brightstar
size:6
Wraithbone Hardsuits 3 EP per
Starblaster Carbines or Rifles 8/10 EP and 2 Starcrystals per
Total:66-78 EP, 12 Starcrystals

Fatebreaker
size:6
Wraithbone Hardsuits 3Ep per
Fatecaster Rifles:25 EP, 1 scope
Total:168 EP, 6 scopes

Ironbreaker
size:6
Wraithbone Hardsuits 3EP per
Power Maul 20 Ep per
Starblaster pistol 4 EP, 1 starcrystal
Total:162 EP, 6 Starcrystals

Fast Attack
Milita Jetbiker
Size:8
Lascarbine 2 Ep per
Wraithbone Trauma Plates 1 EP per
8 jetbikes: 21 EP per
total:192 EP

Heathguard jetbiker
size:6
4: Jetbikes - Fatesplitter Carbine, 28 Ep, 1 Scope per
2: Jetbikes - Starblaster Rifle 31 EP, 2 Starcrystals per
Wraithbone Hardsuits 3EP per
+ 6 Fate cutter Pistols 3 Ep, 1 scope per
total:212Ep, 4 Starcrystals, 10 scopes

Bright Talon Heavy Jetbike
size:6 - 2 per heavy jetbike
Wraithbone Hardsuits 3EP per
Bright Talon Heavy Jetbike 98 EP, 8 Starcrystals, 2 scopes per
Total:312Ep, 24 Crystals, 6 Scopes

Hearthguard Veteran Squad:
size:6
Wraithbone Hardsuits 3EP per
2 Starblaster rifles 10 EP and 2 Starcrystals per
2 Fatecaster rifles 25 Ep, 1 scope
2 Starblaster pr Fatesplitter carbines 8/7 EP, 2 starcrystals/1 Scope per
Total:102-104EP, 4-8 Starcrystals, 2-4Scopes

Break down for a one Milita Line Detachtment:
three Guardian Militia Fire Squads mounted on Attack Barges, Total:3x(32 EP+156Ep) = 564 EP
two squadrons of Militia jetbikers, Total:2x192 EP=384EP
one squad of Bright Talon heavy jetbikes Total:312EP,24 Crystals, 6 Scopes
a squad of Hearthguard Veterans, Total:102-104EP, 4-8 Starcrystals, 2-4Scopes
a single Brightstar squad, Total:66-78 EP, 12 Starcrystals
+ Needlestorm IFV, 236EP

Line Detachtment Total:
-EP cost 1664-1678,40-44 Starcrystals, 8-10 Scopes.

Using that as a base a single Heavy Milita warhost, now some approximation:
They are made up of:
Hearthguard Line detachment
one Militia Line detachment
assault detachment
heavy detachment
three Militia Light Support detachments
a Battlecasting Support Detachment.

The light support detachtments each at least 544 EP per
If the rest of the Detachments cost are each at least 1200EP
We are looking at a total cost of atleast 8000EP, per Heavy Milita warhost.

So yeah i think we do need both vault actions on gear production.
 
Edit: The amount of superheavy Starlances at 90 for PD at least to me seems somewhat questionable considering how much that overkills pretty much everything, as Starlances at that size (super heavy) are weapons that kind of happily kill titans.
That is a good point, I kinda overlooked how hilariously overpowered Starlances are compared to generic las weapons.

Given that Fatesevers which are vehicle grade weapons are considered acceptable point defense for our Battle Brigs which are supposed to be Battleship equivalents and lascannons which seem to only go up to vehicle grade are considered acceptable point defense for our light cruiser equivalents maybe we could downgrade from superheavies to regular Starlances or even lascannons for our escorts?

Regardless, I think once we get into the weeds of designing ships we will have a much better understanding what we should be aiming for beyond just bolting Holofields and Grav-shields onto everything and anything that can mount them.
 
Likely also turning all main weapons into either Starlance or Fatecasters for our Capital ship.
With Secondary potentially being plasma or gravity depending on how they do.

Also potentially adding in Conversion shields as I think all plans spend AP on that ?
Can't do designs using stuff from seeker actions the same turn we do the seeker action.
 
Likely also turning all main weapons into either Starlance or Fatecasters for our Capital ship.
With Secondary potentially being plasma or gravity depending on how they do.

