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Ok, ignoring for moment what the thread wants Mathilde to do because the thread wants to see it, why does Mathilde want to do things?

What is Mathilde's motivation? What is she trying to prove, or accomplish, or obtain?

In the aftermath of the waystone and AV success, who is she as a character, to you?
 
What is Mathilde's motivation? What is she trying to prove, or accomplish, or obtain?

In the aftermath of the waystone and AV success, who is she as a character, to you?
Personally very loyal. Someone with a lot of political opinions, with a unique insight into magical and cultural teamwork- an idealist in that way, who wants and tries to encourage different magical traditions and peoples to work together. A researcher who's eternally curious. Someone with a lot of fragile pride. Someone with a long history of helping.

That's just what's textual so far, but through the magic of quest mechanics the actions we decide on will retroactively influence her motivation. Supreme Matriarch Mathilde ends student debt and her personal struggle with it and musings on it more recently become a motivation. She builds Journeymen partying up and job board networks and her experience with the ducklings and lack of support during her own journeying becomes a motivation. She builds magical infrastructure to fight disease or power great works and her experience with the Waystone project becomes a motivation.

That's who she is to me, and that's who she could be. I can't say what the thread would vote for, but I'm confident Boney would write it in a way that's consistent with her character and growth, and grows it even further. And I think (have faith?) the thread would vote in a character focused way as well, though don't quote me on that.

Honestly, Mathilde's next actual arc is probably going to come from left field. It's not like anyone saw the Waystone project coming, for all that I think it's a very cool and natural outcome of Mathilde's history.
 
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Ok, ignoring for moment what the thread wants Mathilde to do because the thread wants to see it, why does Mathilde want to do things?

What is Mathilde's motivation? What is she trying to prove, or accomplish, or obtain?

In the aftermath of the waystone and AV success, who is she as a character, to you?
"To change the world we live in."

Mathilde gets explicit motivation on a lot of her bigger projects- she can best be described as a proactive idealist. She sees the opportunity for a better world and will see it done come hell or high water- to be content, to go into 'semi-retirement', would mean accepting that the current state of the world is... fine. It doesn't need improvement. Or that Mathilde can't improve it.

The current state of the world, to put it bluntly, still fucking sucks. Mathilde has helped, immensely, but that doesn't strike me as motivation to stop- quite the opposite, she proves to herself more and more each time that she can help, that her help and time are valuable, that her actions matter.

Mathilde is a person who wants to fix the world, and those kind of people don't tend to die peacefully in retirement- especially not in a setting like this.

I'm sure Boney could justify whatever we wind up voting on, but personally I can't see Mathilde retiring- she's going to keep helping until it kills her, and that's part of why I like her as a character. I don't think a retired Mathilde would be a happy one, even if she might live longer.

Its a little bit sad that she's unlikely to ever get a 'happy ending', but she's perfectly capable of being happy in the moment, and I think that's enough.
 
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DL lore is that rediscovery vs invention is an eternal philosophical debate within the Runesmiths Guild. Mathilde's perspective on the matter is skewed because the two Runesmiths she knows are very much on the traditionalist side of things, which says that even the Ancestor Gods only discovered the Runes that already existed and to claim invention is to say you've outdone them, and not really prone to giving equal time to the opposition.
So as far as we modern day humans understand it, "discovering" a Rune may well be on the same spectrum as discovering viable DNA sequences for splicing and discovering how to make silicon and metal do math? Or maybe more akin to discovering how to make a really unintuitive programming language do the things you want it to do, what with the command words not being inventable.

I'm not asking whether any of this is directly accurate. The real answer is that we won't know because we aren't descendants of Thungni and no one os going to invent a whole fictional branch of science. I'm just curious if I am in the ballpark of a viable enough analogy to understand the disagreement.
 
Ok, ignoring for moment what the thread wants Mathilde to do because the thread wants to see it, why does Mathilde want to do things?

What is Mathilde's motivation? What is she trying to prove, or accomplish, or obtain?

