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NorseQuest (A Norse Xianxia)

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I kind of want to save TSS for in case we really need it as a like, back pocket thing. Yeah we can use it, but it's not exactly a sporting ability and we aren't doing too bad thus far. We are giving as much as we are taking for the most part. Use it if we feel like we are gonna lose, don't bust it out at the beginning.

I think we should keep focusing Rikard, and do our best to take him down without TSS. He is clearly the bruiser of the bunch, and the most immediately dangerous to us, though the weird pollen stuff is... interesting and potentially dangerous at least.

If I'm reading the log right we already did 4 damage, which if he has similar endurance to us (possible even if he has more Hamr, since he seems to lack Infusions and Odr) is half of what we need to take him out of a spar.

We took no actual damage and only used a fourth of our Orthstirr pool (not including aspects) while we did at least a third (I lean towards half) of what we need to damage wise to one enemy.
 
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Shard said:
I realize there's this obvious weakness pointed out but we shouldn't target this one in a spar, nor against kinsmen.
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Agreed. The other two we'll exploit the hell out of, but not that one.

KittyEmpress said:
I kind of want to save TSS for in case we really need it as a like, back pocket thing. Yeah we can use it, but it's not exactly a sporting ability and we aren't doing too bad thus far. We are giving as much as we are taking for the most part. Use it if we feel like we are gonna lose, don't bust it out at the beginning.
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The consensus on Discord seems to be we try and win without it, but save it as a way to avoid that 'big coordinated attack' they're prepping if necessary (at which point we'd also do other stuff with it). I think that seems fine. Not having it in the plan at all is too risky for me, but trying to win without it and using it as a panic button seems fine.
 
Forced Leverage to pull Forsetti up and through the air, Mire Ward to shut down Audvin's ranged attacks, then we try and rush down Rikard before he realizes, his Frenzy's down and he's prone to tunnelvision according to Sundersight. The combination should be enough between Forsetti's motion sickness and the fact he's been working on a long windup Trick to keep them both out of play for a turn or so.

Would we be able to conceal our intent in this context with the use of a Calm Charge @Imperial Fister ? So that it catches them both by surprise? Or is that just something our Composure Trick will handle?
 
DeadmanwalkingXI said:
The consensus on Discord seems to be we try and win without it, but save it as a way to avoid that 'big coordinated attack' they're prepping if necessary (at which point we'd also do other stuff with it). I think that seems fine. Not having it in the plan at all is too risky for me, but trying to win without it and using it as a panic button seems fine.
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I'm not on the discord, but this seems fair. Using it to quickly take out one opponent before they can move seems kinda rude and not fun to me, since it takes the joy out of the fight, but utilizing it to defend ourselves from big attacks seems like a fair use point.
 
KittyEmpress said:
I'm not on the discord, but this seems fair. Using it to quickly take out one opponent before they can move seems kinda rude and not fun to me, since it takes the joy out of the fight, but utilizing it to defend ourselves from big attacks seems like a fair use point.
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If we use it, we probably do also take someone out given the price point, but the hope is to avoid that situation entirely.
 
Okay, here's a plan. Please critique if there are any issues. I think we're good but more people looking it over is always better.

[X] Plan And Now For Standstill
-[X] 105d6 Attack (105d6 tricks)
-[X] 32d6 Defense (32d6 tricks)
-[X] 0d6 Intercept
-[X] Important Note: All bonuses do not include our bonus specifically against Rikard from Frenzybane.
-[X] Important Note 2: Every successful defense with Standstill grants an additional 4 Stoked Pool dice. These are not listed because it's only on successful defenses.
-[X] Important Note 3: All attack sequences obviously stop when our opponents surrender or go down, we are trying to avoid casualties.
-[X] Use Sundersight to gauge our opponents as we fight.
-[X] Using a Calm Charge to make ourselves unreadable

-[X] Activate Slowing Slog for 9 levels (-81 Orthstirr, +4 Stoked Pool), Stoker State 4 (-12 Orthstirr), Slipstream (-8 Orthstirr), and Heated Shroud (-5 Orthstirr). All dice pools below include +1d6 from Sunshine.
-[X] If needed for movement while not using Mire Ward activate Ember-Wing Cloak to take to the air (No cost, +4 Stoked Pool) and use Veto Motion (-3 Orthstirr, +4 Stoked Pool) to maneuver precisely as necessary.

-[X] All Guards (two 120d6+16 Sword Guards w/2 Odr each, and a 15d6+16 Semi-Halting Vortex) are still up, continue using the Semi-Halting Vortex only against Basic Attacks, the Sword Guard only against Trick attacks, and neither against Fleinns. The Sword Guards will never engage with Rikard at all in melee. An Atgeir Counter-Stab with a pool of 20 Orthstirr is also up, counterattacking with up to ten 6d6+16 Sharpened Lightning-Charged Firebomb Strikes (-2 Orthstirr from the pool each).