Also potentially adding in Conversion shields as I think all plans spend AP on that ?
I'm excited for Conversion shields, though as I understand it that action is just to (try to) unlock being able to research/recreate them, so I think we should either do a full redesign of our vehicles/ships when we get then, or maybe it might be possible to just leave some room for them to be installed later?

Depends on how well we understand what space they need and if they can work as a discrete module or if they are better integrated throughout a whole machine.
 
That 4400 Starcrystals reads like a typo.


It only has a single heavy Starlance given.
And if you look at the capital ships (combat Brig as example which has a lot more weapons mounted):



This only costs 1600
and the Battle Caravel which has the same Heavy starlance mounted only costs 350.

Edit: The amount of superheavy Starlances at 90 for PD at least to me seems somewhat questionable considering how much that overkills pretty much everything, as Starlances at that size (super heavy) are weapons that kind of happily kill titans.
not typo, but "previously Uncaught math error." this has now been fixed. as has me forgetting to add the Starlances to their gear list.

I also added a shopping list for what all each of your Detachments needs in terms of gear, and CP costs for all Squads, Detachments and Warhosts---and for the record, the reason I'm not bothering to track CP at this stage is because your current army uses less than half a percent of your theoretical maximum strength. You do, after all have a population of nearly six billion and less than 8000 guys under arms (not counting the navy, because their requirements are different).

That is a good point, I kinda overlooked how hilariously overpowered Starlances are compared to generic las weapons.

Given that Fatesevers which are vehicle grade weapons are considered acceptable point defense for our Battle Brigs which are supposed to be Battleship equivalents and lascannons which seem to only go up to vehicle grade are considered acceptable point defense for our light cruiser equivalents maybe we could downgrade from superheavies to regular Starlances or even lascannons for our escorts?

Regardless, I think once we get into the weeds of designing ships we will have a much better understanding what we should be aiming for beyond just bolting Holofields and Grav-shields onto everything and anything that can mount them.
Lascannons are a cheap point defense option. Not necessarily the best option. (also the naval grade ones are Las-Lances; same technology just bigger. )

As a general reminder to people talking about your Special resources, keep in mind that a single Fateforge is making a whole six scopes a year, while Starcrystal farms put out 40 a year. Granted there may be ways to improve that beyond just "build more", in the coming turns, but they are not trivial to stockpile---you can't just run down to Vaul-Mart and have them unload a dumptruck of the things onto your lawn when you're running low anymore.

Huh, I'm noticing that a good portion of the mission-kills and fleet damage our ships have is usually centred on the Æthersails, which seem to be the only form of propulsion some of the ships have (and prone to breaking by the looks of it)

I reckon once we start designing more militarized hulls, we should consider phasing out the Æthersails and substituting with other forms of propulsion (as long as the loss of speed isn't TOO much, that is) which should hopefully make it less likely to mission-kill them or cripple their mobility.

(Ironically enough, the DEldar might have done this in the OTL of 40k)
this basically correct. Aethersails are very efficient, but come with the gigantic caveat of being fairly massive targets that are basically impossible to armor. Plasma Drives-our other propulsion option at the moment-are significantly less efficient propulsion and take up more space in the hull (read; more slots,) but are considerably harder to disable because, well, they're not giant sails sticking out of the ship. You may note that the half of your combat fleet that wasn't built to "need numbers yesterday" cheapness by refitting existing civilian boats with some guns all have at least one backup plasma drive, specifically so if they lose their sails they aren't Mobility Killed. Which tends to become Actually Killed in fairly short order a lot of the time.

I don't think so. I would say that the Warsuits are the less sophisticated Guardian Equivalent. Or in tt terms, 5+ save.
The other eldar aren't that bad at engineering that our first attempt matches the best they can make after significant R&D.
A Warsuit is what you make it. You'll be getting a vote to determine how heavy you want to push it, what kind of integrated systems you want to fit (if any) and so on.

Actually, a question does occur to me. @Mechanis , how does re-equipping previously existing Detachments work? Do we have to disband them and then recreate from scratch for 2 AP, or can we just re-equip them for 1?
You would be getting (limited by gear not AP) Steward actions to re-equip existing Detachments/Warhosts, though they would have to be at the craftworld/not doing anything at the start of the turn.