In the aftermath of the waystone and AV success, who is she as a character, to you?
To answer this somewhat seriously I think Mathilde exemplifies her wind in a very unique way. The grey wind is ultimately the wind of questions. It's not the wind of answers, but rather the wind of the questions themselves. It's practitioners exemplify the fundamental questions, who, what, why, where, how?

Who are they? Nobody knows. What are they doing. You can't tell. Why are they doing it? No idea. Where are they? Not where you can see them. How did they pull it off? Anyone's guess.

But Mathilde exemplifies a very specific question.

Why not?

That's it. She has wrapped herself around the question of Why Not and found that she's perfectly fine without an answer in 99% of situations. Why not become a swordsmaster? Why not take back Silvania? Why not go work for the dwarves? Why not retake the Karak? Why not build a library? Why not rebuild the waystone network? Why not solve the two unsolveable puzzles of the Magic Colleges?

Why not visit Ulthuan? Does it advance any of her current projects? Not particularly, but she doesn't have a reason not to go so she's packing her bags and making plans.

She is fundamentally the absence of that question having an answer. Without a reason why not to do something she just DOES it. She challenges things people see as fundamentally unchallengeable because why not? She is not overly ambitious. She doesn't have some overarching personal goal. She just DOES stuff, whatever stuff she thinks would be interesting in the moment.
 
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@Boney would it be viable/useful to include Egrimm on the "Try to see through Pall of Darkness with your improved magical senses" action? He has the same windsight as us, and I presume that he knows Eyes of Truth, which lets him see through darkness. Or is the action so personal that Egrimm wouldn't be of any assistance?

As long as you don't see any reason not to teach him to hard counter some Grey Order stealth abilities, sure.

So as far as we modern day humans understand it, "discovering" a Rune may well be on the same spectrum as discovering viable DNA sequences for splicing and discovering how to make silicon and metal do math? Or maybe more akin to discovering how to make a really unintuitive programming language do the things you want it to do, what with the command words not being inventable.

It's possible. Any real investigation of it can't really go anywhere until you have some idea what the whole 'Glittering Realm' business is about - the purported origin point of all Runelore. Is it an underground vault full of recorded secrets? (Whose secrets?) An Aethyric realm of some sort? (How did it get separated from the rest of it in the first place?) A divine realm? (Of the Ancestor Gods, or of someone else?) An underground arcane nexus with a different form of power? (Different how? Different why?)

Everyone thinks they've got some insight into the answer, but on the rare occasions where they can be convinced to compare notes, they can't find a way to connect together the different pieces they have and that causes rifts to widen and discourages them from sharing again in the future.
 
What is Mathilde's motivation? What is she trying to prove, or accomplish, or obtain?

In the aftermath of the waystone and AV success, who is she as a character, to you?

I believe this quote from Raymond Chandler says it.

"down these mean streets a man must go who is not himself mean, who is neither tarnished nor afraid. He is the hero; he is everything. He must be a complete man and a common man and yet an unusual man. He must be, to use a rather weathered phrase, a man of honor—by instinct, by inevitability, without thought of it, and certainly without saying it. He must be the best man in his world and a good enough man for any world.

"He will take no man's money dishonestly and no man's insolence without a due and dispassionate revenge. He is a lonely man and his pride is that you will treat him as a proud man or be very sorry you ever saw him.

"The story is this man's adventure in search of a hidden truth, and it would be no adventure if it did not happen to a man fit for adventure. If there were enough like him, the world would be a very safe place to live in, without becoming too dull to be worth living in."
 
"To change the world we live in."

Mathilde gets explicit motivation on a lot of her bigger projects- she can best be described as a proactive idealist. She sees the opportunity for a better world and will see it done come hell or high water- to be content, to go into 'semi-retirement', would mean accepting that the current state of the world is... fine. It doesn't need improvement. Or that Mathilde can't improve it.

The current state of the world, to put it bluntly, still fucking sucks. Mathilde has helped, immensely, but that doesn't strike me as motivation to stop- quite the opposite, she proves to herself more and more each time that she can help, that her help and time are valuable, that her actions matter.