-[X] Open up with a conjured 80d6+16 Sharpenedx9 Orthstirr Enhancedx51 Forceful Lever w/Puncture (-74 Orthstirr) used at range to yank Forseti into the air and out of his pollen cloud and a simultaneous 80d6+16 Inertia-Arresting Throw from our Fast to trap him there, adding 3 Odr for durability (-6 Orthstirr, -3 Odr) which will hopefully cause him some issues.
-[X] Then activate Mire Ward (-6 Orthstirr, +4 Stoked Pool) and make a total of seven Sharpenedx40 Lightning Charged Firebomb Strikes / Puncture 83d6+16 (-50 Orthstirr each) at Rikard (or other targets if Rikard is down).
-[X] If Rikard is down and Forseti is still trapped, fly up and direct attacks at him (getting rid of the pollen cloud first if he has moved it to surround him). If he is also down, move on to Audvin.
-[X] If at any point anyone we are attacking has a Guard up, or plant/ice constructs or pollen clouds seem to be an issue, use up to two 8d6+16 Orthstirr-Enhancedx3 Devouring Blazes adding 3 Stoked Dice to remove them (-10 Orthstirr and -3 Stoked Pool Dice each).
-[X] If it seems useful at any point (to remove, say, a cloud of pollen or seeds, especially ones that look flammable and would hit us with the explosion) use an 30d6+16 Orthstirr-enhancedx23 Sailwind (-30 Orthstirr) to blow things susceptible to that kind of thing away from us.

-[X] Against the first melee attack by Rikard use Contested Movement using Stoked Pool for extra dice (-1 Orthstirr, +4 Stoked Pool then lose all of it, 11d6+16 Hamr Roll + Stoked Pool which should be at least 44 dice here), counterattacking with a Stoking Strike adding Sharpen, Lightning-Charged, and 51 Stoked dice (-5 Orthstirr, -51 Stoked Dice). If attacked simultaneously by other attacks, defend against them starting with Guards with the same priorities as ranged attacks (listed below)
-[X] If attacked in melee default to using Contested Movement using Stoked Pool for extra dice (-1 Orthstirr, +4 Stoked Pool then lose all of it, 11d6+16 Hamr Roll + Stoked Pool which should always be at least 4 dice, usually much higher), counterattacking with with Sharpened Lightning Charged Firebomb Strikes (-2 Orthstirr, +4 Stoked Pool) thereafter unless attacked by multiple things simultaneously, in which case if the attacks look especially large counterattack with a use of Forceful Lever (-5 Orthstirr) to move one attacker into the way of the other attack. For smaller or subsequent simultaneous attacks use Contested Movement against one of them and defend against the other with the same priorities as ranged attacks (listed below). Because the Sword Guards will never engage with Rikard this means we will always use Contested Movement on him and the Sword Guards against others if he's making a Trick Attack (his basic attacks might still hit Semi-Halting Vortex). If he attacks them in melee, we respond to it as an attack on ourselves and use Contested Movement as above.
-[X] While Mire Ward is up, casually bat away ranged attacks (barring using Forceful Lever to yank someone into one) (+4 Stoked Dice per attack defended against). While it is not, by default use the Sword Guards to defend against ranged Trick Attacks and Semi-Halting Vortex to defend against ranged Basic Attacks (except Fleinns, as noted above). In response to any ranged attack not a Fleinn or without Puncture or some other obvious ability to ignore Perfect defenses that gets through those use Halting Vortex (-2 Orthstirr, +4 Stoked Pool), and if facing a fleinn or something with Puncture that gets through instead use up to three quick-drawn Shield Sacrifices (-3 Endurance on one Shield) and if that's not viable up to two 120d6+25 Reinforcedx103 Sway defenses(-105 Orthstirr each) as seems appropriate. If we have drawn a shield and defended against a Trick, always defend against the next Trick Attack with that Shield as well (-3 Endurance on the same Shield).
-[X] As a contingency, if a truly unavoidable attack looks to be coming at us, use Time Stands Still (-1 Aspect), avoid it (dropping Mire Ward if needed), and then use one of our three actions to Forceful Lever one of the enemies into the way of it (-5 Orthstirr), and the other two to use Sparkbombs at melee range on other enemies (-15 Orthstirr each), all trying to take out our remaining opponents.
-[X] If we go below 200 Orthstirr or are trapped by something we could break out of by doing so, stoke an Aspect.

-[X] Tactics – The basic idea here is to toss Forseti into the sky, stick him there, and then go to town on Rikard, using our Stoked Pool to actually win the Hamr contests on Contested Movement this time, while using Mire Ward to render Audvin's archery attacks irrelevant. If we get Rikard down, we fly up, finish off Forseti, then move to Audvin. In a real emergency, we'll activate Time Stands Still, but we're trying to avoid that.

EDIT: Slight logistical reordering, no substantive changes. Added a Calm Charge.
 
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So, it seems like this worry was correct in the end:
Skippy said:
Isn't there a risk here of one of them using their own Stoked Pool to counter at some point? This happened when we fought Hal, as I recall.
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Now, to be clear, when @DeadmanwalkingXI mentioned that Hal had only used in in a latter round, I was convinced that it was not an issue. It did not occur to me that putting Contested Movement down as a general defensive option would mean that we'd reveal it and give Rikard a chance to counter it within the same round. So to be perfectly clear, this is not an "I told you so" because I in fact was got it wrong in the end as well.