@Mechanis I guess we will only find out if these High Technology Weapons use some kind of Special Resource, after we have Researched them?
High Technology will mention (or at least not-especially-subtly imply) if it needs some kind of special resource to produce in the description. But as a general metric, if the Imperium has an equivalent that isn't some kind of ultra-rare Elite of Elite of Elite kit like Adthratic Disruptors or things like that, it probably doesn't need any kind of Special Resources. Special Resouces are rare, always-either there are very, very few sources with low output (EG, Starcrystals), they can't be manufactured at all and have to be retrieved from somewhere insanely dangerous (EG, Soulstones), they have some kind of "must be made while singing the soviet national anthem backwards in Swahili during a specific planetary alignment" production requirement that makes them functionally impossible to produce a large amount of, or similar.

Also expect my responses to be a little slower a lot of the time until the 21st, because I'm out of data.
 
Lascannons are a cheap point defense option. Not necessarily the best option. (also the naval grade ones are Las-Lances; same technology just bigger. )

As a general reminder to people talking about your Special resources, keep in mind that a single Fateforge is making a whole six scopes a year, while Starcrystal farms put out 40 a year. Granted there may be ways to improve that beyond just "build more", in the coming turns, but they are not trivial to stockpile---you can't just run down to Vaul-Mart and have them unload a dumptruck of the things onto your lawn when you're running low anymore.
While I'm not going to disagree with the QM, isn't it kinda also true that a lot of this gear is going to last for millennia? Recycling wargear off the dead is a staple of the setting and it seems like warships are more likely to be mission killed or recoverable hulks than suffer catastrophic damage.

Obviously it's going to be hard to scale up exotic resource production, but it does sort of seem feasible to make a military heavily reliant on exotic resources so long as you can pace and spread out new demand. Our perspective is just kinda distorted by the need to crash build a military now in terms of years vs. centuries.
 
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Arguing with the QM and telling him his intent of Exotics being a serious expense is wrong? Bold strategy.

It's not like Orks respect retrieval rights, only the winner gets to recover wargear, and that wargear might just be destroyed by the attack that killed you.

If the math says that spamming Exotic dependent gear is the only choice even for our basic militia, and the QM says the intent is that Exotic Scarcity is important, then that's a bug, not a hack.
 
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. You do, after all have a population of nearly six billion and less than 8000 guys under arms (not counting the navy, because their requirements are different).
I mean, the Forge of Vaul can barely manufacture a thousand lasguns a year if going full tilt into that direction. Unless we go cheap as chips Eldar waves we ain't massively increasing those numbers any time soon.
 
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Question: were priests of Vaul or other Aeldari gods soul-bound to them like Astropaths are to the big E? If so, could we 'feed' the shard to resurrect Vaul?
 
Ah, That's why I was suddenly possessed with the urge to make a 40K quest!

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OFAmCF_PVD0
Mystery solved!
never have I been more annoyed that I have no money than right now.

I mean, the Forge of Vaul can barely manufacture a thousand lasguns a year if going full tilt into that direction. Unless we go cheap as chips Eldar waves we ain't massively increasing those numbers any time soon.
you will be getting more industry options eventually. If nothing else, just increasing your industry will increase how much equipment you can manufacture at once.
 
Arguing with the QM and telling him his intent of Exotics being a serious expense is wrong? Bold strategy.

It's not like Orks respect retrieval rights, only the winner gets to recover wargear, and that wargear might just be destroyed by the attack that killed you.

If the math says that spamming Exotic dependent gear is the only choice even for our basic militia, and the QM says the intent is that Exotic Scarcity is important, then that's a bug, not a hack.
Please don't fucking strawman me. It's not like literally every faction besides the Necrons and DEldarhave major reasons to scavenge/recover their own losses. IG and their superheavies, Craftworlders and their soulstones + exarch armors, any SM relics/gene seed etc. if you are planning to get massacred and driven off the field never to return as a matter of course, you and I have different ideas. This is a setting where almost every pivotal fight involves anteing irreplaceable war assets be it a Baneblade or a Guardian's Soulstone… unless you're Orks or Necrons.

As for the exotic spam… we have 8000 people in our army out of 6 billion people. The fact that any of our soldiery is being treated as conscripts is a systemic failure of our Craftworld, not the fundamental limitations of production or exotic resources.