Mathilde is a person who wants to fix the world, and those kind of people don't tend to die peacefully in retirement- especially not in a setting like this.

I'm sure Boney could justify whatever we wind up voting on, but personally I can't see Mathilde retiring- she's going to keep helping until it kills her, and that's part of why I like her as a character. I don't think a retired Mathilde would be a happy one, even if she might live longer.

Its a little bit sad that she's unlikely to ever get a 'happy ending', but she's perfectly capable of being happy in the moment, and I think that's enough.

One must imagine Mathilde happy
 
The current state of the world, to put it bluntly, still fucking sucks

According to whom, and compared to what?

For Mathilde, the world is better for humans and dwarves than it has been for thousands of years. And she's been a large enough part of making it that way that she can be proud of it.

What did she grow up fearing and hearing about? Sylvania. Solved. Greenskins? She knows how to kill greenskins and personally broke a waaagh. Demons? She's seen the chaos wastes and knows how to kill demons, knows how far north you have to go before they just evaporate into the world.

The problems she's heard from the dwarves? Lost karaks. Solved. Lost secrets of the glorious works of their ancestors? It's an ongoing journey. Armies of skaven and greenskins constantly besieging everything? The evident ones have been dealt with.

There's no war the empire is mustering for, or threatened by. Kislev is a strong ally, Brettonia is being conversational. The beast herds are quiet. No waaaghs are known to be forming.

So where does she get "the world sucks" from?
 
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[X] Plan: The Prismatic Wanderer

I think this is a ridiculous thing to use such a boon on, but I can tell when the other voting options aren't going to win.
 
One must imagine Mathilde happy

My hatred/love for Camus remains a constant. If this needs to be deleted, I will.


Maximilian caught his long time employer and friend focused on a particular large boulder at the bottom of a steep hill.

"Are you okay?" he asked.

"I...don't know why but I felt the strongest urge to roll that boulder up the hill," she said, "And maybe shoot an Arabyan man,"

"Ohh...okay. Chaos item?"

"Definitely a Chaos item,"
 
Ok, ignoring for moment what the thread wants Mathilde to do because the thread wants to see it, why does Mathilde want to do things?

What is Mathilde's motivation? What is she trying to prove, or accomplish, or obtain?

In the aftermath of the waystone and AV success, who is she as a character, to you?
Mathilde is an optimist, in the sense that she fundamentally believes in the power of people to make things go well. In this respect, she is showing her cards as someone from the Warhammer setting.

What I mean by that: Warhammer is, fundamentally, heroic fantasy. It centers individuals rather than systems or abstractions as the driving forces of history and the levers of the world. As such, Warhammer is extremely agentic in its internal logic: it takes as read the idea that a person can make a difference, even in extremely entrenched systems. As mundane history, the concept that the Empire came back together under Magnus the Pious is insane. It had been fragmented and at war with itself for a thousand years. But between forces that can be explained by the setting's internal logic ("all the major gods publicly endorsed him as being a cool dude") and forces that can't (he was, in fact, just the coolest dude that there has ever been), the empire super long divided did in fact unite, and not in a way where anyone is super worried about it flying apart at the seams any time soon either, which is wild.

Mathilde's life has been pretty shaped by this. She was saved from the pyre by the nameless watchman from her hometown; she discovered soon afterwards that the reason the law protected her at all was because of Magnus the Pious and Teclis. Her Stirland posting was a constant education in how the decisions of the people with power reshaped the world, for good or for ill. She toppled the Drakenhofs to finish what her lord had started, and even after his death Abelhelm's individual choices had massive impact on the fate of the entire Empire through the little list he gave to Mathilde. And then, of course, there was everything about Karak Eight Peaks.

So: why shouldn't she believe that she can change the world? She's already done it multiple times. If she sees something she doesn't like, whether that's a dying Karaz Ankor or an Elector Count under terrible threat or a research project conventionally held to be impossible, she can put her mind to it and change it. If she sees something she likes and wants more of in the world, such as books, Ranald's strength and good repute, sketchy but not technically illegal magic, books, ways to perceive magic, books, or books, she can make that happen. And that's why I say she's an optimist: she can look at the world and feel hope, not because she's naive, but because she's experienced at changing the world for the better by her values and sees no reason why this state of affairs oughtn't continue. There isn't a shred of learned helplessness in her; if her noble motto weren't the thing it actually is, it could just as easily be the "It's Happening" meme.