However, it does speak to how if we want to use a tactic on these guys, I think we have to be prepared to either make it so strong they can't easily stop it, or only use it once. The second time we do something they can take advantage of, they probably will.

Going to look over the plan now and see if I have any thoughts.
 
Skippy said:
It did not occur to me that putting Contested Movement down as a general defensive option would mean that we'd reveal it and give Rikard a chance to counter it within the same round.
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I think the thinking was that it took Hal till round 3 to work out what the hell we were doing and how to counter, whereas this guy did it the second time we used it, like maybe 5/10 seconds after the first time we used it and we barely gave him time to think in the time between
 
AeonIlluminate said:
I think the thinking was that it took Hal till round 3 to work out what the hell we were doing and how to counter, whereas this guy did it the second time we used it, like maybe 5/10 seconds after the first time we used it and we barely gave him time to think in the time between
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Pretty much this, yeah. The turnaround was much faster than expected. Not unreasonably so, necessarily, but a whole lot faster than last time. The calculus did also include that we could afford to lose one Contested Movement this turn if needed...losing two was a bit beyond expectations, but that first roll, with no bonuses, is the average for Hamr 15...which is wild. He probably has an always-on bonus there, which was also unexpected.
 
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Hey Sten, does the Curse of Steel get noticeably stronger when there are a lot of Steel objects in an area?
 
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AeonIlluminate said:
I think the thinking was that it took Hal till round 3 to work out what the hell we were doing and how to counter, whereas this guy did it the second time we used it, like maybe 5/10 seconds after the first time we used it and we barely gave him time to think in the time between
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In fairness, I would bet good money that Hal worked it out fairly quickly as well, and was baiting us. The Tactics notes in the update and his whole schtick as a cunning and deceptive fighter seem to point to that, as well as some statements by Fister if my memory serves.

DeadmanwalkingXI said:
-[X] If attacked in melee default to using Contested Movement using Stoked Pool for extra dice (-1 Orthstirr, +4 Stoked Pool then lose all of it, 11d6+16 Hamr Roll + Stoked Pool which should always be at least 4 dice, usually much higher), counterattacking with, on the first attack against us, a Stoking Strike adding Sharpen, Lightning-Charged, and 51 Stoked dice (-5 Orthstirr, -51 Stoked Dice) and counterattacking with Sharpened Lightning Charged Firebomb Strikes (-2 Orthstirr, +4 Stoked Pool) thereafter unless attacked by multiple things simultaneously, in which case if the attacks look especially large counterattack with a use of Forceful Lever (-5 Orthstirr) to move one attacker into the way of the other attack. For smaller or subsequent simultaneous attacks use Contested Movement against one of them and defend against the other with the same priorities as ranged attacks (listed below). Because the Sword Guards will never engage with Rikard this means we will always use Contested Movement on him and the Sword Guards against others if he's making a Trick Attack (his basic attacks might still hit Semi-Halting Vortex). If he attacks them in melee, we respond to it as an attack on ourselves and use Contested Movement as above.
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This seems to go too far the other way by wasting ninety one dice we worked hard to accumulate on our first Contested Movement, and repeats our previous error of just including it as a general defensive option rather a laying out a specific plan for an impactful counter-attack.

There are precisely two things we need to do to take Rikard out of the fight:
1. Get final confirmation with Fister that we can do the Contested Movement + Stoked Strike trick to allow us to allocate Stoked Dice I talked about earlier.
2. Deliver a Contested Movement where we put say fourteen Stoked Dice on the check itself, and the other seventy five into a Stoked Strike. Maybe a bit less on the Stoked Strike if that will kill him outright.

I don't dislike the idea of using Contested Movement as a general defensive option, especially since the counter-attacks and Contested Movement itself can generate more Stoked Dice, meaning we always have at least four dice or so as a bonus. But any usage as a general defensive option should be specifically delineated from our plan to hit Rikard, which needs to be given the investment to make absolutely certain t succeeds.

This isn't just on a resource investment level, it's also for Fister reading the plan and working out how to pace the scene and what bits of our plan are important.
 
Skippy said:
There are precisely two things we need to do to take Rikard out of the fight:
1. Get final confirmation with Fister that we can do the Contested Movement + Stoked Strike trick to allow us to allocate Stoked Dice I talked about earlier.
2. Deliver a Contested Movement where we put say fourteen Stoked Dice on the check itself, and the other seventy five into a Stoked Strike. Maybe a bit less on the Stoked Strike if that will kill him outright.
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This is exactly the plan. We got confirmation, and the first counterattack has 51 dice going to a Stoking Strike. I was sincerely worried about putting more into it than that...he's already taken damage and that's a 21 damage attack.

I could make it a separate entry, but that involves a lot of repetition.
 
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Hamr 15 doesn't seem that absurd when we consider that if we wanted to, with the math we did for xp on this trip we could push our Hugr to 14 or 15 if we focused it and only it, with how xp cost caps.

It does make anything that causes a hamr vs hamr roll to be much less valuable though.
 
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