My argument is that this desperate military crash buildup is the problem, that somehow sustaining a few thousand heirloom rifles isn't magically impossible for us over the millennia when practically everyone else does. We shouldn't be fielding *any* militia when we have less than 1/60,000th of our population in arms. Wait until we're fielding hundreds of thousands of soldiers before you start insisting on the expedience of cutting corners. Our forces are probably going to *eventually* balloon beyond the means for us to arm them all with exotic weaponry, but that's for when we're actually a population at arms. Not when we're trying to create the barest nucleus of experience to serve as the cadre for an actual long term military force.
 
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Please don't fucking strawman me. It's not like literally every faction besides the Necrons and DEldarhave major reasons to scavenge/recover their own losses. IG and their superheavies, Craftworlders and their soulstones + exarch armors, any SM relics/gene seed etc. if you are planning to get massacred and driven off the field never to return as a matter of course, you and I have different ideas.

As for the exotic spam… we have 8000 people in our army out of 6 billion people. The fact that any of our soldiery is being treated as conscripts is a systemic failure of our Craftworld, not the fundamental limitations of production or exotic resources.

My argument is that this desperate military crash buildup is the problem, that somehow sustaining a few thousand heirloom rifles isn't magically impossible for us over the millennia when practically everyone else does. We shouldn't be fielding *any* militia when we have less than 1/60,000th of our population in arms.
it's more that you basically didn't have a military like you need now until like, four or five years ago, and then you had to build it up while everything was on fire and while fighting off mobs of literally insane murder cultists. The fact that you managed to get as large an army as you have is actually pretty impressive, really.

(obviously, originally your military force would be "one (1) Hearthguard and like 200 psychic murder robots" but you can't do that anymore.)
 
you will be getting more industry options eventually. If nothing else, just increasing your industry will increase how much equipment you can manufacture at once.

How much is our Craftworld Damage holding us back, incidentally?

If people are going to be saying "Dump stat repairs because we don't need them yet, better to get a shitton of EP right now", I'd like to at least have that confirmed while I'm doing my final pass pre-vote.
 
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I mean it only makes sense that repairs would increase our effectiveness. More repairs means more space for facilities or more effective facilities as there's not say a power drop due to cur lines.

Or just the Morale boost of not living on a mostly functional wreck.
 
wait a thousand lasguns a year? the same IG lasguns? or you mean more advanced eldar level lasguns?
 
We can get more industry? You know what that means everyone, it is time to crash industrialize the craftworld. We cannot stop until every soldier has a tank and every crewman has a frigate.
 
[X] Plan: Strong Foundations Lead to Victory
-[X][Steward] Rationalize Infantry (1 AP)
-[X][Steward] Rationalize Vehicles (2 AP)
-[X][Steward] Rationalize Fleet (4 AP)
-[X][Steward] Tend to the Fields, Ye sons and Daughters (2 AP)
-[X][Steward] Harken the Exiles (1 AP)
-[X][Bonesinger] Assess the damage to Vau-Vulkesh's engines (2 AP)
-[X][Bonesinger] Effect general repairs (3 AP)
--[X] Forge of Vaul Supports x2
-[X][Bonesinger] The Fleets of Arach-Qin: Lords of the Void (1 AP)
-[X][Bonesinger] The Fleets of Arach-Qin: Lighter Than a Feather (1 AP)
-[X][Bonesinger] Develop Needlers (1 AP)
-[X][Bonesinger] Develop Wraithbone Warsuit (1 AP)
-[X][Bonesinger] Develop Wraithweave Brigantine Armor (1 AP)
-[X][Bonesinger] Dispatch aid to Zahr-Tann (2 AP)
-[X][Bonesinger] Dispatch aid to Meros (3 AP)
-[X][Seer] Scry the Present (1 AP)
--[X] Who is the Ork in command of the force assaulting Meros
-[X][Seer] Scry the Future (1 AP)
--[X] When can we expect a direct attack on our Craftworld
-[X][Seer] Raise a Warcasting Circle (3 AP)
-[X][Seer] The Flaw, The Curse, The Claim (5 AP)
-[X][Seeker] Reverse-engineer Grav-weapons (2 AP)
-[X][Seeker] Reverse-engineer Plasma Blasters (1 AP)
-[X][Seeker] Reverse-Engineer Conversion Fields (6 AP)
-[X][Seeker] Reverse-engineer Haywire Weapons (3/4 AP)
-[X][Warrior] Dispatch Warhosts
--[X] Fist of Vau-Vulkesh, Vaul-Hammer, Blades of Isha, 2nd and 3rd Militia
-[X][Warrior] Send Forth your Fleets
--[X] 5 Combat Brigs, 12 Battle Carracks, 25 Assault Ketches, 25 Lance Cutters, 25 Lance Sloops
-[X][Warrior] Dispatch ships to scout the Webway (4 AP)
--[X] 1x Caravel, 2x Sloop, 2x Lance Sloop, 2x Assault Ketch each
-[X][Warrior] Raise a Warhost (1 AP)
--[X] Mechanized Headquarters, Hearthguard Armor, Armored Assault, 4x Hearthguard Skirmish