Why does Mathilde do things? Because doing things works.
 
Mathilde is aware that Chaos is stirring. Even if she doesn't have a timeline, she's got to act like it'll be within her lifetime.

True, but also that's a long time and a long ways away. Plus, the archetype then is "golden Kingdom threatened" and that's a thing of the world currently being awesome.

I guess what I'm driving at is, what is she fighting for, now?

The next generation? It would be cool to transition to a teaching arc.

If her goals are mostly satisfied and she's just bopping along, taking her new airship out for a spin, then it seems like a 'research' arc, and by research I mean time not precommitted to any goal or position, it's entirely our own.

If she decides it's time to make some gambles while she is playing with house money? A war for a Nexus seems like the best bet.

Trying to feel out how I feel about next arcs. I am committed to elfcation as interlude, but after?
 
True, but also that's a long time and a long ways away. Plus, the archetype then is "golden Kingdom threatened" and that's a thing of the world currently being awesome.

I guess what I'm driving at is, what is she fighting for, now?

The next generation? It would be cool to transition to a teaching arc.

If her goals are mostly satisfied and she's just bopping along, taking her new airship out for a spin, then it seems like a 'research' arc, and by research I mean time not precommitted to any goal or position, it's entirely our own.

If she decides it's time to make some gambles while she is playing with house money? A war for a Nexus seems like the best bet.

Trying to feel out how I feel about next arcs. I am committed to elfcation as interlude, but after?
I mean, my argument there is that the rise of an Everchosen is a Pascal's Wager for Mathilde. It behooves her to act like it will be coming ASAP, because the benefits of doing so are high, the risks of not doing so are high, and the opportunity cost is relatively low.

Right, but you can't really look at Mathilde's motivations for doing any of those, because whatever happens next will be ex post facto something she wants to do. Her motivation could be that she wants to prepare for the next Everchosen, or she's bored, or she thinks something would be an interesting research paper, or someone wants her help, or the Empire caught fire or anything because ultimately whatever options appear, there will be justification to do any of them.

Or to put it another way, I think you're asking the question backwards. The question is not "what motivation does Mathilde have and which arc will that guide her to" it's "what motivation do I want Mathilde to have and which arc will represent that".
 
I disagree that the opportunity cost is low. I also think she knows that there's usually quite a bit of warning as things get closer, so it's not like it's could happen out of the blue.

And maybe I am asking the question backwards, so I'll rephrase. What is your pitch for your preference of next arc, phrased in terms of what Mathilde would want for herself?
 
I disagree that the opportunity cost is low. I also think she knows that there's usually quite a bit of warning as things get closer, so it's not like it's could happen out of the blue.
How are you defining "quite a bit of warning"? That's a genuine question, because Mathilde's seen and been told that Chaos has been stirring repeatedly at this point. We've had an actual Demon of Tzeentch hit us up and give us their "Hey, you wanna be the Everchosen?" pitch. Boris literally had us assassinate his own father because of his genuine and earnest belief that an Everchosen is coming relatively soon and Kislev needs to be prepared for it.

For me, I don't really see what sort of clearer warning we could get that wouldn't come too late for us to make the best preparations we can.
 
Step 1: Go to Norsca
Step 2: Lead a slave revolt
Step 3: Unify Norsca into a tribal confederation with an elected High King who must be crowned by Mathilde.
Step 4: Get declared Mathilde Schwertfreiheit (Sword of Freedom)
Step 5: In a century, become deified.
Step 6: The cult becomes very popular in Norsca
Step 7: Become the Patron God of the Norscan Confederacy
Step 8: Chill with Ranald.
Step 9-20: Flip off Sigmar.

I understand 9 to 20 is a pretty hard commitment, but I believe Mathilde can do it
 
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