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Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

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[X] Kalishiniviks

time to see how the sausage get made

[x] Tzar Boris Bokha

time to congratulate our bro!

[X] Eonir Tourism

I'd love to see a perspective on the empire from
a foreign perspective

[X] Middenland

time to see how the new ulric elves are

[X] Nordland

time to see how nordland doing
 
Boney said:
Good news: this area of research is already well-established and there's a fair few people out there actively trying to teach it to willing students.

Bad news: it's called Daemonology.
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Is it Daemonology because the skillset of "detecting liminal realms, targeting them, and opening a way to them" is extremely similar to the skillset of "detecting the realms of the Chaos Gods, targeting them, and opening a way to them", or because liminal realms are likely to be full of daemons, or some third thing?

Because if Mathilde had an entirely benign use case for the daemonology skillset, I'd be at least slightly more open to reading the next set of dodgy notes on dark magic we come across.
 
Boney said:
I can't really answer that for GW, but I would turn a questioning eye towards the Wolf God Lupus, theorized to be the original God of the Cherusens, and His defeat and the usurpation of the canine sphere by Ulric, who is unquestionably a God of Humanity.
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The Cherusens, huh? Those that would be become Hochlanders.

In Old World Bestiary, one of the in-universe quotes suggests that old legends about the Cherusens having the ability to 'run with wolves' was about them having many Werewolves among their people*.

I've theorized this before, but the Children of Ulric probably started off as the Children of Lupos. Wonder if any of them remember that?


*Admittedly, the source is Eckhard of Nuln, who was burned as a heretic (probably for calling the noble Griffon a scion of Chaos)
 
[X] The Black Water Canal
[X] Eonir Tourism
[X] Eike
[X] Skull River Ambush
[X] Niedzwenka

As much as I'm interested in how Boris is doing, showing up to his coronation when he had Mathilde murder his father to inherit seems like it would make an already bad day worse for him. Also there's the whole "don't return to the scene of the crime" bit and not reminding/informing people in Kislev that Boris has a sneaky stabby magic friend.
 
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[X] The Black Water Canal
[X] Eike
[X] Skull River Ambush
[X] Tzar Boris Bokha
 
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[X] Middenland
[X] Nordland
[X] The Black Water Canal
[X] Tzar Boris Bokha
[X] Skull River Ambush
[X] Kalishiniviks
[X] Niedzwenka
 
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Deathbybunnies said:
Is it Daemonology because the skillset of "detecting liminal realms, targeting them, and opening a way to them" is extremely similar to the skillset of "detecting the realms of the Chaos Gods, targeting them, and opening a way to them", or because liminal realms are likely to be full of daemons, or some third thing?

Because if Mathilde had an entirely benign use case for the daemonology skillset, I'd be at least slightly more open to reading the next set of dodgy notes on dark magic we come across.
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The first. Looking on what's on the other side of the liminal barrier and cracking it open uses the same skillset whether there's a liminal realm there or not.
 
Yeah, trapping an immortal, ever-regenerating mage inside an isolated space between reality and the Warp just sounds like a recipe for having them regenerate in peace and kick the door back to reality at their own pace.
 
Mopman43 said:
Possibly they might be less unbreakable to someone trapped inside with infinite time on their hands?
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Maybe? They do have their own little Dhar-vortexes, so I suppose they do have a source of magic.

DragonParadox said:
Well it's not perfect Daemonologists can open them.
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They'd have to be looking for them and find them, first. It seems unlikely they'd bother, rather than going for the daemons they're usually aiming for?

Gavin Prince said:
The vampire probably regenerates faster than the liminal barrier closes to the point it's unbreachable from the inside. Flesh has to be regularly scraped off of the skulls we have.
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Break them up into small pieces, and throw them into a very small hole?

Boney said:
The first. Looking on what's on the other side of the liminal barrier and cracking it open uses the same skillset whether there's a liminal realm there or not.
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Thanks for clarifying. I'm okay with Mathilde picking up the skillset if we ever come across the opportunity, then. The call of Ancient Magic Lootboxes scattered across the world calls, and I'm not strong enough to resist :V
 
Boney said:
Looking on what's on the other side of the liminal barrier and cracking it open uses the same skillset whether there's a liminal realm there or not.
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Though I expect most Daemonology tomes on the process make profligate use of shortcuts like human sacrifice. They're easier, readily available, and more pleasing to their patrons, so why bother with trying to do without?

Which would probably harshly limit the usefulness of any that Mathilde picks up for her own more benign liminal spelunking.
 
Mathilde: "I want to learn the Dark Tongue!"
Grey College: "Why?"
Mathilde: "To loan some words I need to describe the relative spatial position of the barrier between reality and the Warp, and also so I can pilfer knowledge from any texts on daemonology I might come across!"
Grey College: "..."
 
Boney said:
The first. Looking on what's on the other side of the liminal barrier and cracking it open uses the same skillset whether there's a liminal realm there or not.
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Hunh. You know, it occurs to me that this overlap in skillsets is also one to result in state of affairs that might result in Daemonologists setting up shop in ancient ruins and thus cracking open ancient sealed bubbles of reality and unveiling lost treasures that no one else could find.

Which, 1: certainly seems thematic.
and 2: means there might be a clever trick where if you can't do that skillset yourself, well then you can just hunt down and mug the Daemonologists.
 
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Asking spirits for directions to hidden and forgotten caches also risks the spirit finding it funnier to point you somewhere you're likely to fall through when you start digging.
 
Entirely unrelatedly from any practical concerns, sticking a sapient mind into a tiny empty box for eternity also just isn't something I'm down for morally. It might be wishy washy of me, but the ideal end goal of infinite torture, even to the irredeemable, isn't worth exchanging for the current status quo.
 
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Somic said:
Yeah, trapping an immortal, ever-regenerating mage inside an isolated space between reality and the Warp just sounds like a recipe for having them regenerate in peace and kick the door back to reality at their own pace.
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To be fair the vampires would go mad in short order from the lack of blood, I do not think that would help with cracking their way out, the greater problem is that someone on the other side might break them out before that happens.
 
Actually, with liminal realms starting pretty small, could you seal a vampire inside one as to prevent it from regenerating?

Picturing say, encasing the vampire skull and other remains in metal, what happens then? Maybe a vampire could regenerate such that it eventually breaks out of a metal casing, but if they're stuck inside a solid block of metal which itself is confined by unyielding dimensional barriers? Or if metal is too compressible such that regeneration would eventually push out a space, what about something more difficult to compress such as water?

Or alternatively, if a vampire regenerated only its head would this be enough for it to properly awaken and use magic? If not what if you made a really small liminal realm only just large enough to fit the skull, but not a body?

I suppose the problem is testing would be difficult and we can't really check to make sure nothing from the other side of things will eventually break through in the liminal realm, especially if it becomes known we've started creating loads of tiny, stray liminal realms full of forbidden goodies.
 
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