This is the final version of the plan that I've developed last night, that has been getting revised based on critiques. It has several major thrusts.

1) Prepare ourselves to meet the trials of the coming days, through preparing a reserve of basic infantry equipment to give our militia a leg up, while also developing something that's better off than the ad-hoc station wagons with guns strapped on and Hazardous Environment gear that we're currently using. Stewardship starts implementing internal farming, but approaches the Exodites this turn with the intention of hopefully getting some guidance as to what the best methods are. I'm hoping between us getting along with Saim-Hann and the precedent we've set that we're not complete dicks helps us get a decent deal here. We have a little wiggle room with our supplies, so we can pass on making a full court spread until we see what options are unlocked by the Exodite advice. Aside from that, we get our basic infantry unit hashed out and equipped with actual, meaningful Stuff, as well as basic bespoke vehicles and a design of Destroyer that we can convert our busted ones into as part of the refurbishment effort.

2) Bonesinger is mostly about rebuilding our industry while preparing to meet our obligations. We lend Arach-Qin our shipyards because we are definitely not lacking in yard space, and we provide significant support to both Zahr-Tann and Meros in getting their own engines online while studying our own. Meros gets the majority of it because they're in the more imminent danger, but once we have an idea of the time we'll be playing Tower Defense with them, that'll go over well. I am committing one of our Forge of Vaul actions to our Craftworld Repair simply because my hope is that this will increase our Bonesinger AP if we get it, and there is a possibility of having it finished by next turn if we spend 3 AP and a Forge action on it. Given how industrially stacked we are, I suspect that fixing our damage will unlock more AP in other places, even if we're a powerhouse right now. Every AP gained sooner is worth its weight in gold.

3) Seer spends half of our AP on working on our Solution, 2 AP on Scrying--both for future threats to us in general (A generic "When can we expect to be attacked" without establishing by whom should give us a floor for how much time we have, and have a high degree of accuracy due to how vague the question is, while using clairvoyance to identify who the Ork commanding the assault on Meros is means we've got a shot at headcapping him--and as this is viewing the Present and identifying which Ork is the Boss of this particular force, it should also have a high degree of accuracy, and likely have benefits to our relief force.

4) Seeker gets Conversion Fields, Plasma Weapons, and Grav-Weapons started, and most of the way towards Haywire Weapons as well, nothing fancy here, we're pretty crazy on Seeker AP for our current projects.

5) Warrior actions are deploying 5 Warhosts--which is the level we were told would be sufficient if they were all militia... But then we have three of those Warhosts being our Hearthguard heavy Warhosts which are the closest thing we have at present to regulars, which should let us make use of the Militia forces to hold ground while using our more advanced forces to achieve objectives. We then spend 2 AP scouting our local area with a Light Cruiser and 4 Escorts apiece, and then reserve 3 AP for raising new Detachments after the Rationalization, which will put us in good position to potentially have another Named Warhost ready to go before it hits the fan. Our second Forge of Vaul action has been reserved to generate 5,000 EP worth of Wargear for these three Detachments, which should be enough to ensure they all have quality gear. Though I'm not committing to actual Wargear until we actually have our full gear list after the Bonesinger and Steward projects ready--but I don't think three detachments are going to break the bank here unless we intentionally try to throw all the best shit in there.




Anyway, that's about 24 hours, give or take a few minutes, I think we're good to go.
 
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